IRC log of mediaann on 2009-01-27

Timestamps are in UTC.

13:01:06 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #mediaann
13:01:06 [RRSAgent]
logging to
13:01:08 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
13:01:10 [trackbot]
Zakim, this will be MAWG
13:01:10 [Zakim]
ok, trackbot, I see IA_MAWG()8:00AM already started
13:01:11 [trackbot]
Meeting: Media Annotations Working Group Teleconference
13:01:11 [trackbot]
Date: 27 January 2009
13:01:19 [raphael]
zakim, who is here?
13:01:19 [Zakim]
On the phone I see pchampin, Thierry, ??P2, wbailer, raphael
13:01:20 [Zakim]
On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, pchampin, Victor, joakim, wbailer, raphael, tmichel, wonsuk, trackbot
13:01:26 [raphael]
zakim, mute Thierry
13:01:26 [Zakim]
Thierry should now be muted
13:01:27 [tmichel]
Zakim, who is here?
13:01:28 [Zakim]
On the phone I see pchampin, Thierry (muted), ??P2, wbailer, raphael
13:01:29 [Zakim]
On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, pchampin, Victor, joakim, wbailer, raphael, tmichel, wonsuk, trackbot
13:01:40 [Zakim]
13:01:45 [raphael]
Thierry, I muted you, you made a lot of noise :-(
13:01:51 [tmichel]
I get a terrible BUZZZZZZ
13:02:07 [raphael]
thierry, are you skyping?
13:02:22 [raphael]
zakim, mute me
13:02:22 [Zakim]
raphael should now be muted
13:02:45 [tmichel]
No I am using a phone over IP, but I can't hear a thing
13:02:58 [tmichel]
zakim, mute me
13:02:58 [Zakim]
sorry, tmichel, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
13:03:18 [tmichel]
I will redial in
13:03:23 [Zakim]
13:03:42 [VeroniqueM]
VeroniqueM has joined #mediaann
13:04:01 [raphael]
zakim, mute pchampin
13:04:01 [Zakim]
pchampin should now be muted
13:04:09 [Zakim]
13:04:24 [tmichel]
It is much better now
13:05:07 [Zakim]
13:05:25 [tmichel]
Zakim, who is here?
13:05:25 [Zakim]
On the phone I see pchampin (muted), ??P2, wbailer, raphael, joakim, Thierry, veronique
13:05:29 [Zakim]
On IRC I see VeroniqueM, RRSAgent, Zakim, pchampin, Victor, joakim, wbailer, raphael, tmichel, wonsuk, trackbot
13:05:52 [Zakim]
13:06:37 [tmichel]
We have regrets from Felix,
13:06:37 [tmichel]
Michele Minno ,Jean-Pierre
13:06:51 [tmichel]
Looking for a vulunteer to scribe ...
13:07:14 [raphael]
13:07:15 [tmichel]
13:08:05 [joakim]
co-chair Daniel will be back soon
13:08:24 [joakim]
Regrets: Frank, Felix, Michel Jean Pierre
13:09:18 [tmichel]
There was a meeting ?
13:09:22 [joakim]
Last week telecom meetings are not on the web
13:09:36 [raphael]
There was a meeting, and the minutes are at
13:11:22 [tmichel]
The scribe should send the minutes with the URI
13:12:52 [raphael]
The Media Fragments WG keep the minutes in the same web space, but remove the 'draft' when the minutes have been fixed and approved
13:13:12 [joakim]
topic: Actions points
13:13:41 [joakim]
The Scribe should mail the edited minutes to the public mail list
13:15:42 [joakim]
Should we include Vicots contribution "Multimedia Presentation material" to the uc document?
13:16:09 [VeroniqueM]
13:16:11 [raphael]
Is it ?
13:16:11 [Victor]
Action 55 was attended here:
13:16:11 [trackbot]
Sorry, couldn't find user - 55
13:16:15 [Victor]
13:17:22 [pchampin]
Zakim, mute tmichel
13:17:23 [Zakim]
sorry, pchampin, I do not know which phone connection belongs to tmichel
13:17:36 [raphael]
zakim, mute ??P9
13:17:36 [Zakim]
??P9 should now be muted
13:19:19 [Victor]
We got no comments on the email
13:19:34 [joakim]
who has read the document, and has an opinion?
13:20:14 [joakim]
Werner: it's important, but maybe it should hold cross all use cases?
13:20:19 [Victor]
Does any other Use Case support Requirement 7?
13:20:43 [pchampin]
zakim, who is here?
13:20:43 [Zakim]
On the phone I see pchampin (muted), ??P2, wbailer, raphael, joakim, Thierry, veronique, ??P9 (muted)
13:20:45 [Zakim]
On IRC I see VeroniqueM, RRSAgent, Zakim, pchampin, Victor, joakim, wbailer, raphael, tmichel, wonsuk, trackbot
13:20:53 [VeroniqueM]
I think that it is a very interesting topic but i think that it is mostly related to the ongoing question of considering complex/simple models, maybe the latter question should be answered first?
13:21:01 [pchampin]
zakim, unmute me
13:21:01 [Zakim]
pchampin should no longer be muted
13:21:24 [joakim]
Victor: Is it possible to change an existing use case and include no / into that one?
13:22:07 [pchampin]
13:22:51 [joakim]
Veronique: The UC7 could be incorporated into cultural heritage UC!
13:23:04 [joakim]
13:23:04 [wbailer]
agree to including it in CH use case, maybe also in MM adaptation (if we make a use case out of that)
13:23:57 [joakim]
Veronique: This is related to the question of the complexity of the model
13:24:59 [raphael]
I also think this text should go in the CH use case
13:25:34 [joakim]
Victor: Add a sentence to the CH description
13:25:44 [Victor]
By changing the last paragraph....
13:26:42 [joakim]
Action 55 is now about reformulating th CH description
13:26:42 [trackbot]
Sorry, couldn't find user - 55
13:27:46 [joakim]
regret+ tobias
13:29:07 [raphael]
good job Werner, Frank :-)
13:29:58 [joakim]
Werner: many mpeg-7 properties could be mapped to XMP, but some are not covered in XMP
13:30:45 [joakim]
We discuss later how to alter the mapping agenda
13:30:52 [joakim]
close 74
13:31:00 [raphael]
close ACTION-74
13:31:00 [trackbot]
ACTION-74 Review SMPTE closed
13:31:25 [raphael]
close ACTION-73
13:31:25 [trackbot]
ACTION-73 review with werner MPEG-7 closed
13:32:09 [tobias]
tobias has joined #mediaann
13:33:42 [pchampin]
13:33:49 [tobias]
done already
13:33:58 [tobias]
has been done already the last time
13:34:17 [joakim]
Pierre Antoine: The DC/DCTerm disucssuion is open on the mailinglist
13:35:18 [joakim]
PA: Don't agree that the main question is about the API
13:35:26 [joakim]
can you speak louder?
13:35:46 [joakim]
13:36:36 [joakim]
PA: We should also define the low level meaning of the propoerties, not only the high level semantics
13:37:21 [joakim]
cant hear
13:37:59 [joakim]
How can we define the low level mapping?
13:38:35 [raphael]
I do see some problems to have discrepancies between having on one hand a lightweight semantics for the creator property (accept string value) in the API and on the other hand another semantics for the same property (URI value) in the ontology
13:39:49 [joakim]
we could define the target of the properties precisely
13:40:32 [tmichel]
how could that be done ?
13:40:53 [joakim]
PA: we should have an Ontology that define this
13:41:00 [Zakim]
13:41:12 [joakim]
Can raphael explain his point?
13:41:30 [tobias]
Zakim ??P18 is me
13:42:02 [joakim]
Raphael: Should it be two different return values
13:42:04 [tobias]
Zakim, ??P18 is me
13:42:04 [Zakim]
+tobias; got it
13:42:49 [wonsuk]
Zakim, ??P9 is me
13:42:49 [Zakim]
+wonsuk; got it
13:42:57 [joakim]
PA: If we map according to the mapping table, it would return very hetrogenus values
13:44:23 [joakim]
PA: Prefer to be more formal in the Ontology
13:45:31 [pchampin]
but I agree that we could also be formal only at the API level
13:46:54 [joakim]
joakim: we could be practical doing toy applications and decide after how to cope with the proble,
13:47:24 [joakim]
PA: agrees that we should be practical as sson as possible
13:48:02 [joakim]
Veronique: based on what?
13:48:09 [wonsuk]
13:49:23 [joakim]
PA. we should aim at making an intermediate implmentation
13:49:38 [pchampin]
13:50:43 [joakim]
PA: We should have a more precise idea of the global structure of the ontology
13:51:03 [pchampin]
13:51:21 [joakim]
We should have a common view of the complexity level before implmenting
13:51:55 [VeroniqueM]
we can also have different levels of complexity of the representations, domain dependant?
13:52:16 [joakim]
Does any one have a suggestino on how to move on?
13:52:25 [VeroniqueM]
DC and VRA and XMP exist in RDF, then we can use rdf-ways of representing mappings
13:52:45 [joakim]
13:54:47 [joakim]
Veronique: We can use the level of mapping/link representation found in existing implmentations
13:55:09 [joakim]
PA: the level is different in different implementations
13:55:33 [joakim]
PA: Maybe to propose some example code foer each case
13:55:42 [joakim]
13:55:46 [joakim]
13:56:59 [joakim]
PA: divide the problem per use case
13:57:37 [joakim]
pA: it should work whatever the format
13:57:42 [raphael]
Raphael: does it mean then that implementation = 1/ (python/java/pick_yours) code expressing mappings between some properties ; 2/ (owl/skos) code expressing mappings between some properties, etc. ?
13:58:40 [joakim]
PA: the code doesnt have to represent the mapping
13:58:48 [joakim]
PA: the mapping should be hidden
13:59:20 [joakim]
Either a mapping relationship or an ontology
13:59:34 [Victor]
but the mapping itself has to be represented
13:59:40 [raphael]
or ... being not exclusive, it could be both :-)
14:00:14 [joakim]
the mapping should be hidden to the developer
14:00:17 [joakim]
14:01:05 [joakim]
PA: Was thinking about writing code showing how to use our API
14:01:45 [joakim]
PA: Write code that illustrates how to use our API
14:03:11 [tobias]
q+ regarding Felix's intention
14:04:41 [joakim]
can PA start to draft a use case?
14:04:48 [pchampin]
14:05:13 [joakim]
we did not have time to finish the agenda
14:05:26 [joakim]
our first public document was published last monday
14:05:38 [joakim]
we have telecon next week same time
14:06:17 [joakim]
Victor: Will attend the MPEG meeting next week
14:06:29 [raphael]
q+ regarding when is the due date for commenting the FPWD?
14:06:53 [joakim]
respond to Victors PPT before the end of the week
14:07:10 [tobias]
q+ regarding action-66
14:08:30 [joakim]
we should start to collect updates for the UC doc
14:08:37 [Victor]
14:08:49 [raphael]
14:09:15 [Zakim]
14:09:16 [Zakim]
14:09:17 [Zakim]
14:09:17 [Victor]
14:09:17 [tobias]
Tobias: regarding action-66: sent it to the list already on the 19th
14:09:39 [Zakim]
14:09:41 [wonsuk]
wonsuk has left #mediaann
14:09:48 [joakim]
rrsagent, draft minutes
14:09:48 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate joakim
14:10:16 [Zakim]
14:14:08 [Zakim]
14:14:10 [Zakim]
14:14:11 [Zakim]
14:14:12 [Zakim]
14:14:12 [Zakim]
IA_MAWG()8:00AM has ended
14:14:14 [Zakim]
Attendees were pchampin, Thierry, wbailer, raphael, joakim, veronique, tobias, wonsuk
14:14:14 [Victor]
14:14:18 [pchampin]
pchampin has left #mediaann
14:14:25 [Victor]
i was also attendee!
14:14:26 [joakim]
14:14:40 [joakim]
present +victor
14:15:35 [joakim]
present+ thierry, werner, rapahel, joakim, veronique, tobias, wonsuk
14:15:38 [joakim]
rrsagent, draft minutes
14:15:38 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate joakim
16:22:37 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #mediaann