OWL Working Group

Minutes of 07 January 2009

Present
Evan Wallace Peter Patel-Schneider Alan Ruttenberg Markus Krötzsch Michael Schneider Ian Horrocks Bernardo Cuenca Grau Rinke Hoekstra Mike Smith Zhe Wu Ivan Herman Sandro Hawke Elisa Kendall Christine Golbreich Boris Motik
Scribe
Bernardo Cuenca Grau
IRC Log
Original and Editable Wiki Version
Resolutions
  1. tests listed on http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/index.php?title=Test_Queue&oldid=17103 that all three reasoners pass are approved link
Topics
00:00:00 <scribenick> PRESENT: Evan_Wallace, Peter_Patel-Schneider, Alan_Ruttenberg, MarkusK_, mschneid (muted), IanH, bcuencagrau (muted), Rinke (muted), msmith, Zhe (muted), Ivan, Sandro, elisa, Christine, bmotik
17:53:40 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/01/07-owl-irc

RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/01/07-owl-irc

17:54:08 <ewallace> Zakim, this will be owlwg

Evan Wallace: Zakim, this will be owlwg

17:54:08 <Zakim> ok, ewallace; I see SW_OWL()1:00PM scheduled to start in 6 minutes

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, ewallace; I see SW_OWL()1:00PM scheduled to start in 6 minutes

17:54:49 <ewallace> RRSAgent, make records public

Evan Wallace: RRSAgent, make records public

17:56:37 <Zakim> SW_OWL()1:00PM has now started

Zakim IRC Bot: SW_OWL()1:00PM has now started

17:56:44 <Zakim> +Evan_Wallace

Zakim IRC Bot: +Evan_Wallace

17:57:49 <Zakim> +Peter_Patel-Schneider

Zakim IRC Bot: +Peter_Patel-Schneider

17:57:52 <Zakim> -Evan_Wallace

Zakim IRC Bot: -Evan_Wallace

17:57:53 <Zakim> +Evan_Wallace

Zakim IRC Bot: +Evan_Wallace

17:58:18 <pfps> zakim, who is here?

Peter Patel-Schneider: zakim, who is here?

17:58:18 <Zakim> On the phone I see Evan_Wallace, Peter_Patel-Schneider

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see Evan_Wallace, Peter_Patel-Schneider

17:58:20 <Zakim> On IRC I see pfps, RRSAgent, Zakim, schneid, Rinke, alanr, IanH, sandro, ewallace, trackbot

Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see pfps, RRSAgent, Zakim, schneid, Rinke, alanr, IanH, sandro, ewallace, trackbot

17:59:14 <Zakim> +Alan_Ruttenberg

Zakim IRC Bot: +Alan_Ruttenberg

17:59:54 <Zakim> +??P13

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P13

18:04:20 <ewallace> scribenick: bcuencagrau

(Scribe set to Bernardo Cuenca Grau)

18:04:27 <Zakim> +Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: +Sandro

18:04:50 <alanr> zakim, who is here?

Alan Ruttenberg: zakim, who is here?

18:04:50 <Zakim> On the phone I see Evan_Wallace, Peter_Patel-Schneider, Alan_Ruttenberg, MarkusK_, schneid (muted), IanH, bcuencagrau (muted), Rinke (muted), msmith, Zhe (muted), Ivan, Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see Evan_Wallace, Peter_Patel-Schneider, Alan_Ruttenberg, MarkusK_, schneid (muted), IanH, bcuencagrau (muted), Rinke (muted), msmith, Zhe (muted), Ivan, Sandro

18:04:53 <Zakim> On IRC I see Christine, ivan, Zhe, msmith, bcuencagrau, Rinke, MarkusK_, pfps, RRSAgent, Zakim, schneid, alanr, IanH, sandro, ewallace, trackbot

Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Christine, ivan, Zhe, msmith, bcuencagrau, Rinke, MarkusK_, pfps, RRSAgent, Zakim, schneid, alanr, IanH, sandro, ewallace, trackbot

18:05:05 <schneid> q+

Michael Schneider: q+

18:05:10 <schneid> zakim, unmute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, unmute me

18:05:12 <Zakim> schneid should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should no longer be muted

18:05:12 <alanr> ack schneid

Alan Ruttenberg: ack schneid

00:00:00 <bcuencagrau> Topic: Admin

1. Admin

18:05:17 <bcuencagrau> alanr: agenda amendments?

(No events recorded for 1085 minutes)

Alan Ruttenberg: agenda amendments?

18:05:35 <schneid> zakim, mute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, mute me

18:05:35 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted

18:05:36 <bcuencagrau> schneid: I would like to say something about the status of RDF smeantics

Michael Schneider: I would like to say something about the status of RDF smeantics

18:05:49 <Zakim> +??P8

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P8

18:05:57 <msmith> the minutes looked ok to me.

Mike Smith: the minutes looked ok to me.

18:05:57 <bcuencagrau> alanr: minuets accepted?

Alan Ruttenberg: minuets accepted?

18:05:58 <pfps> The minutes look acceptable.

Peter Patel-Schneider: The minutes look acceptable.

18:06:07 <schneid> minutes were helpful to find back... :)

Michael Schneider: minutes were helpful to find back... :)

18:06:09 <bcuencagrau> alanr: minutes accepted

Alan Ruttenberg: minutes accepted

18:06:20 <bcuencagrau> alanr: action items

Alan Ruttenberg: action items

18:06:21 <Christine> zakim, ??P8 is christine

Christine Golbreich: zakim, ??P8 is christine

18:06:21 <Zakim> +christine; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +christine; got it

18:06:24 <sandro> "Wow?"

Sandro Hawke: "Wow?"

18:06:35 <bcuencagrau> alanr: F2F registration

Alan Ruttenberg: F2F registration

18:07:16 <pfps> q+

Peter Patel-Schneider: q+

18:07:28 <alanr> ack pfps

Alan Ruttenberg: ack pfps

18:07:49 <bcuencagrau> Zakim, unmute me

Zakim, unmute me

18:07:49 <Zakim> bcuencagrau should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bcuencagrau should no longer be muted

18:08:01 <bcuencagrau> Action 252

ACTION-252

18:08:01 <trackbot> Sorry, bad ACTION syntax

Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, bad ACTION syntax

18:08:10 <bcuencagrau> Zakim, unmute me

Zakim, unmute me

18:08:10 <Zakim> bcuencagrau was not muted, bcuencagrau

Zakim IRC Bot: bcuencagrau was not muted, bcuencagrau

18:08:16 <bcuencagrau> alanr: action 252

Alan Ruttenberg: ACTION-252

18:08:35 <bcuencagrau> pfps: we should tell to people inmediately what the name could be

Peter Patel-Schneider: we should tell to people inmediately what the name could be

18:08:41 <IanH> q+

Ian Horrocks: q+

18:08:48 <alanr> ack ianh

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ianh

18:09:21 <alanr> q+ alanr

Alan Ruttenberg: q+ alanr

18:09:22 <pfps> the name for the date/time XML datatype has been determined

Peter Patel-Schneider: the name for the date/time XML datatype has been determined

18:09:28 <bcuencagrau> ianH: if the docs are approved as it is, we could have a list of changes after last call

Ian Horrocks: if the docs are approved as it is, we could have a list of changes after last call

18:09:32 <alanr> ack alanr

Alan Ruttenberg: ack alanr

18:09:51 <bcuencagrau> alanr: we could use the wiki only for editor comments

Alan Ruttenberg: we could use the wiki only for editor comments

18:10:07 <bcuencagrau> alanr: so that they can be collected

Alan Ruttenberg: so that they can be collected

18:10:16 <bcuencagrau> sandro: better not use the wiki commnets

Sandro Hawke: better not use the wiki commnets

18:10:33 <bcuencagrau> alanr: they are not very readable

Alan Ruttenberg: they are not very readable

18:11:21 <bcuencagrau> ianH: we should make it clear to editors that this is the process

Ian Horrocks: we should make it clear to editors that this is the process

18:11:36 <bcuencagrau> pfps: so edits have to indicate if they make any change to the docs

Peter Patel-Schneider: so edits have to indicate if they make any change to the docs

18:11:55 <schneid> RDF-Based Semantics has a list of changes which is updated regularly, and revised at the end <http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/RDF-Based_Semantics#Changelog>

Michael Schneider: RDF-Based Semantics has a list of changes which is updated regularly, and revised at the end &lt;http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/RDF-Based_Semantics#Changelog&gt;

18:12:16 <bcuencagrau> Zakim, mute me

Zakim, mute me

18:12:16 <Zakim> bcuencagrau should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bcuencagrau should now be muted

18:12:24 <pfps> I'll change Syntax accordingly.

Peter Patel-Schneider: I'll change Syntax accordingly.

18:12:44 <alanr> action: pfps to implement change to syntax for datetime xml schema coordination

ACTION: pfps to implement change to syntax for datetime xml schema coordination

18:12:44 <trackbot> Created ACTION-261 - Implement change to syntax for datetime xml schema coordination [on Peter Patel-Schneider - due 2009-01-14].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-261 - Implement change to syntax for datetime xml schema coordination [on Peter Patel-Schneider - due 2009-01-14].

18:12:45 <bcuencagrau> ianH: we should be a bit more prescriptive in the way docs are changed

Ian Horrocks: we should be a bit more prescriptive in the way docs are changed

18:13:01 <Zakim> + +1.650.960.aadd

Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.650.960.aadd

18:13:03 <pfps> I agree

Peter Patel-Schneider: I agree

18:13:09 <bcuencagrau> ianH: at this point changes should not be made unless we discuss them first

Ian Horrocks: at this point changes should not be made unless we discuss them first

18:13:34 <bcuencagrau> sandro: even for typos?

Sandro Hawke: even for typos?

18:13:47 <bcuencagrau> ianH: no, only for more substantial changes

Ian Horrocks: no, only for more substantial changes

18:13:58 <alanr> q?

Alan Ruttenberg: q?

18:14:06 <Zakim> -Rinke

Zakim IRC Bot: -Rinke

18:14:31 <bcuencagrau> sandro: we should be able to clearly identify the changes since last call

Sandro Hawke: we should be able to clearly identify the changes since last call

18:15:06 <sandro> identify and http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Response_Protocol

Sandro Hawke: identify and http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Response_Protocol

18:15:06 <bcuencagrau> alanr: action 255

Alan Ruttenberg: ACTION-255

18:15:13 <elisa> zakim, ??aadd is me

Elisa Kendall: zakim, ??aadd is me

18:15:13 <Zakim> sorry, elisa, I do not recognize a party named '??aadd'

Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, elisa, I do not recognize a party named '??aadd'

18:15:18 <sandro> action-255?

Sandro Hawke: ACTION-255?

18:15:18 <trackbot> ACTION-255 -- Sandro Hawke to write wiki page on mailing-list behavior guidelines during last call -- due 2008-12-10 -- OPEN

Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-255 -- Sandro Hawke to write wiki page on mailing-list behavior guidelines during last call -- due 2008-12-10 -- OPEN

18:15:18 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/tracker/actions/255

Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/tracker/actions/255

18:15:21 <sandro> action-255 closed

Sandro Hawke: ACTION-255 closed

18:15:21 <trackbot> ACTION-255 Write wiki page on mailing-list behavior guidelines during last call closed

Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-255 Write wiki page on mailing-list behavior guidelines during last call closed

18:15:37 <bcuencagrau> alanr: action 260

Alan Ruttenberg: ACTION-260

18:15:39 <elisa> zakim, +1.650.960.aadd is me

Elisa Kendall: zakim, +1.650.960.aadd is me

18:15:39 <Zakim> +elisa; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +elisa; got it

18:16:08 <Zakim> +??P15

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P15

18:16:20 <bcuencagrau> sandro: I consider my action done

Sandro Hawke: I consider my action done

18:16:24 <Rinke> zakim, +??P15 is me

Rinke Hoekstra: zakim, +??P15 is me

18:16:24 <Zakim> sorry, Rinke, I do not recognize a party named '+??P15'

Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, Rinke, I do not recognize a party named '+??P15'

18:16:46 <Rinke> zakim, ??P15 is me

Rinke Hoekstra: zakim, ??P15 is me

18:16:46 <Zakim> +Rinke; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +Rinke; got it

18:16:57 <bcuencagrau> end of action status

end of action status

18:17:07 <Rinke> zakim, mute me

Rinke Hoekstra: zakim, mute me

18:17:07 <Zakim> Rinke should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Rinke should now be muted

18:17:13 <bcuencagrau> Soliciting reviews of and/or comments on LC documents

Soliciting reviews of and/or comments on LC documents

18:17:15 <IanH> q+

Ian Horrocks: q+

18:17:25 <alanr> ack ianh

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ianh

18:17:59 <bcuencagrau> ianH: if we haven't got comments, we should encourage people to make comments

Ian Horrocks: if we haven't got comments, we should encourage people to make comments

18:18:06 <bcuencagrau> ianH: should we be worried?

Ian Horrocks: should we be worried?

18:18:32 <bcuencagrau> ianH: by next week, if little comes out, we should take some action

Ian Horrocks: by next week, if little comes out, we should take some action

18:19:04 <schneid> q+

Michael Schneider: q+

18:19:17 <bcuencagrau> sandro: sometimes comments we do not happen because people have not read the docs

Sandro Hawke: sometimes comments we do not happen because people have not read the docs

18:19:27 <bcuencagrau> ianH: waht about comments within the WG?

Ian Horrocks: waht about comments within the WG?

18:19:54 <bcuencagrau> sandro: I don't know

Sandro Hawke: I don't know

18:20:27 <bcuencagrau> ianH: comments from industry members may be valuable

Ian Horrocks: comments from industry members may be valuable

18:20:43 <schneid> zakim, unmute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, unmute me

18:20:43 <Zakim> schneid should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should no longer be muted

18:20:43 <alanr> ack schneid

Alan Ruttenberg: ack schneid

18:20:45 <bcuencagrau> sandro: for that, we can wait until rec stage

Sandro Hawke: for that, we can wait until rec stage

18:21:31 <bcuencagrau> mschneid: there have been some comments but not using the official route

Michael Schneider: there have been some comments but not using the official route

18:22:08 <IanH> q+

Ian Horrocks: q+

18:22:28 <bcuencagrau> mschneid: there were some discussions and something came out from them

Michael Schneider: there were some discussions and something came out from them

18:22:44 <bcuencagrau> mschneid: but these people didn't comment officially

Michael Schneider: but these people didn't comment officially

18:22:48 <alanr> ack ianh

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ianh

18:22:52 <alanr> q?

Alan Ruttenberg: q?

18:22:58 <bcuencagrau> mschneid: should we rise the comments on behalf of these people?

Michael Schneider: should we rise the comments on behalf of these people?

18:23:15 <bcuencagrau> ianH; we can ask these people

ianH; we can ask these people

18:24:01 <schneid> zakim, mute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, mute me

18:24:01 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted

18:24:20 <schneid> zakim, unmute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, unmute me

18:24:20 <Zakim> schneid should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should no longer be muted

18:24:26 <schneid> zakim, mute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, mute me

18:24:26 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted

18:24:26 <bcuencagrau> alanr: we might emphasizr that comments are very important for us

Alan Ruttenberg: we might emphasizr that comments are very important for us

18:24:52 <bcuencagrau> alanr: F2F5

Alan Ruttenberg: F2F5

18:25:10 <bcuencagrau> alanr:please confirm your attendance status

Alan Ruttenberg: please confirm your attendance status

18:25:10 <alanr> http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/F2F5_People

Alan Ruttenberg: http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/F2F5_People

18:25:20 <schneid> q+

Michael Schneider: q+

18:25:31 <IanH> q?

Ian Horrocks: q?

18:25:43 <schneid> zakim, unmute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, unmute me

18:25:43 <Zakim> schneid should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should no longer be muted

18:25:48 <alanr> ack schneid

Alan Ruttenberg: ack schneid

18:25:54 <schneid> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2009Jan/0000.html

Michael Schneider: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2009Jan/0000.html

18:26:07 <bcuencagrau> mschneid: there are some new US entry regulations

Michael Schneider: there are some new US entry regulations

18:26:30 <bcuencagrau> mschneid: please, be careful

Michael Schneider: please, be careful

18:26:31 <schneid> zakim, mute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, mute me

18:26:31 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted

18:26:41 <IanH> I filled it recently (voluntarily) and it was pretty light-weight (I got an "instant" OK response)

Ian Horrocks: I filled it recently (voluntarily) and it was pretty light-weight (I got an "instant" OK response)

18:27:07 <alanr> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-comments/2008Dec/0000.html

Alan Ruttenberg: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-comments/2008Dec/0000.html

18:27:16 <IanH> q+

Ian Horrocks: q+

18:27:20 <alanr> ack ianh

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ianh

00:00:00 <bcuencagrau> Topic: Last Call Comments

2. Last Call Comments

18:27:28 <bcuencagrau> ianH: I have looked at alan's email

(No events recorded for 1107 minutes)

Ian Horrocks: I have looked at alan's email

18:27:37 <pfps> q+

Peter Patel-Schneider: q+

18:28:28 <bcuencagrau> ianH: they would like to have complex concepts in comments in order to support sanctioning

Ian Horrocks: they would like to have complex concepts in comments in order to support sanctioning

18:28:53 <bcuencagrau> ianH: I wouldn't personally want to extend the spec in this direction

Ian Horrocks: I wouldn't personally want to extend the spec in this direction

18:28:58 <pfps> q-

Peter Patel-Schneider: q-

18:29:13 <bcuencagrau> ianH: but we could be able to support mechanisms for at least partially support their use case

Ian Horrocks: but we could be able to support mechanisms for at least partially support their use case

18:29:38 <bcuencagrau> alanr: somebody should start drafting those mechanisms

Alan Ruttenberg: somebody should start drafting those mechanisms

18:30:39 <bcuencagrau> ianH: one way would be to use named concepts for defining the complex concepts they want to use

Ian Horrocks: one way would be to use named concepts for defining the complex concepts they want to use

18:30:46 <bcuencagrau> ianH: some problems with that

Ian Horrocks: some problems with that

18:31:06 <bcuencagrau> ianH: one could add the definition of the concept as a string

Ian Horrocks: one could add the definition of the concept as a string

18:31:25 <bcuencagrau> alanr: do you want to start a page, Ian?

Alan Ruttenberg: do you want to start a page, Ian?

18:31:43 <bcuencagrau> ianH: we should use the response page for last call comments

Ian Horrocks: we should use the response page for last call comments

18:32:02 <pfps> +1

Peter Patel-Schneider: +1

18:32:44 <bcuencagrau> alanr: could there will be problems with the mapping to RDF?

Alan Ruttenberg: could there will be problems with the mapping to RDF?

18:32:50 <pfps> No problem. :-)

Peter Patel-Schneider: No problem. :-)

18:32:56 <bcuencagrau> ianH; let's Peter and Boris think about it

ianH; let's Peter and Boris think about it

18:33:18 <bcuencagrau> pfps: there will be no problems

Peter Patel-Schneider: there will be no problems

18:33:51 <bcuencagrau> alanr: no, I meant if we actually wanted to add axioms in the target of annotations

Alan Ruttenberg: no, I meant if we actually wanted to add axioms in the target of annotations

18:33:59 <bcuencagrau> pfps: that is a problem

Peter Patel-Schneider: that is a problem

18:34:21 <bcuencagrau> ianH: well, problably they just want an unnamed individual introducing a complex concept

Ian Horrocks: well, problably they just want an unnamed individual introducing a complex concept

18:34:38 <bcuencagrau> pfps: if it is a class expression, then there should not be a problem

Peter Patel-Schneider: if it is a class expression, then there should not be a problem

18:34:49 <bcuencagrau> alanr: what about serializing the axiom as text?

Alan Ruttenberg: what about serializing the axiom as text?

18:35:17 <bcuencagrau> pfps: they would just be strings

Peter Patel-Schneider: they would just be strings

18:36:25 <bcuencagrau> pfps: we could go and change all documents, but that would be a mess

Peter Patel-Schneider: we could go and change all documents, but that would be a mess

18:36:39 <alanr> q?

Alan Ruttenberg: q?

18:36:54 <bcuencagrau> ianH: I have already created a page

Ian Horrocks: I have already created a page

18:37:10 <bcuencagrau> ianH: we can now start writing our responses

Ian Horrocks: we can now start writing our responses

18:37:48 <alanr> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-comments/2009Jan/att-0000/00-part

Alan Ruttenberg: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-comments/2009Jan/att-0000/00-part

18:37:55 <bcuencagrau> alanr: Ceil's comments

Alan Ruttenberg: Ceil's comments

18:38:09 <bcuencagrau> alanr: have you read it?

Alan Ruttenberg: have you read it?

18:38:10 <schneid> this was not really a comment

Michael Schneider: this was not really a comment

18:38:30 <bcuencagrau> alanr: i agree with michael

Alan Ruttenberg: i agree with michael

18:38:52 <IanH> +1

Ian Horrocks: +1

18:38:59 <pfps> +1

Peter Patel-Schneider: +1

18:39:12 <schneid> +1, just to let her know that somebody is watching her :)

Michael Schneider: +1, just to let her know that somebody is watching her :)

18:39:37 <alanr> Action: alanr to send mail to cecil replying that we are waiting for the real comment

ACTION: alanr to send mail to cecil replying that we are waiting for the real comment

18:39:37 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - alanr

Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - alanr

18:39:58 <pfps> +1

Peter Patel-Schneider: +1

18:40:02 <pfps> q+

Peter Patel-Schneider: q+

18:40:03 <sandro> ACTION: alan  to send mail to cecil replying that we are waiting for the real comment

ACTION: alan to send mail to cecil replying that we are waiting for the real comment

18:40:03 <trackbot> Created ACTION-262 -  to send mail to cecil replying that we are waiting for the real comment [on Alan Ruttenberg - due 2009-01-14].

Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-262 - to send mail to cecil replying that we are waiting for the real comment [on Alan Ruttenberg - due 2009-01-14].

18:40:22 <msmith> q+

Mike Smith: q+

18:40:27 <alanr> ack pfps

Alan Ruttenberg: ack pfps

18:40:45 <bcuencagrau> alanr: the next comment is from Mike Smith

Alan Ruttenberg: the next comment is from Mike Smith

18:40:59 <bcuencagrau> pfps: Mike has noticed an error in the reverse mapping

Peter Patel-Schneider: Mike has noticed an error in the reverse mapping

18:41:08 <bcuencagrau> pfps: we need to fix it

Peter Patel-Schneider: we need to fix it

18:41:24 <bcuencagrau> pfps: i have written an email with the proposed resolution

Peter Patel-Schneider: i have written an email with the proposed resolution

18:41:52 <IanH> q?

Ian Horrocks: q?

18:41:57 <alanr> ack msmith

Alan Ruttenberg: ack msmith

18:42:20 <bcuencagrau> msmith: boris suggested to make it a public comment

Mike Smith: boris suggested to make it a public comment

18:42:30 <pfps> q+

Peter Patel-Schneider: q+

18:42:36 <bcuencagrau> msmith: I dind't mean this to me a LC comment, but just a WG issue

Mike Smith: I dind't mean this to me a LC comment, but just a WG issue

18:42:44 <alanr> ack pfps

Alan Ruttenberg: ack pfps

18:42:56 <bcuencagrau> pfps: it is good to have it as LC comment

Peter Patel-Schneider: it is good to have it as LC comment

18:42:56 <alanr> +1

Alan Ruttenberg: +1

18:43:12 <bcuencagrau> pfps: it will be easier to track

Peter Patel-Schneider: it will be easier to track

18:43:17 <msmith> that's ok by me too.

Mike Smith: that's ok by me too.

18:43:25 <bcuencagrau> pfps: we could distinguish them between internal or external

Peter Patel-Schneider: we could distinguish them between internal or external

18:43:51 <ivan> q+

Ivan Herman: q+

18:43:57 <bcuencagrau> alanr: next comment

Alan Ruttenberg: next comment

18:43:58 <alanr> ack ivan

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ivan

18:44:22 <bcuencagrau> ivan: this looks like a potential formal objection

Ivan Herman: this looks like a potential formal objection

18:45:11 <Zakim> +??P4

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P4

18:45:13 <bcuencagrau> ivan: there could be problems with RDF and SPARQL implementations

Ivan Herman: there could be problems with RDF and SPARQL implementations

18:45:16 <bmotik> Zakim, ??P4 is me

Boris Motik: Zakim, ??P4 is me

18:45:16 <Zakim> +bmotik; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +bmotik; got it

18:45:29 <bcuencagrau> ivan: boris should look at it

Ivan Herman: boris should look at it

18:45:30 <alanr> boris, we are discussing http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-comments/2009Jan/0001.html

Alan Ruttenberg: boris, we are discussing http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-comments/2009Jan/0001.html

18:45:33 <bmotik> Zakim, mute me

Boris Motik: Zakim, mute me

18:45:33 <Zakim> bmotik should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should now be muted

18:45:38 <schneid> Andy's comments seems substantial to me, although I did not yet follow it further

Michael Schneider: Andy's comments seems substantial to me, although I did not yet follow it further

18:46:06 <bcuencagrau> alanr: how do we handle this LC comment?

Alan Ruttenberg: how do we handle this LC comment?

18:46:16 <bcuencagrau> ivan: we should agree on some sort of an answer

Ivan Herman: we should agree on some sort of an answer

18:46:38 <bcuencagrau> alanr: we could use the rdf mailing list

Alan Ruttenberg: we could use the rdf mailing list

18:46:49 <bcuencagrau> sandro: in order to look for an agreement

Sandro Hawke: in order to look for an agreement

18:47:52 <bmotik> I'm sorry, I don't know yet where we are

Boris Motik: I'm sorry, I don't know yet where we are

18:48:12 <bcuencagrau> alanr: we could probably postpone this

Alan Ruttenberg: we could probably postpone this

18:48:26 <bcuencagrau> sandro: I am on that list

Sandro Hawke: I am on that list

18:49:48 <bcuencagrau> alanr: the next one is a comment by Jim

Alan Ruttenberg: the next one is a comment by Jim

18:50:05 <bcuencagrau> alanr: mike had a discussion with him

Alan Ruttenberg: mike had a discussion with him

18:50:09 <schneid> zakim, unmute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, unmute me

18:50:09 <Zakim> schneid should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should no longer be muted

18:50:13 <schneid> q+

Michael Schneider: q+

18:50:18 <alanr> ack schneid

Alan Ruttenberg: ack schneid

18:50:29 <IanH> q+

Ian Horrocks: q+

18:50:33 <bcuencagrau> schneid: the discussion was on the semantics of keys

Michael Schneider: the discussion was on the semantics of keys

18:51:15 <bcuencagrau> schneid: a better explanation was requested in order to avoid confusion with the semantics of keys

Michael Schneider: a better explanation was requested in order to avoid confusion with the semantics of keys

18:51:22 <bcuencagrau> schneid: jim was confused

Michael Schneider: jim was confused

18:51:34 <bcuencagrau> schneid: some clarification is in order

Michael Schneider: some clarification is in order

18:52:01 <Christine> +q

Christine Golbreich: +q

18:52:01 <schneid> zakim, mute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, mute me

18:52:02 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted

18:52:04 <alanr> ack ianh

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ianh

18:52:26 <bcuencagrau> ianH: jim was happy about the structure of the language

Ian Horrocks: jim was happy about the structure of the language

18:52:42 <ivan> q+

Ivan Herman: q+

18:52:46 <bcuencagrau> ianH: we should send him an email to forward his email to the public record

Ian Horrocks: we should send him an email to forward his email to the public record

18:52:55 <alanr> ack Christine

Alan Ruttenberg: ack Christine

18:53:04 <bcuencagrau> ianH: there should be a LC comment of that form

Ian Horrocks: there should be a LC comment of that form

18:53:31 <bcuencagrau> Christine: I can add a sentence to the requirements doc

Christine Golbreich: I can add a sentence to the requirements doc

18:53:40 <alanr> q?

Alan Ruttenberg: q?

18:53:45 <alanr> ack ivan

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ivan

18:54:01 <schneid> indeed, Jim did so

Michael Schneider: indeed, Jim did so

18:54:44 <bcuencagrau> ivan: that is already done

Ivan Herman: that is already done

18:55:18 <bcuencagrau> alanr: perhaps Boris could take a look at the examples on keys

Alan Ruttenberg: perhaps Boris could take a look at the examples on keys

18:55:22 <pfps> yes

Peter Patel-Schneider: yes

18:55:30 <ivan> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Dec/0055.html "So I hereby raise this as a LC Document issue"

Ivan Herman: -&gt; http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Dec/0055.html "So I hereby raise this as a LC Document issue"

18:55:32 <bcuencagrau> alanr: Bijan should also be aware for the primer

Alan Ruttenberg: Bijan should also be aware for the primer

18:55:40 <pfps> Bijan and I will do so.

Peter Patel-Schneider: Bijan and I will do so.

18:55:50 <IanH> Someone -- probably Michael -- should send a summary email to the public comments list?

Ian Horrocks: Someone -- probably Michael -- should send a summary email to the public comments list?

18:56:15 <alanr> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-dev/2009JanMar/0003.html

Alan Ruttenberg: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-dev/2009JanMar/0003.html

18:56:32 <pfps> q+

Peter Patel-Schneider: q+

18:56:36 <bcuencagrau> alanr: the next comment is more like a question

Alan Ruttenberg: the next comment is more like a question

18:56:38 <alanr> ack pfps

Alan Ruttenberg: ack pfps

18:56:46 <schneid> what Jim said in <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Dec/0055.html>: "So I hereby raise this as a LC Document issue (I believe the right

Michael Schneider: what Jim said in &lt;http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2008Dec/0055.html&gt;: "So I hereby raise this as a LC Document issue (I believe the right

18:56:48 <schneid> terminology) -- i.e. the design is okay, but the documentation should

Michael Schneider: terminology) -- i.e. the design is okay, but the documentation should

18:56:49 <schneid> better reflect it"

Michael Schneider: better reflect it"

18:57:17 <alanr> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-dev/2009JanMar/0003.html

Alan Ruttenberg: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-dev/2009JanMar/0003.html

18:57:19 <bcuencagrau> ianH: this is not a LC comment

Ian Horrocks: this is not a LC comment

18:57:19 <ivan> "[This is not a formal comment, just seeking understanding.]"  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-dev/2009JanMar/0003.html

Ivan Herman: "[This is not a formal comment, just seeking understanding.]" http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-dev/2009JanMar/0003.html

18:58:02 <alanr> q?

Alan Ruttenberg: q?

18:59:22 <bcuencagrau> sandro: I am going to reply to him privately

Sandro Hawke: I am going to reply to him privately

18:59:37 <bcuencagrau> alanr: end of LC section

Alan Ruttenberg: end of LC section

00:00:00 <bcuencagrau> Topic: Test Cases

3. Test Cases

19:00:08 <bcuencagrau> alanr: Proposal to approve tests

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Alan Ruttenberg: Proposal to approve tests

19:00:33 <bcuencagrau> alanr: we should probably approve the tests that all implementations pass

Alan Ruttenberg: we should probably approve the tests that all implementations pass

19:00:48 <msmith> q+

Mike Smith: q+

19:00:53 <alanr> ack msmith

Alan Ruttenberg: ack msmith

19:01:12 <bcuencagrau> msmith: the first set of tests are all DL

Mike Smith: the first set of tests are all DL

19:01:33 <bcuencagrau> msmith: there are others that are Full and I haven't run any tool on them

Mike Smith: there are others that are Full and I haven't run any tool on them

19:02:17 <bcuencagrau> msmith: some tests are also datatype-related

Mike Smith: some tests are also datatype-related

19:02:25 <IanH> q+

Ian Horrocks: q+

19:02:32 <alanr> ack ianh

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ianh

19:02:36 <bcuencagrau> msmith: reasoners treat datatypes differently

Mike Smith: reasoners treat datatypes differently

19:03:06 <bcuencagrau> ianH: if in the end some systems do not implement all the datatypes, we may want to keep the tests but explain why some fail

Ian Horrocks: if in the end some systems do not implement all the datatypes, we may want to keep the tests but explain why some fail

19:03:24 <msmith> q+

Mike Smith: q+

19:03:47 <alanr> ack msmith

Alan Ruttenberg: ack msmith

19:04:46 <bcuencagrau> msmith: I am ok with accepting the tests that three or more reasoners pass

Mike Smith: I am ok with accepting the tests that three or more reasoners pass

19:05:45 <bcuencagrau> alanr: should we have a formal vote on these tests?

Alan Ruttenberg: should we have a formal vote on these tests?

19:05:55 <msmith> this is the direct version link http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/index.php?title=Test_Queue&oldid=17103

Mike Smith: this is the direct version link http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/index.php?title=Test_Queue&amp;oldid=17103

19:06:08 <IanH> +1 to Alan's proposal

Ian Horrocks: +1 to Alan's proposal

19:06:52 <alanr> PROPOSED: tests listed on http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/index.php?title=Test_Queue&oldid=17103 that all three reasoners pass are approved

PROPOSED: tests listed on http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/index.php?title=Test_Queue&amp;oldid=17103 that all three reasoners pass are approved

19:07:24 <bcuencagrau> msmith: what about the tests that we still haven't run?

Mike Smith: what about the tests that we still haven't run?

19:07:33 <bcuencagrau> alanr: they go to a different page

Alan Ruttenberg: they go to a different page

19:07:38 <IanH> q+

Ian Horrocks: q+

19:07:42 <alanr> ack ianh

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ianh

19:08:04 <bcuencagrau> ianH; for the OWL Full ones we should have a different process

ianH; for the OWL Full ones we should have a different process

19:08:36 <schneid> q+

Michael Schneider: q+

19:08:36 <msmith> q+

Mike Smith: q+

19:08:48 <alanr> ack schneid

Alan Ruttenberg: ack schneid

19:08:52 <bcuencagrau> alanr: are we sure that all tests marked as OWL Full are indeed full?

Alan Ruttenberg: are we sure that all tests marked as OWL Full are indeed full?

19:08:53 <alanr> ack msmith

Alan Ruttenberg: ack msmith

19:08:55 <alanr> q+ schneid

Alan Ruttenberg: q+ schneid

19:09:13 <bcuencagrau> Zakim, unmute me

Zakim, unmute me

19:09:13 <Zakim> bcuencagrau should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bcuencagrau should no longer be muted

19:09:20 <MarkusK_> zamin, mute schneid

Markus Krötzsch: zamin, mute schneid

19:09:28 <sandro> Zakim, mute schneid

Sandro Hawke: Zakim, mute schneid

19:09:28 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted

19:09:30 <bcuencagrau> Zakim, mute me

Zakim, mute me

19:09:30 <Zakim> bcuencagrau should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bcuencagrau should now be muted

19:09:47 <msmith> report format http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Test_Result_Format#Results_Ontology

Mike Smith: report format http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Test_Result_Format#Results_Ontology

19:09:56 <bcuencagrau> msmith: OWL Full implementors are welcome to run the tests

Mike Smith: OWL Full implementors are welcome to run the tests

19:09:59 <schneid> q- because cannot talk at the moment

Michael Schneider: q- because cannot talk at the moment

19:10:06 <schneid> no

Michael Schneider: no

19:10:37 <IanH> q+

Ian Horrocks: q+

19:10:38 <bcuencagrau> sandro: i wrote an OWL Full reasoner, but it is not currently working well

Sandro Hawke: i wrote an OWL Full reasoner, but it is not currently working well

19:10:43 <schneid> I had a mail on the Full problem today

Michael Schneider: I had a mail on the Full problem today

19:10:46 <alanr> ack ianh

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ianh

19:10:53 <schneid> q-

Michael Schneider: q-

19:10:54 <alanr> q- schneid

Alan Ruttenberg: q- schneid

19:11:06 <bcuencagrau> ianH: we should vote on approving these tests that have three OKs

Ian Horrocks: we should vote on approving these tests that have three OKs

19:11:29 <msmith> I agree with Ian, we should minimally approve the 3 success tests

Mike Smith: I agree with Ian, we should minimally approve the 3 success tests

19:11:29 <alanr> PROPOSED: tests listed on http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/index.php?title=Test_Queue&oldid=17103 that all three reasoners pass are approved

PROPOSED: tests listed on http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/index.php?title=Test_Queue&amp;oldid=17103 that all three reasoners pass are approved

19:11:31 <Zakim> -Rinke

Zakim IRC Bot: -Rinke

19:11:49 <schneid> q+

Michael Schneider: q+

19:11:52 <sandro> +1

Sandro Hawke: +1

19:11:53 <IanH> +1

Ian Horrocks: +1

19:11:54 <msmith> +1

Mike Smith: +1

19:11:55 <MarkusK_> +1

Markus Krötzsch: +1

19:11:56 <bcuencagrau> +1

+1

19:11:57 <alanr> +1

Alan Ruttenberg: +1

19:12:01 <schneid> zakim, unmute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, unmute me

19:12:01 <Zakim> schneid should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should no longer be muted

19:12:01 <pfps> +1

Peter Patel-Schneider: +1

19:12:14 <Christine> +1

Christine Golbreich: +1

19:12:55 <Rinke> +1

Rinke Hoekstra: +1

19:13:03 <alanr> RESOLVED: tests listed on http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/index.php?title=Test_Queue&oldid=17103 that all three reasoners pass are approved

RESOLVED: tests listed on http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/index.php?title=Test_Queue&amp;oldid=17103 that all three reasoners pass are approved

19:13:27 <bcuencagrau> schneid: mschneid: some OWL Full tests can be slightly transformed and be made easy

Michael Schneider: mschneid: some OWL Full tests can be slightly transformed and be made easy

19:13:31 <Zhe> +1 (sorry for the late vote)

Zhe Wu: +1 (sorry for the late vote)

19:13:32 <msmith> action smithmi to update status on approved tests

Mike Smith: action smithmi to update status on approved tests

19:13:32 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - smithmi

Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - smithmi

19:13:47 <msmith> action msmith to update status on approved tests

Mike Smith: action msmith to update status on approved tests

19:13:47 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - msmith

Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - msmith

19:14:15 <bcuencagrau> alanr: are you taking an action to review the Full tests?

Alan Ruttenberg: are you taking an action to review the Full tests?

19:14:18 <msmith> action masmith to update status on approved tests

Mike Smith: action masmith to update status on approved tests

19:14:18 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - masmith

Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - masmith

19:14:29 <bcuencagrau> mschneid: i need 10 days to finish other work on OWl Full

Michael Schneider: i need 10 days to finish other work on OWl Full

19:14:38 <alanr> action: msmith to update status on approved tests

ACTION: msmith to update status on approved tests

19:14:38 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - msmith

Trackbot IRC Bot: Sorry, couldn't find user - msmith

19:14:42 <ivan> s/OWl/OWL/

Ivan Herman: s/OWl/OWL/

19:15:47 <alanr> q?

Alan Ruttenberg: q?

19:15:53 <alanr> ack schneid

Alan Ruttenberg: ack schneid

19:17:06 <bcuencagrau> alanr: please, give details in an email, michael

Alan Ruttenberg: please, give details in an email, michael

00:00:00 <bcuencagrau> Topic: Plans for non-LC documents

4. Plans for non-LC documents

19:17:31 <bcuencagrau> alanr: discussion about Manchester Syntax

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Alan Ruttenberg: discussion about Manchester Syntax

19:17:47 <bcuencagrau> alanr: whether it should be rec track

Alan Ruttenberg: whether it should be rec track

19:17:53 <sandro> q+

Sandro Hawke: q+

19:17:58 <alanr> ack sandro

Alan Ruttenberg: ack sandro

19:18:20 <schneid> The transformation needed for DL/Full entailment tests: <http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2009Jan/0007.html>. Start reading at "There is another important point".

Michael Schneider: The transformation needed for DL/Full entailment tests: &lt;http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-owl-wg/2009Jan/0007.html&gt;. Start reading at "There is another important point".

19:18:26 <bcuencagrau> sandro: I think it should not be rec track. it would make it a Fist Class syntax

Sandro Hawke: I think it should not be rec track. it would make it a Fist Class syntax

19:18:34 <bcuencagrau> sandro: this was not in the charter

Sandro Hawke: this was not in the charter

19:19:26 <bcuencagrau> alanr: should we amke a decision without Uli and Bijan?

Alan Ruttenberg: should we amke a decision without Uli and Bijan?

19:19:55 <IanH> q+

Ian Horrocks: q+

19:20:00 <alanr> ack ianh

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ianh

19:20:00 <pfps> I haven't discussed this with them recently.

Peter Patel-Schneider: I haven't discussed this with them recently.

19:20:19 <bcuencagrau> ianh: I think they wouldn't lie on the road

Ian Horrocks: I think they wouldn't lie on the road

19:20:27 <bcuencagrau> ianH: but we could put it off

Ian Horrocks: but we could put it off

19:21:07 <bcuencagrau> sandro: I will be off next week

Sandro Hawke: I will be off next week

19:21:36 <schneid> schneid: in owl 1 full it was true that all dl entailments were full entailments. In OWL 2, this is not perfectly true anymore. So using feeding one of the old dl/full entailment tests into a OWL 2 Full reasoner may fail. However, there is a general transformation on dl entailments to make them into OWL 2 Full entailments. See pointer above.

Michael Schneider: in owl 1 full it was true that all dl entailments were full entailments. In OWL 2, this is not perfectly true anymore. So using feeding one of the old dl/full entailment tests into a OWL 2 Full reasoner may fail. However, there is a general transformation on dl entailments to make them into OWL 2 Full entailments. See pointer above. [ Scribe Assist by Michael Schneider ]

19:21:57 <alanr> straw poll: 1 = want manchester syntax as rec. 2 = want it as note 3= don't care

Alan Ruttenberg: straw poll: 1 = want manchester syntax as rec. 2 = want it as note 3= don't care

19:22:06 <ivan> 2

Ivan Herman: 2

19:22:10 <sandro> 2

Sandro Hawke: 2

19:22:13 <schneid> 2

Michael Schneider: 2

19:22:15 <pfps> 1 (prefer)

Peter Patel-Schneider: 1 (prefer)

19:22:15 <Christine> 2

Christine Golbreich: 2

19:22:20 <bmotik> 1 (prefer)

Boris Motik: 1 (prefer)

19:22:24 <MarkusK_> 3

Markus Krötzsch: 3

19:22:25 <bcuencagrau> 3

3

19:22:26 <msmith> 1

Mike Smith: 1

19:22:29 <Zhe> 2

Zhe Wu: 2

19:22:30 <Rinke> 3

Rinke Hoekstra: 3

19:22:54 <bmotik> q+

Boris Motik: q+

19:22:58 <bmotik> Zakim, unmute me

Boris Motik: Zakim, unmute me

19:22:58 <Zakim> bmotik should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should no longer be muted

19:23:04 <alanr> ack bmotik

Alan Ruttenberg: ack bmotik

19:23:07 <bcuencagrau> sandro: those who want to have it as a rec, could you give a reason?

Sandro Hawke: those who want to have it as a rec, could you give a reason?

19:23:16 <pfps> +1 to boris

Peter Patel-Schneider: +1 to boris

19:23:17 <msmith> q+

Mike Smith: q+

19:23:19 <bmotik> Zakim, mute me

Boris Motik: Zakim, mute me

19:23:19 <Zakim> bmotik should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bmotik should now be muted

19:23:20 <bcuencagrau> bmotik: we need a readable syntax for OWL

Boris Motik: we need a readable syntax for OWL

19:23:39 <alanr> q+

Alan Ruttenberg: q+

19:23:43 <alanr> ack msmith

Alan Ruttenberg: ack msmith

19:23:45 <bcuencagrau> msmith: having it as a rec does not elevate it to the same status as RDF/XML

Mike Smith: having it as a rec does not elevate it to the same status as RDF/XML

19:23:48 <alanr> ack alanr

Alan Ruttenberg: ack alanr

19:24:01 <ivan> q+

Ivan Herman: q+

19:24:14 <alanr> ack ivan

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ivan

19:24:51 <pfps> q+

Peter Patel-Schneider: q+

19:24:56 <alanr> q?

Alan Ruttenberg: q?

19:25:05 <bcuencagrau> ivan:the conformance doc should have guidelines on how the syntaxes relate

Ivan Herman: the conformance doc should have guidelines on how the syntaxes relate

19:25:12 <bcuencagrau> ivan: we could need a new LC

Ivan Herman: we could need a new LC

19:25:14 <msmith> this bit about conformance isn't true for OWL XML syntax, is it?

Mike Smith: this bit about conformance isn't true for OWL XML syntax, is it?

19:25:31 <IanH> +1 to Peter's statement about conformance

Ian Horrocks: +1 to Peter's statement about conformance

19:25:46 <schneid> +1 to peter

Michael Schneider: +1 to peter

19:25:50 <bcuencagrau> pfps: conformance doe the right thing: it doesn't name other syntaxes other than RDF/XML

Peter Patel-Schneider: conformance doe the right thing: it doesn't name other syntaxes other than RDF/XML

19:25:51 <bmotik> +1 to peter and msmith

Boris Motik: +1 to peter and msmith

19:26:16 <msmith> q+

Mike Smith: q+

19:26:19 <ivan> q+

Ivan Herman: q+

19:26:24 <alanr> q?

Alan Ruttenberg: q?

19:26:27 <pfps> q-

Peter Patel-Schneider: q-

19:26:34 <alanr> ack msmith

Alan Ruttenberg: ack msmith

19:27:11 <bcuencagrau> msmith: please clarify what `first class' means

Mike Smith: please clarify what `first class' means

19:27:47 <bcuencagrau> sandro: people in the WG have not participated in the design

Sandro Hawke: people in the WG have not participated in the design

19:27:59 <pfps> I resonate with Sandro's concerns.

Peter Patel-Schneider: I resonate with Sandro's concerns.

19:28:06 <msmith> thank you, that is compelling

Mike Smith: thank you, that is compelling

19:28:06 <bcuencagrau> sandro: the features have not been discussed

Sandro Hawke: the features have not been discussed

19:28:17 <alanr> ack ivan

Alan Ruttenberg: ack ivan

19:28:18 <pfps> In particular, I don't think that Manchester should slow down the WG.

Peter Patel-Schneider: In particular, I don't think that Manchester should slow down the WG.

19:28:22 <sandro> Sandro: If the WG really feels that Manchester is as mature as the XML syntax, and should be another "first class" document, and we've really thought about it, and really like it, ... then yeah, I'm okay with it being a REC.

Sandro Hawke: If the WG really feels that Manchester is as mature as the XML syntax, and should be another "first class" document, and we've really thought about it, and really like it, ... then yeah, I'm okay with it being a REC. [ Scribe Assist by Sandro Hawke ]

19:28:47 <schneid> zakim, mute me

Michael Schneider: zakim, mute me

19:28:47 <Zakim> schneid should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: schneid should now be muted

19:29:05 <bcuencagrau> ivan: if it becomes a rec, it will have to go over all stages, such as requirement to have multiple implementations

Ivan Herman: if it becomes a rec, it will have to go over all stages, such as requirement to have multiple implementations

19:29:21 <bcuencagrau> ivan: we may be approving something that will slow us down

Ivan Herman: we may be approving something that will slow us down

19:29:23 <pfps> I'm resonating even more with Sandro and Ivan.

Peter Patel-Schneider: I'm resonating even more with Sandro and Ivan.

19:30:05 <IanH> q+

Ian Horrocks: q+

19:30:18 <schneid> hm, people outside the WG may have strong opinions on the Manchester document, because the syntax is in reasonably wide use, I guess...

Michael Schneider: hm, people outside the WG may have strong opinions on the Manchester document, because the syntax is in reasonably wide use, I guess...

19:30:56 <bcuencagrau> ianH: in OWL 1 the func. syntax was rec track but it was ignored by implementations

Ian Horrocks: in OWL 1 the func. syntax was rec track but it was ignored by implementations

19:31:07 <pfps> OWL 1 abstract syntax wasn't supposed to be used (according to some WG members).

Peter Patel-Schneider: OWL 1 abstract syntax wasn't supposed to be used (according to some WG members).

19:31:09 <bcuencagrau> sandro: it had a special status

Sandro Hawke: it had a special status

19:31:23 <bcuencagrau> Zakim, unmute me

Zakim, unmute me

19:31:23 <Zakim> bcuencagrau should no longer be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: bcuencagrau should no longer be muted

19:31:29 <msmith> bye

Mike Smith: bye

19:31:33 <MarkusK_> bye

Markus Krötzsch: bye

19:31:33 <Zakim> -bmotik

Zakim IRC Bot: -bmotik

19:31:35 <Zakim> -msmith

Zakim IRC Bot: -msmith

19:31:36 <Zakim> -Evan_Wallace

Zakim IRC Bot: -Evan_Wallace

19:31:36 <Rinke> bye

Rinke Hoekstra: bye

19:31:38 <Zakim> -MarkusK_

Zakim IRC Bot: -MarkusK_

19:31:38 <Zakim> -elisa

Zakim IRC Bot: -elisa

19:31:39 <Zhe> bye

Zhe Wu: bye

19:31:45 <elisa> by

Elisa Kendall: by

19:31:46 <Zakim> -Peter_Patel-Schneider

Zakim IRC Bot: -Peter_Patel-Schneider

19:31:47 <Zakim> -Zhe

Zakim IRC Bot: -Zhe

19:31:48 <schneid> ok, no RDF-Based Semantics today...

Michael Schneider: ok, no RDF-Based Semantics today...

19:31:49 <Zakim> -bcuencagrau

Zakim IRC Bot: -bcuencagrau

19:31:50 <Zakim> -IanH

Zakim IRC Bot: -IanH

19:31:50 <Zakim> -Sandro

Zakim IRC Bot: -Sandro

19:31:51 <Zakim> -Alan_Ruttenberg

Zakim IRC Bot: -Alan_Ruttenberg

19:31:51 <Zakim> -christine

Zakim IRC Bot: -christine

19:32:04 <Zakim> -schneid

Zakim IRC Bot: -schneid

19:32:17 <schneid> quit

Michael Schneider: quit

19:34:02 <Zakim> -Ivan

Zakim IRC Bot: -Ivan

19:34:03 <Zakim> SW_OWL()1:00PM has ended

Zakim IRC Bot: SW_OWL()1:00PM has ended

19:34:04 <Zakim> Attendees were Evan_Wallace, Peter_Patel-Schneider, Alan_Ruttenberg, MarkusK_, schneid, bcuencagrau, IanH, Rinke, +1.202.408.aabb, msmith, Zhe, Ivan, Sandro, christine, elisa, bmotik

Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were Evan_Wallace, Peter_Patel-Schneider, Alan_Ruttenberg, MarkusK_, schneid, bcuencagrau, IanH, Rinke, +1.202.408.aabb, msmith, Zhe, Ivan, Sandro, christine, elisa, bmotik


This revision (#2) generated 2009-01-09 10:36:40 UTC by 'ihorrock2', comments: None