IRC log of tsdtf on 2008-11-05

Timestamps are in UTC.

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logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/11/05-tsdtf-irc

09:16:08 [CarlosV]

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logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/11/05-tsdtf-irc

11:44:19 [shadi]

meeting: TSD TF f2f

11:44:24 [shadi]

scribe: shadi

11:44:25 [shadi]

05.11.2008 Participants: Shadi Abou-Zahra, Carlos Velasco, Johannes Koch, Yehya Mohamad

11:44:25 [shadi]

Test samples task force:

11:44:25 [shadi]

Starting point:

11:44:25 [shadi]

BenToWeb test suits: word suite changed to samples because suite does main the software is correct and sufficient. Samples does not have that meaning and does not imply the tool running the samples is accessible

11:44:26 [shadi]

Audience

11:44:28 [shadi]

Task force, review notes

11:44:29 [shadi]

People, who want to test their software

11:44:31 [shadi]

Goal for today's meeting:

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Basic concept and a mock up for today morning

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discuss it in a wider view

11:44:37 [shadi]

Create a stable concept as a start of implementation work.

11:44:39 [shadi]

Extensibility and maintenance are core issues of the architecture:-

11:44:41 [shadi]

CVS repository as a component

11:44:43 [shadi]

for reasons of extensibility and reusability, the architecture should stick to w3c architecture e.g. Using technologies like PHP, MYSQL etc.

11:44:46 [shadi]

Carlos presented the BenToWeb repository:

11:44:49 [shadi]

A cron job was synchronising with CVS every 6 hours

11:44:51 [shadi]

A static copy of the test (TCDL) was copied to the website

11:44:53 [shadi]

table automatically generated

11:44:54 [shadi]

The server (Cocoon) reads from the meta data and recognise the relevant data and generate them dynamically

11:44:56 [shadi]

SAZ: Are there filtering (sorting) technologies in the current system ? Answer No

11:44:58 [shadi]

There exists a human readable test viewable in a browser

11:45:01 [shadi]

There are different type of tests

11:45:02 [shadi]

plain HTML files

11:45:05 [shadi]

Change of the current BenToWeb JSP test files to the target language like PHP, python etc.

11:45:06 [shadi]

The Editor Parsifal would not be considered as it would mean a deep level involvement in Software development

11:45:08 [shadi]

Structure of CVS

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metdata

11:45:12 [shadi]

test files

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resources

11:45:16 [shadi]

CV: For tools FIT is working on development of the next version of their tool imergo, which will be able to run groups of tests

11:45:19 [shadi]

Accessing directly meta data vers. Accessing directly the HTML test files

11:45:21 [shadi]

Accessing the test files would be the start point, having a search page selecting criteria e.g. Technologies as a result would be

11:45:24 [shadi]

a tool friendly page: set of links

11:45:26 [shadi]

EARL output with expected results

11:45:28 [shadi]

Human friendly format

11:45:30 [shadi]

Accessing the meta data would be the next and ultimate step towards tool development implementing EARL

11:45:33 [shadi]

Search functionality

11:45:34 [shadi]

1.Technology – any, html, css, scripting...

11:45:36 [shadi]

2.Requirement - any, principle guidelines, success criteria

11:45:38 [shadi]

1.Guidelines, success criteria

11:45:40 [shadi]

1.Technics should show up

11:45:42 [shadi]

3.Level – A, AA, AAA

11:45:45 [shadi]

4.Select output parameters

11:45:46 [shadi]

Display defualt human readable output

11:45:48 [shadi]

Display just links to test files

11:45:50 [shadi]

Display expected results as EARL

11:45:53 [shadi]

SAZ:

11:45:54 [shadi]

we need to develop more test cases

11:45:56 [shadi]

AND a web interface to the test cases

11:45:58 [shadi]

3 Step search:

11:46:00 [shadi]

1.Select global parameters

11:46:03 [shadi]

2.Depending on the first selection select a level (optional)

11:46:05 [shadi]

3.Select the techniques

11:46:06 [shadi]

Output of the form is a URI pointing to a list of test files. This URI would be fed into the tools, which will then read all test files and process them sequentially and generate their own output.

11:46:09 [shadi]

File format:

11:46:11 [shadi]

Id – title – Techniques – Expected outcome - Test file - XML Meta data

11:46:13 [shadi]

Note: there is the problem of blocking IP's because of too much traffic! In this case the tool developer will create during the tests huge amount of requests to the w3C servers.

11:48:35 [shadi]

rrsagent, make logs world

11:48:40 [shadi]

rrsagent, make minutes

11:48:40 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/05-tsdtf-minutes.html shadi

11:52:57 [shadi]

shadi has changed the topic to: Lunch Break -- back shortly

12:28:25 [MikeS]

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12:36:31 [shadi]

hi mike!

12:36:46 [shadi]

just back from lunch, setting up

12:45:20 [shadi]

http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/2008/11/tsd-agenda

12:58:09 [CarlosV]

xslt file for TCDL 2.0 files: http://bentoweb.org/refs/TCDL2.0/tcdl2.0tsdtf_to_xhtml.xslt

13:13:06 [shadi]

http://www.bentoweb.org/ts/XHTML1_TestSuite3/metadata/sc3.2.4_l2_002

13:40:08 [Christophe]

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13:40:35 [shadi]

http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/tests/usingTCDL

13:41:42 [MichaelC]

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13:42:44 [MikeS]

we're in discussion - done with lunch

13:57:35 [JohannesK]

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13:58:10 [JohannesK]

mc: approach seems to be quite WCAG-specific

13:59:12 [shadi]

http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/tests/usingTCDL#structure

14:00:34 [shadi]

scribe: JohannesK

14:02:59 [shadi]

agenda+ Go Over Search Criteria

14:03:33 [shadi]

http://www.bentoweb.org/ts/XHTML1_TestSuite3/metadata/sc3.2.4_l2_002

14:06:00 [Christophe]

HTML view (sortable and with expected result): http://tinyurl.com/ynu7q4

14:06:50 [Christophe]

http://canada.esat.kuleuven.be/bentoweb/tsdtf/xhtml/index.html

14:08:26 [JohannesK]

works in FF 2

14:12:11 [shadi]

shadi has changed the topic to: Coffee Break -- back at 15:30 CET

14:12:40 [MikeS]

will redial in 20

14:28:45 [MikeS]

IBM's auto software installer just did an install and I need to reboot. will be back on in a few

14:33:35 [MikeS]

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14:34:32 [Tim]

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14:36:30 [MichaelC]

Tim http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/tests/WebInterface/Mockups/design.html

14:37:44 [MikeS]

trying to dial back in - not getting anything. anybody else try yet?

14:38:01 [shadi]

yes, all here :)

14:38:22 [MikeS]

+496940359803

14:38:32 [MikeS]

using our internal VOIP SameTime suite

14:38:36 [shadi]

yup, correct #

14:38:43 [MikeS]

worked fine this AM

14:39:06 [MikeS]

pls proceed without me; I'll listen in on IRC

14:39:37 [shadi]

http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/tests/WebInterface/Mockups/search.html

14:41:32 [shadi]

http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/tests/usingTCDL

14:45:12 [shadi]

MC: sorty by pass/fail -- expected outcome

14:45:39 [shadi]

MC: sorty by technology element -- such as "img", "table" etc

14:47:01 [MichaelC]

Note I mean more "search by" than "sort by" those features, though sorting on them useful too

14:51:50 [shadi]

http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/tools/

15:05:57 [shadi]

http://www.w3.org/2006/tsdtf/TestSampleStatusList

15:07:35 [JohannesK]

saz explains status list in WIKI

15:08:46 [JohannesK]

saz: can JIRA be a replacement?

15:09:01 [JohannesK]

CV: JIRA is an issue tracker

15:10:01 [JohannesK]

http://www.atlassian.com/software/jira/

15:10:14 [JohannesK]

CV: requires MySQL and Tomcat

15:22:47 [shadi]

tool should be self-contained

15:22:47 [shadi]

the basic interface should be a list as currently implemented in the wiki

15:22:47 [shadi]

templates for the structure review, content review, and issues are available

15:22:47 [shadi]

automated aspects such as schematron checking etc should be automatically built into the tool, rather than need to be installed separately

15:23:50 [shadi]

+ changing status (taking it over from the submitted reviews)

15:41:35 [shadi]

http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/tests/process

15:43:53 [JohannesK]

saz: we should think about how to get information about the submitter into the database

15:45:14 [JohannesK]

saz: either remove status from metadata or have the script update the field

15:48:57 [JohannesK]

CV: wish: give public read-only access to CVS repository

15:50:10 [JohannesK]

saz: then the status has to be in the metadata

16:10:20 [CarlosV]

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16:10:38 [shadi]

rrsagent, make logs world

16:10:43 [shadi]

rrsagent, make minutes

16:10:43 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/11/05-tsdtf-minutes.html shadi

16:10:44 [shadi]

rrsagent, make logs world

16:10:48 [shadi]

rrsagent, bye

16:10:48 [RRSAgent]

I see no action items