14:55:23 RRSAgent has joined #swd 14:55:23 logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc 14:55:33 rrsagent, bookmark 14:55:33 See http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T14-55-33 14:55:42 zakim, this will be swd 14:55:42 ok, TomB; I see SW_SWD()11:00AM scheduled to start in 5 minutes 14:55:50 Meeting: SWD WG 14:55:56 Chair: Guus 14:56:23 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0021.html 14:56:24 vit has joined #SWD 14:57:11 Previous: http://www.w3.org/2008/06/03-swd-minutes.html 14:57:45 Ralph has joined #swd 14:57:56 Regrets: Diego, Simone 14:58:03 rrsagent, please make meeting public 14:58:03 I'm logging. I don't understand 'please make meeting public', TomB. Try /msg RRSAgent help 14:58:19 SW_SWD()11:00AM has now started 14:58:23 rrsagent, please make record public 14:58:26 + +1.267.391.aaaa 14:58:55 +[IPcaller] 14:59:10 qhreul has joined #swd 14:59:18 zakim, who is on the call? 14:59:18 On the phone I see +1.267.391.aaaa, [IPcaller] 14:59:19 +JeffP 14:59:39 zakim, aaaa is Clay 14:59:39 +Clay; got it 14:59:41 seanb has joined #swd 14:59:47 zakim, IPcaller is me 14:59:47 +TomB; got it 15:00:30 +Ralph 15:00:38 +??P22 15:00:54 Clay has joined #swd 15:01:00 zakim, ??p22 is me 15:01:07 +vit; got it 15:01:09 +Guus_Schreiber 15:02:43 zakim, who is here? 15:02:43 On the phone I see Clay, TomB, JeffP, Ralph, vit, Guus_Schreiber 15:02:44 +??P32 15:02:46 Antoine has joined #swd 15:02:46 On IRC I see Clay, seanb, qhreul, Ralph, vit, RRSAgent, Zakim, TomB, Guus 15:02:49 zakim, ??P32 is me 15:02:52 +seanb; got it 15:03:13 dlrubin has joined #swd 15:03:14 +??P35 15:03:28 edsu has joined #swd 15:03:59 zakim, ??p35 is DLRubin 15:04:00 zakim, who is here? 15:04:13 +DLRubin; got it 15:04:17 On the phone I see Clay, TomB, JeffP, Ralph, vit, Guus_Schreiber, seanb, DLRubin 15:04:29 +??P40 15:04:31 +[LC] 15:04:34 Zakim, LC is edsu 15:04:35 On IRC I see edsu, dlrubin, Antoine, Clay, seanb, qhreul, Ralph, vit, RRSAgent, Zakim, TomB, Guus 15:04:36 zakim, ??p40 is Antoine 15:04:48 +edsu; got it 15:04:52 +Antoine; got it 15:04:54 zakim, JeffP is qhreul 15:05:14 +qhreul; got it 15:05:27 JonP has joined #swd 15:05:57 guus: decision on the RDFa documents today 15:06:10 +Jon_Phipps 15:06:19 Topic: Admin 15:06:35 guus: two telcos remaining 15:06:42 zakim, Jon_Phipps is me 15:06:42 +JonP; got it 15:06:48 assumed to finish with telco by june 24 15:07:17 ...minutes accepted 15:07:33 Topic: RDFa 15:08:05 ACTION: Ben to prepare draft implementation report for RDFa (with 15:08:05 assistance from Michael) [recorded in 15:08:05 http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14] 15:08:10 --continues 15:08:15 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0032.html "[RDFa] CR for RDFa" [Ben 2008-06-09] 15:08:44 guus: ralph should explain more on that 15:08:51 ralph: published LC for RDFa 15:08:55 ... in february 15:09:16 ... WG is expected to collect comments 15:09:47 ... once this is done, present to the director 15:09:58 ... move to the last phase 15:10:22 ... ready to issue the call for implementations then 15:10:29 ... no objections in the TF 15:10:48 ... open issues 15:11:01 ... 106 - set of comments from TIMBL 15:11:17 ... two classes of comments 15:12:53 ... the claim of the TF is that the first class has been addressed - by resolving the follow your ??? issue 15:13:42 s/???/nose 15:13:57 ... the XHTML WG has decided to add this to the definition of DTDs 15:14:28 ... the spec says there should be a doctype to validate 15:15:01 guss: not a feature at risk ? 15:15:06 ralph: no 15:15:12 ralph: issue 113 15:15:21 ... request to define processing rules in the spec 15:16:19 ... we believe the spec has clear processing rules for copying doc fragments 15:16:44 guus: why this was not ruled out of scope? 15:16:57 ralph: we're not specifying proc. rules, leaving it open 15:18:03 ... issues not closed, response to commentor send 15:18:21 ... no satisfaction indicated so far 15:18:50 ... record the state of the comment by the tracker 15:19:06 guus: anymore question from the WG? 15:19:24 ... ed reviewed the document - are you happy to go to the CR? 15:19:34 ed: yes 15:19:49 Ralph: the Task Force has in fact resolved issues 106 and 113 and replied to the commenter; they remain in the "open" state only while awaiting the commentor's acceptance of the resolution 15:19:49 guus: asking diego 15:20:01 ...diego sent regrets 15:20:06 ... assume he agrees 15:20:45 Guus: I have seen no indication of objection from Diego 15:21:04 guus: resolution proposed - ask for transition of the RDFa documents 15:21:16 ... and get CR status 15:21:50 PROPOSE: the SWD WG request the Director advance RDFa Syntax and Processing to Candidate Recommendation 15:22:10 PROPOSE: the SWD WG request the Director advance RDFa Syntax and Processing to Candidate Recommendation per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0032.html 15:22:29 PROPOSE: the SWD WG request the Director advance RDFa in XHTML: Syntax and Processing to Candidate Recommendation per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0032.html 15:22:42 thx for the help ralph! 15:23:50 ralph: we're done with CR if we have at least 2 implementation that pass test cases 15:24:32 PROPOSE: the SWD WG request the Director advance RDFa in XHTML: Syntax and Processing to Candidate Recommendation per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0032.html, with exit criteria being 2 implementations of each feature and 2 implementations that pass all tests 15:25:06 guus: asks for objections, who seconds the proposals? 15:25:10 ed: second it 15:25:27 guus: no objections, resolved by consensus 15:25:58 berrueta has joined #swd 15:26:04 guus: have to wait for XHTML decision 15:26:06 note that per the CR draft, we are proposing July 15 as the CR end date 15:26:33 ACTION: Ralph to draft to draft the transitional request 15:26:55 s/transitional/RDFa transition/ 15:26:58 ralph: no controversy with the director anticipated 15:27:35 guus: waiting for the implementation report to be finished 15:28:12 ... expect to have a telco middle July about the CR track 15:28:40 Ralph++ 15:28:58 Topic: Recipes 15:29:40 jon: current status - completed the document 15:30:01 ... ralph expressed some irritation, we'll fix it 15:30:09 ... not critical 15:30:22 ... document is ready to publish we believe 15:30:31 ... within the review 15:30:37 ... several issues 15:30:52 ... hash URIs - not addressed this use case 15:31:16 ... usage of RDFa and GRDDL not covered - also an interested use case 15:31:33 ... before the end of this WG, the document should perhaps be updated 15:31:59 ... suggesting - publish the document, but revise the document before the end of the WG 15:32:17 guus: we don't promise anything, but are open w.r.t. revisions 15:32:24 +1 to proceeding to NOTE for this document, noting in Status that RDFa, new purl.org, and LCSH cases are not covered 15:32:45 jon: possibilities: postpone or publish with possible revision in the future 15:32:54 guus: proposes to publish as WG note 15:33:02 ... see if we need revision later on 15:33:16 ralph: seconds guus 15:33:31 +1 to advance note and update if necessary since that is an option 15:33:43 ... suggests mentioning the possibility of an update in the published document 15:34:27 guus: publishing good for giving an impression we're serious about that 15:34:50 jon: RDFa and GRDDL mentioned in a paragraph 15:35:18 guus: reviewers - ralph and ed - can comment on it? 15:35:22 I've been privately discussing this with Jon and I support his proposal to publish a note now and try to update the document before the end of the WG 15:35:24 ralph: happy to publish it 15:35:32 ed: happy as well 15:35:51 guus: advance to the note 15:36:13 PROPOSE: jon publish the document as working note 15:37:09 JonP, berrueta: nice work! 15:37:35 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html Ralph 15:37:38 guus: would like jon to take an action on reflecting the possible future activities related to the document 15:38:50 PROPOSE: Advance Recipes to Working Group Note 15:39:02 RESOLVED: Advance Recipes to Working Group Note 15:39:07 PROPOSE: the SWD WG request the Director advance RDFa in XHTML: Syntax and Processing to Candidate Recommendation per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0032.html, with exit criteria being 2 implementations of each feature and 2 implementations that pass all tests 15:39:20 RESOLVED: the SWD WG request the Director advance RDFa in XHTML: Syntax and Processing to Candidate Recommendation per http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0032.html, with exit criteria being 2 implementations of each feature and 2 implementations that pass all tests 15:39:26 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html Ralph 15:40:08 ACTION: jon to publish the document 15:40:23 s/jon/Jon and Ralph 15:40:24 s/jon/jon and ralph 15:40:39 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html Ralph 15:41:13 ACTION: Ralph propose resolution to ISSUE-16 "Default behavior" 15:41:13 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14] 15:41:34 --dropped 15:41:40 ACTION: Ralph/Diego to work on Wordnet implementation [of Recipes 15:41:40 implementations] [recorded in 15:41:40 http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action20] 15:42:16 --continues 15:42:31 guus: people really look at the WordNet implementation 15:42:36 ACTION: Ralph to review the new Editor's Draft of the Recipes [recorded 15:42:36 in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action06] 15:42:37 --done 15:43:11 Topic: VOCABULARY MANAGEMENT 15:43:13 scribenick: Ralph 15:43:38 Guus: we have 4 reviews 15:43:52 ... we were scheduled to get to a Working Draft by today 15:43:58 Vit: I've sent some materials to Elisa 15:44:07 ... she has taken this into account 15:44:13 ... I suppose she has incorporated changes 15:44:31 ... I shortened the research topics and resolved 5 or 6 remarks from the reviewers 15:44:48 ... I do not know the current status of the editors' draft 15:44:58 ... not sure if she has sent an update to the list 15:45:21 Ralph: I am not aware of any off-list discussion with the reviewers 15:45:35 Guus: we'll have to wait for Elisa to be on a telecon 15:45:38 scribenick: vit 15:45:44 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html Ralph 15:45:44 Topic: SKOS 15:46:05 guus: new WD published 15:46:13 -> http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/WD-skos-reference-20080609/ 15:46:19 i/guus: decision on the RDFa/scribenick: vit 15:46:33 Scribe: Vit 15:46:34 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html Ralph 15:46:37 sean: commenting on the current status 15:46:40 q+ to point out that RDFa action on Ben should be moved forward 15:46:43 ... addressed 1 or 2 issues 15:46:50 ... some editorial stuff 15:46:58 ... addition of a section on notations 15:47:24 ... semantic relations and OWL imports covered 15:47:39 ... cleaning up, produced RDF schemas of the documents 15:48:03 guus: the main amount of work related to the current issues 15:48:18 sean: don't think other major issues need to be addressed besides the open issues 15:49:06 antoine: status of the primer 15:49:29 ... no updates, only an editorial changes related to reference 15:49:36 ... only thing since two weeks ago 15:49:49 ed: holding things up 15:50:03 ACTION: Ed to investigate what text could be added to primer re. concept 15:50:03 co-ordination [recorded in 15:50:03 http://www.w3.org/2008/04/22-swd-minutes.html#action02] 15:50:10 --continues 15:50:24 ACTION: Guus to write primer text re: broaderGeneric and equivalence 15:50:25 w/r/t subclass [recorded in 15:50:25 http://www.w3.org/2008/03/18-swd-minutes.html#action08] 15:50:55 --continues 15:51:04 guus: discuss with antoine later on 15:51:14 ACTION: Alistair to check the old namespace wrt dereferencing [recorded 15:51:15 in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action03] 15:51:25 --continues 15:51:34 ACTION: Antoine and Ed to add content to Primer about irreflexivity 15:51:34 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action06] 15:51:40 --continues 15:51:49 ACTION: Ralph compose intermediate pages for 15:51:50 http://www.w3.org/TR/swbp-skos-core-spec and 15:51:50 http://www.w3.org/TR/swbp-skos-core-guide/ to inform readers of the 15:51:50 paths to the old and new SKOS documents [recorded in 15:51:50 http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action02] 15:51:58 --continues 15:52:14 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0024.html 15:52:16 ACTION: Sean and Alistair to send a file for the namespace [recorded in 15:52:17 http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action04] 15:52:19 --done 15:52:38 ACTION: Sean to write a proposal to indicate to OWL WG our requirements 15:52:38 for annotation properties [recorded in 15:52:38 http://www.w3.org/2008/05/06-swd-minutes.html#action07] 15:52:59 --continues 15:53:11 ACTION: Editors of the Use Cases to clean up the lists of requirements 15:53:12 in light of resolutions [recorded in 15:53:12 http://www.w3.org/2008/05/07-swd-minutes.html#action02] 15:53:20 --continues 15:53:37 guus: would like this to be done around the end of june 15:53:46 ACTION: Margherita to liase with author primer about example using plain 15:53:46 literals and some with datatype literals [recorded in 15:53:46 http://www.w3.org/2008/05/20-swd-minutes.html#action17] 15:53:53 --continues 15:53:57 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0025.html 15:53:58 ACTION: Seanb to set up wiki for SKOS/OWL patterns [recorded in 15:53:58 http://www.w3.org/2008/05/27-swd-minutes.html#action14] 15:54:01 --done 15:54:12 [on a quick glance, it appears to me that the SKOS 2005 namespace http://www.w3.org/2004/02/skos/core is dereferencing OK] 15:54:16 ACTION: Editors to produce a revised SKOS Reference WD for June 3 on 15:54:17 which we can vote [recorded in 15:54:17 http://www.w3.org/2008/05/27-swd-minutes.html#action15] 15:54:18 --done 15:54:29 seanb: where's that wiki page at< did i miss that? 15:54:34 ACTION: Ed to write up the rationale behind the dereferencing behavior 15:54:34 for LCSH [recorded in 15:54:34 http://www.w3.org/2008/06/03-swd-minutes.html#action01] 15:54:55 --done 15:55:24 ed: there is an e-mail about that 15:55:59 ... not provide more rationale now, willing to develop it more, done for the moment 15:56:10 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/0019.html 15:56:20 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2008Jun/thread.html#msg19 thread on LCSH as SKOS linked data 15:56:39 guus: look at the issues 15:56:47 ... issue 83 15:57:28 -> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/products/3 SKOS open issues 15:58:39 guus: wonders which issues are included, open. etc. 15:58:58 ... main point for the next weeks agenda - how to resolve the last 6 issues 15:59:18 ... move forward with issues 72, 73, 75 15:59:26 ACTION: Guus to mail his position on issues 72, 73 and 75 to the list 15:59:27 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/05/13-swd-minutes.html#action25] 15:59:31 --continues 15:59:55 dlrubin has left #swd 16:00:28 -> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/RDFa/primer/20080609/ update RDFa primer 16:00:30 -DLRubin 16:00:31 tom: publish the updated RDFa primer - the reviewers should check it before publishing 16:01:04 Topic: RDFa Primer 16:01:36 PROPOSE: publish the RDFa primer 16:01:44 q? 16:01:53 -> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/RDFa/primer/20080609/ updated RDFa Primer editor's draft (9 June) 16:01:57 ack TomB 16:01:57 TomB, you wanted to point out that RDFa action on Ben should be moved forward 16:02:13 tom: points out an action on Ben in RDFa 16:02:26 Guus: PROPOSE to publish the RDFa Primer contingent on Ed's final review 16:02:56 guus: any seconds? 16:03:01 ralph: second 16:03:22 RESOLVED: to publish the RDFa Primer contingent on Ed's final review 16:03:56 ACTION: Ben to prepare draft implementation report for RDFa (with assistance from Michael) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14] 16:04:04 -qhreul 16:04:07 -edsu 16:04:07 Ralph: reminder -- RDFa Primer will still be WD; intent is to transition to NOTE after end of CR 16:04:08 -Guus_Schreiber 16:04:08 -seanb 16:04:08 -JonP 16:04:09 -TomB 16:04:09 -Clay 16:04:10 -vit 16:04:12 -Antoine 16:04:14 -Ralph 16:04:21 SW_SWD()11:00AM has ended 16:04:22 Attendees were +1.267.391.aaaa, Clay, TomB, Ralph, Guus_Schreiber, vit, seanb, DLRubin, edsu, Antoine, qhreul, JonP 16:04:33 rrsagent, please draft minutes 16:04:33 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-minutes.html Ralph 16:05:48 seanb has left #swd 16:06:04 JonP has left #swd 16:06:04 zakim, bye 16:06:04 Zakim has left #swd 16:06:10 rrsagent, bye 16:06:10 I see 20 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-actions.rdf : 16:06:10 ACTION: Ben to prepare draft implementation report for RDFa (with [1] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-08-05 16:06:10 ACTION: Ralph to draft to draft the transitional request [2] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-26-33 16:06:10 ACTION: jon to publish the document [3] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-40-08 16:06:10 ACTION: Ralph propose resolution to ISSUE-16 "Default behavior" [4] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-41-13 16:06:10 ACTION: Ralph/Diego to work on Wordnet implementation [of Recipes [5] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-41-40 16:06:10 ACTION: Ralph to review the new Editor's Draft of the Recipes [recorded [6] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-42-36 16:06:10 ACTION: Ed to investigate what text could be added to primer re. concept [7] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-50-03 16:06:10 ACTION: Guus to write primer text re: broaderGeneric and equivalence [8] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-50-24 16:06:10 ACTION: Alistair to check the old namespace wrt dereferencing [recorded [9] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-51-14 16:06:10 ACTION: Antoine and Ed to add content to Primer about irreflexivity [10] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-51-34 16:06:10 ACTION: Ralph compose intermediate pages for [11] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-51-49 16:06:10 ACTION: Sean and Alistair to send a file for the namespace [recorded in [12] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-52-16 16:06:10 ACTION: Sean to write a proposal to indicate to OWL WG our requirements [13] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-52-38 16:06:10 ACTION: Editors of the Use Cases to clean up the lists of requirements [14] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-53-11 16:06:10 ACTION: Margherita to liase with author primer about example using plain [15] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-53-46 16:06:10 ACTION: Seanb to set up wiki for SKOS/OWL patterns [recorded in [16] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-53-58 16:06:10 ACTION: Editors to produce a revised SKOS Reference WD for June 3 on [17] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-54-16 16:06:10 ACTION: Ed to write up the rationale behind the dereferencing behavior [18] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-54-34 16:06:10 ACTION: Guus to mail his position on issues 72, 73 and 75 to the list [19] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T15-59-26 16:06:10 ACTION: Ben to prepare draft implementation report for RDFa (with assistance from Michael) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14] [20] 16:06:10 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/06/10-swd-irc#T16-03-56