IRC log of xhtml on 2008-04-23

Timestamps are in UTC.

13:00:38 [RRSAgent]
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/04/23-xhtml-irc
13:01:02 [Zakim]
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13:36:14 [Roland]
Zakim, list
13:36:14 [Zakim]
I see no active conferences
13:36:15 [Zakim]
scheduled at this time are IA_XHTML2()9:45AM, Team_W3M()8:00AM
13:36:29 [Roland]
Zakim, this will be XHTML2
13:36:29 [Zakim]
ok, Roland; I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM scheduled to start in 9 minutes
13:36:48 [Roland]
rrsagent, make minutes
13:36:48 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/23-xhtml-minutes.html Roland
13:37:02 [Roland]
rrsagent, make log public
13:38:10 [Roland]
Meeting: XHTML2 WG Weekly Teleconference
13:38:28 [Roland]
Chair: Roland
13:38:45 [Roland]
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0057.html
13:39:02 [Roland]
Regrets: Yam, Alessio
13:39:18 [Roland]
rrsagent, make minutes
13:39:18 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/23-xhtml-minutes.html Roland
13:40:10 [Steven]
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13:45:37 [Zakim]
IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has now started
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+Roland
13:45:58 [Roland]
Zakim, list
13:45:58 [Zakim]
I see IA_XHTML2()9:45AM active
13:45:59 [Zakim]
also scheduled at this time are SW_SWEO()10:00AM, Team_W3M()8:00AM, I18N_CoreWG()10:00AM
13:47:07 [ShaneM]
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13:47:32 [Steven]
zakim, dial steven-617
13:47:32 [Zakim]
ok, Steven; the call is being made
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+Steven
13:47:46 [Zakim]
+ShaneM
13:52:29 [oedipus]
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13:55:05 [Zakim]
+Gregory_Rosmaita
13:55:23 [Steven]
Scribe: steven
13:55:34 [Steven]
Topic: CSS Namespaces review
13:55:49 [Steven]
Steven: The reply was sent. Done
13:55:54 [Steven]
Topic: XML Base
13:56:00 [Steven]
Steven: Not done yet
13:56:12 [Steven]
Topic: FtF:
13:56:27 [Steven]
Roland: I see there is a registration questioniarre, and FtF page
13:56:33 [Steven]
... please fill in everyone
13:57:01 [Steven]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0061.html
13:57:27 [Roland]
http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/xhtml2/wiki/2008-06-Minneapolis-FtF
13:57:49 [Steven]
8-0
13:58:13 [Steven]
Topic: CURIE status
13:58:23 [Steven]
Roland: We worked through one set of comments last week
13:58:50 [Steven]
Steven: I sent a redraft last Friday
13:58:51 [Steven]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0056.html
13:59:08 [oedipus]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0063.html
13:59:18 [Steven]
Steven: Today I sent a draft pf part 2
13:59:36 [Steven]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0063.html
14:00:16 [Steven]
Steven: I would like an OK from the group on the content
14:00:19 [Steven]
... of both
14:00:42 [Steven]
Shane: Please CC the issue tracking system, so that we have the DB trail too
14:00:44 [Steven]
Steven: OK
14:01:48 [ShaneM]
This is issue number 8035 in the tracking system.
14:02:11 [Steven]
Roland: OK with 2 mails?
14:02:21 [Steven]
Steven: I prefer it that way, general/specific
14:02:30 [Steven]
Roland: Any comments on these
14:02:43 [Steven]
s/these/these?/
14:02:52 [Steven]
Roland: Hearing no objections...
14:02:54 [oedipus]
no - send 'em
14:03:15 [Steven]
ACTION: Steven to send two replies to TAG (issue 8035)
14:03:52 [Zakim]
-ShaneM
14:04:01 [Steven]
Roland: Does this mean we can go to last call
14:04:21 [Zakim]
+ShaneM
14:04:53 [Steven]
s/call/call?/
14:05:10 [Steven]
Steven: I believe we can, I see no hurdle
14:05:18 [Steven]
Roland: DO we need to add that to the reply?
14:05:22 [Steven]
s/DO/Do/
14:06:38 [Steven]
Shane: In that case I think the reply to the TAG shouldn't ask them for more input. ("What more would you like to see?")
14:07:18 [ShaneM]
if you cc xhtml2-issues@mn.aptest.com with (PR#8032) in the subject line magic should occur.
14:07:48 [ShaneM]
[ ]
14:07:52 [ShaneM]
{ }
14:08:54 [Steven]
ACTION: Steven to announce last call of CURIEs
14:09:31 [Steven]
Topic: Mime type
14:09:48 [Steven]
Roland: We should review this
14:09:59 [Steven]
... and possibly send a message to the public list
14:12:38 [oedipus]
SP: lot of discussions internal to w3c about mime-type; TBL doesn't see problem with text/html; got impression would address at AC meeting in Beijing; haven't checked those minutes yet; both TBL and DanC agree with us on this; TBL didn't realize how successful XHTML actually is -- only hearing "a complete flop" because no one using application/xml -- pointed out real usage statistics; some misunderstanding of role of new document; unreviewed at present, still
14:13:19 [oedipus]
SP: Olivier complained that in XHTML 1.0 allowed text/html for docs that follow Appendix C - which is informative, but section normative; found difficult to decide if Appendix C informative or normative
14:13:26 [oedipus]
Shane: we fixed that
14:13:50 [oedipus]
SP: doesn't satisfy Olivier; could put stake in ground by reissuing 1.0 to make it clear
14:14:16 [oedipus]
Shane: proposal - let's reissue PR 1.0 removing Appendix C and instead referencing XHTML Mime
14:14:28 [oedipus]
SP: reissue 1.0 with those changes? works for me
14:14:38 [oedipus]
Shane: eliminates possibility of confusion
14:14:59 [oedipus]
SP: good for 2 reasons: 1) removes ambiguity and 2) puts our stake firmly in ground
14:15:09 [oedipus]
SP: need to get some backing for XHTML Mime -- ready to review?
14:15:27 [oedipus]
Shane: Roland had some concerns, but in terms of changes i've made, i think i've completed the work
14:16:01 [oedipus]
ACTION - Everybody: review latest draft of XHTML Mime and consider RM's comments thereupon - due 2008/04/30
14:16:10 [oedipus]
ACTION: Everybody - review latest draft of XHTML Mime and consider RM's comments thereupon - due 2008/04/30
14:16:28 [Tina]
Could someone remind me of the draft URI?
14:16:42 [Steven]
look in /Drafts tina
14:16:45 [oedipus]
Shane: had been planning on updating Appendix C in context of XHTML Mime, until realized, why not just replace?
14:16:56 [oedipus]
scribeNick+ oedipus
14:17:05 [oedipus]
TOPIC: M12N
14:17:11 [oedipus]
RM: anything from SteveBratt
14:17:36 [oedipus]
SP: most people in beijing at moment; been very quiet week for email, meetings and IRC -- next week will follow up
14:17:57 [Steven]
scribe: Steven
14:18:44 [oedipus]
recent email on Event from GJR: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0064.html
14:18:55 [Steven]
Topic: script/@implements
14:19:04 [Roland]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0059.html
14:19:41 [oedipus]
quote from shane from f2f: "We can also do that with an @if that checks HASFEATURE so @implements is then a shorthand"
14:20:20 [Steven]
Roland: Was I close?
14:20:31 [oedipus]
GJR: +1 to RM's Question 1
14:20:54 [Steven]
Steven: Yes
14:21:07 [oedipus]
@implements tells the system that if there is an implementation of that NS, to ignore this script, or, if no script is present, to use the @implements to point to the pertinent namespace URI for the markup dialect/version/module which the user agent or an expert handler -- a piece of middleware that provides context and the language's ontology -- to invoke that namespace in order to properly parse input and output interactions with specialized knowledge doma
14:21:12 [Steven]
Roland: Is namespace too coarse a level?
14:21:33 [oedipus]
q+ to ask did you have specific granularity levels in mind when you posed the
14:21:33 [oedipus]
question?
14:22:04 [Steven]
Roland: Consider Alessio's frames script
14:22:47 [oedipus]
SP: might include several scripts for sub-parts - top-level or not?
14:23:15 [Steven]
Steven: I did intend it to be for namkespaces
14:23:34 [Steven]
... but we could be more finely grained, if we could find a notation
14:25:37 [Steven]
... consider a script that implemented href everywhere, or src everywhere
14:25:44 [oedipus]
q?
14:26:23 [Steven]
Shane: And then there are problems with different versions of a spec (XForms 1.0 and 1.1, which are both in the same namesapce)
14:26:39 [Steven]
Roland: and then you have @role and access
14:27:11 [Steven]
SHane: What about a list of CURIEs?
14:27:16 [Steven]
s/SH/Sh/
14:27:40 [Steven]
Shane: implements="xh:role xh:access"
14:28:24 [Steven]
Gregory: If there is an implementation of a dialect or module that the UA doesn't know, it needs some middleware to help interpret the input
14:34:03 [oedipus]
q-
14:34:07 [Steven]
Steven: I think that @implements gives you exactly what you want, since your middleware then knows to ignore those bits of script
14:34:16 [oedipus]
yes, you are correct
14:34:31 [Steven]
Gregory: WHat level of granularity were you thinking of ROland?
14:34:38 [Steven]
Roland: Well, maybe module
14:34:43 [Steven]
s/WH/Wh/
14:34:57 [Steven]
Gergory: That is what I want too!
14:35:10 [Steven]
SHane: I think I agree
14:35:14 [Steven]
s/SH/Sh/
14:35:47 [Steven]
Shane: I think that since that is our granularity level of definition, we should match that
14:36:07 [Steven]
Gregory: It also gives people a reason to use M12N and to implement it correctly
14:37:00 [Steven]
Roland: I would agree with Shane that CURIEs would then be associated with modules
14:37:24 [Steven]
Shane: So we just need to develop a naming scheme - name, revision
14:37:35 [Steven]
[general agreement]
14:38:10 [Steven]
s/Gerg/Greg/
14:38:14 [ShaneM]
in case I was not clear, I think the datatype for @implements is URIorCURIEs....
14:38:24 [Steven]
Roland: I will refine the rpoposal and send it for a later discussion
14:38:26 [ShaneM]
which should probably be renamed URIorSafeCURIEs
14:38:30 [oedipus]
yes, URI or CURIE
14:39:02 [Steven]
Topic: Access
14:41:47 [Steven]
Gregory: The issue is on the PF agenda today
14:42:01 [oedipus]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0045.html
14:42:18 [oedipus]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xhtml2/2008Apr/0044.html
14:43:21 [Steven]
Gregory: This is a cross-group effort, so it is importnant we get it right in order to do just one review
14:43:38 [Steven]
... it is also a focus of the UA guidelines, and on the agenda this week
14:44:25 [Steven]
Gregory: On the issue of boolena, I may have an answer by the end of today
14:44:37 [Steven]
... on the issue of keys, maybe by Friday
14:44:52 [Steven]
s/boolena/boolean/
14:46:21 [Steven]
Roland: Is the ARIA issue solved with HTML5?
14:46:26 [Steven]
Gregory: Not yet
14:47:43 [Steven]
[ADJOURN]
14:47:48 [Zakim]
-ShaneM
14:47:52 [Zakim]
-Steven
14:47:54 [Zakim]
-Gregory_Rosmaita
14:47:57 [ShaneM]
I fell off the call again. gotta run. roland, I will catch you in a few minutes
14:48:08 [Zakim]
-Roland
14:48:09 [Zakim]
IA_XHTML2()9:45AM has ended
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Attendees were Roland, Steven, ShaneM, Gregory_Rosmaita
14:48:15 [Roland]
rrsagent, make minutes
14:48:15 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/23-xhtml-minutes.html Roland
14:50:49 [Steven]
I will publish them later
14:50:59 [Roland]
ok
14:51:11 [Roland]
Zakim, please part
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