IRC log of sweo on 2008-01-16

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:42:33 [RRSAgent]: RRSAgent has joined #sweo
14:42:33 [RRSAgent]: logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-sweo-irc
14:42:39 [ivan]: rrsagent, set log public
14:43:00 [ivan]: Meeting: SWEO Weekly Telco
14:43:03 [ivan]: Chair: Susie
14:43:11 [ivan]: rrsagent, draft minutes
14:43:11 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-sweo-minutes.html ivan
14:46:45 [Susie]: Susie has joined #sweo
14:55:25 [bengee]: bengee has joined #sweo
14:58:51 [Zakim]: SW_SWEO()10:00AM has now started
14:58:58 [Zakim]: +Susie
14:59:19 [Zakim]: +??P1
14:59:28 [patranja]: patranja has joined #sweo
15:00:39 [Zakim]: + +019082aaaa
15:00:53 [MartinD]: +01908 is me
15:01:02 [MartinD]: zakim, +01908 is me
15:01:02 [Zakim]: +MartinD; got it
15:01:18 [ivan]: zakim, dial ivan-voip
15:01:18 [Zakim]: ok, ivan; the call is being made
15:01:20 [Zakim]: +Ivan
15:01:47 [ivan]: zakim, who is here?
15:01:47 [Zakim]: On the phone I see Susie, ??P1, MartinD, Ivan
15:01:48 [Zakim]: On IRC I see PaulaP, bengee, Susie, RRSAgent, Zakim, MartinD, ivan, Kjetil
15:02:07 [ivan]: zakim, ??P1 is JeffP
15:02:07 [Zakim]: +JeffP; got it
15:02:22 [Zakim]: +??P9
15:02:30 [Andrea]: Andrea has joined #sweo
15:02:43 [ivan]: zakim, ??P9 is Paula
15:02:43 [Zakim]: +Paula; got it
15:03:34 [JacekK]: JacekK has joined #sweo
15:03:37 [JacekK]: zakim, code?
15:03:37 [Zakim]: the conference code is 7936 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), JacekK
15:03:41 [Zakim]: + +49.895.4.aabb
15:03:54 [MartinD]: zakim, Paula is PaulaP
15:03:54 [Zakim]: +PaulaP; got it
15:04:29 [Susie]: http://esw.w3.org/topic/SweoIG/Meetings/2008-01-16_Conference_Call
15:04:29 [MartinD]: paula, now it should be identifying you correctly
15:04:49 [Zakim]: + +1.978.664.aacc
15:05:14 [ivan]: zakim, aacc is chris
15:05:14 [Zakim]: +chris; got it
15:05:17 [Zakim]: +??P14
15:05:28 [CaptSolo]: CaptSolo has joined #sweo
15:05:37 [ivan]: zakim, ??P14 is uldis
15:05:37 [Zakim]: +uldis; got it
15:05:54 [ivan]: zakim, who is here?
15:05:54 [Zakim]: On the phone I see Susie, JeffP, MartinD, Ivan, PaulaP, +49.895.4.aabb, chris, uldis
15:05:56 [Zakim]: On IRC I see CaptSolo, JacekK, Andrea, PaulaP, bengee, Susie, RRSAgent, Zakim, MartinD, ivan, Kjetil
15:06:01 [Susie]: Zakim, pick a scribe
15:06:01 [Zakim]: Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose MartinD
15:07:02 [MartinD]: jeff put together some initial info for business case/presentation
15:07:21 [Zakim]: + +47.67.8.aadd
15:07:24 [MartinD]: so far draft has been produced, link sent via email
15:07:36 [ivan]: zakim, aadd is Kjetil
15:07:36 [Zakim]: +Kjetil; got it
15:07:50 [Kjetil]: Zakim, mute me
15:07:50 [Zakim]: Kjetil should now be muted
15:07:55 [Zakim]: + +43.512.507.aaee
15:08:01 [MartinD]: draft shall now be opened up so that people out of SWEO can comment
15:08:03 [JacekK]: zakim, aaee is me
15:08:03 [Zakim]: +JacekK; got it
15:08:22 [Zakim]: + +49.631.2.aaff
15:08:24 [leobard]: leobard has joined #sweo
15:08:35 [Zakim]: +??P16
15:08:51 [leobard]: 16 could be me
15:08:57 [kidehen]: kidehen has joined #sweo
15:09:08 [ivan]: zakim, ??P16 is Leo
15:09:09 [Zakim]: +Leo; got it
15:09:15 [kidehen]: kidehen joined
15:09:21 [MartinD]: draft is produced in a "backwards" style: technology is a background, very few successful business cases are technology led
15:09:32 [kidehen]: who is speaking?
15:09:35 [MartinD]: most uilt around idea of decreasing risks
15:09:41 [MartinD]: Jeff Pollock speaking
15:10:13 [leobard]: who's here?
15:10:21 [leobard]: zakim, who's here?
15:10:21 [Zakim]: On the phone I see Susie, JeffP, MartinD, Ivan, PaulaP (muted), +49.895.4.aabb, chris, uldis, Kjetil (muted), JacekK, +49.631.2.aaff, Leo
15:10:24 [Zakim]: On IRC I see kidehen, leobard, uldis, JacekK, Andrea, PaulaP, bengee, Susie, RRSAgent, Zakim, MartinD, ivan, Kjetil
15:10:32 [MartinD]: the approach tries to show why SW can be used as a low-cost as opposed to hi-risk solution
15:10:45 [leobard]: P15 is leobard
15:10:56 [MartinD]: SW is often pictured as strategic, long-terms solution, so this is somewaht addressed
15:11:04 [Zakim]: +??P17
15:11:17 [Kjetil]: Zakim, P15 is leobard
15:11:17 [Zakim]: sorry, Kjetil, I do not recognize a party named 'P15'
15:11:17 [leobard]: zakim, who's here?
15:11:18 [Zakim]: On the phone I see Susie, JeffP, MartinD, Ivan, PaulaP (muted), +49.895.4.aabb, chris, uldis, Kjetil (muted), JacekK, +49.631.2.aaff, Leo, ??P17
15:11:21 [Zakim]: On IRC I see kidehen, leobard, uldis, JacekK, Andrea, PaulaP, bengee, Susie, RRSAgent, Zakim, MartinD, ivan, Kjetil
15:11:23 [Kjetil]: Zakim, ??P15 is leobard
15:11:25 [Zakim]: I already had ??P15 as JacekK, Kjetil
15:11:25 [MartinD]: scribenick: MartinD
15:11:55 [MartinD]: Jeff continues: think about SW as a tactical rather than strategic choice...
15:11:56 [leobard]: hm, I am +49.631.2.aaff but don't know the number P..
15:12:19 [Zakim]: +??P19
15:12:19 [Kjetil]: Zakim, aaff is leobard
15:12:20 [Zakim]: +leobard; got it
15:12:29 [bengee]: zakim, ??P19 is me
15:12:29 [Zakim]: +bengee; got it
15:12:56 [MartinD]: Jeff: after technical founations, provide justifications why and how to launch programmes (in the near future), rather than relying on technologies from the past
15:13:13 [danja]: danja has joined #sweo
15:13:32 [MartinD]: Jeff: make people understand that when they invest into SW they invest into a (technology) solution of the future
15:13:56 [danja]: (sorry I'm late, dozed off after lunch)
15:14:11 [MartinD]: Jeff: draft shall be now opened to comments to gauge consensus, etc. once that is reached, we can go for a PPT version of it
15:14:25 [Zakim]: + +1.603.897.aagg
15:14:25 [ivan]: zakim, who is here?
15:14:26 [Zakim]: On the phone I see Susie, JeffP, MartinD, Ivan, PaulaP (muted), +49.895.4.aabb, chris, uldis, Kjetil (muted), JacekK, leobard, Leo, ??P17, bengee, +1.603.897.aagg
15:14:28 [Zakim]: On IRC I see danja, kidehen, leobard, uldis, JacekK, Andrea, PaulaP, bengee, Susie, RRSAgent, Zakim, MartinD, ivan, Kjetil
15:14:41 [MartinD]: Kingsley: is the draft in ESW wiki?
15:14:56 [ivan]: zakim, aagg is Kingsley
15:14:56 [Zakim]: +Kingsley; got it
15:15:01 [MartinD]: Jeff: only to mailing list... so the thing needs to go into ESW wiki
15:15:11 [Zakim]: +??P27
15:15:12 [Kjetil]: http://me.jtpollock.us/pubs/drafts/SWEO.SemWeb.BusinessCase.v1.doc # <- this one?
15:15:32 [danja]: Zakim, ??P27 is danja
15:15:32 [Zakim]: +danja; got it
15:15:33 [MartinD]: KIngsley: if in wiki, the doc might be easier to edit, collaborate (via a browser, rather than downloading)
15:15:36 [Melli]: Melli has joined #sweo
15:15:55 [MartinD]: Jeff: no preference for collab medium/format... doc should reside with the community
15:16:06 [MartinD]: Susie: then it looks like wiki is the choice
15:16:28 [MartinD]: ACTION: Susie to put Jeff''s doc onto ESW wiki
15:16:55 [MartinD]: Susie: can edits be done before sweo concludes at the end of January = how much can be edited by then?
15:17:12 [MartinD]: Susie: we should aim at a delivery around next week
15:17:39 [MartinD]: Ivan: PPT is ssecondary, doc should be finished to the extent people are happy with it
15:18:05 [danja]: Zakim, mute me
15:18:05 [Zakim]: danja should now be muted
15:18:10 [MartinD]: Chris: offering help...it's good doc talks about capabilities, what SW enables, how it's done
15:18:46 [MartinD]: Susie: also agrees that technological basis might not be ideal for this kind of doc, so a good choice of approach
15:19:08 [MartinD]: Susie: we should get comments by next Wednesday, so that Jeff can move on to slides
15:19:27 [MartinD]: Susie: would we be able to publish the doc itself (not only PPT)?
15:19:47 [MartinD]: Jeff: would be very useful, so that there is more narrative, not just labels, bullet points
15:19:59 [leobard]: q+
15:20:10 [ivan]: ack leobard
15:21:01 [MartinD]: Leo: good doc, neutrally written... wonders what is the "white paper"-ish aspect of this doc = how is it gonna be published
15:21:31 [MartinD]: Ivan: finished version on the wiki is fine, at this moment, if more is needed, we can 'upgrade' to e.g. IG Note
15:22:01 [MartinD]: Ivan: if slides are made, they should be done in a way that links them with narrative (e.g. for re-use)
15:22:28 [MartinD]: Susie: maybe preparing slides so that it contains chunks of the agreed narrative
15:22:45 [MartinD]: Topic: Leo & info gathering
15:22:55 [MartinD]: Leo: data uploaded today
15:23:21 [MartinD]: Leo: core data sets up and running, few smaall technical problems - contacted implementers
15:23:42 [MartinD]: Susie: let me know when the issues are overcome, so that we can write it into blog
15:23:58 [MartinD]: Susie: there was some discussion re URI doc
15:24:48 [MartinD]: Leo: a few emails from december, one this month... Danny also responded, but the recent emails somewhat returned back to old issues discussed at the w3c level
15:24:51 [danja]: Zakim, unmute me
15:24:51 [Zakim]: danja should no longer be muted
15:25:41 [MartinD]: Danny: main of the latest email wasn't really relevant to the URI doc, only minor editorial change suggested
15:25:50 [leobard]: danja: the editorial change you suggested is good
15:26:32 [leobard]: danja: it is: "The standard Web transfer protocol, HTTP, should be used."
15:26:32 [leobard]: to something like:
15:26:32 [leobard]: "The standard Web transfer protocol, HTTP, can provide such a look-up
15:26:32 [leobard]: mechanism".
15:26:36 [MartinD]: Susie: URI doc is on track, waiting for deadline for comments to pass to upgrade the doc
15:26:54 [MartinD]: Susie: encouraged people at W3 coordination mtg to look at it
15:27:16 [MartinD]: Leo: deadline is next Monday for URI, what will happen after the revision round?
15:27:41 [MartinD]: Ivan: depends on comments, so far comments / issues are minor, almost on the editorial level
15:28:25 [MartinD]: Ivan: with such points we can still go ahead and publish it as a Note, if something controversial comes, we may have a problem
15:28:46 [MartinD]: Susie: let's wait for the deadline (21/Jan) and see the what kind of comments we get
15:28:48 [Zakim]: -JeffP
15:28:59 [MartinD]: Topic: FAQ
15:29:25 [MartinD]: Ivan: no update, nothing received from GRDDL people to include
15:29:31 [MartinD]: Susie: I will chase them
15:29:47 [MartinD]: Topic: Use cases
15:29:56 [MartinD]: Ivan: no progress at this point
15:30:23 [MartinD]: Ivan: received mail from Melli who should review the use cases by the end of this weekend, Lee will do something similar
15:31:00 [MartinD]: Melli: Lee and me would have a look at cases, identify categories of facets that seem to be coming out of materials
15:31:14 [MartinD]: Topic: preferred doc collection
15:31:27 [MartinD]: Danny: no more progress at this point
15:32:12 [MartinD]: Danny: some ideas to use talis technology, but still in progress, so more information to come next week
15:32:21 [MartinD]: Topic: community projects
15:32:25 [Kjetil]: Zakim, unmute me
15:32:25 [Zakim]: Kjetil should no longer be muted
15:32:47 [MartinD]: Kjetil: continued to work
15:33:15 [MartinD]: Kjetil: project likely to continue, probably not concluding within this SWEO
15:33:25 [Kjetil]: Zakim, mute me
15:33:25 [Zakim]: Kjetil should now be muted
15:33:41 [danja]: ACTION: Danny to continue with RecommendedTutorials, with aim of having something to show within current SWEO lifetime
15:33:44 [MartinD]: Benji: also needs more time for his project, still there is a possibility to conclude within SWEO
15:34:09 [MartinD]: Kingsley: work is going on, some more inpute expected from german guys
15:34:15 [MartinD]: Topic: enterprise survey
15:34:38 [MartinD]: Susie: now about a year old, data is a bit out of date, so what about its validity?
15:34:58 [MartinD]: Susie: maybe it was good as an information input, but little reason to publish it as a doc
15:35:16 [MartinD]: proposed: scrap the idea of publishing enterprise survey
15:35:28 [MartinD]: Topic: Other
15:35:54 [MartinD]: Susie: go to wiki and enter info on what SWEO should be interested in when going on into the future
15:35:55 [Susie]: http://esw.w3.org/topic/SweoIG/TaskForces/Next_Steps
15:36:10 [bengee]: s/aded/added/
15:36:15 [MartinD]: Susie: put yout thoughts there, it would influence what SWEO does, etc.
15:36:52 [MartinD]: Bengee: Q re wiki page... maybe we should get some form of task force debriefing, to get an idea what worked,etc
15:37:13 [MartinD]: Susie: maybe debriefing should be scheduled for last call, 30 Jan
15:37:33 [bengee]: :)
15:37:44 [MartinD]: bye
15:37:44 [Zakim]: -Susie
15:37:44 [PaulaP]: bye
15:37:45 [Zakim]: -Leo
15:37:46 [Zakim]: -JacekK
15:37:47 [Zakim]: -Kingsley
15:37:48 [Zakim]: -Kjetil
15:37:49 [Zakim]: -??P17
15:37:51 [Zakim]: -chris
15:37:51 [kidehen]: kidehen has left #sweo
15:37:53 [Zakim]: - +49.895.4.aabb
15:37:55 [Zakim]: -uldis
15:37:57 [Zakim]: -bengee
15:37:58 [Zakim]: -leobard
15:37:59 [Zakim]: -PaulaP
15:38:01 [Zakim]: -danja
15:38:03 [Zakim]: -MartinD
15:38:04 [danja]: danja has left #sweo
15:38:06 [uldis]: uldis has left #sweo
15:38:10 [Zakim]: -Ivan
15:38:12 [Zakim]: SW_SWEO()10:00AM has ended
15:38:13 [Zakim]: Attendees were Susie, +019082aaaa, MartinD, Ivan, JeffP, +49.895.4.aabb, PaulaP, +1.978.664.aacc, chris, uldis, +47.67.8.aadd, Kjetil, +43.512.507.aaee, JacekK, +49.631.2.aaff,
15:38:16 [Zakim]: ... Leo, leobard, bengee, +1.603.897.aagg, Kingsley, danja
15:38:19 [ivan]: zakim, bye
15:38:22 [Zakim]: Zakim has left #sweo
15:38:29 [ivan]: rrsagent, draft minutes
15:38:29 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-sweo-minutes.html ivan
15:38:46 [ivan]: rrsagent, bye
15:38:46 [RRSAgent]: I see 2 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-sweo-actions.rdf :
15:38:46 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: Susie to put Jeff''s doc onto ESW wiki [1]
15:38:46 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-sweo-irc#T15-16-28
15:38:46 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: Danny to continue with RecommendedTutorials, with aim of having something to show within current SWEO lifetime [2]
15:38:46 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2008/01/16-sweo-irc#T15-33-41