14:30:46 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rif
14:30:47 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-rif-irc
14:30:52 <ChrisW> zakim, this will be rif
14:30:52 <Zakim> ok, ChrisW; I see SW_RIF()11:00AM scheduled to start in 30 minutes
14:30:59 <ChrisW> rrsagent, make minutes
14:30:59 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-rif-minutes.html ChrisW
14:31:36 <ChrisW> Meeting: RIF Telecon 21-Oct-08
14:31:41 <ChrisW> Chair: Chris Welty
14:31:53 <ChrisW> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2008Oct/0083.html
14:32:06 <ChrisW> ChrisW has changed the topic to: 21 Oct RIF Telecon Agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2008Oct/0083.html
14:32:26 <ChrisW> rrsagent, make logs public
14:59:04 <DaveReynolds> DaveReynolds has joined #rif
15:00:04 <sandro> sandro has joined #rif
15:00:12 <sandro> zakim, who is here?
15:00:12 <Zakim> apparently SW_RIF()11:00AM has ended, sandro
15:00:13 <Zakim> On IRC I see sandro, DaveReynolds, RRSAgent, ChrisW, Zakim, trackbot
15:00:15 <Zakim> SW_RIF()11:00AM has now started
15:00:20 <Zakim> + +1.914.784.aaaa
15:00:23 <ChrisW> zakim, aaaa is me
15:00:23 <Zakim> +ChrisW; got it
15:00:28 <Zakim> +StuartTaylor
15:00:34 <Zakim> +Sandro
15:00:55 <mdean> mdean has joined #rif
15:01:12 <StellaMitchell> StellaMitchell has joined #rif
15:01:29 <Zakim> +Mike_Dean
15:01:37 <Hassan> Hassan has joined #rif
15:02:08 <Zakim> +[IBM]
15:02:15 <StellaMitchell> zakim, ibm is temporarily me
15:02:15 <Zakim> +StellaMitchell; got it
15:02:24 <ChrisW> hassan, will you be able to scribe today?
15:03:00 <Harold> Harold has joined #rif
15:03:00 <Gary_Hallmark> Gary_Hallmark has joined #rif
15:03:00 <yzhao> yzhao has joined #rif
15:03:07 <ChrisW> zakim, who is on the phone?
15:03:07 <Zakim> On the phone I see ChrisW, StuartTaylor, Sandro, Mike_Dean, StellaMitchell
15:03:18 <Zakim> -StuartTaylor
15:03:46 <josb> josb has joined #rif
15:03:47 <Zakim> +josb
15:04:01 <Zakim> +Hassan
15:04:06 <Zakim> +??P13
15:04:11 <Zakim> +??P14
15:04:26 <ChrisW> Scribe: Hassan
15:04:41 <Zakim> + +43.158.801.3aabb
15:04:46 <ChrisW> Last week's minutes: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2008Oct/att-0017/2008-10-07-minutes.html
15:04:57 <ChrisW> PROPOSED: accept minutes of last telecon
15:05:01 <ChrisW> RESOLVED: accept minutes of last telecon
15:05:25 <Harold> zakim, +43.158.801.3aabb is me
15:05:25 <Zakim> +Harold; got it
15:05:33 <ChrisW> zakim, take up item 2
15:05:33 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Action Review" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:05:37 <Hassan> No telecon on Oct. 28 - meetin cancelled
15:05:39 <Zakim> +Gary
15:05:49 <Hassan> s/meetin/meeting/
15:05:53 <ChrisW> zakim, who is on the phone?
15:05:53 <Zakim> On the phone I see ChrisW, Sandro, Mike_Dean, StellaMitchell, josb, Hassan, DaveReynolds, ??P14, Harold, Gary
15:06:35 <yzhao> zakim, ??P14 is me
15:06:35 <Zakim> +yzhao; got it
15:07:03 <sandro> action-621 done
15:07:16 <sandro> ACTION-621: done
15:07:16 <trackbot> ACTION-621 Start F2F12 wiki page notes added
15:07:23 <sandro> ACTION-621 done
15:07:27 <sandro> ACTION-621 complete
15:07:53 <DaveReynolds> ACTION-621: completed
15:07:54 <trackbot> ACTION-621 Start F2F12 wiki page notes added
15:07:56 <josb> ACTION-621 is done
15:08:33 <sandro> ACTION-621 closed
15:08:34 <trackbot> ACTION-621 Start F2F12 wiki page closed
15:10:47 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
15:11:08 <ChrisW> zakim, who is on the call
15:11:08 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who is on the call', ChrisW
15:11:11 <ChrisW> zakim, who is on the call?
15:11:11 <Zakim> On the phone I see ChrisW, Sandro, Mike_Dean, StellaMitchell, josb, Hassan (muted), DaveReynolds, yzhao, Harold, Gary, [IPcaller]
15:11:25 <mkifer> mkifer has joined #rif
15:11:25 <ChrisW> zakim, [ipcaller] is AdrianP
15:11:25 <Zakim> +AdrianP; got it
15:13:15 <Zakim> +Michael_Kifer
15:13:47 <StuartTaylor> StuartTaylor has joined #rif
15:14:39 <Harold> zakim, who is on the call?
15:14:39 <Zakim> On the phone I see ChrisW, Sandro, Mike_Dean, StellaMitchell, josb, Hassan (muted), DaveReynolds, yzhao, Harold, Gary, AdrianP, Michael_Kifer
15:15:04 <StuartTaylor> Zakim, StuartTaylor is with yzhao 
15:15:04 <Zakim> +StuartTaylor; got it
15:15:49 <sandro> action-613 closed
15:15:49 <trackbot> ACTION-613 Put f2f12 on agenda next week closed
15:17:17 <ChrisW> zakim, take up item 3
15:17:17 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Core" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:17:41 <ChrisW> PROPOSED: Core should keep safe disjunction in rule bodies. Implementations can be direct or use a well-known preprocessing step.
15:18:15 <ChrisW> RESOLVED: Core should keep safe disjunction in rule bodies. Implementations can be direct or use a well-known preprocessing step.
15:18:54 <DaveReynolds> It was Issue-75 I thinkg
15:19:34 <ChrisW> PROPOSED: Core should keep safe disjunction in rule bodies. Implementations can be direct or use a well-known preprocessing step.
15:19:44 <ChrisW> PROPOSED: CLose Issue-75
15:19:59 <ChrisW> RESOLVED: Close Issue-75
15:20:10 <ChrisW> action: Chris to close issue 75
15:20:10 <trackbot> Created ACTION-622 - Close issue 75 [on Christopher Welty - due 2008-10-28].
15:21:18 <Hassan> Harold discussing 2 sorts of "safeness"
15:21:20 <josb> I already said last week I'm fine with either choice
15:21:43 <ChrisW> PROPOSED: Parameterize the conformance clauses of Core with
15:21:43 <ChrisW> safeness requirements "strict" and "none" (default: "none").
15:22:11 <ChrisW> PROPOSED: Parameterize the conformance clauses of Core with safeness requirements "strict" and "none" (default: "none").
15:22:51 <ChrisW> action: chris to put proposal in agenda for next telecon (to close issue-70)
15:22:51 <trackbot> Created ACTION-623 - Put proposal in agenda for next telecon (to close issue-70) [on Christopher Welty - due 2008-10-28].
15:24:43 <Hassan> DaveReynolds: Looking for definition of Skolem functions that would suit both BLD and PRD. But this looks like two different concepts.
15:25:15 <Hassan> ChrisW: Does this mean Skloem functions should not be on Core?
15:25:48 <Hassan> DaveReynolds: Not necessarily - just that the logical notion is not good for PRD.
15:26:14 <Hassan> Harold: member is in Core - but not subclass
15:26:41 <ChrisW> zakim, take up item 4
15:26:41 <Zakim> agendum 4. "UCR" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:26:42 <Hassan> ChrisW: these are the 2 things remaining to discuss for Core
15:27:53 <Hassan> s/Skloem/Skolem/
15:28:35 <Hassan> AdrianPaschke: Updated some examples in the UCR document to use the canonical syntax
15:29:59 <Hassan> DaveReynolds: discusses the changes needed in his UCR examples (frames vs. predicates)
15:31:29 <Zakim> -Mike_Dean
15:32:42 <DaveReynolds> The 4.2 example seems to use nested frames - I didn't think that was supported in BLD PS.
15:34:02 <Hassan> ChrisW: looking for reviewers of the UCR document after AP is done with it (two weeks)
15:34:13 <ChrisW> action: stella to review UCR in two weeks
15:34:13 <trackbot> Created ACTION-624 - Review UCR in two weeks [on Stella Mitchell - due 2008-10-28].
15:34:21 <ChrisW> zakim, pick a victim
15:34:21 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Michael_Kifer
15:34:46 <ChrisW> zakim, pick a victim
15:34:46 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Gary
15:35:06 <ChrisW> action: Gary to review UCR in two weeks
15:35:07 <trackbot> Created ACTION-625 - Review UCR in two weeks [on Gary Hallmark - due 2008-10-28].
15:35:19 <ChrisW> zakim, take up item 5
15:35:19 <Zakim> agendum 5. "SWC" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:35:43 <josb> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/SWC
15:36:51 <Hassan> ChrisW: asking for comments before we publish this? discussion?
15:38:01 <Hassan> ChrisW: asking for reviewers for the SWC document...
15:38:13 <ChrisW> action: sandro freeze RDF&OWL
15:38:13 <trackbot> Created ACTION-626 - Freeze RDF&OWL [on Sandro Hawke - due 2008-10-28].
15:38:23 <ChrisW> action: Chris to review RDF&OWL
15:38:23 <trackbot> Created ACTION-627 - Review RDF&OWL [on Christopher Welty - due 2008-10-28].
15:38:58 <sandro> zakim, who is on the call?
15:38:58 <Zakim> On the phone I see ChrisW, Sandro, StellaMitchell, josb, Hassan (muted), DaveReynolds, yzhao, Harold, Gary, AdrianP, Michael_Kifer
15:39:01 <Zakim> yzhao has yzhao, StuartTaylor
15:39:08 <ChrisW> zakim, pick a victim
15:39:08 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Hassan (muted)
15:39:23 <ChrisW> zakim, pick a victim
15:39:23 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose AdrianP
15:39:39 <ChrisW> zakim, pick a victim
15:39:39 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose AdrianP
15:39:43 <ChrisW> zakim, pick a victim
15:39:43 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose ChrisW
15:39:45 <ChrisW> zakim, pick a victim
15:39:45 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose StuartTaylor
15:40:15 <Hassan> Stuart are U there?
15:40:23 <StuartTaylor> sorry ChrisW phone problems again
15:40:33 <StuartTaylor> yes, I'll do that
15:40:39 <ChrisW> action: StuartTaylor to review RDF&OWL in two weeks
15:40:39 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - StuartTaylor
15:40:48 <yzhao> I can also review it
15:41:00 <ChrisW> action: YutingZhao to review RDF&OWL in two weeks
15:41:00 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - YutingZhao
15:41:26 <ChrisW> action: Yuting to review RDF&OWL in two weeks
15:41:44 <ChrisW> action: Stuart to review RDF&OWL in two weeks
15:42:03 <sandro> action-600?
15:42:09 <sandro> issue-1?
15:42:16 <sandro> trackbot, help?
15:42:17 <trackbot> Created ACTION-628 - Review RDF&OWL in two weeks [on Yuting Zhao - due 2008-10-28].
15:42:18 <trackbot> Created ACTION-629 - Review RDF&OWL in two weeks [on Stuart Taylor - due 2008-10-28].
15:42:20 <trackbot> ACTION-600 -- Christopher Welty to draft revised metadata conformance wording for BLD -- due 2008-10-03 -- CLOSED
15:42:20 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/track/actions/600
15:42:22 <trackbot> ISSUE-1 -- This is a test issue. Please ignore. -- CLOSED
15:42:24 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/track/issues/1
15:42:26 <trackbot> See http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc for help
15:43:07 <ChrisW> zakim, list agenda
15:43:07 <Zakim> I see 10 items remaining on the agenda:
15:43:08 <Zakim> 1. Admin [from ChrisW]
15:43:08 <Zakim> 2. Action Review [from ChrisW]
15:43:09 <Zakim> 3. Core [from ChrisW]
15:43:09 <Zakim> 4. UCR [from ChrisW]
15:43:10 <Zakim> 5. SWC [from ChrisW]
15:43:10 <Zakim> 6. Test Cases [from ChrisW]
15:43:12 <Zakim> 7. Liason [from ChrisW]
15:43:14 <Zakim> 8. Public Comments [from ChrisW]
15:43:15 <ChrisW> zakim, take up item 6
15:43:16 <Zakim> 9. Pick Scribe [from ChrisW]
15:43:18 <Zakim> 10. AOB [from ChrisW]
15:43:20 <Zakim> agendum 6. "Test Cases" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:43:45 <ChrisW> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Category:Test_Case
15:46:03 <Hassan> Discussing the "Disjuctive Information from Negative Guards" test case
15:46:26 <Hassan> ChrisW: there are two cases
15:46:47 <Hassan> s/Discussing/ChrisW: Discussing/
15:47:43 <Hassan> ChrisW: discussing: Equality in conclusion 1, Equality in conclusion 2, Inconsistent Entailment - all seem to look good
15:47:45 <Zakim> +Mike_Dean
15:48:38 <Hassan> ChrisW: discussing No polymorphic symbols, Non-Annotation Entailment - both seem to look good
15:49:11 <Hassan> ChrisW: discussing http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Category:Proposed
15:49:54 <Hassan> ChirsW: Annotation Entailment needs to be discussed
15:50:07 <Hassan> s/ChirsW/ChrisW/
15:50:29 <ChrisW> PROPOSED: accept TC http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Annotation_Entailment
15:50:30 <Hassan> ChrisW: this case is about annotation in OWL
15:50:48 <ChrisW> RESOLVED: accept TC http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Annotation_Entailment
15:50:56 <StellaMitchell> yes
15:51:32 <ChrisW> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Argument_names_not_Const
15:52:53 <sandro> sandro: Wow -- that's not what I was expecting.  I dont like that.    We should allow IRIs.
15:53:27 <josb> "The argument names in ArgNames are written as unicode strings that must not start with a question mark, "?"."
15:54:01 <DaveReynolds> a countably infinite set of argument names, ArgNames (disjoint from Const and Var) 
15:54:36 <sandro> sandro: So maybe no one cares that Named Arguments are broken like this, since no one is ever going to use Named Arguments.   :-(   :-(
15:55:05 <sandro> _p("http://example.com/example#a"->4)
15:55:19 <sandro> (that IS okay)
15:55:42 <sandro> _p("http://example.com/example#a"->4)    IS OKAY
15:55:49 <josb> "http://example.com/example#a"^^xsd:string
15:55:51 <sandro> _p(<http://example.com/example#a>->4)    NOT  OKAY
15:56:04 <Hassan> JosB: points out that shorthands syntax is interfering with this...
15:56:15 <StellaMitchell> yes, they are in DTB
15:56:42 <Hassan> q+
15:57:15 <StellaMitchell> yes, it just can be a string that satisfies the syntaxs of a constant
15:57:27 <StellaMitchell> cannot, I mean
15:57:31 <Hassan> all: discussing the ambiguous syntax of identifiers
15:57:38 <StellaMitchell> it can be anything except something that is syntactically a constant
15:57:40 <Hassan> q?
15:57:50 <ChrisW> ack hassan
15:57:55 <Hassan> q+
15:58:06 <Hassan> q?
15:59:33 <Hassan> q-
15:59:39 <ChrisW> action: open issue on ambiguity in presentation syntax
15:59:39 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - open
15:59:48 <ChrisW> action: chris to open issue on ambiguity in presentation syntax
15:59:48 <trackbot> Created ACTION-630 - Open issue on ambiguity in presentation syntax [on Christopher Welty - due 2008-10-28].
16:01:03 <josb> q+
16:01:05 <Zakim> -Mike_Dean
16:01:45 <StellaMitchell> the BLD doc does give a reason for argname different from conts
16:02:05 <StellaMitchell> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/BLD#Terms
16:02:09 <Hassan> discussing the rationale of syntactic choices ...
16:02:20 <ChrisW> ack jos
16:02:39 <josb> http://example.com/example#a
16:02:54 <josb> _p(http://example.com/example#a->4) 
16:03:12 <Hassan> JosB: IRI's and Strings are usable there (as slots) but we need a means to identify that case.
16:03:46 <Gary> why don't we just get rid of named arg uniterms?
16:03:59 <josb> :)
16:04:09 <Hassan> All: discussing the nature of named-argument terms' slots
16:04:14 <Hassan> q-
16:04:33 <Hassan> q-
16:04:49 <sandro> Sandro: Oh, okay, I remember now why these argument names can't be constants (like slot names) -- we don't want equality to apply (as Michael is saying) -- we want them to be purely syntactic sugar.
16:04:59 <Hassan> Hassan has joined #rif
16:05:17 <sandro> Hassan, hello?
16:05:20 <Hassan> hello
16:06:00 <josb> q+
16:06:31 <josb> q-
16:06:40 <StellaMitchell> I can do that test case
16:06:43 <Hassan> JosB: let use the XML not the PS when the latter is ambiguous
16:06:53 <StellaMitchell> I can
16:07:08 <Hassan> s/let/let's/
16:07:13 <StellaMitchell> will make xml versions of all the test
16:07:15 <ChrisW> action: Stella make a positive syntax test version of Argument names not Const
16:07:16 <trackbot> Created ACTION-631 - Make a positive syntax test version of Argument names not Const [on Stella Mitchell - due 2008-10-28].
16:07:16 <StellaMitchell> test
16:08:30 <ChrisW> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Class_Membership
16:10:55 <sandro> Can someone read this in English:   fam:isParent(?Y ?X):- And (?Y=fam:Uwe fam:Uwe#fam:Parent ?X=fam:Adrian fam:Adrian#fam:Child)
16:12:58 <josb> q+
16:13:00 <DaveReynolds> q+
16:13:27 <DaveReynolds> q-
16:13:38 <DaveReynolds> Exactly what I was going to say!
16:13:50 <Hassan> JosB: I don't understand the purpose of the TC - should be simpler to illustrate membership
16:13:52 <sandro> Sandro: Yes, please, let's do this in a much simpler way.
16:13:58 <josb> q-
16:14:24 <ChrisW> action: adrian to shorten test case Class Membership
16:14:24 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - adrian
16:14:34 <ChrisW> action: apaschke to shorten test case Class Membership
16:14:34 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - apaschke
16:14:40 <ChrisW> action: paschke to shorten test case Class Membership
16:14:40 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - paschke
16:14:51 <ChrisW> action: adrianp to shorten test case Class Membership
16:14:51 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - adrianp
16:15:09 <Hassan> I concur with Sandro: the last rule makes no sense ...
16:15:21 <sandro> Sandro: It's baffling to have Adrian named in the body of the isParent rule.
16:16:17 <ChrisW> action: sandro to ask adiran to shorten test case Class Membership
16:16:17 <trackbot> Created ACTION-632 - Ask adiran to shorten test case Class Membership [on Sandro Hawke - due 2008-10-28].
16:16:26 <StellaMitchell> q+
16:17:48 <sandro> Sandro: I've been assuming we'd use the Prefix(...) declarations from the Premise in the Conclusion condition.
16:19:33 <Hassan> I fully concur with Jos on this - I already requested this (Prefix and Base are pragmas)
16:19:45 <sandro> Jos: Just say the the conclusion has the Prefix copied from the Premise
16:20:13 <StellaMitchell> a lot of the test case conclusions are not documents, but they are condition formulas
16:20:29 <StellaMitchell> and the xml validates by bldcond.xsd and not bldrule.xsd
16:21:29 <Hassan> s/adiran/AdrianPaschke/
16:21:45 <stu_> stu_ has joined #rif
16:22:07 <Hassan> q+
16:22:18 <StellaMitchell> q-
16:24:10 <josb> pre:local
16:24:28 <josb> =http://bla#local
16:24:45 <josb> (if Prefix(pre http://bla#local))
16:25:06 <Hassan> q-
16:25:07 <StellaMitchell> write conclusions in fully expanded format
16:25:18 <StellaMitchell> or anglebracket iri form
16:26:26 <Hassan> I agree with DaveReynolds - separting the macroexpansion from the syntax analysis
16:26:30 <StellaMitchell> I think fully expanded it ok
16:26:37 <Hassan> s/separt/separat/
16:28:03 <Hassan> DaveRaynolds: no - I propose to separate the pragmas from the examples
16:28:35 <Hassan> I agree wit Dave - that is what I proposed earlier 
16:28:54 <Hassan> s/DaveRay/DaveRey/
16:29:45 <ChrisW> action: chris to discuss how to specify prefixes on email
16:29:45 <trackbot> Created ACTION-633 - Discuss how to specify prefixes on email [on Christopher Welty - due 2008-10-28].
16:29:57 <Hassan> BTW: What Dave is porposing is what we did De Facto in the previous versions using namespaces
16:30:07 <Hassan> s/porpo/propo/
16:30:40 <Hassan> AOB?
16:30:48 <Zakim> -Michael_Kifer
16:30:49 <sandro> Sandro: Agreed -- namespace handling of the presentation syntax of the conclusion is something test-case-specific, not BLD-general.
16:30:50 <Zakim> -Gary
16:30:50 <Hassan> +1 to adjourn
16:30:52 <Zakim> -AdrianP
16:30:54 <Zakim> -StellaMitchell
16:30:54 <DaveReynolds> bye
16:30:57 <Zakim> -josb
16:30:58 <Zakim> -Harold
16:30:58 <Zakim> -Hassan
16:31:00 <Zakim> -DaveReynolds
16:31:00 <ChrisW> zakim, list attendees
16:31:00 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been +1.914.784.aaaa, ChrisW, StuartTaylor, Sandro, Mike_Dean, StellaMitchell, josb, Hassan, DaveReynolds, Harold, Gary, yzhao, AdrianP,
16:31:04 <Zakim> ... Michael_Kifer
16:31:07 <yzhao> ye
16:31:12 <ChrisW> Leora Morgenstern (Sukkot) StuartTaylor ChanghaiKe Christian de Sainte Marie (at risk) PaulVincent
16:31:28 <ChrisW> Regrets: Leora Morgenstern (Sukkot) StuartTaylor ChanghaiKe Christian de Sainte Marie (at risk) PaulVincent
16:31:30 <sandro> zakim, who is here?
16:31:30 <Zakim> On the phone I see ChrisW, Sandro, yzhao
16:31:31 <Zakim> yzhao has yzhao, StuartTaylor
16:31:32 <Zakim> On IRC I see StuartTaylor, Hassan, mkifer, Gary, Harold, mdean, sandro, RRSAgent, ChrisW, Zakim, trackbot
16:32:02 <ChrisW> rrsagent, make minutes
16:32:02 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-rif-minutes.html ChrisW
16:32:02 <sandro> Zakim, yzhao is Hassan
16:32:02 <Zakim> +Hassan; got it
16:32:07 <sandro> zakim, who is here?
16:32:07 <Zakim> On the phone I see ChrisW, Sandro, Hassan
16:32:08 <Zakim> Hassan has yzhao, StuartTaylor
16:32:09 <Zakim> On IRC I see StuartTaylor, Hassan, mkifer, Gary, Harold, mdean, sandro, RRSAgent, ChrisW, Zakim, trackbot
16:32:27 <ChrisW> rrsagent, make logs public
16:33:37 <sandro> http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-rif-minutes.html
16:33:39 <Hassan> hello
16:33:41 <sandro> http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-rif-minutes.html
16:33:42 <sandro> http://www.w3.org/2008/10/21-rif-minutes.html
16:33:47 <sandro> :_)
16:34:45 <Zakim> -Hassan
16:36:40 <Zakim> -ChrisW
16:36:42 <Zakim> -Sandro
16:36:43 <Zakim> SW_RIF()11:00AM has ended
16:36:45 <Zakim> Attendees were +1.914.784.aaaa, ChrisW, StuartTaylor, Sandro, Mike_Dean, StellaMitchell, josb, Hassan, DaveReynolds, Harold, Gary, AdrianP, Michael_Kifer