14:55:11 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #swd
14:55:11 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-irc
14:55:18 <Ralph> Meeting: SemWeb Deployment WG
14:55:22 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #swd
14:55:27 <Ralph> zakim, this will be swd
14:55:27 <Zakim> ok, Ralph; I see SW_SWD()11:00AM scheduled to start in 5 minutes
14:55:29 <berrueta> berrueta has joined #swd
14:55:35 <Ralph> rrsagent, please make record public
14:55:50 <Ralph> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Sep/0049.html
14:55:55 <Ralph> Chair: Guus
14:57:12 <TomB> TomB has joined #swd
14:57:18 <Ralph> Regrets: Simone, Elisa, Daniel
14:57:26 <Ralph> Previous: http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-swd-minutes.html
14:58:22 <Zakim> SW_SWD()11:00AM has now started
14:58:29 <Zakim> +??P18
14:58:35 <seanb> seanb has joined #swd
14:58:40 <TomB> zakim, ??P18 is TomB
14:58:41 <Zakim> +TomB; got it
14:58:51 <Zakim> + +1.617.252.aaaa
14:59:04 <edsu> edsu has joined #swd
14:59:17 <Ralph> zakim, aaaa is Ralph
14:59:17 <Zakim> +Ralph; got it
14:59:44 <Zakim> +VeroniqueM
14:59:50 <JonP> JonP has joined #swd
15:00:07 <marghe> marghe has joined #swd
15:00:12 <Guus> Guus has joined #swd
15:00:48 <Ralph> zakim, veroniqueM is Guus
15:00:48 <Zakim> +[CTIC]
15:00:50 <Zakim> +Guus; got it
15:01:00 <Zakim> +Jon_Phipps
15:01:00 <Ralph> zakim, ctic is Diego
15:01:01 <berrueta> zakim, [CTIC
15:01:03 <Zakim> +Diego; got it
15:01:05 <Zakim> I don't understand '[CTIC', berrueta
15:01:12 <Zakim> +[LC]
15:01:13 <edsu> zakim, LC is edsu
15:01:21 <Zakim> +edsu; got it
15:01:27 <aliman> aliman has joined #swd
15:01:33 <JonP> zakim, Jon_Phipps is me
15:01:33 <Zakim> +JonP; got it
15:01:33 <Guus> zakim, who is here?
15:01:35 <Zakim> On the phone I see TomB, Ralph, Guus, Diego, JonP, edsu
15:01:42 <Zakim> On IRC I see aliman, Guus, marghe, JonP, edsu, seanb, TomB, berrueta, Zakim, RRSAgent, Ralph
15:02:04 <Zakim> +??P20
15:02:19 <Ralph> zakim, ??p20 is Margherita
15:02:19 <Zakim> +Margherita; got it
15:02:44 <Zakim> +??P36
15:02:53 <dlrubin> dlrubin has joined #swd
15:03:00 <Zakim> +??P38
15:03:02 <Ralph> zakim, ??p36 is Daniel
15:03:02 <Zakim> +Daniel; got it
15:03:05 <Zakim> +??P34
15:03:06 <Ralph> regrets- Daniel
15:03:08 <seanb> zakim, ??P38 is me
15:03:08 <Zakim> +seanb; got it
15:03:22 <Ralph> zakim, ??p34 is Alistair
15:03:22 <Zakim> +Alistair; got it
15:03:33 <Guus> zakim, who is here?
15:03:33 <Zakim> On the phone I see TomB, Ralph, Guus, Diego, JonP, edsu, Margherita, Daniel, seanb, Alistair
15:03:35 <Zakim> On IRC I see dlrubin, aliman, Guus, marghe, JonP, edsu, seanb, TomB, berrueta, Zakim, RRSAgent, Ralph
15:03:45 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Ralph
15:03:54 <Ralph> scribe: Ralph
15:04:07 <edsu> Zakim++
15:04:45 <Ralph> Topic: Admin
15:04:52 <Ralph> zakim, list participants
15:04:52 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been TomB, +1.617.252.aaaa, Ralph, Guus, Diego, edsu, JonP, Margherita, Daniel, seanb, Alistair
15:05:16 <Ralph> Guus: schedule for future telecons?
15:05:24 <Ralph> Tom: haven't created a proposal yet
15:05:40 <TomB> +1 for 7 October next call
15:05:47 <Antoine> Antoine has joined #swd
15:05:55 <Ralph> RESOLVED: next telecon 7 October
15:06:05 <Ralph> ... Tom to chair
15:06:32 <Ralph> Jon: I'm at risk for 7 Oct
15:06:40 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose seanb
15:07:04 <Zakim> +??P5
15:07:08 <aliman> /me would be happy to take it in turns with someone
15:07:18 <Ralph> zakim, ??p5 is Antoine
15:07:18 <Zakim> +Antoine; got it
15:07:45 <Ralph> Ed: I will scribe on 7 Oct
15:08:04 <Ralph> Antone: regrets for 7 Oct
15:08:14 <Zakim> +Ben_Adida
15:08:18 <benadida> benadida has joined #swd
15:08:32 <Ralph> PROPOSED: accept http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-swd-minutes.html as minutes of previous meeting
15:08:39 <Ralph> Sean: I'd indicated my regrets
15:09:24 <Ralph> RESOLVED: http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-swd-minutes.html as minutes of previous meeting, amended to show Sean's regrets
15:09:33 <Ralph> s/as min/accepted as min
15:09:49 <Ralph> Topic: RDFa
15:10:21 <Ralph> Ben: no specific update; we have to schedule the last step
15:10:30 <Ralph> ... only minor comments received during PR; some typos
15:10:38 <Ralph> ... I need to tweak the Primer
15:10:55 <Ralph> ... we've had positive comments on the Primer but some recent comments say there's not enough in it
15:11:08 <Ralph> ... we want to have an updated version to publish with the REC
15:12:51 <Ralph> Ralph: It's important that WG members get their AC reps to respond to the Call for Reviwe
15:14:10 <Ralph> ACTION: All to remind respective AC Reps to respond to RDFa Proposed Rec Call for Review
15:15:25 <Ralph> Guus: schedule also says we'll publish RDFa Use Cases as WG Note
15:15:34 <Ralph> Ben: yep, we should see if it needs any updates
15:15:51 <Ralph> ACTION: Ben review RDFa Use Cases and propose transition to Group Note
15:16:02 <Ralph> Topic: Recipes
15:16:07 <Ralph> Guus: I think we're done here
15:16:25 <Ralph> [CONTINUES] ACTION: Ralph/Diego to work on Wordnet implementation [of Recipes implementations] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action20]
15:16:35 <Ralph> Topic: RDFa Metadata Note
15:16:47 <Ralph> Guus: was this discussed at the previous telecon?
15:16:53 <Ralph> Diego: there's a new version in the Wiki
15:17:06 <Ralph> ... but I haven't yet discussed this draft with Ed
15:17:24 <Ralph> ... hope to discuss with Ed in the next few days and then have a version for the WG
15:17:56 <Ralph> ACTION: Diego updates "Minimum RDFa metadata set for WG deliverables" draft in the wiki
15:18:27 <Ralph> Ed: I read the previous draft and found a few minor things, would like to talk about this in a telecon; in particular, talk about the various vocabularies to use
15:18:54 <Ralph> Diego: I propose that Ed and I talk about it during the week and we put it on the agenda for 7 October
15:19:35 <Ralph> Topic: CURIE
15:19:53 <Ralph> [DONE] ACTION: Jeremy to send a review to XHTML2 with comments [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/16-swd-minutes.html#action06]
15:20:10 <Ralph> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Sep/0042.html "CURIE review from SWD WG" [Jeremy 2008-09-22]
15:20:26 <Ralph> Topic: Vocabulary Management
15:20:31 <Ralph> Guus: no status change
15:20:33 <Ralph> Topic: SKOS
15:20:55 <Ralph> Alistair: [reviews comments received]
15:21:30 <Ralph> ... comment about disjointness of ConceptScheme and Concept
15:21:52 <Ralph> ... hasTopConcept v. hasTopConceptOf
15:22:02 <Ralph> ... mappings
15:22:23 <aliman> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Sep/0014.html
15:22:36 <aliman> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Sep/0015.html
15:22:39 <Ralph> -> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/129 Last Call Comment: S9 skos:ConceptScheme is disjoint with skos:Concept
15:22:55 <aliman> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Sep/0026.html
15:22:59 <Ralph> -> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/130 Last Call Comment: skos:hasTopConcept and skos:topConceptOf
15:23:01 <aliman> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/SKOS/LastCall#preview
15:23:18 <Ralph> Alistair: I've linked all these messages from LastCall#preview
15:23:30 <aliman> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Sep/0037.html
15:23:37 <Ralph> ... Quentin spotted an error in an example
15:23:48 <aliman> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Sep/0044.html
15:24:03 <JeremyCarroll> JeremyCarroll has joined #swd
15:24:07 <aliman> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Sep/0055.html
15:24:09 <Ralph> ... several comments from Michael Schneider, I broke out into separate issues
15:24:33 <Ralph> -> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/raised SKOS Issues Raised
15:24:42 <aliman> 5 external last call comments
15:24:46 <Ralph> Sean: I expect a comment from Peter Patel-Schneider about some of the OWL
15:25:07 <Ralph> Alistair++ for entering these into tracker
15:25:18 <Ralph> Antoine: I found another, from 28 June
15:25:24 <Ralph> ... from Eric Enum
15:25:27 <Ralph> ... of IBM
15:25:45 <Ralph> Alistair: I was wondering whether this should be entered as if it were a Last Call comment
15:26:05 <Ralph> Ralph, Guus: yes, we should include Eric's message among Last Call comments
15:26:12 <Ralph> Alistair: I'll generate issues for it
15:26:35 <Ralph> Guus: I don't see many comments from the thesaurus or representation fields
15:27:17 <Ralph> ... should we extend Last Call to get more comments?
15:27:29 <Ralph> Ralph: is the esw-thes list sufficiently represented?  Could we get more expressions of support?
15:27:40 <Ralph> Alistair: we could definitely get more expressions of support
15:27:45 <Ralph> Ralph: that would be helpful
15:27:54 <Zakim> + +1.650.215.aabb
15:27:54 <Ralph> Guus: do we have input on our features at risk?
15:28:03 <Ralph> Alistair: yes, in particular from Kjetl
15:28:07 <Ralph> zakim, aabb is Jeremy
15:28:07 <Zakim> +Jeremy; got it
15:28:40 <Ralph> ACTION: Alistair enter Last Call issues from Eric Enum's 28 June mail
15:29:09 <Ralph> Sean: we've had no comments about the namespace
15:29:29 <Ralph> s/Eric Enum/Erik Hennum/G
15:29:50 <Ralph> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0103.html "SKOS comment" [Erik Hennum 2008-06-27]
15:30:15 <Ralph> Margherita: I have not yet had time to update [my work] with the latest SKOS
15:30:30 <Ralph> ... I might ask folk in Sicily; they have a glossary and other resources
15:30:51 <Ralph> s/Sicily/the Fisheries Department
15:31:15 <Ralph> Guus: I'll ask some folk here to comment
15:31:52 <Ralph> Ed: Clay and I are the primary Library of Congress folk working with SKOS right now
15:32:17 <Ralph> ... I might be able to get a general note of support but unlikely to get specific comments on the namespace
15:32:52 <Ralph> Ralph: it would be good to get a consensus from esw-thes on the namespace question
15:33:08 <Ralph> Alistair: I can ask that list explicitly; I've just sent a reminder
15:33:44 <TomB> q+ to suggest to Ed that a note of support and interest from someone at LC, even just a one-liner, would be helpful
15:33:49 <Ralph> Guus: I am worried that we don't have enough input on the features at risk
15:34:07 <Ralph> Ralph: right, folks who like what we've proposed may feel they don't need to comment but the opposite is true
15:34:28 <Ralph> Jon: Ed and I have presented SKOS at CAUSE conferences, including noting the features at risk
15:34:36 <Ralph> ... there have been no objections
15:34:45 <Ralph> Guus: it would be helpful to send a mail with that
15:34:50 <Zakim> TomB, you wanted to suggest to Ed that a note of support and interest from someone at LC, even just a one-liner, would be helpful
15:35:21 <Ralph> Ed: ok, but not from me or Clay, right?
15:35:27 <Ralph> Tom: right; better from Barbara
15:35:53 <Ralph> Ed: dbpedia uses SKOS quite heavily in their datastore; has anyone approached them?
15:36:31 <Ralph> ACTION: Ed ask dbpedia to send a message in support of SKOS
15:36:55 <Ralph> Ed: I could also contact the Department of Agriculture Library
15:37:32 <Ralph> Guus: should we formally extend Last Call or just accept comments until 14 October?
15:37:36 <Ralph> Ralph: I'm happy either way
15:37:44 <Ralph> Guus: most WGs accept comments even if they arrive late
15:37:54 <JeremyCarroll> (There is no option to reject late comments .... but one can take the lateness into account)
15:38:33 <Ralph> Guus: Alistair; what, in your opinion, are the major comments
15:38:59 <Ralph> Alistair: http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/129 issue 129 ConceptScheme and Concept
15:39:26 <Ralph> Sean: http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/135 issue 135; should the label properties be subClassOf rdfs:Label
15:40:18 <Ralph> ... Michael Schneider suggests that the label properties *not* be sub properties of rdfs:label
15:40:27 <Ralph> ... I recall a related comment from Bernard Vatant
15:40:42 <Ralph> ... some tools want the subPropertyOf so they can pull the labels out easily
15:40:51 <JeremyCarroll> (as a tool builder I am keen for all label props to be subPropertyOf rdfs:Label)
15:41:08 <Ralph> Guus: [my group] depends on subPropertyOf a lot; we don't have to adapt our software that looks for rdfs:label
15:41:54 <Ralph> Alistair: there might be a different way to do this in OWL2 than what we currently use
15:43:08 <Ralph> ... Alan Ruttenburg sent mail recently that might be relevant
15:44:04 <aliman> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2008Sep/0024.html Alan Ruttenberg links to OWL 2 annotations proposal
15:45:10 <aliman> -> http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Syntax#Annotations OWL 2 Syntax -- Annotations
15:50:08 <JeremyCarroll> q+
15:51:37 <JeremyCarroll> ack
15:52:17 <JeremyCarroll> q-
15:52:44 <dlrubin> dlrubin has left #swd
15:53:56 <Ralph> [DONE] ACTION: SKOS Reference editors to send mail asking for feedback from users [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/02-swd-minutes.html#action06]
15:54:15 <Ralph> [DONE] ACTION: Sean to add a request for implementations to the mail asking for feedback [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/02-swd-minutes.html#action07]
15:54:35 <Ralph> ACTION: Alistair to update the history page adding direct link to latest  version of rdf triple [recorded in  http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-minutes.html#action01]
15:54:37 <Ralph> -- continues
15:54:41 <aliman> sorry for no progress on that
15:56:05 <Ralph> Guus: it would be nice to show implementations
15:56:29 <Ralph> ... every vocabulary owner who uses SKOS to produce a compliant thesaurus should be considered an implementation
15:56:43 <Ralph> ... we should find some example thesaurii that use features from our spec
15:56:59 <Ralph> ... finding one or two such vocabularies for each feature would make a nice implementation report
15:57:45 <Ralph> ... showing some vocabularies that use the label features would be good
15:58:00 <Ralph> Jon: what's the timeframe for implementation responses?
15:58:13 <Ralph> Guus: during Candidate Rec phase, which is typically 4-6 weeks
15:58:42 <Zakim> -Ben_Adida
15:59:12 <TomB> Ralph: We can propose what our own Candidate Rec exit criteria are.  Traditionally, two independent implementations.  Traditionally, candidate rec lasts as long as it takes to get implementations.
16:00:04 <Ralph> Jeremy: recently most groups have been very close to meeting their CR exit criteria before they enter CR
16:00:34 <TomB> JonP: We have 100+ vocabularies in the registries.  Have been avoiding switching over these vocabularies to new namespace because may be messy.
16:00:41 <Ralph> Jon: I may be able to submit some examples but it will take a while
16:00:53 <Ralph> Alistair: do the implementations have to be publicly available
16:01:14 <Ralph> s/able/able?/
16:01:33 <aliman> s/Alistair/Antoine/
16:01:40 <Ralph> Ralph: we can accept an email message from an implementor describing their experiences, without making the code public
16:01:54 <Ralph> Jeremy: that mail can even go to a Member- or Team-confidential list :)
16:02:11 <Ralph> [adjourned]
16:02:14 <Zakim> -Daniel
16:02:16 <Zakim> -Jeremy
16:02:17 <Zakim> -Diego
16:02:18 <Zakim> -Guus
16:02:19 <seanb> seanb has left #swd
16:02:21 <Zakim> -Margherita
16:02:22 <Zakim> -Alistair
16:02:25 <Zakim> -JonP
16:02:27 <Zakim> -Antoine
16:02:28 <Zakim> -TomB
16:02:36 <Zakim> -Ralph
16:02:38 <berrueta> berrueta has left #swd
16:02:38 <Zakim> -edsu
16:02:40 <Zakim> -seanb
16:02:42 <Zakim> SW_SWD()11:00AM has ended
16:02:44 <Zakim> Attendees were TomB, +1.617.252.aaaa, Ralph, Guus, Diego, edsu, JonP, Margherita, Daniel, seanb, Alistair, Antoine, Ben_Adida, +1.650.215.aabb, Jeremy
16:02:47 <Ralph> rrsagent, please draft minutes
16:02:47 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-minutes.html Ralph
16:02:52 <Zakim> Zakim has left #swd
16:02:56 <edsu> edsu has left #swd
16:04:01 <Ralph> rrsagent, bye
16:04:01 <RRSAgent> I see 6 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-actions.rdf :
16:04:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: All to remind respective AC Reps to respond to RDFa Proposed Rec Call for Review [1]
16:04:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-irc#T15-14-10
16:04:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ben review RDFa Use Cases and propose transition to Group Note [2]
16:04:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-irc#T15-15-51
16:04:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Diego updates "Minimum RDFa metadata set for WG deliverables" draft in the wiki [3]
16:04:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-irc#T15-17-56
16:04:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Alistair enter Last Call issues from Eric Enum's 28 June mail [4]
16:04:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-irc#T15-28-40
16:04:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ed ask dbpedia to send a message in support of SKOS [5]
16:04:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-irc#T15-36-31
16:04:01 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Alistair to update the history page adding direct link to latest  version of rdf triple [recorded in  http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-minutes.html#action01] [6]
16:04:01 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/09/30-swd-irc#T15-54-35