IRC log of mediaann on 2008-09-23

Timestamps are in UTC.

12:59:06 [RRSAgent]
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12:59:06 [RRSAgent]
logging to
12:59:11 [fsasaki]
meeting: MAGW
12:59:14 [fsasaki]
chair: Daniel
12:59:33 [fsasaki]
12:59:36 [wbailer]
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12:59:38 [fsasaki]
rrsagent, make log public
12:59:54 [Zakim]
13:00:07 [VeroniqueM]
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13:00:18 [tobiasbuerger]
Zakim, aabb is me
13:00:18 [Zakim]
+tobiasbuerger; got it
13:00:28 [raphael]
raphael has joined #mediaann
13:01:36 [Zakim]
13:01:44 [fsasaki]
present+ tobias, davy, raphael(IRC), felix
13:01:58 [fsasaki]
present+ VĂ©ronique
13:02:05 [Zakim]
13:02:17 [VeroniqueM]
zakim, [VrijeUni] is me
13:02:17 [Zakim]
+VeroniqueM; got it
13:02:33 [Zakim]
+ +43.699.187.6aadd
13:02:35 [fsasaki]
scribe: Felix
13:02:41 [fsasaki]
scribeNick: fsasaki
13:02:55 [wbailer]
?aadd is wbailer
13:03:32 [fsasaki]
present+ Daniel, Werner
13:03:56 [fsasaki]
13:04:23 [fsasaki]
topic: agenda review
13:04:31 [fsasaki]
Daniel reviews the agenda
13:05:31 [fsasaki]
daniel: no need to go through all open issue, we can go through them briefly and continue discussion via mail
13:05:46 [fsasaki]
topic: Agenda review / approval of previous minutes
13:05:54 [fsasaki]
13:06:30 [fsasaki]
RESOLUTION: minutes approved
13:06:47 [fsasaki]
topic: Selection of scribe for next meeting
13:07:12 [fsasaki]
next scribe will be Hui
13:07:18 [hmiao]
yep. : 0
13:07:22 [hmiao]
: )
13:07:26 [hmiao]
i'll do it from next time
13:07:28 [fsasaki]
present+ Hui
13:07:41 [hmiao]
my pleasure
13:08:29 [fsasaki]
topic: Future telephone conferences and f2f meetings / call time
13:09:30 [fsasaki]
Daniel: we will have an alternating schedule, see upcoming calls at
13:10:11 [fsasaki]
.. at TPAC, we will have a joint meeting with PLING IG
13:10:28 [fsasaki]
.. in Belgium we will have a joint meeting with media fragment WG
13:10:30 [erik]
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13:10:38 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate fsasaki
13:11:07 [fsasaki]
present+ Erik
13:11:16 [fsasaki]
topic: Call for co-chair
13:11:49 [fsasaki]
no update for now
13:12:04 [fsasaki]
topic: Action items
13:12:11 [fsasaki]
13:12:43 [fsasaki]
close ACTION-1
13:12:43 [trackbot]
ACTION-1 Book the bridge for the weekly telecon closed
13:12:44 [fsasaki]
close ACTION-2
13:12:44 [trackbot]
ACTION-2 Give a cvs access to Daniel and to the editors closed
13:12:46 [fsasaki]
close ACTION-3
13:12:46 [trackbot]
ACTION-3 Prepare the editing environment including templates, directories, etc. closed
13:14:37 [fsasaki]
close ACTION-4
13:14:37 [trackbot]
ACTION-4 Pull out requirements of one standard (to be decided which), AI also for Erik closed
13:15:35 [fsasaki]
Veronique had sent information on IPTC, and we will not keep this general action item
13:15:50 [fsasaki]
topic: Editing
13:16:51 [VeroniqueM]
I could also participate in editing, but I have very few experience with this...
13:17:16 [fsasaki]
tobias: I can edit later
13:17:21 [fsasaki]
daniel: we will be a team
13:17:48 [fsasaki]
felix: every editor will edit each deliverable
13:17:55 [hmiao]
i would like to join editing, though i've little experience.
13:18:01 [fsasaki]
13:18:04 [spark3]
Hui and tobias are volunteers for editing team as of today
13:18:04 [Zakim]
+ +31.20.525.aaee
13:19:10 [fsasaki]
present+ Frank
13:19:20 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate fsasaki
13:19:47 [fsasaki]
topic: Open issues
13:21:05 [raphael]
13:21:36 [raphael]
There is an open questionnaire regarding the formats in scope and out of scope, could we keep it open one more week ?
13:21:54 [raphael]
zakim, ack me
13:21:54 [Zakim]
I see no one on the speaker queue
13:22:14 [hmiao]
anyone mension the youtube like video yet ?
13:22:28 [hmiao]
it'll be an important format for our application
13:26:20 [fsasaki]
daniel: propose that we go through the issues until next teleconference via mail, and try to wrap them up during that call, and work on the editors draft just after that
13:26:41 [VeroniqueM]
would it make sense to link the use cases with requirements lists more specifically?
13:26:43 [spark3]
Raphael, yes, we will open for all of open issue until next telecon
13:26:45 [fsasaki]
action: Felix to extend "formats ... scope" for one more week
13:26:45 [trackbot]
Created ACTION-5 - Extend \"formats ... scope\" for one more week [on Felix Sasaki - due 2008-09-30].
13:26:57 [VeroniqueM]
this might hep us getting a list of requirements?
13:28:30 [VeroniqueM]
maybe we can make a short list of the use cases, just by their names?
13:30:23 [fsasaki]
Use case "Services by using an unified media annotation"
13:30:34 [VeroniqueM]
13:30:39 [wbailer]
13:30:55 [davy]
13:30:58 [erik]
13:31:29 [fsasaki]
Use case "Video on IPTV" - should that be merged into another use case?
13:31:46 [VeroniqueM]
13:31:53 [spark3]
13:32:00 [davy]
13:32:02 [wbailer]
yes, merge with services
13:32:02 [erik]
13:32:15 [tobiasbuerger]
13:32:42 [fsasaki]
Requirement "Covering variations across locales"
13:33:26 [spark3]
it's requirements, yes
13:33:40 [wbailer]
yes, it's maybe related to adaptation use case?
13:33:56 [VeroniqueM]
or to interoperability?
13:34:23 [fsasaki]
Use case "Audiovisual archive as a Cultural Heritage institution"
13:34:35 [spark3]
13:35:08 [wbailer]
yes, as mentioned on the list it might be broad and could be more concrete
13:35:28 [wbailer]
13:35:44 [fsasaki]
veronique: well, it was more a general view than a specific usecase, but can be splitted into searching and interoperability
13:36:20 [spark3]
13:36:42 [davy]
13:36:56 [tobiasbuerger]
13:37:07 [fsasaki]
Use case "Metadata to help promoting safe environments"
13:37:07 [erik]
13:37:20 [VeroniqueM]
13:37:32 [fsasaki]
s/Use case "Metadata to help promoting safe environments"//
13:37:35 [fsasaki]
Use case "Metadata to help promoting safe environments"
13:37:36 [VeroniqueM]
can be related to personalisation, to some extent?
13:38:17 [fsasaki]
Felix: should it be a separate use case? Or
13:38:23 [wbailer]
agree to relate it to other uc
13:38:25 [fsasaki]
... be related to something else
13:38:33 [tobiasbuerger]
we could also merge it with the services use case...
13:38:39 [erik]
agree to relate it
13:38:56 [fsasaki]
Use case "Multi media and semantic web technologies"
13:39:14 [tobiasbuerger]
This is too broad I guess and not meant as a use case. Yes - please drop it
13:39:14 [fsasaki]
drop this since it is too broad?
13:39:19 [davy]
13:39:23 [VeroniqueM]
13:39:25 [wbailer]
13:39:27 [spark3]
13:39:30 [erik]
13:39:36 [raphael]
13:39:51 [fsasaki]
Use case "Photo" - should we take this into account?
13:40:17 [raphael]
Does the charter talk only about videos ?
13:40:22 [VeroniqueM]
has this not be covered by the XG?
13:40:31 [spark3]
isn't it related to Multimedia Annotation XG ?
13:40:36 [VeroniqueM]
Image annotation I mean
13:40:47 [fsasaki]
13:40:50 [raphael]
No, the role of the XG was not to promote a particular schema or ontology for describing media
13:40:59 [wbailer]
yes, but somehow it'orthogonal: media types vs application like searc etc
13:41:02 [fsasaki]
"This Group is chartered to provide a simple ontology to support cross-community data integration of information related to media objects on the Web, as well as an API to access the information."
13:41:08 [fsasaki]
(from the charter)
13:41:19 [raphael]
... but rather to investigate how SW technologies help to build bridges between exixting formats and standards
13:41:59 [fsasaki]
daniel: our homepage talks about video, audio and images
13:42:00 [spark3]
13:42:00 [raphael]
... so my conclusion is, there is still a lot to do to make the DC for photos, or videos
13:42:18 [tobiasbuerger]
+1, Raphael. Agree.
13:42:25 [erik]
13:42:51 [fsasaki]
Use case "music" - should we take this into account?
13:43:30 [fsasaki]
daniel: not sure
13:43:37 [raphael]
Same conclusion, the pseudo-formalization of the ID3 tags using the Music Ontology is interesting and might be a good start up
13:43:57 [fsasaki]
raphael: "same conclusion" means: valid use case?
13:44:02 [VeroniqueM]
not sure either, lots of very specific issues would then be taken into account
13:44:27 [VeroniqueM]
ok to Raphael
13:44:29 [wbailer]
but music ontology is quite specific, we should stay on a more generic level
13:44:40 [raphael]
Yes, valid use case, I think ... in the sense that your title property would be likely to be used for a title of a movie or a song
13:44:50 [raphael]
... and a link to the ID3 title is a good thing, etc.
13:45:12 [raphael]
agree for the music ontology, I'm talking about reusing some elements ... and link to some others
13:45:17 [fsasaki]
Felix: sounds like a valid use case but on a very general level
13:45:23 [wbailer]
providing means for linking seems to be a good idea
13:45:42 [fsasaki]
Use case "News"
13:45:48 [erik]
13:45:54 [tobiasbuerger]
13:46:07 [raphael]
I see the outcome of this group as a core schema, with a lot of open windows to standards, with explicit semantics
13:46:13 [VeroniqueM]
that's a very complex and very interesting use case! Vote for yes
13:46:28 [raphael]
News: not in the state that it is described in the XG document .. but yet in the general sense
13:46:41 [raphael]
13:46:41 [wbailer]
yes, i see the same thing as for music: avoid getting too specific
13:46:53 [spark3]
13:47:11 [fsasaki]
Use case "Tagging"
13:47:35 [VeroniqueM]
in what sense?
13:47:41 [spark3]
tagging for what ?
13:47:49 [VeroniqueM]
as values for a schema?
13:47:57 [VeroniqueM]
or instead of it?
13:48:03 [tobiasbuerger]
what it was about: "The tagging use case which tackles the problem of interoperability and portability of tagging systems and personal tags."
13:48:05 [raphael]
Goal of the XG was to allow reusing a personomy between various platforms
13:48:20 [raphael]
... example: you use the same flickr tags on delicious
13:48:33 [wbailer]
merge it with interop?
13:48:36 [raphael]
... you own your tags, defined in SKOS, and you can search cross-platform
13:48:55 [VeroniqueM]
in that case, makes sense
13:49:01 [VeroniqueM]
if you define them
13:49:03 [raphael]
... each tags has a global URI and is formally defined
13:50:56 [fsasaki]
Felix: maybe we will not be able to solve that interoperabiltiy problem, only on a very high level of the ontology, and leave the rest to other fora
13:51:08 [fsasaki]
Use case "semantic media analysis"
13:51:19 [fsasaki]
Felix: too general - close that?
13:51:38 [raphael]
13:51:39 [spark3]
13:51:43 [davy]
13:51:47 [tobiasbuerger]
I guess we should take some aspects into accout...
13:51:53 [wbailer]
agree, analysis is done for search, adaptation ,...
13:51:54 [tobiasbuerger] links between modalities
13:52:34 [VeroniqueM]
like semiotic relations between speech and image in a video?
13:52:41 [fsasaki]
tobias: how text can support the analsys of media. This use case is about references between text and parts of the image
13:53:11 [fsasaki]
felix: do you think the relations should be typed and part of the ontology?
13:53:24 [fsasaki]
tobias: yes
13:53:41 [fsasaki]
felix: let's discuss this via mail
13:53:53 [fsasaki]
Use case "algorithm representation"
13:54:06 [wbailer]
13:54:08 [tobiasbuerger]
13:54:09 [fsasaki]
felix: out of scope - drop it?
13:54:13 [VeroniqueM]
13:54:15 [davy]
13:54:18 [raphael]
agree to drop it
13:54:28 [erik]
13:56:09 [fsasaki]
topic: wrap up
13:56:25 [fsasaki]
Daniel: please check
13:56:27 [fsasaki]
=substring&email1=&emailtype2=substring&email2=&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&votes=&chfieldfrom=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&cmdtype=doit&order=Reuse+same+sort+as+last+time&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&value0-0-0= for new use cases
13:56:45 [fsasaki]
daniel: and make discussion on the list
13:57:18 [raphael]
13:57:25 [fsasaki]
ack ra
13:57:33 [spark3]
please raphael
13:57:35 [raphael]
is next week telecon changing hour ?
13:57:55 [fsasaki]
yes, see schedule at
13:57:58 [tobiasbuerger]
13:58:04 [raphael]
ok, it has been approved ?
13:58:04 [fsasaki]
ack to
13:58:04 [spark3]
21 UTC
13:58:14 [raphael]
ok, thanks, I can make it :-)
13:58:53 [fsasaki]
topic: AOB
13:59:07 [fsasaki]
raphael: can I participate in TPAC f2f via phone?
13:59:09 [spark3]
any issues today ?
13:59:16 [fsasaki]
Felix: yes, we have a bridge for both days
13:59:29 [raphael]
14:00:03 [spark3]
Raphael, is that ok for you ? we will adjourn today call
14:00:09 [raphael]
yes, thanks !
14:00:37 [Zakim]
14:00:39 [Zakim]
14:00:43 [Zakim]
14:00:45 [Zakim]
14:00:47 [fsasaki]
many thanks, spark3!
14:00:49 [Zakim]
14:00:51 [Zakim]
14:00:53 [Zakim]
14:00:55 [Zakim]
IA_MAWG()9:00AM has ended
14:00:56 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate fsasaki
14:00:59 [Zakim]
Attendees were +329331aaaa, +49.861.209.aabb, +329331aacc, Felix, tobiasbuerger, Davy, VeroniqueM, Daniel, +43.699.187.6aadd, wbailer, +31.20.525.aaee, Frank
14:06:58 [davy]
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14:07:30 [erik]
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14:15:17 [fsasaki]
rrsagent, bye
14:15:17 [RRSAgent]
I see 1 open action item saved in :
14:15:17 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Felix to extend "formats ... scope" for one more week [1]
14:15:17 [RRSAgent]
recorded in
14:15:20 [fsasaki]
zakim, bye
14:15:20 [Zakim]
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