15:44:19 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #soap-jms
15:44:19 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-soap-jms-irc
15:44:21 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
15:44:21 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #soap-jms
15:44:23 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be SJMS
15:44:23 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WS_SOAP-JM()12:00PM scheduled to start in 16 minutes
15:44:24 <trackbot> Meeting: SOAP-JMS Binding Working Group Teleconference
15:44:24 <trackbot> Date: 07 October 2008
15:53:00 <rmerric> rmerric has joined #soap-jms
15:53:24 <alewis> alewis has joined #soap-jms
15:53:34 <rmerric> rmerric has changed the topic to: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-soap-jms/2008Oct/0000.html
15:53:35 <Phil> Phil has joined #soap-jms
15:53:55 <rmerric> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-soap-jms/2008Oct/0000.html
15:54:18 <rmerric> Meeting: SOAP-JMS Binding Working Group Teleconference
15:54:26 <Zakim> WS_SOAP-JM()12:00PM has now started
15:54:33 <Zakim> +[IBM]
15:54:40 <Roland> Roland has joined #soap-jms
15:54:44 <Phil> Zakim, IBM is Phil
15:54:44 <Zakim> +Phil; got it
15:55:08 <Roland> Zakim, this will be WS_SOAP-JM
15:55:08 <Zakim> ok, Roland, I see WS_SOAP-JM()12:00PM already started
15:55:33 <Roland> Zakim, this is WS_SOAP-JM
15:55:33 <Zakim> Roland, this was already WS_SOAP-JM()12:00PM
15:55:34 <Zakim> ok, Roland; that matches WS_SOAP-JM()12:00PM
15:56:21 <Zakim> +Roland_Merrick
15:56:25 <Zakim> -Phil
15:56:26 <Zakim> +Phil
15:56:38 <Roland> Zakim, Roland_Merrick is Roland
15:56:38 <Zakim> +Roland; got it
15:56:53 <Roland> rrsagent, make minutes
15:56:53 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-soap-jms-minutes.html Roland
15:57:03 <Roland> rrsgagent, make log public
15:58:49 <Roland> Chair: Roland
15:59:02 <Derek> Derek has joined #soap-jms
15:59:17 <Roland> Regrets: Mark, Bhakti
15:59:39 <Roland> rrsagent, make minutes
15:59:39 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-soap-jms-minutes.html Roland
15:59:39 <Zakim> + +1.708.246.aaaa
15:59:57 <Roland> Zakim, aaaa is Derek
15:59:57 <Zakim> +Derek; got it
16:01:06 <peaston> peaston has joined #soap-jms
16:01:12 <eric> eric has joined #soap-jms
16:02:08 <Zakim> +Peter_Easton
16:02:24 <Zakim> + +1.650.846.aabb
16:02:41 <eric> Zakim, aabb is eric
16:02:41 <Zakim> +eric; got it
16:02:58 <Zakim> +Yves
16:03:18 <Zakim> + +1.919.742.aacc
16:04:59 <eric> scribe: eric
16:05:21 <eric> Topic: TextMessage
16:07:39 <eric> eric: Since nobody objected to mark's email, that seems to be consensus about adopting Phil's proposal.
16:07:57 <eric> ... my action was in addition to that proposal - the concerns about using TextMessage.
16:07:58 <Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-soap-jms/2008Oct/0003.html
16:08:48 <eric> eric walking us through the proposal...
16:09:43 <Yves> issue is that base64 encoded in utf-16 is very inefficient
16:12:16 <eric> eric: no normative statements in this proposal.
16:12:54 <eric> roland: suggest that we put it in line, and see how it reads.
16:13:06 <eric> ... and then if we think it doesn't read well,  move it to an appendix.
16:13:57 <eric> eric: does anyone object to what I wrote...?
16:14:00 <eric> (no objections)
16:14:24 <eric> roland: I'll do the work of getting the text into the spec.
16:14:52 <eric> action: Roland - put the just agreed-upon changes related to TextMessage into the spec (Phil's write up & Eric's writeup)
16:14:52 <trackbot> Created ACTION-38 - - put the just agreed-upon changes related to TextMessage into the spec (Phil's write up & Eric's writeup) [on Roland Merrick - due 2008-10-14].
16:15:21 <Roland> Topic: actions
16:15:22 <Roland> http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/soapjms/tracker/actions/open
16:16:00 <eric> close action-36
16:16:00 <trackbot> ACTION-36 Write up details around the use of text message, specifically addressing the "encoding" element in XML, the increased size as a consequence of base64 encoding. closed
16:16:27 <peaston> peaston has joined #soap-jms
16:16:41 <eric> close action-35
16:16:41 <trackbot> ACTION-35 Update proposal re context variant and reply to for queue and topic closed
16:18:28 <eric> close action-37
16:18:28 <trackbot> ACTION-37 Write up how to indicate use of text message in WSDL. closed
16:19:37 <Roland> Topic: URI changes
16:19:39 <Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-soap-jms/2008Sep/0046.html
16:27:24 <eric> derek: Should we need to be able let someone specify a temporary topic?
16:27:34 <eric> amy: Can't imagine anyone using a temporary topic.
16:29:27 <eric> eric: don't think the scenario derek is raising actually applies.
16:29:53 <eric> ... only applies when the server specifically wants to set the reply destination - which is a rare case.
16:30:46 <eric> peter: This is flexible - so long as we do not require reply to in the URI.
16:36:16 <eric> action: roland to email/phone Oracle/BEA to see if they want to continue to be listed on the URI specification by 2008-10-08
16:36:16 <trackbot> Created ACTION-39 - Email/phone Oracle/BEA to see if they want to continue to be listed on the URI specification by 2008-10-08 [on Roland Merrick - due 2008-10-14].
16:36:44 <eric> Eric's change to URI scheme agreed to.
16:38:17 <Roland> Topic: WSDL normative status
16:39:03 <Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-soap-jms/2008Sep/0043.html
16:41:29 <eric> roland: soap protocol support required, WSDL 1.1 & WSDL 2.0 both optional, but if you implement them, you must implement them as stated.
16:42:11 <eric> action: roland to write up specific proposal for conformance to address the normative concerns.
16:42:11 <trackbot> Created ACTION-40 - Write up specific proposal for conformance to address the normative concerns. [on Roland Merrick - due 2008-10-14].
16:44:02 <Roland> Topic: indication of textmessage in WSDL
16:44:14 <Roland> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-soap-jms/2008Oct/0007.html
16:48:11 <eric> eric: My concern about specifying anything is that then we have to specify conformance around what it means if you receive something other than what was expected.
16:48:53 <eric> peaston: yes, this is about legacy scenarios.
16:50:32 <eric> eric: we have a use case at TIBCO for sending TextMessage - but it is client side configuration, and doesn't appear in WSDL.
16:50:58 <eric> peaston: not uncomfortable with not putting this in the spec.
16:51:51 <eric> Phil: since we expect the runtime vendor to indicate whether to use text or bytes.  If we allow for the message type to be specified - if you support WSDL 1.1 - then you have to support that message type parameter in the WSDL, and that might not make sense based on what the vendor has already defined.
16:52:09 <eric> Roland: have we just talked ourselves out of doing this?
16:52:25 <eric> Phil: Since we're not fully specifying, we probably shouldn't mention anything - up to the runtime vendor.
16:53:11 <eric> Roland: anyone disagree with what Phil just said?
16:53:21 <eric> ... anyone think that we should keep this?
16:53:39 <eric> ... anyone object to dropping this item?
16:54:34 <eric> peaston: dropping it is fine.  I put it forth because of the use cases presented to support legacy interaction.  If vendors are going to have their own switches, that's probably fine.
16:55:04 <eric> ... also through out the idea for ad-hoc items in the WSDL.
16:55:14 <eric> Roland: Still on the agenda - we can do that next week.
16:56:02 <eric> Phil: Can you clarify something - legacy vendor - they only accept text messages - to be truly interoperable, I need to know somehow how to send TextMessages.
16:56:18 <Phil> actually that was Derek :)
16:57:01 <eric> peaston: I might be able to describe myself in WSDL, and have a newer client work with my endpoint.  A legacy server that only accepts TextMessage....
16:57:23 <eric> Derek: We're not precluding a vendor specifying something to accommodate that.
16:57:34 <eric> peaston: I just threw this out there to see if there is some interest.
16:58:06 <eric> Oops - and that Derek before peaston - that was Phil.
16:58:16 <eric> (SORRY!)
16:59:46 <eric> Roland: Can we close of the issue of specifying text vs. bytes in WSDL? We're not going to specify it.
16:59:53 <eric> (no disagreement on the call)
17:00:01 <Zakim> -alewis
17:00:06 <Zakim> -Derek
17:00:08 <Zakim> -Phil
17:00:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-soap-jms-minutes.html Yves
17:00:12 <Zakim> -eric
17:00:16 <Zakim> -Roland
17:00:18 <Zakim> -Yves
17:00:46 <Zakim> -Peter_Easton
17:00:47 <Zakim> WS_SOAP-JM()12:00PM has ended
17:00:48 <Zakim> Attendees were Phil, Roland, +1.708.246.aaaa, Derek, Peter_Easton, +1.650.846.aabb, eric, Yves, +1.919.742.aacc, alewis
17:00:57 <Roland> 06rrsagent, draft minutes01
17:01:24 <Roland> rrsagent, make minutes
17:01:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-soap-jms-minutes.html Roland
17:01:55 <Roland> rrsagent, make minutes
17:01:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-soap-jms-minutes.html Roland
17:03:32 <Roland> rrsagent, please part
17:03:32 <RRSAgent> I see 3 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-soap-jms-actions.rdf :
17:03:32 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Roland - put the just agreed-upon changes related to TextMessage into the spec (Phil's write up & Eric's writeup) [1]
17:03:32 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-soap-jms-irc#T16-14-52
17:03:32 <RRSAgent> ACTION: roland to email/phone Oracle/BEA to see if they want to continue to be listed on the URI specification by 2008-10-08 [2]
17:03:32 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-soap-jms-irc#T16-36-16
17:03:32 <RRSAgent> ACTION: roland to write up specific proposal for conformance to address the normative concerns. [3]
17:03:32 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-soap-jms-irc#T16-42-11