IRC log of rif on 2007-11-13

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:50:08 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #rif
15:50:08 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/11/13-rif-irc
15:50:22 [csma]
zakim, this will be rif
15:50:22 [Zakim]
ok, csma; I see SW_RIF()11:00AM scheduled to start in 10 minutes
15:50:46 [csma]
Meeting RIF telecon 13 November 2007
15:51:03 [csma]
Meeting: RIF telecon 13 November 2007
15:51:19 [csma]
Chair: Christian de Sainte Marie
15:51:22 [Zakim]
SW_RIF()11:00AM has now started
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SW_RIF()11:00AM has ended
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Attendees were
15:52:07 [csma]
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2007Nov/0053.html
15:53:01 [csma]
csma has changed the topic to: 13 November telecon agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2007Nov/0053.html
15:58:55 [barry_b]
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15:59:50 [DaveReynolds]
DaveReynolds has joined #rif
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SW_RIF()11:00AM has now started
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+??P7
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patranja has joined #rif
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+Dave_Reynolds (was Guest P9 74394)
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+Dave_Reynolds
16:00:44 [Zakim]
-Dave_Reynolds
16:00:45 [Zakim]
+Dave_Reynolds
16:01:30 [StellaMitichell]
StellaMitichell has joined #rif
16:01:31 [igor]
igor has joined #rif
16:01:33 [csma]
csma has joined #rif
16:01:46 [csma]
zakim, who is on the phone?
16:01:46 [Zakim]
On the phone I see ??P7, Dave_Reynolds
16:01:58 [IgorMozetic]
IgorMozetic has joined #rif
16:02:00 [Zakim]
+Hassan_Ait-Kaci
16:02:15 [csma]
zakim, ??P7 is me
16:02:15 [Zakim]
+csma; got it
16:02:16 [Zakim]
+PaulaP
16:03:01 [Zakim]
+ +43.512.507.9aaaa
16:03:09 [barry_b]
Zakim, aaaa is me
16:03:09 [Zakim]
+barry_b; got it
16:03:25 [Zakim]
+[IBM]
16:03:33 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller]
16:03:43 [IgorMozetic]
zakim, [IPcaller] is me
16:03:43 [Zakim]
+IgorMozetic; got it
16:03:51 [IgorMozetic]
zakim, mute me
16:03:51 [Zakim]
IgorMozetic should now be muted
16:04:03 [StellaMitichell]
zakim, [ibm] is temporarily StellaMitchell
16:04:03 [Zakim]
+StellaMitchell; got it
16:04:06 [csma]
Scribe: Barry Bishop
16:04:09 [barry_b]
Zakim, mute me
16:04:09 [Zakim]
barry_b should now be muted
16:04:16 [csma]
Scribenick: barry_b
16:04:28 [csma]
zakim, who is on the phone?
16:04:28 [Zakim]
On the phone I see csma, Dave_Reynolds, Hassan_Ait-Kaci (muted), PaulaP (muted), barry_b (muted), StellaMitchell, IgorMozetic (muted)
16:04:34 [PaulVincent]
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16:05:32 [Zakim]
+Doug
16:06:10 [Zakim]
+??P18
16:06:10 [barry_b]
Main reason for meeting is to debrief F2F
16:06:24 [barry_b]
And discuss items on critical path
16:06:50 [Zakim]
+Gary_Hallmark
16:06:53 [barry_b]
Minutes of 30.10.07 telecon accepted.
16:06:53 [Doug]
Doug has joined #rif
16:07:28 [PaulVincent]
No liaison news
16:08:09 [csma]
RESOLVED: accept minutes of October 30 telecon
16:08:39 [LeoraMorgenstern]
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16:08:53 [csma]
action 371 done
16:09:50 [Zakim]
+LeoraMorgenstern
16:10:06 [barry_b]
F2F - extensibility issues discussed. Reasonably successful. Enough to progress BLD.
16:10:16 [LeoraMorgenstern]
zakim, mute me
16:10:16 [Zakim]
LeoraMorgenstern should now be muted
16:10:18 [MichaelKifer]
MichaelKifer has joined #rif
16:11:03 [barry_b]
Will have a way to avoid invisible extensions.
16:11:43 [barry_b]
Will have a BLD without equality.
16:12:09 [Zakim]
+MichaelKifer
16:12:26 [barry_b]
Discussed whether al extensions must extend BLD or BRD
16:12:46 [MichaelKifer]
zakim, mute me
16:12:46 [Zakim]
MichaelKifer should now be muted
16:13:29 [MichaelKifer]
we did NOT make a decision to exclude equality
16:13:38 [Zakim]
+Sandro
16:13:52 [barry_b]
Fallback mechanism - trim part of tree that is not understood?
16:15:23 [IgorMozetic]
As far as I remember, we decided that CORE (not BLD) will be without equality
16:16:00 [sandro]
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16:16:55 [barry_b]
Received public review of BLD - actions assigned.
16:17:10 [MichaelKifer]
yes, only the core (whatever it will be). BLD is anyway quite large and many systems won't implement it in full.
16:17:21 [barry_b]
Introduced PRD in one session.
16:18:08 [barry_b]
PRD will be discussed in future telecon - concensus was that PRD should include as much of BLD as possible.
16:19:49 [barry_b]
Condition language between PRD and BLD should as far as possible be described in the terms.
16:21:16 [barry_b]
Re. partial semantics - conflict resolution - pick up rule in agenda that will actually be fired. Should have simple default strategy.
16:21:49 [csma]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/wiki/Conflict_Resolution_Strategies
16:22:00 [barry_b]
Will do survey of resolution strategy in commercial systems.
16:22:16 [Zakim]
-IgorMozetic
16:23:07 [Zakim]
+??P11
16:23:15 [barry_b]
Session on test cases - decided people should start submitting test cases.
16:23:15 [IgorMozetic]
zakim, ??P11 is me
16:23:15 [Zakim]
+IgorMozetic; got it
16:23:20 [IgorMozetic]
zakim, mute me
16:23:20 [Zakim]
IgorMozetic should now be muted
16:23:44 [StellaMitichell]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/wiki/Arch/Test_Cases
16:23:55 [StellaMitichell]
I added to the end of that existing pate
16:23:59 [StellaMitichell]
s/pate/page/
16:24:10 [Zakim]
-Doug
16:24:59 [barry_b]
Compliance defnition discussed. Yes/No or levels. Clear that simplest approach supported, i.e. yes/no.
16:26:00 [barry_b]
Discussed which documents need to be published, UCR, CORE, BLD, PRD, framework/architectute, extensibility
16:26:46 [barry_b]
Also discussed - WG extension for 6 months requested.
16:27:11 [barry_b]
If we can't agree BLD in 6 months then WG has problems
16:27:34 [barry_b]
Should prioritise open issues - which ones are on critical path.
16:27:39 [Zakim]
-Gary_Hallmark
16:28:49 [barry_b]
Also next working draft of BLD - issues regarding lists, meta data, etc must be resolved.
16:29:22 [barry_b]
Michael should be able to propose a draft by mid-december.
16:29:36 [csma]
looks like I have been disconnected...
16:29:37 [Hassan]
I lost the phone line ....
16:29:50 [Zakim]
-Hassan_Ait-Kaci
16:29:52 [Zakim]
-IgorMozetic
16:29:53 [Zakim]
-PaulaP
16:30:02 [Zakim]
-MichaelKifer
16:30:06 [Zakim]
-StellaMitchell
16:30:18 [Zakim]
+Hassan_Ait-Kaci
16:30:23 [Zakim]
-csma
16:30:33 [sandro]
sound seems to have stopped.
16:30:40 [PaulVincent]
Ah there was a French answer to the call...
16:30:41 [Zakim]
+[IBM]
16:30:50 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller]
16:30:56 [sandro]
zakim, who is on the call?
16:30:56 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Dave_Reynolds, barry_b (muted), ??P18, LeoraMorgenstern (muted), Sandro, Hassan_Ait-Kaci, [IBM], [IPcaller]
16:30:58 [StellaMitichell]
zakim, [ibm] is temporarily StellaMitchell
16:30:59 [Zakim]
+StellaMitchell; got it
16:31:03 [Zakim]
+PaulaP
16:31:20 [csma]
trying to rejoin...
16:31:31 [Zakim]
+??P7
16:31:34 [Zakim]
-[IPcaller]
16:31:46 [PaulVincent]
I guess that was the Zakim drone filter... :)
16:31:57 [Zakim]
+Gary_Hallmark
16:32:03 [csma]
zakim, who is on the phone?
16:32:03 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Dave_Reynolds, barry_b (muted), ??P18, LeoraMorgenstern (muted), Sandro, Hassan_Ait-Kaci, StellaMitchell, PaulaP (muted), ??P7, Gary_Hallmark
16:32:03 [Zakim]
-LeoraMorgenstern
16:32:13 [Zakim]
+??P16
16:32:32 [Zakim]
+Sandro.a
16:32:41 [Zakim]
-Sandro
16:32:58 [IgorMozetic]
IgorMozetic has joined #rif
16:32:58 [sandro]
zakim, Sandro.a is Sandro
16:32:58 [Zakim]
+Sandro; got it
16:32:59 [csma]
zakim, ??P7 is me
16:32:59 [Zakim]
+csma; got it
16:33:02 [Zakim]
+??P19
16:33:04 [csma]
ack csma
16:33:05 [Zakim]
-??P16
16:33:08 [csma]
ack ??P7
16:33:31 [GaryHallmark]
GaryHallmark has joined #rif
16:33:42 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller]
16:33:51 [IgorMozetic]
zakim, [IPcaller] is me
16:33:51 [Zakim]
+IgorMozetic; got it
16:34:05 [LeoraMorgenstern]
zakim, ??P7 is me
16:34:05 [Zakim]
I already had ??P7 as csma, LeoraMorgenstern
16:34:09 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Oh, sorry
16:34:19 [LeoraMorgenstern]
zakim, ??P19 is me
16:34:19 [Zakim]
+LeoraMorgenstern; got it
16:34:25 [LeoraMorgenstern]
zakim, mute me
16:34:25 [Zakim]
LeoraMorgenstern should now be muted
16:35:19 [barry_b]
Implementation break-out notes on minutes
16:35:20 [Zakim]
+MichaelKifer
16:35:31 [MichaelKifer]
zakim, mute me
16:35:31 [Zakim]
MichaelKifer should now be muted
16:35:37 [barry_b]
No further comments on F2F
16:36:29 [csma]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/wiki/F2F9
16:36:30 [barry_b]
Need 2 more F2F meetings, F2F9 in february, with 3 proposals for hosting.
16:38:35 [IgorMozetic]
Feb 18-22 is not possible for F2F9 at Bled
16:39:04 [IgorMozetic]
all other options areopen
16:39:18 [IgorMozetic]
s/areopen/are open/
16:39:37 [barry_b]
3 proposals are: DERI galway, Joseph Stefan Institut (18.02 - 22.02 not possible), ...
16:40:08 [PaulVincent]
When is F2F10?
16:40:30 [barry_b]
...18.02 or 19.02 possible in France.
16:40:32 [sandro]
probably May, Paul..... but no decision
16:42:47 [barry_b]
Neeed to poll early for dates for F2F9
16:43:12 [IgorMozetic]
zakim, mute me
16:43:12 [Zakim]
IgorMozetic should now be muted
16:45:02 [PaulVincent]
F2F10: April 14-18 might be OK for TIBCO/me to host... London Maidenhead in UK
16:45:12 [barry_b]
Date for F2F10. May too late? April might be better for technical decisions to be made before publication decisions.
16:45:49 [Zakim]
-MichaelKifer
16:46:37 [barry_b]
No more on F2F
16:48:39 [barry_b]
Actions for BLD reviewed.
16:49:14 [IgorMozetic]
zakim, unmute me
16:49:14 [Zakim]
IgorMozetic should no longer be muted
16:49:34 [IgorMozetic]
zakim, mute me
16:49:34 [Zakim]
IgorMozetic should now be muted
16:53:44 [csma]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/track/issues/open
16:55:32 [Zakim]
-Dave_Reynolds
17:00:18 [Zakim]
+Doug
17:01:14 [PaulaP]
yes
17:01:25 [PaulaP]
I did start a list with built-ins
17:01:40 [PaulaP]
I would actually do the modules :)
17:02:18 [PaulaP]
ok, I can do that
17:05:41 [PaulaP]
I can try to look also at modules
17:05:59 [PaulaP]
ok :)
17:07:26 [barry_b]
Conslusion: F2F update, open issues discussed.
17:07:28 [PaulaP]
+1
17:07:32 [Hassan]
+1
17:07:32 [barry_b]
AOB?
17:07:34 [Zakim]
-Doug
17:07:39 [Zakim]
-IgorMozetic
17:07:47 [Zakim]
-PaulVincent
17:07:48 [Zakim]
-LeoraMorgenstern
17:07:55 [Zakim]
-Hassan_Ait-Kaci
17:08:00 [barry_b]
Yes
17:08:01 [Zakim]
-Gary_Hallmark
17:08:03 [Zakim]
-StellaMitchell
17:08:05 [PaulaP]
bye
17:08:13 [Zakim]
-PaulaP
17:08:23 [csma]
zakim, who is on the phone?
17:08:23 [Zakim]
On the phone I see barry_b (muted), csma, Sandro
17:08:29 [barry_b]
Zakim, ack
17:08:29 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'ack', barry_b
17:08:36 [csma]
rrsagent, make minutes
17:08:36 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/11/13-rif-minutes.html csma
17:08:55 [barry_b]
No access!
17:09:07 [csma]
rrsagent, make record public
17:09:23 [csma]
rrsagnet, make minutes
17:09:33 [csma]
rrsagent, make minutes
17:09:33 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/11/13-rif-minutes.html csma
17:09:53 [barry_b]
Yes, I can see this now!
17:10:30 [barry_b]
Ok! No problem!
17:10:41 [barry_b]
a
17:10:51 [Zakim]
-barry_b
17:11:39 [barry_b]
barry_b has left #rif
17:12:00 [csma]
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meeting.html
17:13:53 [csma]
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingtime.html?day=13&month=11&year=2007&p1=43&p2=195&p3=235&p4=-1
17:15:05 [Zakim]
-csma
17:15:11 [Zakim]
-Sandro
17:15:13 [Zakim]
SW_RIF()11:00AM has ended
17:15:14 [Zakim]
Attendees were Dave_Reynolds, Hassan_Ait-Kaci, csma, PaulaP, +43.512.507.9aaaa, barry_b, IgorMozetic, StellaMitchell, Doug, Gary_Hallmark, LeoraMorgenstern, MichaelKifer, Sandro,
17:15:16 [Zakim]
... PaulVincent
17:50:42 [csma]
csma has left #rif