IRC log of mediafrag on 2008-10-20
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 06:38:56 [RRSAgent]
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- logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-irc
- 06:38:58 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, make logs public
- 06:38:58 [Zakim]
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- Zakim, this will be IA_MFWG
- 06:39:00 [Zakim]
- ok, trackbot; I see IA_MFWG()3:00AM scheduled to start in 21 minutes
- 06:39:01 [trackbot]
- Meeting: Media Fragments Working Group Teleconference
- 06:39:01 [trackbot]
- Date: 20 October 2008
- 06:39:40 [raphael]
- Agenda: http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/FirstF2FAgenda
- 06:39:49 [raphael]
- Chairs: Erik, Raphael
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- 07:07:36 [raphael]
- zakim, call IlesC
- 07:07:36 [Zakim]
- I am sorry, raphael; I do not know a number for IlesC
- 07:08:11 [raphael]
- zakim, call Iles_C
- 07:08:11 [Zakim]
- ok, raphael; the call is being made
- 07:08:12 [Zakim]
- IA_MFWG()3:00AM has now started
- 07:08:14 [Zakim]
- +Iles_C
- 07:11:04 [nessy]
- Meeting openend 9:08
- 07:11:16 [nessy]
- round of introductions
- 07:11:20 [nessy]
- Raphael
- 07:11:22 [nessy]
- Erik
- 07:11:36 [raphael]
- scribenick: raphael
- 07:12:00 [raphael]
- s/round of introductions/TOPIC: 1. Round of introductions
- 07:12:22 [raphael]
- Davy: also in Multimedia Lab, IBBT, Ghent (BE)
- 07:13:07 [raphael]
- Silvia: involved in MPEG-7, MPEG-21, developed Annodex (annotation format for ogg media files)
- 07:13:36 [raphael]
- ... start my own start up for measuring the audience of video on the web + consultant for Mozilla
- 07:13:47 [raphael]
- ... developped the TemporalURI specification, 6 years ago
- 07:14:55 [raphael]
- Guillaume Olivrin, South Africa, focus on accessibility, how do you attach specific semantics to parts of media
- 07:15:29 [raphael]
- Daniel Park, Samsung, co-chair of the Media Annotation, focus on IPTV (background in wireless networking)
- 07:16:06 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
- 07:17:51 [raphael]
- Andy Heath, Open University, UK, background on e-learning, but develop far more general technologies, focus on accessibility
- 07:18:57 [raphael]
- ... experience in standards such as LOOM, DC, SKOM
- 07:19:45 [raphael]
- s/LOOM/LOM
- 07:19:53 [raphael]
- s/SKOM/SKORM
- 07:20:50 [raphael]
- Colm Doyle: Blinkx
- 07:23:02 [raphael]
- Larry Masinter: Adobe, experience in co-chairing HTTP group, focus on acquisition of metadata
- 07:25:24 [guillaume_]
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- 07:26:22 [raphael]
- Khang Cham, Samsung, focus on IPTV
- 07:27:11 [raphael]
- Yves: W3C team contact, expertise in protocols, web services
- 07:28:37 [nessy]
- http://www.w3.org/2008/01/media-fragments-wg.html
- 07:29:13 [nessy]
- ... working group charter
- 07:31:11 [raphael]
- Larry: important to define first requirements for why these URIs will be used for
- 07:34:16 [raphael]
- ... it might happen that you can not satisfy all the requirements with a URI, don't put that out of scope now
- 07:34:33 [raphael]
- TOPIC: 2. Use Cases Discussion (Part 1)
- 07:34:44 [raphael]
- Photo Use Case: http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Use_Cases_%26_Requirements#Photobook_UC
- 07:35:57 [raphael]
- Slides at: http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/meetings/2008-10-20-f2f_cannes/photobook_UC.pdf
- 07:36:03 [raphael]
- Erik goes through the slides
- 07:40:03 [raphael]
- Erik: take parts of images ... and assemble them together in a slideshow
- 07:40:23 [raphael]
- Guillaume: unclear the value of the fragments here
- 07:40:35 [raphael]
- ... I understand fragment as taking a part of a large thing
- 07:58:18 [raphael]
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- 07:59:19 [raphael]
- Larry: is it worth at all to look at Spatial URIs? Is it for doing partial retrieval?
- 07:59:23 [raphael]
- Raphael: mention maps applications
- 07:59:26 [raphael]
- Larry: but they are intereactive!
- 07:59:30 [raphael]
- Raphael: mention multi-resolution images, image industry has huge need and will to expose high resolution version of images
- 07:59:33 [raphael]
- Larry: they do have JPEG2000 and protocols
- 07:59:36 [raphael]
- Silvia: SMIL has ellaborate on the need for spatial fragments
- 07:59:40 [davy]
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- 07:59:59 [raphael]
- Jack: important needs in the SMIL community and SVG ... image maps, pan zoom, cropping
- 08:00:02 [raphael]
- Erik: continues the presentation, after temporally assemble parts of images into a slideshow, assemble two parts of an image into a new one (stich)
- 08:00:05 [erik]
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- 08:00:05 [raphael]
- ... Existing technologies: RSS and Atom for the playlist generation
- 08:00:06 [jackjansen]
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- 08:00:08 [raphael]
- ... W3C SMIL: XML-based markup language, requires a SMIL player
- 08:00:11 [raphael]
- ... MPEG-21: Part 17 for fragment identification of MPEG Ressources, client-side processing ... pseudo playlist
- 08:00:14 [raphael]
- ... MPEG-A: MAF (Media Application Format) that combines MPEG technologies
- 08:00:17 [raphael]
- ... XSPF (spiff): XML Shareable Playlist Format: Xiph Community
- 08:00:19 [raphael]
- ... Discussion: is it out of scope or not? specific use cases around? other technologies around?
- 08:00:26 [davy]
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- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
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- 08:00:59 [nessy]
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- 08:02:42 [raphael]
- Guillaume: unclear the value of the fragments here
- 08:02:45 [Kangchan]
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- 08:02:51 [raphael]
- ... I understand fragment as taking a part of a large thing
- 08:02:59 [raphael]
- Silvia: we are mainly looking at audio and videos files, but a video is a sequence of images
- 08:03:24 [raphael]
- Larry: there are different servers and clients
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- 08:04:32 [raphael]
- Silvia: one way to look at a criteria is: is it a pure client-side issue or server-side + client-side problems?
- 08:05:16 [raphael]
- Larry: even if it is only a client-side issue, it might be worth to do some standardisation
- 08:05:29 [raphael]
- ... the main point of still images fragment is the interactivity
- 08:09:02 [raphael]
- Raphael: is interactivity the key interest in spatial fragment
- 08:09:39 [raphael]
- Larry: there is a lot of work in this area, would recommend to focus on the temporal issue
- 08:10:07 [raphael]
- ... it is also a good exercise to look at the out-of-scope use case, help to shape the scope
- 08:12:30 [raphael]
- Jack: URI is good because it is the web, the client is not necessarily aware of the time dimension
- 08:13:32 [raphael]
- ... HTML has already a notion of Area, so don't encode it in a URI
- 08:14:51 [raphael]
- Larry: need to be carreful on URIs, resources, representations
- 08:16:22 [raphael]
- ... example of an image: need to decode it, take the parts, re-encode it
- 08:16:32 [raphael]
- ... JPEG2000 might have a direct way to do that
- 08:17:41 [raphael]
- Guillaume: create mosaic, collage of parts of media
- 08:17:53 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
- 08:19:56 [raphael]
- Yves: it depends if the transformation needs to be on the client or not
- 08:20:57 [raphael]
- Jack: be carreful, to not put SVG in a URI :-)
- 08:21:20 [raphael]
- ... good balance on which processing can be on client side, and what is worth to put in a URL
- 08:22:05 [raphael]
- ... is it better to have the processing in the URL?
- 08:23:23 [raphael]
- Erik: we question again the interest of the spatial fragment
- 08:25:01 [raphael]
- Silvia: is it a question of the size of the media? Large: worth to have fragment, Small: not worth
- 08:26:33 [raphael]
- Larry: define what do you mean by media
- 08:27:18 [raphael]
- ... it is reasonable to limit yourself to videos
- 08:27:42 [raphael]
- Silvia: SMIL and Flash are interactive media, not necessarily one timeline
- 08:28:10 [raphael]
- ... we focus on a resource with one timeline
- 08:29:34 [raphael]
- ... there is a whole sweat of codecs issues
- 08:31:32 [raphael]
- Larry: define markers in videos
- 08:33:21 [Yves]
- time... what is the reference of time for a video, embedded time code? 0 for the start?
- 09:15:59 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
- 09:16:31 [davy]
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- 09:16:37 [raphael]
- Coffee break
- 09:16:42 [raphael]
- Map Use Case: http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Use_Cases_%26_Requirements/Map_Application_UC
- 09:16:57 [raphael]
- scribenick: erik
- 09:18:30 [erik]
- Raphael: Map UC Description
- 09:18:36 [nessy]
- http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Use_Cases_%26_Requirements
- 09:20:08 [erik]
- Raphael: Annotation is key
- 09:20:43 [guillaume]
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- 09:22:23 [Kangchan]
- Question : What is relation between Geolocation Working Group(with http://www.w3.org/2008/geolocation/) and Web Map Services
- 09:23:29 [erik]
- Raphael: UC examples using Yahoo, Google & Microsoft
- 09:26:33 [erik]
- Jack: what we see here are URI's for the applications, not images
- 09:27:46 [erik]
- Raphael will look deeper into different specs over the next couple of weeks for this Map UC
- 09:29:43 [erik]
- Davy & Jack: is this a valid UC? will our spatial URL adressing scheme will be used by Maps Applications?
- 09:30:56 [fsasaki]
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- 09:31:03 [erik]
- Raphael: as Larry said this morning, out-of-scope UC's are valid to come up with our final WG's scope
- 09:32:42 [guillaume]
- Must document the out of scope UC to explain why it is out of scope.
- 09:32:50 [erik]
- Sylvia: there might be a UC when we are talking about really large images (cfr. medical images in really high resolutions)
- 09:34:37 [erik]
- Sylvia: having a way to get a subpart of such a big image is nice to have, but implementation is something different ... a lot of complications, certainly on some server-side implimentations
- 09:37:26 [erik]
- Guillaume: codec issues not to be underestimated, have a nice adressing scheme vs. server-side complexity
- 09:39:09 [erik]
- Sylvia: should look further than just server-side complexity, solutions for certain codecs will come around eventually if needed
- 09:39:59 [erik]
- Jack: pratical issues vs. fundamental issues have to be taken into account within this group
- 09:40:50 [erik]
- Jack: media fragments are needed because some things can not e expressed today
- 09:41:37 [erik]
- s/not e/not be
- 09:43:06 [erik]
- Raphael: is it worth of having an overview of the TimedText WG?
- 09:45:58 [nessy]
- Guillaume: URI fragment identifier for text/plain: http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc5147.txt
- 09:46:07 [Yves]
- (multi-resolution formats, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FlashPix is a good example of a single file containing multiple resolutions, maybe better than the map application)
- 09:48:33 [erik]
- Raphael: Zoomify is good example of UC of very big images (life sciences) using fragments
- 09:50:57 [erik]
- Raphael: task of this group to insure interoperability of different standards? (eg. MPEG-21 URI to SVG)
- 09:51:14 [erik]
- s/insure/ensure
- 09:53:05 [erik]
- Sylvia: defining the mappings should be out-of-scope for this WG
- 09:53:45 [erik]
- Jack: worthwile is testing our scheme to the others out there
- 09:54:19 [erik]
- Sylvia: last thing to do & should be straight forward by then if we did a good job
- 09:55:01 [erik]
- Raphael: what about spatial dimension?
- 09:55:36 [erik]
- Sylvia: temporal adressing need is biggest, but spatial adressing need is also valid
- 09:57:32 [raphael]
- TOPIC: 3. Use Case Discussion (Part 2)
- 09:57:49 [erik]
- Sylvia presenting the Media Annotation UC
- 09:57:52 [raphael]
- http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Use_Cases_%26_Requirements#Media_Annotation_UC
- 10:00:27 [raphael]
- Annotation can be attached to the full media resource or to fragments of media resources
- 10:00:37 [raphael]
- s/Annotation/Silvia: Annotation
- 10:00:52 [raphael]
- scribenick: raphael
- 10:01:21 [raphael]
- Sylvia: annotations to fragment is relevant for this group
- 10:03:05 [raphael]
- Guillaume: can the structure of the video be represented in the URI
- 10:03:53 [raphael]
- Silvia: difference between the representation of the fragment and its semantics
- 10:06:08 [spark3]
- if necessary, what about adding a new UC (naming use case for fragment) into the Media Annotation WG UC ?
- 10:07:42 [raphael]
- Silvia: drawing on the board
- 10:15:01 [erik]
- Jack: there's only 1 timeline for timed media
- 10:16:14 [erik]
- Jack: there's only 1 coordinate system for spatial media
- 10:17:42 [erik]
- Jack: Annotation UC is important because we're reasoning on a higher abstraction level
- 10:18:42 [raphael]
- Jacck: loves that use case since it is purely about fundamental description and indexing of a media
- 10:18:48 [raphael]
- s/Jacck/Jack
- 10:19:44 [raphael]
- Silvia: goes through the advantages of a possible URI scheme for media fragments
- 10:21:41 [raphael]
- ... actually motivating the need for media fragments
- 10:22:00 [raphael]
- ... shows the picture at https://wiki.mozilla.org/Image:Video_Fragment_Linking.jpg
- 10:22:54 [raphael]
- ... jumps into the track problems
- 10:23:14 [raphael]
- ... there is actually 3 dimensions: space, time and track
- 10:27:03 [raphael]
- ... temporalURI just deal with cropping, no track awareness
- 10:32:44 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
- 10:33:53 [raphael]
- Jack: rename this use case into 'Anchoring'
- 10:34:00 [raphael]
- ... annotation = RDF community
- 10:34:08 [raphael]
- ... structuring = SMIL community
- 10:35:38 [raphael]
- Silvia: agree to rename it into Media Anchor Definition
- 10:35:44 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
- 11:58:53 [davy]
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- 12:00:42 [raphael]
- Lunch break
- 12:00:56 [raphael]
- Media Delivery Use Case: http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/Use_Cases_%26_Requirements#Media_Delivery_UC
- 12:04:21 [jackjansen]
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- 12:05:27 [raphael]
- scribenick: Jack
- 12:05:38 [Yves]
- Scribe: Jack
- 12:05:40 [jackjansen]
- scribenick: jackjansen
- 12:05:43 [raphael]
- scribenick: jackjansen
- 12:06:02 [jackjansen]
- zakim, who is the scribe?
- 12:06:02 [Zakim]
- I don't understand your question, jackjansen.
- 12:06:04 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html Yves
- 12:06:29 [jackjansen]
- TOPIC: Media Delivery use case
- 12:11:02 [raphael]
- Davi going through the slide at: http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/meetings/2008-10-20-f2f_cannes/media_delivery_UC.pdf
- 12:11:10 [raphael]
- s/Davi/Davy
- 12:17:00 [jackjansen]
- Various: (discussing slide 3, # vs. ? or ,): Can we use # as the only user-visible marker and use http-ranges or something similar?
- 12:18:19 [raphael]
- Silvia drawing a communication channel between UA and servers
- 12:22:16 [raphael]
- Discussion about the use of the "hash" character
- 12:27:40 [raphael]
- Yves: use case is to extract a frame of a video, and creates a new image (so a new resource), use a '?'
- 12:28:04 [raphael]
- ... use case is to keep the context, use a '#'
- 12:29:19 [raphael]
- Summary: there is use cases for both, should be further discussed tomorrow morning
- 12:29:32 [jackjansen]
- summary: there are use cases for both. We will get back to the subject tomorrow.
- 12:30:11 [spark3]
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- 12:30:39 [guillaume]
- dejà vue
- 12:31:03 [raphael]
- Davy: explains the MPEG-21 Fragment identification
- 12:31:18 [raphael]
- ... use of the '#', but no delivery protocol
- 12:33:43 [raphael]
- ... mention also the proposal of Dave Singer: UA get first N bytes representing the headers with timing and bytes offset information of the media resource
- 12:34:39 [raphael]
- ... goes through an explanation of MPEG-21: http://www.w3.org/2008/WebVideo/Fragments/wiki/State_of_the_Art#MPEG-21_Part_17:_Fragment_Identification_of_MPEG_Resources_.28Davy_.2F_Silvia.29
- 12:34:50 [raphael]
- ... 4 schemes
- 12:35:29 [raphael]
- ... ffp for the track
- 12:35:37 [raphael]
- ... offset for bytes range
- 12:38:05 [jackjansen]
- all: discussing #mp() scheme
- 12:38:07 [raphael]
- ... mp for specifying the temporal or spatial fragment (only for MPEG mime-type resources)
- 12:38:32 [jackjansen]
- Siylvia: whoever controls the mimetype also controls what is after the # in a url
- 12:38:50 [jackjansen]
- Jack: is surprised, but pleasantly so.
- 12:39:45 [jackjansen]
- s/Siylvia/sylvia
- 12:42:07 [raphael]
- Davy: the 4th scheme is 'mask' (only for MPEG resources)
- 12:48:24 [raphael]
- Jack: seems they structure the video resource and point towards this structure
- 12:49:19 [raphael]
- Raphael: how many user agents can understand this syntax?
- 12:49:31 [jackjansen]
- all: none, that we know of
- 12:49:41 [raphael]
- Davy: i'm not aware of ... altough there is a referenced implementation
- 12:50:47 [raphael]
- Larry: http is not necessarily the best protocol to transport video
- 12:52:35 [Yves]
- in video, it depends if you want exact timing, control of the lag, and in that case HTTP is not the best choice
- 12:54:03 [raphael]
- Silvia: I would say that most of the videos is transported over http
- 12:59:35 [raphael]
- ... RTP and RTSP have their own fragments, we should learn from them
- 13:00:27 [raphael]
- ... if they do not satisfy all our requirements, we can feed them so they extend the use of fragments in these protocols
- 13:00:44 [raphael]
- Davy: goes through TemporalURI
- 13:02:24 [raphael]
- ... this is the only that specifies a delivery protocol over http
- 13:06:45 [jackjansen]
- Silvia: Real used to allow something similar to temporal URLs
- 13:06:57 [jackjansen]
- Jack: thinks it may be part of the .ram files
- 13:07:34 [jackjansen]
- Guillaume: Flash allows doc author to export subparts by name, these can then be accessed with url#name
- 13:08:44 [jackjansen]
- Davy: continues with slide 6, http media delivery
- 13:08:52 [guillaume]
- Guillaume: Flash could also embed internal links in movie attached to certain frames. Once compiled with specific option, fragment of the Flash movie could be accessed using #
- 13:14:01 [raphael]
- Silvia: draw the four-way handshake
- 13:30:01 [raphael]
- ... 1st exchange: User requests http://www.example.com/resource.ogv#t=20-30
- 13:30:35 [raphael]
- ... UA does a GET <uri stripped of hash>, Range: time 20-30
- 13:31:53 [raphael]
- ... Server send back a Response 200, with the content-range: time 20-30 + content-type + ogg header + time-range bytes 50000-20000
- 13:32:14 [raphael]
- ... (needs to create a new http header, 'time-range')
- 13:32:33 [raphael]
- Raphael: can we use content-range: bytes ... ?
- 13:33:48 [raphael]
- ... UA does a GET <URI strriped of the hash>, Range x bytes: 5000-20000
- 13:34:35 [raphael]
- ... Server send back a Response 200, with the content-range bytes + the cropped data
- 13:39:29 [raphael]
- Silvia: it is not implemented yet as far as I know
- 13:39:41 [raphael]
- ... discussion based on a lot of discussions with proxies vendors
- 13:41:34 [raphael]
- Davy: could we apply the same four-way handshake with RTSP?
- 13:42:14 [raphael]
- ... RTSP specifies a Range Header, similar to the HTTP byte range mechanism
- 13:42:57 [spark3]
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- 13:43:09 [raphael]
- ... RTSP could support temporal fragments by a two-way handshake (using Range header)
- 13:43:25 [raphael]
- ... Problem: spatial fragments are not supported!
- 13:44:03 [raphael]
- Jack: the spatial problem is kind of orthogonal
- 13:44:44 [raphael]
- ... the spatial fragment will not be about bytes range
- 13:44:59 [raphael]
- Davy: cropping is more complex in images
- 13:46:42 [raphael]
- Jack: you're right, I can create a non-continous quicktime movie
- 13:48:17 [raphael]
- ... problem is it is not necessarily possible to generate a byte range from a time range
- 13:49:03 [raphael]
- Silvia: a single byte range
- 13:51:56 [jackjansen]
- all: the non-contiguous ranges may occur more often than we like. But maybe
- 13:52:20 [jackjansen]
- ... we can get away with ignoring them (because all relevant formats also have a contiguous form).
- 13:52:29 [jackjansen]
- ... need to discuss after the break.
- 13:53:17 [jackjansen]
- raphael: suggest coffee break
- 13:53:39 [guillaume]
- or need to coalesce
- 13:56:26 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html raphael
- 13:56:27 [jackjansen]
- Larry: please decouple representation of how you refer to fragments form he implementations
- 13:57:16 [jackjansen]
- ... Als think about embedded metadata: if the original has a copyright statement, do you get it wth every fragment?
- 13:57:22 [jackjansen]
- s/Als/Also
- 13:58:16 [jackjansen]
- Sylvia: (on prev subject): wonders whether http can do multiple byte ranges
- 13:58:27 [jackjansen]
- Larry: yes, I think so, with multipart
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- 14:30:06 [erik]
- rssagent, draft minutes
- 14:31:08 [erik]
- rrsagent, draft minutes
- 14:31:08 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html erik
- 14:33:48 [davy]
- scribenick: davy
- 14:34:11 [davy]
- Media Delivery UC
- 14:34:56 [davy]
- s/Delivery/Linking
- 14:35:40 [davy]
- raphael discusses the description written by Michael on the wiki
- 14:36:56 [davy]
- ... 3 things: bookmarking, playlists, and interlinking multimedia
- 14:37:11 [davy]
- silvia: definition of playlists is out of scope
- 14:37:35 [davy]
- guillaume: playlist is about presentation
- 14:43:28 [davy]
- raphael: regarding interlinked: temporal URIs can be described in RDF (RDF doc describing an audio file)
- 14:45:39 [davy]
- ... difference between URI and RDF (or SMIL, or ...): you need to parse the metadata
- 14:46:19 [davy]
- ... RDF description of time segment could be replaced by a temporal URI
- 14:49:22 [davy]
- silvia: interlinking multimedia is already covered in other UCs
- 14:53:54 [davy]
- Video Browser UC
- 14:54:21 [davy]
- silvia: large media files introduces special challenges
- 14:54:47 [davy]
- ... requirement for server-side processing
- 14:55:35 [davy]
- ... dynamic creation of thumbnails through URI mechanism
- 14:56:19 [davy]
- guillaume: link to PNG or GIF
- 14:56:28 [davy]
- ... provide a preview function of the resource
- 14:57:30 [davy]
- ... trivial: get all the I-frames of a video resource
- 14:57:36 [davy]
- ... use them as thumbs
- 15:00:26 [davy]
- ... thumbnail extraction is quite easy
- 15:00:49 [davy]
- silvia, jack: not so trivial, might be processing-intensive
- 15:02:07 [davy]
- silvia: it should be possible to point to one single frame with the URI scheme
- 15:03:11 [davy]
- jack: URI scheme does not know that frame is 'the' thumbnail
- 15:03:32 [davy]
- s/does/should
- 15:04:21 [davy]
- guillaume: you can have multiple thumbs per resource
- 15:05:27 [davy]
- raphael: URI scheme can point to a frame, but does not have knowledge about thumbs
- 15:06:50 [davy]
- raphael: should we be able to address in terms of frames?
- 15:07:09 [davy]
- guillaume: no, too coding-specific
- 15:07:38 [davy]
- RRSAgent, draft minutes
- 15:07:38 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html davy
- 15:08:23 [davy]
- silvia: previews of images?
- 15:08:35 [davy]
- ... preview is then a lower resolution image
- 15:08:49 [davy]
- guillaume: that is processing
- 15:09:57 [davy]
- ... mostly, previews are already part of the media resource
- 15:10:51 [davy]
- ... hence lower image resolutions are out of scope
- 15:14:45 [davy]
- jack: not too far?
- 15:15:01 [davy]
- ... is a preview embedded in a resource still a fragment?
- 15:18:17 [davy]
- guillaume: compare it with tracks
- 15:18:26 [davy]
- ... preview is just another track
- 15:19:23 [davy]
- raphael: we put this in mind and make a decision later
- 15:21:38 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html davy
- 15:24:11 [davy]
- silvia: previews are another sort of tracks
- 15:24:32 [davy]
- raphael: should we also to be able to address metadata within the headers?
- 15:26:19 [davy]
- silvia: it is not a common property of all the formats to have previews, therefore, it is not a candidate to be standardized
- 15:28:08 [davy]
- raphael: after first fase of the WG: report the current limitations
- 15:28:31 [davy]
- ... and wait for feedback
- 15:28:56 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html davy
- 15:29:05 [davy]
- Moving Point Of Interest UC
- 15:29:12 [davy]
- raphael: complex UC
- 15:30:04 [davy]
- ... should be for the second phase
- 15:30:55 [davy]
- jack: if this ever to be going to used at server-side?
- 15:31:03 [davy]
- ... if not, it is out of scope
- 15:31:42 [davy]
- raphael: you can share the link of the moving region
- 15:37:45 [davy]
- erik: delivery to mobile devices is a use case introduced by the public flemish broadcaster
- 15:38:23 [davy]
- jack: there is no reason to use URIs for that purpose, use metadata
- 15:39:57 [davy]
- raphael: it is like concatenating spatial fragments over time
- 15:45:33 [davy]
- guillaume: we are addressing points over space or time
- 15:46:02 [davy]
- raphael: refer to HTML image maps
- 15:51:25 [davy]
- raphael: region, interval can be defined by a combination of points
- 15:51:42 [davy]
- ... you need more than one point
- 15:53:50 [davy]
- Issues
- 15:54:08 [davy]
- raphael: we will discuss this tomorrow
- 15:54:42 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html davy
- 17:05:01 [Zakim]
- disconnecting the lone participant, Iles_C, in IA_MFWG()3:00AM
- 17:05:02 [Zakim]
- IA_MFWG()3:00AM has ended
- 17:05:04 [Zakim]
- Attendees were Iles_C
- 17:35:20 [Zakim]
- Zakim has left #mediafrag
- 19:30:55 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/20-mediafrag-minutes.html Yves
- 20:24:54 [nessy]
- nessy has joined #mediafrag