18:00:50 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #sml
18:00:50 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/04/17-sml-irc
18:01:38 <Kirk> zakin, who's on the phone?
18:01:47 <johnarwe> johnarwe has joined #sml
18:01:55 <Kirk> zakim, who's on the phone?
18:01:55 <Zakim> sorry, Kirk, I don't know what conference this is
18:01:56 <Zakim> On IRC I see johnarwe, RRSAgent, Zakim, MSM, pratul, Kirk, Jim, Julia, trackbot-ng
18:02:17 <Kumar> Kumar has joined #sml
18:02:42 <johnarwe> zakim, this is sml
18:02:42 <Zakim> ok, johnarwe; that matches XML_SMLWG()2:00PM
18:03:06 <johnarwe> zakim, who's here?
18:03:06 <Zakim> On the phone I see Julia, [Microsoft], Jim, Kirk, johnarwe, [Microsoft.a]
18:03:08 <Zakim> On IRC I see Kumar, johnarwe, RRSAgent, Zakim, MSM, pratul, Kirk, Jim, Julia, trackbot-ng
18:03:11 <Julia> 06scribe: Julia McCarthy
18:03:19 <Julia> 06scribenick: Julia
18:03:23 <MSM> zakim, please call MSM-617
18:03:23 <Zakim> ok, MSM; the call is being made
18:03:24 <Jordan> Jordan has joined #sml
18:03:25 <Zakim> +MSM
18:03:34 <Jim> rrsagent, make log public
18:03:56 <Zakim> + +1.303.495.aaaa
18:04:09 <Jordan> zakim, aaaa is me
18:04:09 <Zakim> +Jordan; got it
18:04:18 <Julia> 06zaim, who is here?
18:04:28 <Julia> 06zakim, who is here?
18:05:11 <Julia> 06chair: johnarwe
18:05:23 <Julia> 06zakim, who's here?
18:05:49 <johnarwe> topic: approval of minutes
18:07:03 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Minutes from 3/31 are approved.
18:07:15 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Minutes from 4/1/2008 are approved.
18:07:38 <Julia> 06RESOLTUION: Minutes from 4/2/2008 are approved.
18:08:05 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Minutes from 4/10/2008 are approved.
18:09:20 <pratul> Zakim, Microsoft is me
18:09:20 <Zakim> +pratul; got it
18:11:30 <ginny> ginny has joined #sml
18:11:41 <johnarwe> kumar prefers 11/03 to 11/10, and prefers even more to move it into october
18:11:57 <johnarwe> jim notes 11/4 is election day; MSM adds that CG did consider this
18:12:09 <Zakim> +ginny
18:15:58 <Julia> 06rrsagent, publish minutes
18:16:25 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/17-sml-minutes.html Julia
18:20:26 <johnarwe> proposal is oct 28-30 in redmond
18:21:39 <johnarwe> proposal revision: oct 28 1300 - oct 30 1700 in redmond
18:22:31 <johnarwe> no objections noted
18:24:54 <Zakim> -pratul
18:25:24 <Julia> 06Topic: Review of Action Items
18:25:59 <Julia> 06Pending action for Kumar (179) to be closed.
18:26:15 <Julia> 06Pending action items for MSM - eta next week.
18:26:36 <johnarwe> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5645
18:26:39 <Julia> 06Topic: New bugs
18:26:52 <Julia> 06Topic: 10 01http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=564506
18:27:30 <Julia> 06Proposal from John: Mark 5645 as editorial. 
18:27:38 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Fix as editorial.
18:28:30 <Julia> 06Topic: Decided bugs that are at least two weeks old
18:28:45 <Julia> 06Topic: 10 01http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=529806
18:30:32 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Remove the decided keyword. 
18:31:41 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5513
18:32:19 <pratul> zulah sent her regrets 
18:32:52 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
18:33:02 <pratul> Zakim, Microsoft is me
18:33:02 <Zakim> +pratul; got it
18:34:38 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Remove the decided keyword; add editorial keyword; editors to make the change.
18:34:58 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5520
18:36:40 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Remove decided keyword.
18:37:00 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5541
18:38:04 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Removed decided keyword.
18:39:05 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5543
18:40:07 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Removed decided keyword; resolve as later.
18:40:31 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5544
18:41:06 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Remove decided keyword. Resolve as later.
18:41:24 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5545
18:47:50 <Julia> 06Kumar proposes: Remove decided keyword; resolve as invalid.
18:48:11 <Julia> 06MSM: prefers to resolve as works for me
18:51:35 <Julia> 06New proposal: Remove keyword decided; resolve as works for me.
18:52:15 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5546
18:59:25 <Julia> 06One proposal; ask editors to do their best to draft the final part of Henry's remark. 
18:59:35 <Julia> 06Seoncd proposal: do not address the final remark.
18:59:55 <Julia> 06s/Seoncd/Second/
19:05:32 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Remove the decided keyword and resolve the bug without creating a note. (Resolution to be decided separately.)
19:06:06 <MSM> [I'd like the record to show that I think the majority is making a mistake; we have the opportunity, without any technical changes to the spec, to be responsive to the commentator, and the majority is declining to take that opportunity.  The only rationale given is fear that it would invite closer scrutiny of the spec.  I don't think that's a persuasive rationale.]
19:06:59 <Julia> 06Proposal: Resolve as won't fix.
19:07:34 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Resolve as won't fix.
19:08:04 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5561
19:09:16 <Julia> 06Topic: Bugs that need review
19:09:59 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5523
19:10:03 <ginny> [regarding 5546: My rationale is not fear of scrutiny but the fear that this one note may be construed as incomplete and we may be asked to add more notes along this line.]
19:10:59 <Julia> 06s/5523/5283/
19:15:33 <Kumar> constitute: comprise, make up, form, compose, represent
19:15:53 <MSM> "is composed of" again seems to entail physical containment
19:15:59 <MSM> perhaps "packages" ?
19:17:35 <Julia> 06Proposal: Comment #7, item 2 - use the word "specifies" in place of "constitutes" or "contains".
19:18:07 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Comment #7, item 2 - use the word "specifies" in place of "constitutes" or "contains".
19:23:13 <Julia> 06Ginny: would like time to think about Comment #7, item 3.
19:24:05 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Keyword remains as "needs review".
19:24:28 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5543
19:26:54 <Julia> 06s/5543/5451/
19:28:57 <johnarwe> http://www.w3.org/2000/09/dbwg/details?group=41079&public=1 shows standing by person
19:33:18 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Remove needs review keyword; resolve as fixed.
19:33:44 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5475
19:34:33 <Julia> 06RESOLUTION: Remove needs review keyword; resolve as fixed.
19:35:38 <Julia> 06Topic: http://=www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5561
19:35:57 <Julia> 06s/=w/w/
19:36:51 <Julia> 06Kirk: would like more time to review.
19:37:28 <Julia> 06Topic: http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=5606
19:43:46 <johnarwe> revised text: An SML Reference is a link from one element in an SML model to another element in the same model. If the target of the reference cannot be located in the model, the SML reference is considered to be unresolved.
19:45:12 <johnarwe> An SML ref is a link from one element in an SML model intended to target another element in the same model.
19:47:29 <MSM> +1 to Julia's suggestion
19:48:19 <MSM> Q. Can an SML reference resolve to an element outside the model?  
19:48:30 <MSM> A1 (Juila): clearly not.
19:48:31 <pratul> A; No
19:48:43 <MSM> A2 (ginny): yes, but then it's in error. (?)
19:50:04 <MSM> Ginny, would you be happier if the second sense were simply "SML references may be resolved or unresolved"
19:50:10 <MSM> s/sense/sentence/
19:52:07 <Kumar> An SML reference is a link from one element in an SML model to another element.
19:52:47 <Julia> 06+1 to Kumar's suggestion
19:56:37 <johnarwe> an issue with the note in 4.1.4 is the stmt in 2.1 that "All notes are non-normative unless otherwise specified."
19:59:06 <Zakim> -[Microsoft.a]
19:59:41 <johnarwe> ? An SML reference is an element in an SML model that (conceptually) links to another element.
20:00:21 <MSM> A concrete proposal:
20:00:23 <MSM> SML Reference 
20:00:23 <MSM> An SML Reference is an element with sml:ref="true".
20:00:24 <MSM>   Note: Conceptually, SML references are used to signal a link from
20:00:24 <MSM>   one element in an SML model to another element in the same model. If
20:00:24 <MSM>   the target of the reference cannot be located in the model,
20:00:24 <MSM>   the SML reference is considered to be unresolved.↑SML Reference
20:00:26 <MSM>   Scheme.
20:01:24 <ginny> Proposal 2 : remove last sentence
20:02:01 <johnarwe> s/ce/ce from MSMs proposal/
20:02:02 <ginny> s/sentence/sentence from above proposal/
20:03:14 <Zakim> -pratul
20:03:20 <johnarwe> I'm w/ ginny on prop 2.
20:03:51 <Julia> 06Ginny to put MSM's proposal without second sentence - in the bug and we will continue discussing next week.
20:04:39 <Julia> 06Discussion on 5606 to be resumed next week.
20:04:43 <Kirk> Proposal from Kirk and Kumar: drop "in the same model" in the first sentence of the definition of SML Reference.
20:05:16 <Kirk> MSM feels that the phrase "in the same model" is helpful in certain contexts.
20:05:39 <Zakim> -MSM
20:05:40 <Jim> Jim has left #sml
20:05:47 <Zakim> -Kirk
20:05:48 <Zakim> -johnarwe
20:05:48 <Zakim> -Jim
20:05:50 <Zakim> -Jordan
20:05:54 <Zakim> -ginny
20:06:12 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/17-sml-minutes.html Julia
20:10:54 <Zakim> disconnecting the lone participant, Julia, in XML_SMLWG()2:00PM
20:10:57 <Zakim> XML_SMLWG()2:00PM has ended
20:10:58 <Zakim> Attendees were Julia, Jim, Kirk, johnarwe, MSM, +1.303.495.aaaa, Jordan, pratul, ginny
20:27:19 <Julia> Julia has joined #sml
20:28:09 <Julia> 06zakim, where are you?
20:29:41 <julia> julia has joined #sml
20:29:53 <julia> 06zakim, who's here?
20:31:19 <julia> 06 zakim, who's here?
20:31:22 <johnarwe>  zakim, testing
20:31:22 <Zakim> I don't understand 'testing', johnarwe
20:31:46 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'generate log', julia.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
20:32:13 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/04/17-sml-minutes.html julia
20:36:40 <julia> julia has joined #sml
20:36:48 <julia> zakim, testing
20:36:48 <Zakim> I don't understand 'testing', julia
20:49:37 <johnarwe> johnarwe has left #sml
23:09:05 <Zakim> Zakim has left #sml