08:32:31 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dawg
08:32:31 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/04/23-dawg-irc
08:32:56 <ericP> Topic: SPARQL WWW2008 BOF
08:33:06 <ericP> scribe: ericP
08:33:31 <ericP> ivan: we shoudl not discuss throwing away and starting again
08:33:45 <ericP> ... should be backward compatible
08:34:48 <ericP> orri: Virtuoso program manager
08:34:59 <ericP> ... clustered query processing
08:35:45 <ericP> ... we would not dream of changinthe SPARLQL spec
08:35:50 <ericP> ... have extended it
08:36:00 <ericP> ... have fedration interests
08:36:31 <ericP> ... can't have SPARQL be less expressive than SQL
08:37:00 <ericP> ... added expression slselects
08:37:04 <ericP> have aggregation and group by
08:37:45 <ericP> uri: also OpenLink
08:38:19 <ericP> ivan; mix of CAD nd translators
08:38:58 <ericP> ... i deal with XML XSL...
08:39:29 <ericP> chris B: have a php SPARQL impl
08:39:45 <ericP> ... working on database to RDF mapping via SPARQL/SQL rewriter
08:39:55 <ericP> ..... currently working on benchmarks
08:40:15 <ericP> steveH: garlic, built a couple SPARQL enginnes
08:40:27 <ericP> Tom Heath: interestd from the user perspective
08:40:36 <ericP> Ivan: built one in pyuthin
08:41:05 <ericP> ericP: 
08:41:17 <ericP> fabien: INRIA has a SPARQL impl
08:41:25 <ericP> ... in terested in aggregation
08:41:56 <ericP> simonCh: view mechanism for RDF
08:42:05 <ericP> ... did work on SPARQL semantics
08:42:11 <ericP> ... defined some extensions
08:42:26 <ericP> ... would like extensions for aggregation
08:42:38 <ericP> ....DannyV: 
08:42:47 <ericP> DennyV: philospher
08:42:56 <ericP> ... developer of semantic media ikik
08:46:22 <ericP> [insert 1]
08:46:46 <ericP> Andy: SPARQL postponed 12 issues
08:46:55 <ericP> ... UPDATE
08:47:26 <ericP> ... don't want to get tied to a toolkit
08:47:44 <ericP> ... counting
08:47:57 <ericP> ... service description -- lot's of different issues
08:48:26 <ericP> ivan: whirled peas
08:48:52 <ericP> andy: all impls have extensions
08:49:28 <ericP> ... what are the few important things that a WG could address
08:50:02 <ericP> ... people ask me what the plan is
08:50:11 <ericP> ... W3C reacts to events like this
08:50:25 <ericP> ivan: [W3C process overview]
08:52:30 <ericP> ... charter work at end of the year not unrelalistic
08:53:26 <AndyS> AndyS has joined #dawg
08:54:27 <ericP> ericP: implement, specify, cooperate -- these help you get your interests get met
08:55:16 <ericP> andy: compatibility is important, but not if it hurts people forever
08:55:32 <ericP> steveH: i think we bit off more than we could chew
08:55:38 <ericP> ... don't put many featurs in the charter
08:56:04 <ericP> ... we ruled out some extensibility in the syntax
08:56:15 <ericP> ... e.g. no commas between selects
08:56:38 <ericP> ... we were generally anti-comma in the spec
08:56:51 <ericP> ... not fond of default graph/named graph
08:57:36 <ericP> chris: S tries to meet both groups' needs
08:58:08 <ericP> orri: we have use cases of querying across UNION in a DB
08:58:18 <ericP> ... expect to extend FROM
08:58:47 <ericP> ... update is fine as andy spec'd it
08:59:42 <ericP> andy: i documented the SPARUL that i understood the community wanted
08:59:54 <ericP> ... it's not a general purpose graph conversion
09:00:08 <ericP> ... i ran away from transactions
09:00:29 <ericP> ... needs seem to be replicating OLTP
09:01:17 <AndyS> One update proposal: http://jena.hpl.hp.com/~afs/SPARQL-Update.html
09:02:09 <ericP> ... what needs do you see?
09:02:18 <ericP> chrisB: free text search
09:03:41 <ericP> orri: search engine and SQL world have CONTAINS
09:03:48 <ericP> ... is not a regex
09:04:01 <ericP> andy: you get ranked matches
09:07:12 <ericP> Chris: was frustrated by the lack of free text search
09:07:38 <ericP> ivan: implemented as a boolean
09:07:48 <ericP> ... not a generator
09:14:04 <ericP> Simon: re page by rank - would be nice to bind cvars by filter functions
09:14:04 <ericP> ericP: [generator vs. filter]
09:14:04 <ericP> orri: ... fourth place in the triple pattern
09:14:04 <ericP> andy: var bindg happens in the pattern
09:14:17 <ericP> ... accessing lists wasn't so useful
09:14:17 <ericP> ... only atomic types frustrates people
09:14:17 <ericP> ivan: get list querying feedback
09:14:17 <ericP> ... i have seen graph pattern languages
09:14:17 <ericP> andy: the sparql/inference interaction isn't clear to many people
09:14:43 <ericP> ivan: user wants to know if an engine can do, say. RDFS inferencing
09:15:13 <ericP> orri: might have a pragma for enabling
09:15:55 <ericP> ... we do some backward chaining
09:17:19 <ericP> andy: OWL folks are working on a profile that works on ...
09:17:33 <ericP> ivan: also one over SQL
09:17:50 <ericP> Angi: should be in the QL or the system
09:20:19 <ericP> ???: two different URIs for the two different levels of inference?
09:20:27 <ericP> Danny: what about in the query?
09:20:52 <ericP> Andrew: folks wanted control when creating the query
09:21:19 <ericP> ... wanted controled inference over ranges of the class hierarchy
09:21:31 <ericP> ... partOf in a cell is ginormous
09:28:52 <ericP> Ivan: we have use cases for SELECT-COMPLETE-BUT-NOT-SOUND
09:30:25 <ericP> [migrate to query federation]
09:31:05 <ericP> [told BNodes]
09:31:55 <ericP> AndrewN: give the BNode with a CBD
09:32:26 <ericP> chrisB: radical folks in the community who would like to dispense with BNodes
09:33:04 <ericP> [fabien's list]
09:34:43 <Ivan> Ivan has joined #dawg
09:35:10 <ericP> andys: negation. does this pattern NOT match?
09:35:23 <ericP> ... gets logicians involved
09:35:44 <ericP> ... used for syntax checking a lot
09:36:40 <FabienG> FabienG has joined #dawg
09:36:53 <ericP> salut, FabienG, ca va?
09:38:20 <ericP> Jun (... of Oxford): want to traverse an RDF graph with a defined path
09:38:24 <ericP> ... UPDATE
09:39:11 <FabienG> group by and count ; 
09:39:11 <FabienG> effective cardinality and counting occurrences of properties and using that count ; 
09:39:11 <FabienG> path variables, expressions, path length ; 
09:39:11 <FabienG> return expressions in the select  ; 
09:39:11 <FabienG> direct:: deactivate raisonning for answers  ; 
09:39:12 <FabienG> distinct on the binding as a set not a list  ; 
09:39:14 <FabienG> DISPLAY RDF return the RDF/XML instead of SPARQL binding; 
09:39:16 <FabienG> MERGE all the results in one graph; 
09:39:18 <FabienG> Type operators in filters ; 
09:39:20 <FabienG> control the namespaces used to answer ; 
09:39:39 <Ivan> merci FabienG 
09:40:10 <ericP> Jun: re service desc: liked darq; it describes what kinds of data are at a source
09:40:31 <FabienG> for more see http://www-sop.inria.fr/edelweiss/software/corese/v2_4_0/manual/index.php#additivefunctionalities 
09:40:34 <ericP> ... want to know what anchor holds the data
09:41:50 <ericP> [negation]
09:42:51 <ericP> ivan: would like to ask a sparql endpoint to pick from multiple endpoints
09:45:13 <ericP> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
09:45:13 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/23-dawg-minutes.html ericP
09:45:24 <ericP> RRSAgent, please make log world visible
09:45:24 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'please make log world visible', ericP.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
09:45:29 <ericP> RRSAgent, please make log world-visible
09:45:41 <ericP> RRSAgent, please make log world visible, ralph
09:45:41 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'please make log world visible, ralph', ericP.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
09:51:46 <FabienG> FabienG has left #dawg