IRC log of tsdtf on 2007-12-11

Timestamps are in UTC.

13:22:04 [RRSAgent]
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13:22:04 [RRSAgent]
logging to
13:22:09 [Zakim]
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13:22:15 [shadi]
zakim, this will be tsd
13:22:15 [Zakim]
ok, shadi; I see WAI_TSDTF()8:30AM scheduled to start in 8 minutes
13:22:22 [shadi]
meeting: TSD TF
13:22:58 [Vangelis]
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13:23:09 [shadi]
chair: CarlosV, Christophe
13:23:42 [Christophe]
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13:25:42 [shadi]
13:25:57 [shadi]
agenda+ Announcements
13:26:06 [shadi]
agenda+ Reviewing test samples for current working draft
13:26:17 [shadi]
agenda+ Test suite ID in metadata
13:26:27 [shadi]
agenda+ Review of action items
13:30:46 [Zakim]
WAI_TSDTF()8:30AM has now started
13:30:54 [Zakim]
13:31:09 [shadi]
zakim, helen is actually shadi
13:31:09 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'helen is actually shadi', shadi
13:31:19 [shadi]
zakim, helen is really shadi
13:31:19 [Zakim]
+shadi; got it
13:31:20 [Zakim]
13:31:24 [Zakim]
13:31:25 [Zakim]
13:31:39 [Zakim]
13:32:04 [Zakim]
13:32:51 [Christophe]
Regrets: CarlosV
13:34:10 [carlosI]
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13:35:33 [Drew]
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13:35:47 [Drew]
Good morning all
13:36:16 [Drew]
Ahhh yes, good afternoon:)
13:37:17 [Christophe]
scribe: Drew
13:37:55 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 1
13:37:55 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Announcements" taken up [from shadi]
13:38:38 [Drew]
45 new test samples uploaded
13:39:02 [shadi]
13:39:12 [Drew]
should be fewer issues during structure review due to scricter rules.
13:39:16 [Drew]
all new test samples are in the wiki
13:39:30 [Zakim]
+ +49.843.9.aaaa
13:39:52 [Drew]
previous 3 comments were from Christophe
13:40:05 [Christophe]
Zakim, +49 is CarlosI
13:40:05 [Zakim]
+CarlosI; got it
13:40:53 [CarlosV]
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13:41:16 [Drew]
Shadi forwarded SSH key to systems team (AJL)
13:41:48 [Drew]
WCAG working Group has approved Working Draft. Last Call draft expected very soon (SAZ)
13:41:52 [CarlosV]
Connecting from review meeting ;-)
13:42:35 [Drew]
When Last Call comes out, more focus on techniques and failures (SAZ)
13:44:56 [Drew]
Zakim, take up agendum 2
13:44:56 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "Reviewing test samples for current working draft" taken up [from shadi]
13:45:28 [Drew]
CS: No new reviews this week.
13:46:24 [Drew]
CS: Fixed all the issues found by CV last week. Should be ready for another review. Many test samples with CSS and Javascript code inside HTML files. In the newest test files, these issues should not exist.
13:51:21 [Drew]
CS: CV raised issue of primary and complexity attibutes. They are required in TCDL2, may want to make them optional
13:53:38 [Drew]
13:56:15 [shadi]
13:57:09 [shadi]
13:57:29 [shadi]
<rule primary="yes" xlink:href="">
13:58:22 [Drew]
SAZ: Is the question, is primary always "yes"? ie: is it always redundant?
13:58:35 [Drew]
CI: This is a compatiability issue.
13:59:02 [Drew]
13:59:54 [Drew]
CI: In our use case, we should focus on the primary rule. The sample will map to one rule.
14:00:12 [Drew]
CS: That means the test sample needs to pass all of WCAG except the primary rule.
14:01:33 [Drew]
SAZ: Each test sample must link to at least one technique. One test sample could meet more than one technique or use case. A test sample can show more than one thing, so it makes sense to have a primary and a secondary.
14:02:23 [Drew]
CI: We decided some time ago we would focus on one WCAG requirement in each test sample.
14:02:24 [CarlosV]
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14:02:56 [Drew]
s/requirement/success criterion
14:09:58 [Drew]
SAZ: If you do not meet 1.4.3 you will not meet 1.4.5. Some of the SC are in direct relationship to each other. In that case, its useful to have this relationship info in the metadata as well.
14:10:00 [EtnaRosso]
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14:11:16 [Drew]
SAZ: The question that CI raises is what is the criteria for calling something primary vs secondary.
14:14:38 [shadi]
vk: in BenToWeb we use rules to point to different version of the WCAG documents
14:14:49 [Drew]
Christophe V: in BenToWeb, we also use 'primary="no"' to reference versions of the same SC in older WCAG drafts
14:15:14 [carlosI]
Not sure what the "it must not combine several issues in one test" mean if we use several rules
14:16:24 [Drew]
CS: Easiest way to proceed is to make primary attribute optional. Make the default value yes, but this removes the possibility to map to several SC>
14:16:32 [Drew]
14:17:51 [EtnaRosso]
hi Christophe hi all
14:18:13 [Drew]
CI: if we allow the use of several rules, not sure what it means to combine several issues into 1 test. If we do this, we need to change the first step in the content review.
14:19:02 [EtnaRosso]
what is this channel about?
14:20:29 [Drew]
CS: We need to clarify what "issue" means. The terminology is different between the WCAG doc and the review process document.
14:21:54 [Drew]
Action: CI to continue discussion on the mailing list
14:22:14 [Drew]
s/discussion/discussion of primary and secondary attributes
14:24:03 [Drew]
CS: CR has uploaded test cases to the wiki
14:24:25 [Drew]
14:24:44 [EtnaRosso]
ah ok it is a "one time" channel
14:24:50 [Drew]
zakim, take up agendum 3
14:24:50 [Zakim]
agendum 3. "Test suite ID in metadata" taken up [from shadi]
14:25:36 [EtnaRosso]
see you gui, have a nice meeting
14:25:44 [EtnaRosso]
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14:27:43 [Christophe]
Test Suite ID:
14:27:45 [Drew]
s/Christophe V/VK
14:28:46 [Drew]
Continue this discussion on the mailing list.
14:29:28 [Drew]
Next meeting 8 January 2008
14:30:05 [Zakim]
14:30:07 [Zakim]
14:30:12 [Zakim]
14:30:25 [Vangelis]
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14:30:25 [Zakim]
14:31:18 [shadi]
no thanks, i'll do that
14:31:43 [shadi]
zakim, who is on the call?
14:31:43 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Drew_LaHart
14:31:47 [Zakim]
14:31:49 [Zakim]
WAI_TSDTF()8:30AM has ended
14:31:50 [Zakim]
Attendees were shadi, Drew_LaHart, Christophe_Strobbe, Vangelis_Karkaletsis, +49.843.9.aaaa, CarlosI
14:31:54 [shadi]
zakim, bye
14:31:54 [Zakim]
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14:32:00 [shadi]
rrsagent, make logs world
14:32:05 [shadi]
rrsagent, make minutes
14:32:05 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate shadi
14:32:06 [shadi]
rrsagent, make logs world
14:32:10 [shadi]
rrsagent, bye
14:32:10 [RRSAgent]
I see 1 open action item saved in :
14:32:10 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: CI to continue discussion on the mailing list [1]
14:32:10 [RRSAgent]
recorded in