18:47:27 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #core
18:47:27 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/03/12-core-irc
18:47:32 <aphillip> zakim, this will be I18N
18:47:32 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, aphillip
18:47:40 <aphillip> zakim, this will be i18n
18:47:40 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, aphillip
18:47:57 <aphillip> zakim, bye
18:47:57 <Zakim> Zakim has left #core
19:54:33 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #core
19:54:37 <aphillip> zakim, this will be i18n
19:54:37 <Zakim> ok, aphillip; I see I18N_CoreWG()4:00PM scheduled to start in 6 minutes
19:54:51 <aphillip> Meeting: Internationalization Core WG
19:55:00 <aphillip> Chair: Addison Phillips
19:55:05 <aphillip> Scribe: Addison Phillips
19:55:09 <aphillip> ScribeNick: aphillip
19:55:19 <aphillip> RRSAgent, set logs world-visible
19:55:49 <aphillip> Agenda: http://www.w3.org/International/wiki/Core_Homework
19:55:55 <aphillip> RRSAgent, make minutes
19:55:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/12-core-minutes.html aphillip
19:57:44 <aphillip> Regrets: Michelle
20:00:23 <Zakim> I18N_CoreWG()4:00PM has now started
20:00:30 <Zakim> +Addison
20:00:36 <aphillip> zakim, Addison is aphillips
20:00:36 <Zakim> +aphillips; got it
20:00:40 <aphillip> er...
20:00:52 <aphillip> zakim, aphillips is aphillip
20:00:52 <Zakim> +aphillip; got it
20:00:57 <aphillip> zakim, who is here?
20:00:57 <Zakim> On the phone I see aphillip
20:00:58 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, aphillip
20:01:12 <Zakim> +Michael_Monaghan
20:01:38 <Mick> Mick has joined #core
20:01:54 <DavidClarke> DavidClarke has joined #core
20:02:12 <r12a> r12a has joined #core
20:02:17 <r12a> zakim, dial richard please
20:02:17 <Zakim> ok, r12a; the call is being made
20:02:19 <Zakim> +Richard
20:02:29 <fsasaki> fsasaki has joined #core
20:02:49 <Zakim> + +0044797368aaaa
20:02:53 <Zakim> +Felix
20:02:58 <r12a> zakim, who's here ?
20:02:58 <Zakim> On the phone I see aphillip, Michael_Monaghan, Richard, +0044797368aaaa, Felix (muted)
20:03:00 <Zakim> On IRC I see fsasaki, r12a, DavidClarke, Mick, Zakim, RRSAgent, aphillip
20:03:01 <aphillip> zakim, +0044 is DavidClarke
20:03:01 <Zakim> +DavidClarke; got it
20:03:09 <aphillip> zakim, who's here?
20:03:09 <Zakim> On the phone I see aphillip, Michael_Monaghan, Richard, DavidClarke, Felix
20:03:11 <Zakim> On IRC I see fsasaki, r12a, DavidClarke, Mick, Zakim, RRSAgent, aphillip
20:03:29 <aphillip> RRSAgent, make minutes
20:03:29 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/12-core-minutes.html aphillip
20:03:46 <aphillip> http://www.w3.org/International/wiki/Core_Homework
20:04:00 <aphillip> Topic: Agenda
20:05:10 <aphillip> Topic: Action Items
20:05:19 <aphillip> Addison to finish revising Unicode Migration for publication; Addison to resolve editing issues
20:05:43 <aphillip> Addison: write basic outline in wiki for a note on case folding
20:05:55 <aphillip> Addison: update review radar also blog post, etc.
20:06:13 <aphillip> Mick: revise his proposal and send to public list as a reference for future inquiries about bidi entities
20:06:26 <aphillip> DONE
20:07:03 <aphillip> agenda plus for discussing mick's proposal
20:07:10 <aphillip> Addison: Write to WebAPI WG chair expressing our concern about non-i18n statement and lack of i18n in widgets 1.0 WD
20:07:20 <aphillip> Andrew: create notes on how to use the wiki template
20:07:39 <aphillip> Addison to request new schedule following 2 April
20:07:53 <aphillip> Addison to reschedule the meeting for the next couple of weeks to follow DST in USA
20:08:00 <aphillip> DONE
20:08:08 <aphillip> Addison: produce list of documents and add to pipeline
20:08:22 <aphillip> DONE
20:08:39 <aphillip> Topic: Info Share
20:09:23 <aphillip> http://www.w3.org/International/wiki/Core_Pipeline
20:11:55 <aphillip> richard: one teammate published a blog to say that we have reached 1000 translations on the W3C website; and unicode really helped that
20:12:15 <aphillip> ... and I have four more, so it's 1004; our first ukrainian ones among them
20:13:14 <aphillip> mick: linking between translations is okay on w3 site, since content negotiation is used; need some hints on managing translations for sites that can't do this would be useful
20:14:21 <aphillip> richard: w3 site (outside i18n) uses a different format--uses a database and no links appear on the pages themselves
20:15:03 <aphillip> mick: we've done things with automation to list the translations available
20:15:11 <Mick> http://www.sun.com/bigadmin/hubs/multilingual/japanese/content/install_multi_solaris.jsp
20:15:37 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/12-core-minutes.html aphillip
20:16:56 <aphillip> ---
20:17:13 <aphillip> Topic: XLink 1.1 LC
20:17:27 <aphillip> addison: issued their last call announce
20:17:33 <aphillip> ... LEIRIs are in
20:18:26 <aphillip> ... want to comment on this positiviely as a WG
20:18:54 <aphillip> Topic: XML-Spec usage for WG Note status document
20:19:14 <aphillip>  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-core/2008JanMar/0101.html
20:19:44 <aphillip> richard: was editing bidi best practices yesterday... bit painful, since I had to keep generating the document
20:19:59 <aphillip> ... not using xmetal, so it might be easier to use html directly
20:20:19 <aphillip> ... and if we go back to charmod, it'll take some DTD archaeology to fix the docs up
20:20:29 <aphillip> ... on the other hand, there are lots of good things to using xml
20:20:38 <aphillip> ... for one thing, the docs are consistent
20:20:43 <aphillip> .. and always valid, etc.
20:20:51 <aphillip> ... can easily number things, etc. etc.
20:21:25 <aphillip> ... on the gripping hand, if you want to change anything, it requires that you edit a bunch of stuff, like DTD and XSLT
20:21:38 <aphillip> ... so the question in my head was: should would change to html?
20:22:14 <aphillip> ... maybe let authors decide?
20:23:01 <aphillip> felix: add a couple points
20:23:11 <aphillip> ... xml pain first, easy later
20:23:18 <aphillip> ... html easy first, pain later
20:24:20 <aphillip> felix: might disagree about leaving to editor
20:24:50 <aphillip> ... try to convince folks to change over, maybe, since it provides more flexibility
20:25:10 <aphillip> ... differences between TR and Editor version, for example, easier to maintain using XSL
20:26:31 <fsasaki> addison: xml provides a significant learning curve
20:26:42 <fsasaki> .. but if things work it is easier to get things done
20:26:56 <fsasaki> .. I support the idea of XML
20:27:07 <fsasaki> .. but we have to be careful about non TR documents
20:27:18 <aphillip> aphillip has left #core
20:27:30 <fsasaki> Richard: if we did use XHTML it would need to be carefully controlled
20:27:50 <Zakim> -aphillip
20:27:51 <fsasaki> .. have stylesheet checking etc.
20:28:19 <fsasaki> Mick: choice of XML or HTML:
20:28:31 <fsasaki> .. barrier of usage is a problem, but I don't really care
20:28:40 <fsasaki> .. for people, XHTML is simpler
20:29:02 <fsasaki> Richard: XHTML appears simpler but we'd have to put a lot of constraints on people for editing
20:29:20 <fsasaki> Mick: if people edit people their own XHTML - what are the consequences?
20:29:45 <fsasaki> Richard: you need be sure that things work
20:30:15 <fsasaki> .. e.g. in character model we extracted a list of conformance constraints, or example numbering
20:32:27 <fsasaki> .. we'd also need to do checking
20:35:29 <fsasaki> Felix: checking might not be so powerful if you use XHTML, compared to the xmlspec
20:36:21 <fsasaki> .. people might also give us invalid XHTML which we'd need to clean up
20:36:32 <fsasaki> Mick: is validation during upload possible?
20:36:34 <fsasaki> Richard: no
20:36:52 <fsasaki> .. we currently use XHTML 1.0
20:37:15 <fsasaki> David: doesn't matter to me which (X)HTML version
20:38:14 <fsasaki> Felix: think this discussion is only relevant for TR space publications, not things published on our i18n site
20:38:29 <fsasaki> Richard: agree
20:39:00 <fsasaki> .. was always a strong supporter for XML document
20:39:10 <fsasaki> .. just wanted to re-visited that
20:39:47 <fsasaki> David: comment on Dream weaver and BOM
20:39:57 <fsasaki> Richard: there is an option about tht
20:40:07 <fsasaki> s/tht/that/
20:40:48 <fsasaki> topic: documents to work on
20:41:04 <fsasaki> Richard: charmod IRI, norm, LTLI, i18n-ws need to be edited
20:42:09 <fsasaki> Felix: LTLI might be hot, but might take long time until it's done
20:42:54 <fsasaki> Richard: chardmod norm has been going for a long time and we refer to it frequently, would be good to have it done
20:43:09 <fsasaki> Mick: propose just to pick one and start with it
20:43:21 <fsasaki> David: agree with Mick - choose one
20:43:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/12-core-minutes.html fsasaki
20:44:08 <fsasaki> David: soft preference for charmod norm
20:44:21 <fsasaki> Richard: we'll discuss this next week again with Addison
20:44:38 <fsasaki> topic: entities mail from Mick
20:44:51 <fsasaki> Mick: was a rewording of the original mail I had send out
20:45:03 <fsasaki> Richard: let's discuss again with Addison on the call
20:45:19 <r12a> http://www.w3.org/International/wiki/Core_Homework
20:46:12 <fsasaki> Richard: feel free to edit the homework page (to add this to the agenda). Everybody can do that during the week
20:46:27 <Zakim> -Michael_Monaghan
20:46:30 <Zakim> -Felix
20:46:31 <Zakim> -Richard
20:46:35 <Zakim> -DavidClarke
20:46:36 <fsasaki> adjourned
20:46:37 <Zakim> I18N_CoreWG()4:00PM has ended
20:46:38 <Zakim> Attendees were aphillip, Michael_Monaghan, Richard, +0044797368aaaa, Felix, DavidClarke
20:46:55 <fsasaki> present: Addison (partly), Michael, David, Richard, Felix
20:46:59 <fsasaki> regrets: Michelle
20:47:03 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/12-core-minutes.html fsasaki
20:47:40 <fsasaki> scribe: Addison, Felix
20:47:41 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/03/12-core-minutes.html fsasaki
20:49:01 <fsasaki> rrsagent, bye
20:49:01 <RRSAgent> I see no action items