14:51:59 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #swd
14:51:59 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc
14:52:03 <Tom> rrsagent, bookmark
14:52:03 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T14-52-03
14:52:07 <Tom> zakim, this will be swd
14:52:07 <Zakim> ok, Tom; I see SW_SWD()11:00AM scheduled to start in 8 minutes
14:52:12 <Tom> Meeting: SWD WG
14:52:16 <Tom> Chair: Tom
14:52:39 <Tom> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0058.html
14:52:53 <Tom> Regrets: Daniel, Vit, Ed, Sean, Guus, Elisa
14:53:54 <Tom> Previous: http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html
14:54:04 <Tom> rrsagent, please make record public
14:55:06 <Zakim> SW_SWD()11:00AM has now started
14:55:14 <Zakim> +Margherita_Sini
14:55:41 <marghe> marghe has joined #swd
14:56:15 <marghe> zakim, this conference is swd
14:56:15 <Zakim> marghe, this was already SW_SWD()11:00AM
14:56:16 <Zakim> ok, marghe; that matches SW_SWD()11:00AM
14:56:29 <marghe> rrsagent, bookmark
14:56:29 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T14-56-29
14:56:34 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:57:03 <marghe> rrsagent, please draft minutes
14:57:03 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-minutes.html marghe
14:58:11 <marghe> Scribe: Margherita Sini
14:58:22 <marghe> Scribenick: marghe
14:59:39 <Zakim> +Ralph
15:00:26 <aliman> aliman has joined #swd
15:01:18 <JonP> JonP has joined #swd
15:02:14 <Zakim> +??P19
15:02:27 <Ralph> zakim, ??p19 is Aliman
15:02:27 <Zakim> +Aliman; got it
15:02:39 <Zakim> +Jon_Phipps
15:03:17 <Antoine> Antoine has joined #swd
15:03:42 <JonP> zakim, Jon_Phipps is me
15:03:42 <Zakim> +JonP; got it
15:04:17 <Tom> rrsagent, bookmark
15:04:17 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-04-17
15:04:31 <Zakim> +??P34
15:04:41 <Ralph> zakim, ??p34 is Antoine
15:04:41 <Zakim> +Antoine; got it
15:04:42 <Antoine> zakim, ??P34 is me
15:04:43 <Zakim> I already had ??P34 as Antoine, Antoine
15:05:02 <marghe> TOPIC: ADMIN
15:05:26 <marghe> next week the last regular conference scheduled
15:05:37 <marghe> Guus in charge
15:06:06 <marghe> in summer no teleconferences but wrap-up sessions
15:06:14 <marghe> to discuss next week
15:06:15 <benadida> benadida has joined #swd
15:06:56 <Zakim> +Ben_Adida
15:06:58 <seanb> seanb has joined #swd
15:07:11 <marghe> propose to accept meeting of last teleconf
15:07:36 <marghe> actions on the last minutes fixed 
15:07:45 <marghe> no objections --> accepted
15:07:52 <marghe>  TOPIC: SKOS 
15:08:27 <marghe> ACTION: Ed to investigate what text could be added to primer re. concept co-ordination [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/04/22-swd-minutes.html#action02]
15:08:36 <marghe> --continue
15:08:47 <marghe> ACTION: Guus to write primer text re: broaderGeneric and equivalence w/r/t subclass
15:08:51 <marghe> --continues
15:08:52 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-minutes.html Ralph
15:09:24 <marghe> ACTION: Alistair to check the old namespace wrt dereferencing
15:09:51 <marghe> \me sorry could not hear
15:10:13 <marghe> --continues
15:10:53 <marghe> Antoine: should we have skos ontology .... donwloadable?
15:11:29 <marghe> ralph?: there is a url to go to
15:11:36 <Zakim> +??P9
15:11:40 <seanb> zakim, ??P9 is me
15:11:40 <Zakim> +seanb; got it
15:12:03 <marghe> Antoine: owl file should be available
15:13:26 <marghe> Tom: good to have action to define how different products will be made available
15:13:51 <marghe> ralph?: recipes should be enough ?
15:14:08 <marghe> alistar: ok if there is a link on the pages
15:14:32 <marghe> ralph: maybe people can be confused by namespaces and other links
15:14:43 <marghe> tom: owl file should be somewhere....
15:15:18 <marghe> sean: can i access the owl file from my browser?
15:15:45 <marghe> sean: as a user why should i access the owl file?
15:15:59 <marghe> alistar: users want to download it
15:16:08 <marghe> ... and look it locally
15:16:16 <marghe> ... should be possible to do that
15:16:40 <marghe> antoine: url should be available with the receipt 
15:17:01 <marghe> tom: maybe people would like to point to the owl file directly
15:17:11 <marghe> ... even to cite it
15:18:44 <marghe> ralph: if there is the uri to retrieve the owl then we have to tell why is different from namespace
15:19:03 <marghe> ... is the uri normative, informative,... ?
15:19:48 <seanb> q+
15:20:09 <Ralph> Margherita: in FAO we redirect the namespace to the OWL file
15:20:10 <Tom> ack seanb
15:21:20 <Ralph> q+
15:21:42 <marghe> tom?: the question is the owl file has a uri? and if is persistent ? and why not make that uri visible for people that wants to refer to it
15:21:50 <Tom> ack Ralph
15:22:15 <JonP> skos owl uri: http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/WD-skos-reference-20080609/skos.rdf
15:22:22 <marghe> ralph: we haven't decided yes if uri should be persistent ....
15:22:24 <aliman> q+ to mention http://www.w3.org/2004/02/skos/history and publishing uris
15:22:56 <JonP> and that uri returns owl in the browser
15:23:05 <marghe> ... i think that we are realizing that this case we need to address as deployment group
15:23:50 <marghe> ... we should think about what is our advice... 
15:24:30 <Tom> ack aliman
15:24:30 <Zakim> aliman, you wanted to mention http://www.w3.org/2004/02/skos/history and publishing uris
15:24:34 <marghe> tom: the uri is not a secret so we should write it in the document
15:24:43 <seanb> +1 to Ralp's comments re secrets.
15:24:49 <seanb> s/Ralp/Ralph
15:25:09 <Ralph> Ralph: the URI is not a secret.  What I object to without further discussion is writing down that URI in a document.
15:25:47 <Tom> aliman, the page looks good 
15:25:56 <marghe> \me (sorry i cannot hear well alistar)
15:26:08 <Antoine> http://www.w3.org/2004/02/skos/vocabs
15:26:13 <marghe> antoine: what about vocabulary page....
15:26:45 <marghe> alistar: has generic uris ... 
15:27:01 <marghe> ... in the rdf vocab page you have a link
15:27:39 <marghe> the url redirect to latest version
15:28:54 <marghe> ralph?: ... there is grey area in the middle between ??? 
15:29:39 <marghe> tom: who is maintaining the 2004/02/skos space?
15:29:47 <marghe> ralph: alistar + others
15:30:01 <marghe> tom: there is going to be changes
15:30:16 <marghe> ... to skos material so there will be few changes to this web space
15:30:41 <marghe> ... so should be clear to user the new namespace and that the old namespace will stay there
15:31:07 <marghe> ... we need an action so we can back to this topic
15:31:28 <marghe> ... to decide what is the best reccomandation
15:31:41 <marghe> tom: alistar is ok to work on that?
15:31:46 <marghe> alistar: yes
15:32:23 <marghe> tom: we need action about linking directly to owl file
15:32:24 <JonP> q+ have we now raised an issue wrt the recipes?
15:32:28 <marghe> ... what is best practice
15:33:04 <JonP> q+ is there an issue wrt the recipes?
15:33:08 <JonP> grrr
15:33:37 <marghe> Alistar: suggest to update vocabulary page ...
15:34:07 <Tom> ack Jon
15:35:41 <Ralph> -> http://www.w3.org/2005/ajar/tab Tabulator; an RDF browser plugin for FireFox
15:36:03 <marghe> antoine: ideally would be better that tool could manage ??
15:36:56 <marghe> tom: let's wrap up 
15:38:45 <marghe> ACTION: Alistar to update the vocabulary page adding direct link to latest version of rdf triple
15:40:02 <marghe> Ralph: refer to history page
15:40:09 <Tom> s/vocabulary page/history page/
15:40:29 <marghe> ACTION: Antoine and Ed to add content to Primer about irreflexivity 
15:40:45 <marghe> --continues
15:40:53 <marghe> ACTION: Ralph compose intermediate pages 
15:41:22 <marghe> --done
15:41:34 <Ralph> [DONE] ACTION: Ralph compose intermediate pages for http://www.w3.org/TR/swbp-skos-core-spec and http://www.w3.org/TR/swbp-skos-core-guide/ to inform readers of the paths to the old and new SKOS documents [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action02]
15:42:22 <marghe> ACTION: Sean and Alistair to send a file for the namespace
15:42:28 <marghe> --done
15:42:43 <marghe> ACTION: Sean to write a proposal to indicate to OWL WG our requirements for annotation properties
15:42:47 <marghe> --continues
15:42:57 <marghe> ACTION: Editors of the Use Cases to clean up the lists of requirements in light of resolutions
15:43:00 <marghe> --continues
15:43:40 <aliman> ralph, I've reviewed the intermediate skos pages, they look fine to me.
15:43:54 <Ralph> [Antoine, if you're referring to the difference between "SKOS Simple Knowledge Organization System Primer" in the title and "SKOS -- Simple Knowledge Organisation System" in the abstract, that's how it appears in http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/WD-skos-primer-20080221/ -- I can change the intermediate page either way you like :)
15:44:35 <Ralph> [DONE] ACTION: Margherita to liase with primer authors about example using plain literals and some with datatype literals [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/20-swd-minutes.html#action17] 
15:45:03 <Ralph> Margherita: I don't see a need for translating symbols now
15:46:01 <Ralph> ... I'll have another look and send email later today
15:46:36 <Ralph> -> http://www.w3.org/TR/skos-reference/#L2655 6.5.4. Notations and Preferred Labels
15:47:08 <Ralph> Alistair: I added section 6.5.4 to the SKOS Reference after our discussion on symbolic labels
15:47:17 <Ralph> ... see the prose before Example 22
15:48:05 <marghe> TOPIC: Issue 83
15:48:52 <marghe> Alistar: no objection on the proposal 
15:50:39 <seanb> Sean: should make it clear that the properties are not inverses.
15:51:14 <marghe> tom: propose to resolve issue 83
15:51:40 <marghe> RESOLVED: to close Issue 83 
15:52:50 <Tom> s=to close Issue 83=to close Issue 83 as proposed in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008May/0068.html =
15:53:10 <Tom> s/=/|/g
15:53:50 <Ralph> s|: to close Issue 83|: to close Issue 83 as proposed in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008May/0068.html
15:53:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-minutes.html Ralph
15:54:07 <marghe> TOPIC: Issues 72, 73, 75
15:54:23 <marghe> ACTION: Guus to mail his position on issues 72, 73 and 75 to the list
15:54:30 <marghe> --continues
15:54:45 <marghe> TOPIC: RDFa
15:55:43 <marghe> ACTION: Ben to prepare draft implementation report for RDFa (with assistance from Michael) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14]
15:55:46 <marghe> --continues
15:56:01 <marghe> ACTION: Ralph to draft to draft the RDFa transition request [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html#action02]
15:56:05 <marghe> --continues
15:56:21 <marghe> --done
15:56:32 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-minutes.html Ralph
15:56:51 <marghe> TOPIC: RECIPES
15:57:01 <marghe> ACTION: Ralph/Diego to work on Wordnet implementation [of Recipes implementations] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action20]
15:57:06 <marghe> --continues
15:58:53 <Zakim> -seanb
15:58:55 <marghe> ACTION: Jon and Ralph to publish Recipes as Working Group Note [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html#action03]
15:58:55 <Zakim> -Ben_Adida
15:58:57 <Zakim> -JonP
15:58:58 <Zakim> -Antoine
15:58:59 <Zakim> -Aliman
15:59:14 <Ralph> zakim, list attendees
15:59:14 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Margherita_Sini, Tom, Ralph, Aliman, JonP, Antoine, Ben_Adida, seanb
15:59:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-minutes.html Ralph
16:00:47 <JonP> @Ralph from last minutes: guus: would like jon and ralph to take an action on reflecting the possible future activities related to the document
16:03:56 <Zakim> -Ralph
16:03:57 <Zakim> -Tom
16:03:58 <Zakim> -Margherita_Sini
16:03:59 <marghe> marghe has left #swd
16:04:04 <Zakim> SW_SWD()11:00AM has ended
16:04:06 <Zakim> Attendees were Margherita_Sini, Tom, Ralph, Aliman, JonP, Antoine, Ben_Adida, seanb
16:04:13 <Ralph> zakim, bye
16:04:14 <Zakim> Zakim has left #swd
16:04:16 <Ralph> rrsagent, bye
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> I see 14 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-actions.rdf :
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ed to investigate what text could be added to primer re. concept co-ordination [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/04/22-swd-minutes.html#action02] [1]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-08-27
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Guus to write primer text re: broaderGeneric and equivalence w/r/t subclass [2]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-08-47
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Alistair to check the old namespace wrt dereferencing [3]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-09-24
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Alistar to update the vocabulary page adding direct link to latest version of rdf triple [4]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-38-45
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Antoine and Ed to add content to Primer about irreflexivity  [5]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-40-29
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ralph compose intermediate pages  [6]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-40-53
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Sean and Alistair to send a file for the namespace [7]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-42-22
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Sean to write a proposal to indicate to OWL WG our requirements for annotation properties [8]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-42-43
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Editors of the Use Cases to clean up the lists of requirements in light of resolutions [9]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-42-57
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Guus to mail his position on issues 72, 73 and 75 to the list [10]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-54-23
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ben to prepare draft implementation report for RDFa (with assistance from Michael) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14] [11]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-55-43
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ralph to draft to draft the RDFa transition request [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html#action02] [12]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-56-01
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ralph/Diego to work on Wordnet implementation [of Recipes implementations] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action20] [13]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-57-01
16:04:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Jon and Ralph to publish Recipes as Working Group Note [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html#action03] [14]
16:04:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/17-swd-irc#T15-58-55