IRC log of rif on 2008-10-07

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:47:39 [RRSAgent]: RRSAgent has joined #rif
14:47:39 [RRSAgent]: logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-rif-irc
14:47:44 [ChrisW]: zakim, this will be rif
14:47:44 [Zakim]: ok, ChrisW; I see SW_RIF()11:00AM scheduled to start in 13 minutes
14:47:55 [ChrisW]: Meeting: RIF Telecon 7-Oct-08
14:48:01 [ChrisW]: Chair: Chris Welty
14:48:53 [ChrisW]: Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2008Oct/0013.html
14:49:06 [ChrisW]: ChrisW has changed the topic to: Oct 7 telecon agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2008Oct/0013.html
14:49:22 [ChrisW]: rrsagent, make minutes
14:49:22 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-rif-minutes.html ChrisW
14:49:36 [ChrisW]: agenda+ Admin
14:49:41 [ChrisW]: agenda+ Liason
14:49:56 [ChrisW]: agenda+ Public comments
14:50:02 [ChrisW]: agenda+ Action Review
14:50:09 [ChrisW]: agenda+ Publication plans
14:50:25 [ChrisW]: agenda+ OWL2-RL
14:50:30 [ChrisW]: agenda+ PRD
14:50:40 [ChrisW]: agenda+ Weak vs. strong safety
14:50:49 [ChrisW]: agenda+ Test cases
14:50:53 [ChrisW]: agenda+ Pick scribe
14:50:57 [ChrisW]: agenda+ AOB
14:51:03 [ChrisW]: rrsagent, make logs public
14:51:59 [StuartTaylor]: StuartTaylor has joined #rif
14:53:46 [ChanghaiKe]: ChanghaiKe has joined #rif
14:55:38 [Zakim]: SW_RIF()11:00AM has now started
14:55:40 [Zakim]: +??P15
15:00:24 [mdean]: mdean has joined #rif
15:00:50 [csma]: csma has joined #rif
15:00:51 [Zakim]: +Mike_Dean
15:00:52 [Zakim]: -Mike_Dean
15:00:53 [Zakim]: +Mike_Dean
15:01:03 [LeoraMorgenstern]: LeoraMorgenstern has joined #rif
15:01:38 [Zakim]: +[NRCC]
15:01:46 [Zakim]: +??P33
15:01:54 [csma]: zakim, ??P33 is me
15:01:54 [Zakim]: +csma; got it
15:02:15 [csma]: zakim, mute me
15:02:15 [Zakim]: csma should now be muted
15:02:18 [Hassan]: Hassan has joined #rif
15:02:20 [Zakim]: + +24356aaaa
15:02:20 [Zakim]: + +0122427aabb
15:02:27 [csma]: zakim, who is on the phone?
15:02:27 [Zakim]: On the phone I see ??P15, Mike_Dean, [NRCC], csma (muted), +24356aaaa, +0122427aabb
15:02:37 [csma]: zakim, unmute �e
15:02:37 [Zakim]: sorry, csma, I do not know which phone connection belongs to �e
15:02:50 [csma]: zakim, unmute me
15:02:50 [Zakim]: csma should no longer be muted
15:03:09 [Harold]: zakim, NRCC is me
15:03:09 [Zakim]: +Harold; got it
15:03:11 [Zakim]: + +1.212.781.aacc
15:03:17 [csma]: zakim, ??P15 is ChanghaiKE
15:03:19 [Zakim]: +ChanghaiKE; got it
15:03:20 [LeoraMorgenstern]: zakim, aacc is me
15:03:21 [Gary_Hallmark]: Gary_Hallmark has joined #rif
15:03:24 [Zakim]: +LeoraMorgenstern; got it
15:03:37 [csma]: zakim, ChanhaiKE is ChanghaiKe
15:03:45 [Zakim]: -Hassan
15:03:49 [Zakim]: sorry, csma, I do not recognize a party named 'ChanhaiKE'
15:03:55 [josb]: josb has joined #rif
15:03:58 [csma]: zakim, ChanhaiKE is ChanghaiKe
15:03:58 [csma]: <Zakim> -Hassan
15:04:04 [csma]: zakim, ChanhaiKE is ChanghaiKe
15:04:04 [csma]: <Zakim> -Hassan
15:04:05 [Zakim]: - +24356aaaa
15:04:07 [Zakim]: sorry, csma, I do not recognize a party named 'ChanhaiKE'
15:04:07 [Hassan]: Hassan has joined #rif
15:04:15 [Zakim]: sorry, csma, I do not recognize a party named 'ChanhaiKE'
15:04:18 [csma]: zakim, ChanghaiKE is ChanghaiKe
15:04:35 [Zakim]: + +39.047.101.aadd
15:04:39 [Zakim]: +ChanghaiKe; got it
15:04:43 [Zakim]: + +1.503.533.aaee
15:04:47 [Zakim]: +Hassan
15:04:51 [Zakim]: +[IBM]
15:04:54 [ChrisW]: zakim, ibm is temporarily me
15:05:02 [Gary]: zakim, aaee is me
15:05:14 [csma]: zakim, who is on the phone?
15:05:15 [Zakim]: +ChrisW; got it
15:05:23 [Zakim]: + +24356aaff
15:05:25 [Zakim]: +Gary; got it
15:05:27 [Zakim]: +Sandro
15:05:30 [Zakim]: On the phone I see ChanghaiKe, Mike_Dean, Harold, csma, LeoraMorgenstern, josb, Gary, Hassan, ChrisW, +24356aaff, Sandro
15:05:32 [StuartTaylor]: zakim, who is on the phone?
15:05:40 [Zakim]: On the phone I see ChanghaiKe, Mike_Dean, Harold, csma, LeoraMorgenstern, josb, Gary, Hassan, ChrisW, +24356aaff, Sandro
15:05:49 [StuartTaylor]: zakim, aaaf is me
15:05:49 [Zakim]: sorry, StuartTaylor, I do not recognize a party named 'aaaf'
15:06:01 [StuartTaylor]: zakim, aaff is me
15:06:08 [Zakim]: +StuartTaylor; got it
15:06:25 [csma]: scribe: Changhai Ke
15:06:42 [ChrisW]: scribe: ChanghaiKe
15:06:45 [csma]: scribenick: ChanghaiKe
15:06:57 [ChrisW]: zakim, next item
15:06:57 [Zakim]: agendum 1. "Admin" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:07:01 [ChanghaiKe]: We get started
15:07:27 [ChanghaiKe]: Accept minutes from last week and week ago
15:07:29 [ChrisW]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2008Sep/att-0206/2008-09-23-minutes-revised.html
15:07:35 [csma]: zakim, mute me
15:07:35 [Zakim]: csma should now be muted
15:07:51 [ChrisW]: PROPOSED: accept minutes of Sept 23 telecon
15:07:53 [mdean]: mdean has joined #rif
15:08:00 [ChrisW]: RESOLVED: accept minutes of Sept 23 telecon
15:08:09 [ChrisW]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2008Oct/att-0003/20080930-rif-minutes.html
15:08:19 [ChrisW]: PROPOSED: accept minutes of Sept 30 telecon
15:08:29 [ChrisW]: RESOLVED: accept minutes of Sept 30 telecon
15:08:43 [ChanghaiKe]: Any agenda amendment?
15:08:49 [ChanghaiKe]: all right
15:08:52 [ChrisW]: zakim, next item
15:08:52 [Zakim]: agendum 2. "Liason" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:09:22 [ChrisW]: zakim, next item
15:09:22 [Zakim]: agendum 2 was just opened, ChrisW
15:09:31 [ChrisW]: zakim, close item 2
15:09:31 [Zakim]: agendum 2, Liason, closed
15:09:32 [Zakim]: I see 9 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:09:33 [Zakim]: 3. Public comments [from ChrisW]
15:09:34 [ChrisW]: zakim, next item
15:09:34 [Zakim]: agendum 3. "Public comments" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:10:16 [ChanghaiKe]: In wiki, answers to public comments, in good shape
15:10:59 [ChanghaiKe]: Comment priod closed, is there any comment or discussion?
15:11:06 [ChrisW]: zakim, next item
15:11:06 [Zakim]: agendum 4. "Action Review" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:11:31 [csma]: zakim, unmute me
15:11:31 [Zakim]: csma should no longer be muted
15:14:21 [ChanghaiKe]: For Gary, deadline will be 13/10
15:14:29 [ChrisW]: action: csma to put f2f12 on agenda next week
15:14:29 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-613 - Put f2f12 on agenda next week [on Christian de Sainte Marie - due 2008-10-14].
15:14:54 [DaveReynolds]: DaveReynolds has joined #rif
15:14:58 [mkifer]: mkifer has joined #rif
15:15:08 [Zakim]: + +44.145.441.aagg
15:15:35 [ChrisW]: zakim, who is on the phone?
15:15:35 [Zakim]: On the phone I see ChanghaiKe, Mike_Dean, Harold, csma, LeoraMorgenstern, josb, Gary, Hassan (muted), ChrisW, StuartTaylor, Sandro, DaveReynolds
15:17:26 [Zakim]: -LeoraMorgenstern
15:17:30 [ChanghaiKe]: where can I find the list of actions currently under review?
15:17:47 [DaveReynolds]: http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/track/actions/open
15:18:08 [LeoraMorgenstern]: disconnected, but will reconnect in a minute
15:18:21 [Zakim]: +Michael_Kifer
15:18:23 [Zakim]: +LeoraMorgenstern
15:19:09 [mkifer]: zakim, mute me
15:19:09 [Zakim]: sorry, mkifer, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
15:19:43 [ChanghaiKe]: Action 588 status
15:19:43 [trackbot]: Sorry, couldn't find user - 588
15:19:50 [Zakim]: + +49.351.315.aahh
15:20:26 [ChanghaiKe]: Actions: 583 & 580
15:20:29 [ChanghaiKe]: Not here
15:21:09 [ChanghaiKe]: 583 and 580 are ongoing discussions
15:22:09 [csma]: zakim, Michael_Kifer is mkifer
15:22:10 [Zakim]: +mkifer; got it
15:22:40 [Gary]: action 591 is continued...
15:22:40 [trackbot]: Sorry, couldn't find user - 591
15:22:46 [ChrisW]: action: leora to start discussion on what test cases we need
15:22:46 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-614 - Start discussion on what test cases we need [on Leora Morgenstern - due 2008-10-14].
15:23:19 [ChanghaiKe]: Action 576 is closed
15:23:19 [trackbot]: Sorry, couldn't find user - 576
15:23:47 [Hassan]: yes
15:24:07 [ChanghaiKe]: Action 564: update due date to end oct
15:24:07 [trackbot]: Sorry, couldn't find user - 564
15:24:49 [sandro]: ChanghaiKe, you don't need to be recording these action details -- Christian is using the web interface to do it.
15:25:01 [sandro]: (or at least he said he was.)
15:25:01 [ChanghaiKe]: OK, thanks.
15:25:12 [StuartTaylor]: sorry I'm here
15:25:18 [sandro]: zakim, who is on the phone?
15:25:18 [Zakim]: On the phone I see ChanghaiKe, Mike_Dean, Harold, csma, josb, Gary, Hassan (muted), ChrisW, StuartTaylor, Sandro, DaveReynolds, mkifer, LeoraMorgenstern, +49.351.315.aahh
15:25:19 [StuartTaylor]: phone doesn't seem to work
15:25:27 [csma]: yes, I am doing it
15:25:31 [StuartTaylor]: yes, I'll talk to Jeff about the test cases
15:28:17 [ChrisW]: zakim, next item
15:28:17 [Zakim]: agendum 5. "Publication plans" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:29:02 [Zakim]: - +49.351.315.aahh
15:29:07 [ChanghaiKe]: Plan for most of them. Have frozen version by 3rd week oct. working group reviews for weeks
15:29:18 [Zakim]: -Hassan
15:29:41 [Zakim]: -Mike_Dean
15:29:54 [ChanghaiKe]: New draft BLD
15:29:59 [Zakim]: +Hassan
15:30:05 [csma]: q+
15:30:31 [StuartTaylor]: Hassan, I think that you have my phone identifier
15:30:41 [Zakim]: + +49.351.315.aaii
15:31:06 [csma]: zakim, who is on the phone?
15:31:06 [Zakim]: On the phone I see ChanghaiKe, Harold, csma, josb, Gary, ChrisW, StuartTaylor, Sandro, DaveReynolds, mkifer, LeoraMorgenstern, Hassan, +49.351.315.aaii
15:31:07 [ChanghaiKe]: What about core? Are the issues actually blocking the publication? We can publish without solving all the issues.
15:32:09 [ChanghaiKe]: BLD is too large for rule engines
15:32:53 [ChanghaiKe]: Publish a working draft next month?
15:33:11 [csma]: dave, harold: yes
15:34:28 [Gary]: we don't take Columbus day off
15:34:48 [StuartTaylor]: csma is +49 the country code, or something else?
15:35:09 [csma]: @stuart: yes, it is
15:35:10 [DaveReynolds]: OK for me
15:35:15 [LeoraMorgenstern]: IBM does not give off for Columbus Day
15:35:20 [Gary]: monday is fine w/ me
15:35:25 [ChanghaiKe]: are core people avalable for next monday, 13/10?
15:35:37 [ChanghaiKe]: Yes for Gary
15:35:50 [ChanghaiKe]: and some others
15:36:02 [csma]: zakim, aaii is AdrianPaschke
15:36:02 [Zakim]: +AdrianPaschke; got it
15:36:19 [ChrisW]: ack csma
15:37:00 [ChanghaiKe]: <csma> First week of Nov for next version of PRD
15:37:29 [ChanghaiKe]: <csma> 04/11.
15:37:51 [ChanghaiKe]: <csma> Corrected: 07/11
15:38:08 [ChanghaiKe]: This will be the second draft of PRD
15:39:07 [ChanghaiKe]: Do we maintain weekly meeting the week of BRF end oct?
15:39:09 [ChrisW]: action: csma to decide if we will cancel Oct 28th telecon
15:39:09 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-615 - Decide if we will cancel Oct 28th telecon [on Christian de Sainte Marie - due 2008-10-14].
15:39:38 [Zakim]: +Mike_Dean
15:39:40 [csma]: Ok, action 615 is done: we do not have a telecon on Oct 28th
15:39:58 [ChrisW]: zakim, next item
15:39:58 [Zakim]: agendum 6. "OWL2-RL" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:40:19 [DaveReynolds]: http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/OWLRL
15:40:26 [ChrisW]: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2008Sep/0138.html
15:41:21 [ChanghaiKe]: pushed by oracle. Implementable in core quite easily
15:41:44 [DaveReynolds]: http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/OWLRL#Datatypes_supported
15:41:45 [csma]: zakim, mute me
15:41:45 [Zakim]: csma should now be muted
15:41:51 [mkifer]: sorry, have to disconnect - we have a fire drill
15:42:00 [Zakim]: -mkifer
15:42:15 [ChanghaiKe]: We do not support some data types
15:42:45 [sandro]: DaveReynolds: I'm not sure about float & double. I don't remember where we are. They don't support double.
15:43:02 [Harold]: "datatypes which differs from that supported by RIF" looks like a DTB issue more than a Core issue.
15:43:18 [sandro]: DaveReynolds: They support many subtypes that we don't bother with. And they have "real" rather than double, and datetime, and the binary blob types.
15:43:26 [josb]: q+
15:44:03 [StuartTaylor]: StuartTaylor has joined #rif
15:45:32 [josb]: q?
15:45:47 [ChanghaiKe]: List of data types: any objection to add data types to DTB?
15:45:57 [ChrisW]: ack jos
15:46:07 [sandro]: rdfs:Literal
15:47:23 [sandro]: q+
15:47:39 [Harold]: q+
15:48:45 [ChrisW]: ack sandro
15:49:06 [ChanghaiKe]: <sandro> why we need these data types?
15:49:40 [ChrisW]: action: jos to draft comment to OWL WG on the datatypes we don't support
15:49:40 [trackbot]: Sorry, amibiguous username (more than one match) - jos
15:49:40 [trackbot]: Try using a different identifier, such as family name or username (eg. jdebruij2, jderoo)
15:50:07 [sandro]: action: josb to draft comment to OWL WG on the datatypes we don't support
15:50:07 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-616 - Draft comment to OWL WG on the datatypes we don't support [on Jos de Bruijn - due 2008-10-14].
15:50:13 [Zakim]: +mkifer
15:51:50 [ChrisW]: q?
15:51:56 [ChrisW]: ack h
15:52:19 [Harold]: Our question to the OWL focus might focus owl:real, which seems most unusual for an ontology language.
15:52:39 [Harold]: s/OWL focus/OWL WG/
15:53:09 [DaveReynolds]: http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/OWLRL#Datatype_rules_with_extended_builtins
15:57:22 [csma]: zakim, unmute me
15:57:22 [Zakim]: csma should no longer be muted
15:57:49 [ChrisW]: action: chris to open an issue on extending DTB with Dave's extended builtins (http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/OWLRL#Datatype_rules_with_extended_builtins)
15:57:49 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-617 - Open an issue on extending DTB with Dave's extended builtins (http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/OWLRL#Datatype_rules_with_extended_builtins) [on Christopher Welty - due 2008-10-14].
15:58:09 [ChrisW]: action chris to open issue on extended OWL2RL datatypes
15:58:09 [trackbot]: Created ACTION-618 - Open issue on extended OWL2RL datatypes [on Christopher Welty - due 2008-10-14].
15:59:16 [ChrisW]: zakim, next item
15:59:16 [Zakim]: agendum 7. "PRD" taken up [from ChrisW]
15:59:47 [ChanghaiKe]: Proposed resolutions for PRD
15:59:55 [ChrisW]: PROPOSED: Add "New" construct with Gary's proposed syntax (�New� (Var �#�)? Const) and semantics to represent the creation of new frame objects in then-part of PRD rules; not excluding extending it later with the use of constructors once we resolve how to call "methods".
16:00:46 [csma]: q+
16:01:01 [csma]: ack csma
16:01:20 [Gary]: I think Dave had some concerns about some new-like thing maybe should be in CORE
16:01:42 [ChanghaiKe]: <csma> proposed amendment. Propose not to resolve the exact syntax.
16:02:43 [ChanghaiKe]: <csma> Gary's proposed syntax will be just for example, keep some room for syntax
16:03:46 [ChrisW]: PROPOSED: Add "New" construct with e.g Gary's proposed semantics to represent the creation of new frame objects in then-part of PRD rules; not excluding extending it later with the use of constructors once we resolve how to call "methods".
16:03:47 [ChanghaiKe]: <csma> for "do", we do not exclude using it for other statements, what's the reason
16:03:57 [ChrisW]: PROPOSED: Add "New" construct with Gary's proposed semantics to represent the creation of new frame objects in then-part of PRD rules; not excluding extending it later with the use of constructors once we resolve how to call "methods".
16:04:31 [ChrisW]: RESOLVED: Add "New" construct with Gary's proposed semantics to represent the creation of new frame objects in then-part of PRD rules; not excluding extending it later with the use of constructors once we resolve how to call "methods".
16:04:41 [ChrisW]: PROPOSED: Add "Do" construct with Gary's proposed syntax (�Do� Var* �(� ACTION+ �)�) and semantics to represent the declaration of local variables for binding to New frames in the then-part of PRD rules ; not excluding that later resolutions might extend the use of local variables in the action part.
16:04:59 [Harold]: q+
16:05:01 [ChrisW]: PROPOSED: Add "Do" construct with Gary's proposed semantics to represent the declaration of local variables for binding to New frames in the then-part of PRD rules ; not excluding that later resolutions might extend the use of local variables in the action part.
16:05:11 [ChrisW]: ack h
16:06:24 [ChrisW]: i prefer "Let"
16:06:31 [ChrisW]: Do has a "loop"y connotation to me
16:06:56 [csma]: do(action*)
16:07:21 [csma]: bind(var* pattern*)
16:07:31 [csma]: do(bind action*)
16:07:48 [Gary]: Do ?var (action+) like Exists ?var (forumla)
16:09:09 [Harold]: Bind(var* And/seq(action+)) or Exists(var* And/seq(action+))
16:09:28 [ChanghaiKe]: It's not a formula, we cannot use exists
16:09:46 [Hassan]: q+
16:10:07 [Harold]: Instead do(bind action*) use bind(var* And/seq(action+))
16:11:43 [Hassan]: q-
16:11:51 [csma]: PROPOSED: Add a construct with Gary's proposed semantics to represent the declaration of local variables for binding to New frames in the then-part of PRD rules ; not excluding that later resolutions might extend the use of local variables in the action part.
16:13:17 [Harold]: bind(var* do(action+)), except for names.
16:13:38 [Harold]: E.g. uppercase Bind and Do or a name better than Do.
16:17:28 [ChanghaiKe]: Any objection to this?
16:17:43 [ChanghaiKe]: OK
16:17:46 [ChrisW]: PROPOSED: Extend "Retract" construct with Gary's proposed syntax (�Retract(� [Atom|Frame|TERM] �)�) and semantics to add represent the removal of a frame object in then-part of PRD rules, that is, to represent the removal of an object from the instances of its class as well as all the frames with that object in the object position.
16:17:59 [csma]: RESOLVED: Add a construct with Gary's proposed semantics to represent the declaration of local variables for binding to New frames in the then-part of PRD rules ; not excluding that later resolutions might extend the use of local variables in the action part.
16:18:00 [ChrisW]: PROPOSED: Extend "Retract" construct with Gary's semantics to add represent the removal of a frame object in then-part of PRD rules, that is, to represent the removal of an object from the instances of its class as well as all the frames with that object in the object position.
16:18:10 [ChanghaiKe]: I agree with this
16:18:33 [csma]: PROPOSED: Extend "Retract" construct with Gary's semantics to represent the removal of a frame object in then-part of PRD rules, that is, to represent the removal of an object from the instances of its class as well as all the frames with that object in the object position.
16:19:37 [csma]: RESOLVED: Extend "Retract" construct with Gary's semantics to represent the removal of a frame object in then-part of PRD rules, that is, to represent the removal of an object from the instances of its class as well as all the frames with that object in the object position.
16:19:43 [ChrisW]: zakim, list agenda
16:19:43 [Zakim]: I see 5 items remaining on the agenda:
16:19:44 [Zakim]: 7. PRD [from ChrisW]
16:19:44 [Zakim]: 8. Weak vs. strong safety [from ChrisW]
16:19:45 [Zakim]: 9. Test cases [from ChrisW]
16:19:45 [Zakim]: 10. Pick scribe [from ChrisW]
16:19:46 [Zakim]: 11. AOB [from ChrisW]
16:19:52 [Zakim]: -DaveReynolds
16:20:05 [ChrisW]: zakim, take up item 9
16:20:05 [Zakim]: agendum 9. "Test cases" taken up [from ChrisW]
16:20:26 [ChrisW]: http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Category:Test_Case
16:20:33 [mkifer]: I mean that I suggested to use a different name for this version of retract, but I don't really care.
16:21:33 [ChrisW]: http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Annotation_Entailment
16:22:37 [LeoraMorgenstern]: I think, also, this was the first case that needed extra description
16:22:54 [ChrisW]: http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Disjunctive_Information_from_Negative_Guards_2
16:23:01 [LeoraMorgenstern]: but subsequently, cases that needed extra description were approved subject to extra description
16:27:38 [csma]: zakim, mute me
16:27:38 [Zakim]: csma should now be muted
16:28:24 [ChrisW]: PROPOSED: accept http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Disjunctive_Information_from_Negative_Guards_2
16:28:42 [ChrisW]: RESOLVED: accept http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wiki/Disjunctive_Information_from_Negative_Guards_2
16:29:23 [ChrisW]: Aentailment
16:30:04 [Zakim]: -Harold
16:30:16 [StuartTaylor]: yeah, I'll give that a go
16:30:24 [StuartTaylor]: the phone still seems to be playing up sorry
16:30:27 [ChrisW]: scribe for next week: StuartTaylor
16:30:30 [csma]: zakim, unmute me
16:30:30 [Zakim]: csma should no longer be muted
16:30:38 [Zakim]: -josb
16:30:40 [Zakim]: -StuartTaylor
16:30:42 [Zakim]: -AdrianPaschke
16:30:44 [Zakim]: -LeoraMorgenstern
16:30:45 [Zakim]: -Mike_Dean
16:30:47 [Zakim]: -Gary
16:30:54 [Zakim]: -Hassan
16:30:56 [Zakim]: -mkifer
16:30:59 [ChrisW]: Regrets: Stella Mitchell PaulVincent AxelPolleres
16:31:01 [csma]: zakim, who is on the ^hone?
16:31:01 [Zakim]: I don't understand your question, csma.
16:31:03 [ChrisW]: zakim, list attendees
16:31:03 [Zakim]: As of this point the attendees have been Mike_Dean, csma, +24356aaaa, +0122427aabb, Hassan, Harold, +1.212.781.aacc, LeoraMorgenstern, +39.047.101.aadd, ChanghaiKe,
16:31:07 [Zakim]: ... +1.503.533.aaee, josb, ChrisW, +24356aaff, Gary, Sandro, StuartTaylor, +44.145.441.aagg, DaveReynolds, +49.351.315.aahh, mkifer, +49.351.315.aaii, AdrianPaschke
16:31:14 [csma]: zakim, who is on the phone?
16:31:14 [Zakim]: On the phone I see ChanghaiKe, csma, ChrisW, Sandro
16:31:17 [ChrisW]: rrsagent, make minutes
16:31:17 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/10/07-rif-minutes.html ChrisW
16:33:51 [Zakim]: -ChanghaiKe
16:37:03 [Zakim]: -ChrisW
16:37:04 [Zakim]: -Sandro
16:37:05 [Zakim]: -csma
16:37:06 [Zakim]: SW_RIF()11:00AM has ended
16:37:10 [Zakim]: Attendees were Mike_Dean, csma, +24356aaaa, +0122427aabb, Hassan, Harold, +1.212.781.aacc, LeoraMorgenstern, +39.047.101.aadd, ChanghaiKe, +1.503.533.aaee, josb, ChrisW,
16:37:13 [Zakim]: ... +24356aaff, Gary, Sandro, StuartTaylor, +44.145.441.aagg, DaveReynolds, +49.351.315.aahh, mkifer, +49.351.315.aaii, AdrianPaschke
16:56:35 [csma]: csma has left #rif
17:03:32 [Gary]: join rif-prd
18:45:21 [sandro]: sandro has joined #rif