IRC log of pling on 2008-07-09

Timestamps are in UTC.

11:58:07 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #pling
11:58:07 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/07/09-pling-irc
11:58:19 [Zakim]
Zakim has joined #pling
11:59:00 [renato]
zakim, list conferences
11:59:00 [Zakim]
I see P3P_PLING()8:00AM active
11:59:01 [Zakim]
also scheduled at this time is Team_W3M()8:00AM
11:59:25 [renato]
this is P3P_PLING()8:00AM
12:00:09 [boabjohn]
g'day from another window...will dial in shortly
12:00:48 [Ashok]
Ashok has joined #pling
12:01:01 [rigo]
rigo has joined #pling
12:03:16 [rigo]
zakim, this is pling
12:03:16 [Zakim]
ok, rigo; that matches P3P_PLING()8:00AM
12:03:32 [rigo]
present+ Rigo
12:03:36 [rigo]
present+ Ashok
12:03:42 [rigo]
present+ Renato
12:03:47 [rigo]
present+ Marco
12:05:33 [rigo]
RRSAgent, please set log public
12:05:42 [rigo]
present+ Christina
12:05:49 [rigo]
present+ John
12:05:55 [rigo]
present+ Hannes
12:07:24 [renato]
last meeting action - Marco to look at how to indicate new updates to wiki more visible
12:08:32 [boabjohn]
(lurking IRC only..no phone connect, sorry!)
12:09:20 [renato]
See "recent changes" under the Navigation panel on the wiki
12:09:51 [rigo]
scribenick: rigo
12:09:54 [rigo]
scribe: rigo
12:10:03 [rigo]
zakim, who is here?
12:10:03 [Zakim]
On the phone I see ??P0, [IPcaller], +358.504.87aaaa, ??P4, Ashok_Malhotra, +1.978.867.aabb
12:10:05 [Zakim]
On IRC I see rigo, Zakim, RRSAgent, renato, christinatzivisko, boabjohn
12:10:18 [boabjohn]
Hello.
12:10:40 [rigo]
RI: reviewing wiki activity in last 4 weeks
12:10:55 [tlr]
tlr has joined #pling
12:10:55 [Zakim]
- +358.504.87aaaa
12:11:08 [tlr]
zakim, who is on the phone?
12:11:08 [Zakim]
On the phone I see ??P0, [IPcaller], ??P4, Ashok_Malhotra, +1.978.867.aabb
12:11:11 [tlr]
zakim, call thomas-skype
12:11:11 [Zakim]
ok, tlr; the call is being made
12:11:13 [Zakim]
+Thomas
12:11:33 [Zakim]
+ +358.504.87aacc
12:12:17 [rigo]
RW: swamped, have lots of interesting cases to write up
12:12:35 [rigo]
zakim, aacc is Hannes
12:12:35 [Zakim]
+Hannes; got it
12:12:43 [tlr]
zakim, who is on the phone
12:12:43 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'who is on the phone', tlr
12:12:54 [rigo]
RI: any major additions to the wiki past 4 weeks
12:13:06 [rigo]
RI: two new languages added
12:13:17 [tlr]
PROTUNE
12:13:55 [tlr]
sure
12:14:01 [tlr]
ScribeNick: trl
12:14:04 [tlr]
ScribeNick: tlr
12:14:14 [tlr]
RW: PrimeLife deliverable
12:14:18 [tlr]
... about to be published ...
12:14:36 [tlr]
... contains lots of review of standards the project will try to address ...
12:14:40 [tlr]
... collection of policy languages ...
12:14:50 [tlr]
... have to see whether we have all of these in that list ...
12:14:58 [tlr]
... and also whether there are additions in the PrimeLife list ...
12:15:06 [tlr]
RI: Analysis as well as just documenting?
12:15:13 [tlr]
RW: Not a deep analysis
12:15:21 [tlr]
... just adds some explanation of what these do ...
12:15:27 [tlr]
... still lots of pages ...
12:15:36 [tlr]
MCM: Description of successful use cases? pros/cons?
12:15:42 [tlr]
RW: Good idea, but we haven't done that yet
12:15:53 [tlr]
... maybe if we ever come across implementation, let's add that to wiki ...
12:16:00 [tlr]
HT: Think Implementation itself is nice ...
12:16:07 [tlr]
... deployment is the crucial part ...
12:16:17 [tlr]
... I worked on a specific protocol that's widely implemented ...
12:16:21 [tlr]
... but in fact not widely deployed ...
12:16:35 [tlr]
RW: Interesting
12:16:38 [tlr]
HT: Protocol is @@
12:16:48 [tlr]
s/@@/diameter/
12:16:56 [tlr]
... it's a AAA protocol ...
12:17:01 [tlr]
... 26 implementations, but hardly any use ...
12:17:13 [tlr]
... implementations are interesting, but it doesn't help ..
12:17:21 [tlr]
... understand why things are not successful wrt deployment ...
12:17:35 [tlr]
MCM: important to consider deployment
12:17:40 [tlr]
HT: Hard to get by with that information about deployments
12:17:43 [tlr]
RW: Hard work indeed.
12:18:00 [tlr]
RI: Looking forward to PrimeLife report
12:18:22 [tlr]
MCM: Public deliverable?
12:18:27 [tlr]
RW: In the loop for publication clearance
12:18:33 [Ashok]
Ashok has joined #pling
12:18:49 [tlr]
RI: </languages>
12:18:56 [tlr]
RI: No new use cases added that I've seen.
12:18:59 [tlr]
... anything new from Marco?
12:19:05 [tlr]
MCM: Haven't seen anything extremely different
12:19:22 [tlr]
... main driver is how to deal with multiple languages in different contexts ...
12:19:24 [tlr]
... big theme in HP ...
12:19:32 [tlr]
... talking to some of the business groups ...
12:19:37 [tlr]
... common context is heterogeneous ...
12:19:57 [tlr]
... environments with enforcement and decision points at different points of the stack ...
12:20:02 [tlr]
... conservative approach to change ...
12:20:29 [tlr]
... any compelling way to combine / compare different policies ...
12:20:31 [tlr]
... check for inconsistencies ...
12:20:36 [tlr]
... update consistently ...
12:20:42 [tlr]
RI: Reviewing other sections of wiki, not much enw
12:20:44 [tlr]
s/enw/new/
12:20:51 [tlr]
zakim, unmute me
12:20:51 [Zakim]
sorry, tlr, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
12:21:01 [tlr]
q+
12:21:06 [tlr]
RW: What's PROTUNE about?
12:21:15 [tlr]
q-
12:21:24 [tlr]
RI: There's a link from the wiki. Don't know it in detail.
12:21:37 [tlr]
RW: Picos?
12:21:48 [tlr]
MCM: Trying to get people to join these calls, but conflict today.
12:22:04 [tlr]
re PROTUNE: http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/wiki/Concrete_examples_given_in_Protune
12:22:15 [tlr]
RW: share information on pling mailing list?
12:22:25 [tlr]
-- scribe takes break --
12:23:22 [tlr]
MCM: (PICOS summary)
12:23:35 [rigo]
http://www.picos-project.eu/
12:26:38 [tlr]
RI: Please update the wiki. If you make major changes, please alert the list.
12:26:42 [tlr]
Topic: Liaisons
12:27:22 [tlr]
RI: ISO/IEC JTC 1 SC 27 WG5?
12:27:29 [tlr]
RW: Talked to convener two weeks ago.
12:27:51 [tlr]
... have to submit paper
12:28:43 [tlr]
... access to documents, excuse for publication of specs
12:28:49 [tlr]
... I'm tracking the action already.
12:29:07 [tlr]
RI: PrimeLife?
12:29:15 [tlr]
RW: I'd love to get Jan C on these calls.
12:29:19 [tlr]
... tlr, bug him?
12:29:23 [tlr]
ACTION: tlr to bug JanC
12:29:33 [tlr]
RI: Concordia?
12:30:27 [tlr]
TR: No news, sorry.
12:30:44 [tlr]
MCM: Started by Liberty, interoperability for FIM
12:30:56 [renato]
action: rigo liaison letter to SC27/Wg5
12:31:05 [tlr]
MCM: Monitoring
12:31:17 [tlr]
... not sure contact needs to be created from scratch ...
12:31:26 [tlr]
... it's been launched by liberty alliance; purpose is to be independence ...
12:31:29 [tlr]
... name says it all ...
12:32:15 [tlr]
q+
12:32:27 [rigo]
ack tlr
12:32:46 [tlr]
TR: Maybe best to approach them in the context of broader conversation with Liberty.
12:33:51 [tlr]
RI: ok, let's keep it on the back-burner
12:33:58 [tlr]
... anything else we should be looking at?
12:34:36 [tlr]
RW: I saw something about ODRL and microformats...
12:34:49 [tlr]
... one of the chairs is a good liaison candidates ..
12:35:07 [tlr]
ACTION: Renato to put in material re ODRL and microformat-representation
12:35:44 [tlr]
RW: Negation in ODRL?
12:35:56 [tlr]
RI: ODRL 2
12:36:02 [tlr]
RW: How is it modelled?
12:36:28 [tlr]
RI: actions, prohibitions, high-level
12:36:37 [tlr]
... modeling side, don't have the answer yet ...
12:37:07 [tlr]
... things have been a bit slow on ODRL front ...
12:37:18 [tlr]
... not getting much of a push from market or industry ...
12:37:21 [tlr]
... to put out v2 quickly ...
12:37:32 [tlr]
RW: Understandable.
12:37:44 [tlr]
RI: Happy to report on ODRL here.
12:37:57 [tlr]
... anything else?
12:38:10 [tlr]
MCM: infocard foundation as been created
12:38:42 [tlr]
... could be interesting to do liaison ...
12:38:50 [tlr]
... suspect exploration of policiese to handle infocards ...
12:38:57 [tlr]
... back-end management of infocards ...
12:39:16 [tlr]
Topic: Events
12:39:26 [tlr]
RI: f2f meeting proposal for TPAC
12:39:29 [tlr]
... 23/24 October ...
12:39:37 [tlr]
... That's Thu/Fri of that week ...
12:39:40 [tlr]
... we have a room scheduled ...
12:39:48 [tlr]
... have to get back to them and say "yes, we want" ...
12:39:53 [tlr]
... (or "no") ...
12:40:03 [tlr]
... need to decide quickly whether to go ahead with f2f ...
12:40:29 [tlr]
... if it's not of interest, we should W3C that resource can be released ...
12:40:31 [tlr]
RW: Understand RI won't be able to come?
12:40:35 [tlr]
RI: 80% probability that I can come
12:40:39 [tlr]
... depends on external factors ...
12:40:41 [tlr]
... lookign reasonably well that I could make it ...
12:40:48 [tlr]
... issue is how many other people are here ...
12:40:58 [tlr]
RW: Think one of the chairs should raise things on the mailing list ...
12:41:17 [tlr]
... TR and I will care for having people invited where needed, and all that ...
12:41:25 [tlr]
ACTION: RI to poll group about TPAC attendance
12:41:38 [tlr]
RW: Maybe raise in ac-forum?
12:42:06 [tlr]
... we can't issue another call for participation ...
12:42:09 [tlr]
... maybe also in chairs ...
12:42:17 [tlr]
... maybe meeting the experts might be useful for other groups ...
12:42:42 [tlr]
RI: Happy to draft e-mail to ac-forum to highlight that ...
12:42:47 [tlr]
RW: 95 subscribers on mailing list
12:42:57 [tlr]
... maybe we can get some feedback ...
12:43:23 [tlr]
RI: Will send something soon.
12:43:26 [tlr]
RW: Agenda important.
12:43:32 [tlr]
RI: anything else on f2f?
12:43:46 [tlr]
RI: Also, IEEE policy 2008
12:43:57 [tlr]
... to occur, has occured?
12:44:29 [tlr]
MCM: I raised this point last time to ask if anybody here was there
12:44:43 [tlr]
... don't know that we've anything relevant ...
12:44:47 [tlr]
RW: Maybe ask on mailing list?
12:44:49 [tlr]
MCM: good idea
12:44:53 [tlr]
RI: Interesting papers.
12:45:02 [renato]
Paper from IEEE Policy <http://www.usukita.org/?q=node/183>
12:45:13 [tlr]
topic: AOB
12:45:25 [tlr]
RI: Charter extension.
12:45:31 [tlr]
... the charter is extended through June 2009 ...
12:45:33 [tlr]
... thanks to Rigo ...
12:46:03 [tlr]
RW: Meeting at barrier reef!
12:46:11 [tlr]
... preferably in winter ...
12:46:22 [tlr]
RI: So, we're here for another year
12:46:26 [tlr]
... any other other business
12:46:33 [boabjohn]
Many apologies: more progress on usecases next meeting
12:46:41 [tlr]
... next meeting scheduled for @@ August
12:46:44 [tlr]
... same time ...
12:46:45 [rigo]
13
12:46:49 [tlr]
s/@@/13/
12:46:54 [tlr]
... telco is scheduled monthly
12:47:13 [tlr]
RI: adjourned
12:47:32 [Zakim]
- +1.978.867.aabb
12:47:34 [Zakim]
-[IPcaller]
12:47:35 [Zakim]
-??P0
12:47:36 [Zakim]
-??P4
12:47:36 [Zakim]
-Hannes
12:47:38 [Zakim]
-Ashok_Malhotra
12:47:38 [Zakim]
P3P_PLING()8:00AM has ended
12:47:39 [Zakim]
Attendees were [IPcaller], +358.504.87aaaa, Ashok_Malhotra, +1.978.867.aabb, Thomas, +358.504.87aacc, Hannes
12:47:59 [rigo]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
12:47:59 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/07/09-pling-minutes.html rigo
12:48:45 [rigo]
RRSAgent, bye
12:48:45 [RRSAgent]
I see 4 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/07/09-pling-actions.rdf :
12:48:45 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: tlr to bug JanC [1]
12:48:45 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/07/09-pling-irc#T12-29-23
12:48:45 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: rigo liaison letter to SC27/Wg5 [2]
12:48:45 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/07/09-pling-irc#T12-30-56
12:48:45 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Renato to put in material re ODRL and microformat-representation [3]
12:48:45 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/07/09-pling-irc#T12-35-07
12:48:45 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: RI to poll group about TPAC attendance [4]
12:48:45 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/07/09-pling-irc#T12-41-25
12:48:50 [rigo]
zakim, bye
12:48:50 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #pling