IRC log of svgig on 2008-11-20

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:51:32 [RRSAgent]
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logging to
15:51:34 [trackbot]
RRSAgent, make logs public
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Zakim, this will be SVGIG
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ok, trackbot; I see GA_SVGIG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 9 minutes
15:51:37 [trackbot]
Meeting: SVG Interest Group Teleconference
15:51:37 [trackbot]
Date: 20 November 2008
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GA_SVGIG()11:00AM has now started
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15:58:27 [Zakim]
+ +1.713.851.aaaa
15:58:30 [shepazu]
Christophe, it depends upon the WG
15:58:35 [Manuel]
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15:58:44 [shepazu]
I think most of them are
15:58:52 [Zakim]
+ +1.312.540.aabb
16:00:14 [JeffSchiller]
Zakim, aabb is JeffSchiller
16:00:14 [Zakim]
+JeffSchiller; got it
16:00:15 [Zakim]
16:00:47 [Zakim]
16:01:43 [Manuel]
i'm here, but, as mentioned, not in reach of a phone
16:02:21 [stelt]
16:02:34 [Christophe]
Previous minutes are at
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16:04:43 [Christophe]
Scribe: Christophe
16:04:48 [Christophe]
Meeting: SVG IG
16:05:04 [Christophe]
16:05:25 [Christophe]
Chair: Jeff, Doug
16:06:04 [Christophe]
Topic: SVG Spec
16:07:26 [Christophe]
DS: SVG 1.2 has entered PR phase (yesterday). Announcement:
16:08:10 [shepazu]
16:08:38 [Christophe]
DS: Notable change: URL is no longer 'SVGMobile' etc but 'SVGTiny':
16:09:10 [Christophe]
DS: Sort of important: clarify the message of SVG. Want to work on marketing.
16:09:32 [Christophe]
JS: I.e. the spec is not only aimed at the mobile space.
16:09:47 [shepazu]
16:09:49 [Rob_Russell]
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16:09:54 [stelt]
SVG counting in mobile space:
16:10:06 [Christophe]
DS: See also implementation report at
16:10:33 [Donald_Doherty]
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16:10:35 [Christophe]
DS: New version of the test suite does not rely on XML ID.
16:11:14 [Christophe]
DS: Desktop browsers were not interested in implementing XML ID, and there were other issues related to XML ID.
16:11:21 [Zakim]
16:11:32 [Christophe]
DS: Basically say: "only use XML ID if you are in a non-browser environment"
16:13:00 [Christophe]
DS: Only risk now would be if W3C member companies now said they don't want to publish it. (Not very likely.)
16:13:31 [Christophe]
DS: Companies interested in seeing SVG 1.2 published are asked to support it.
16:13:46 [Christophe]
DS: Possibly REC in mid December.
16:13:51 [stelt]
16:14:54 [Christophe]
DS: SVG GI web site would be a good promotion tool. The book, too.
16:15:25 [Christophe]
rrsagent, make logs world
16:15:40 [Christophe]
DS: also ask more people to implement SVG
16:16:36 [Christophe]
DS: Convince people in Safari and Firefox to take SVG 1.2 as an implementation target by saying X is better defined in SVG 1.2; it's a better reference for resolving bugs.
16:17:02 [Christophe]
JS: Pushback microDOM?
16:17:18 [Christophe]
DS: That was one of the less populart parts in SVG, but it's very useful.
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16:17:53 [Christophe]
JS: In terms of implementation, microdom is easier that full SVG 1.1 DOM. Another DOM might be expensive.
16:18:05 [Christophe]
DS: Much of it is convenience methods.
16:18:33 [Christophe]
DS: Anything that can be implemented as it stands: encourage vendors to implement.
16:19:08 [Christophe]
JS: Future? SVG 2.0 Core mentioned in places
16:19:20 [Christophe]
DS: Not yet 100% certain about path forward.
16:19:52 [Christophe]
DS: Current plan: build modules that describe specific pieces of functionality. you could plug them into SVG Tiny 1.2.
16:20:29 [Christophe]
DS: SVG 1.2 has most of the features of SVG 2.0; the modules ... Other modules would introduce new features.
16:21:07 [Christophe]
DS: SVG 2 would be a major rewrite of the spec but not necessarily much new functionality. tighthening up the spec and changes things to make it more adaptable. Integration with HTML content.
16:21:51 [Christophe]
DS: Make it a more stable platform. E.g. allowing non-namespaced href on outgonig links as well as ... etc.
16:23:18 [Manuel]
I'd like to see mentioning of text format handling in SVG 2.0via XHTML *or* XSL-FO, that would be great.
16:23:25 [Christophe]
DS: We resolved to work on modules. In the near future, there would be a path to follow before a single profile ...
16:23:52 [Christophe]
Topic: SVG IG Japan
16:24:59 [Christophe]
DS: Japanese chapter - Japanese market is not comfortable communicating through the same channels as rest of W3C. They're more comfortable discussing technical matters in japanese.
16:25:24 [Christophe]
DS: Try to see how they can promote SVG in Japan, find use cases and requirements and bring the back to the SVG IG.
16:25:35 [Christophe]
DS: Two main things going one:
16:26:35 [Christophe]
DS: (1) KDDI (service provider) is working on a "map module": module for mapping uses. Have a prototype. Not necessarily a general SVG viewer, but works on mobiles.
16:26:53 [stelt]
16:27:28 [Christophe]
DS: They're working on things like level of detail (e.g. when you zoom in, blocks resolve into individual buildings etc)
16:28:06 [Christophe]
DS: Range of zoom - e.g. from zoom level 5 - 10 show X, from 10 - 15 show X details etc
16:28:22 [Christophe]
JS: At the highest zoom level, you dont want all the details in your document.
16:28:56 [Christophe]
DS: See the 'discard' element; also need 'add' element: add something to the DOM when useful.
16:29:41 [Zakim]
+ +
16:29:49 [Christophe]
DS: Also tile mechanism so you don't need whole map.
16:29:55 [darobin]
Zakim: aacc is me
16:30:05 [darobin]
Zakim, aacc is me
16:30:05 [Zakim]
+darobin; got it
16:30:42 [Christophe]
DS: (2) Also working on making SVG 1.2 Tiny ratify in JISC. Until it is a JISC standard, Japanese companies won't implement it.
16:31:13 [Christophe]
DS: More a formalization thing. If they decide that it is a good time to have this spec, they'll translate it.
16:31:40 [Christophe]
DS: They're also interested in making the mapping module a JISC standard.
16:31:53 [Christophe]
DS: Not aware of changes that they would want to make.
16:32:04 [darobin]
16:32:24 [Christophe]
Topic: SVG Open 2009
16:32:42 [Christophe]
JS: Google no sponsor for SVG Open 2009
16:33:38 [Christophe]
RB: Liaison statement from ITU (?) to SVG about standardizing SVG for interactive TV.
16:34:53 [Christophe]
RB: The statement was sent by one of the ITU groups; a group that has to do with interactivity.
16:35:08 [Christophe]
DS: Discuss off-line.
16:36:04 [Christophe]
DS: JSR-287 : up for ratification as well.
16:36:32 [Christophe]
JS: One of the companies there is NVidia.
16:36:46 [Christophe]
Topic: SVG Open 2009
16:37:09 [Christophe]
XX: someone had good contacts with NVidia.
16:37:19 [darobin]
16:37:30 [darobin]
16:38:17 [stelt] shows loads of parties to maybe contact
16:38:29 [Christophe]
JS: Conference: can work that out on the mailing list.
16:38:40 [Christophe]
JS: Robin Berjon: first time on IG call.
16:38:57 [Christophe]
RB: Independent consultant. Was member of SVG WG for a few years.
16:39:11 [shepazu]
16:39:14 [Christophe]
RB: Also editor on the community site.
16:39:37 [Christophe]
DS: Element traversal spec: really useful for SVG.
16:40:28 [Christophe]
DS: Was moved out of SVG and moved to Web Apps WG and is going to PR.
16:40:36 [shepazu]
16:40:50 [Christophe]
DS: There is an implementation report at
16:41:20 [Christophe]
RB: Same interface as in HTML 5?
16:41:20 [stelt]
SVG Open 2009: Enschede city has economical relation with Palo Alto city. Thin, but looking into it for leads
16:42:34 [Christophe]
DS: Already planning Element Traversal 2.0.
16:42:59 [Rob_Russell]
16:43:46 [Christophe]
DS: Element Traversal 2.0 already being implemented; could be published next year.
16:43:55 [Christophe]
Topic: SVG Community Website
16:44:10 [Christophe]
RR: Working on a theme.
16:44:54 [Christophe]
RR: Looks good graphically, but ... Will be uploaded to the site later; either default or optional.
16:45:49 [Christophe]
RR: Also turned on the update check .... Drupal updated.
16:46:15 [stelt]
the sooner to have something other than the default Drupal the better IMHO. We can perfect later
16:46:38 [shepazu]
q+ to ask about RSS feed for news
16:46:51 [Manuel]
i'm working on how the forums page could look, but it will last a bit (weekend?)
16:46:55 [stelt]
I've figured out how moderating works :-)
16:48:00 [JeffSchiller]
16:48:05 [Christophe]
RR: list items - new: need to get URL at bottom of the blurb.
16:48:15 [stelt]
make NEWS index ?
16:48:25 [Christophe]
16:49:13 [Christophe]
RR: Need to work on news feed and global feed for articles (RSS or Atom)
16:50:10 [Christophe]
RS: currently site looks like nothing is happening.
16:50:46 [Christophe]
RR: (...) In the theme we can filter which types of content go into which boxes.
16:51:32 [Christophe]
JS: News and latest stories and articles should be major focus.
16:53:01 [Christophe]
RR: Manuel working on ... theme.
16:54:57 [Christophe]
DS: Worried about input and output. Would like this as source of info for SVG WG page. RSS feed for news available?
16:55:21 [Christophe]
RR: No feed for news yet. There will also be other feeds.
16:56:11 [stelt]
raw feed is what editors get
16:56:22 [Christophe]
DS: Also interested in raw feed with Google news alerts etc where SVG is mentioned .
16:56:49 [Christophe]
RR: The editors get that feed and approve things for publication.
16:57:16 [gwadej]
Apologies, but I have a meeting and have to go. Bye.
16:57:30 [Zakim]
- +1.713.851.aaaa
16:58:11 [Christophe]
Zakim, +1.713 was gwadej
16:58:11 [Zakim]
I don't understand '+1.713 was gwadej', Christophe
16:59:15 [Christophe]
DS: Would like to be notified. Would rather have a feed from SVG than one from Google.
16:59:28 [Christophe]
17:00:25 [stelt]
to get "SVG Capital", StaVanGer, etc. filtered out
17:00:31 [Christophe]
DS: Forums: when building community site, they noticed that "old folks" like e-mail while "young folks" prefer forums.
17:01:21 [Christophe]
RR: We need a "Frankenstein's monster" for mail and forums.
17:01:45 [stelt]
Jon Cruz said he wanted to help on that
17:02:01 [Christophe]
RB: There are modules for sending mails to people when there's a new post on the forum etc.
17:02:28 [Christophe]
RB: You ca't reply via the e-mail, but there's a link to the forum.
17:02:46 [Christophe]
17:03:06 [Christophe]
DS: That would not be as good as replying to a thread via e-mail.
17:03:23 [Christophe]
RB: You would need to integrate with a mail module on the back end.
17:03:24 [Manuel]
have to leave, bye
17:03:45 [Christophe]
DS: If we get simply the notification, that would satisfy the "old fogeys".
17:05:13 [stelt]
i'll bill an extra hour then :-)
17:06:49 [Christophe]
DS: Would also like to see old news stories from Should be possible to get a dump of the news stories, maybe also the blogs.
17:06:58 [Christophe]
RR: Legal ramifications?
17:07:14 [Rob_Russell]
(that was js)
17:08:01 [stelt]
i'd like my diary from there as well
17:09:07 [Christophe]
DS: Get tutorials and/or fresh materials ("instant tricks" etc) on the site.
17:09:36 [Christophe]
JS: Would like to get one or two tutorials. Anyone else who can write something up?
17:10:18 [Christophe]
XX: We could get content from that is more than one year odl - see A. Quint's articles?
17:10:22 [stelt]
there are many inkscape tuts on Youtube
17:10:27 [darobin]
17:12:20 [Christophe]
17:13:00 [Christophe]
DS: go through tutorials sites elsewhere. E.g. Photoshop tutorial -> how do the same thing in SVG.
17:13:49 [darobin]
17:14:05 [darobin]
17:14:06 [Christophe]
DS: Also simpler things e.g. what is the simplest way to do a gradient, markers, etc.
17:14:23 [stelt]
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17:15:09 [Zakim]
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GA_SVGIG()11:00AM has ended
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Attendees were Shepazu, +1.713.851.aaaa, +1.312.540.aabb, JeffSchiller, Christophe_Strobbe, Rob_Russell, Don_Doherty, +, darobin
17:16:34 [Christophe]
Present: Doug_Schepers, Jeff_Schiller, Bruce_Rindahl, Rob_Russel, Ruud_Steltenpool, Donald_Doherty, Robin_Berjon, Anthony_Grasso, Christophe_Strobbe
17:16:42 [Christophe]
rrsagent, generate minutes
17:16:42 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate Christophe
17:17:59 [Christophe]
regrets: David_Dailey, Dominic_DePasquale, David_Porter, Andreas_Neumann, Manuel_Strehl
17:18:13 [Christophe]
rrsagent, generate minutes
17:18:13 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate Christophe
17:18:49 [Christophe]
17:18:51 [Christophe]
rrsagent, generate minutes
17:18:51 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate Christophe
17:19:21 [Christophe]
zakim, bye
17:19:21 [Zakim]
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17:20:30 [Christophe]
Present: Doug_Schepers, Jeff_Schiller, Bruce_Rindahl, Rob_Russel, Ruud_Steltenpool, Donald_Doherty, Robin_Berjon, Anthony_Grasso, Christophe_Strobbe, G_WadeJohnson
17:20:32 [Christophe]
rrsagent, generate minutes
17:20:32 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate Christophe
17:20:42 [stelt]
stelt has left #svgig
17:21:00 [Christophe]
rrsagent, bye
17:21:00 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items