15:50:08 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #rif
15:50:08 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/11/13-rif-irc
15:50:22 <csma> zakim, this will be rif
15:50:22 <Zakim> ok, csma; I see SW_RIF()11:00AM scheduled to start in 10 minutes
15:50:46 <csma> Meeting RIF telecon 13 November 2007
15:51:03 <csma> Meeting: RIF telecon 13 November 2007
15:51:19 <csma> Chair: Christian de Sainte Marie
15:51:22 <Zakim> SW_RIF()11:00AM has now started
15:51:29 <Zakim> SW_RIF()11:00AM has ended
15:51:31 <Zakim> Attendees were 
15:52:07 <csma> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2007Nov/0053.html
15:53:01 <csma> csma has changed the topic to: 13 November telecon agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2007Nov/0053.html
15:58:55 <barry_b> barry_b has joined #rif
15:59:50 <DaveReynolds> DaveReynolds has joined #rif
16:00:21 <Zakim> SW_RIF()11:00AM has now started
16:00:23 <Zakim> +??P7
16:00:26 <patranja> patranja has joined #rif
16:00:42 <Zakim> +Dave_Reynolds (was Guest P9 74394)
16:00:44 <Zakim> +Dave_Reynolds
16:00:44 <Zakim> -Dave_Reynolds
16:00:45 <Zakim> +Dave_Reynolds
16:01:30 <StellaMitichell> StellaMitichell has joined #rif
16:01:31 <igor> igor has joined #rif
16:01:33 <csma> csma has joined #rif
16:01:46 <csma> zakim, who is on the phone?
16:01:46 <Zakim> On the phone I see ??P7, Dave_Reynolds
16:01:58 <IgorMozetic> IgorMozetic has joined #rif
16:02:00 <Zakim> +Hassan_Ait-Kaci
16:02:15 <csma> zakim, ??P7 is me
16:02:15 <Zakim> +csma; got it
16:02:16 <Zakim> +PaulaP
16:03:01 <Zakim> + +43.512.507.9aaaa
16:03:09 <barry_b> Zakim, aaaa is me
16:03:09 <Zakim> +barry_b; got it
16:03:25 <Zakim> +[IBM]
16:03:33 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:03:43 <IgorMozetic> zakim, [IPcaller] is me
16:03:43 <Zakim> +IgorMozetic; got it
16:03:51 <IgorMozetic> zakim, mute me
16:03:51 <Zakim> IgorMozetic should now be muted
16:04:03 <StellaMitichell> zakim, [ibm] is temporarily StellaMitchell
16:04:03 <Zakim> +StellaMitchell; got it
16:04:06 <csma> Scribe: Barry Bishop
16:04:09 <barry_b> Zakim, mute me
16:04:09 <Zakim> barry_b should now be muted
16:04:16 <csma> Scribenick: barry_b
16:04:28 <csma> zakim, who is on the phone?
16:04:28 <Zakim> On the phone I see csma, Dave_Reynolds, Hassan_Ait-Kaci (muted), PaulaP (muted), barry_b (muted), StellaMitchell, IgorMozetic (muted)
16:04:34 <PaulVincent> PaulVincent has joined #rif
16:05:32 <Zakim> +Doug
16:06:10 <Zakim> +??P18
16:06:10 <barry_b> Main reason for meeting is to debrief F2F
16:06:24 <barry_b> And discuss items on critical path
16:06:50 <Zakim> +Gary_Hallmark
16:06:53 <barry_b> Minutes of 30.10.07 telecon accepted.
16:06:53 <Doug> Doug has joined #rif
16:07:28 <PaulVincent> No liaison news
16:08:09 <csma> RESOLVED: accept minutes of October 30 telecon
16:08:39 <LeoraMorgenstern> LeoraMorgenstern has joined #rif
16:08:53 <csma> action 371 done
16:09:50 <Zakim> +LeoraMorgenstern
16:10:06 <barry_b> F2F - extensibility issues discussed. Reasonably successful. Enough to progress BLD.
16:10:16 <LeoraMorgenstern> zakim, mute me
16:10:16 <Zakim> LeoraMorgenstern should now be muted
16:10:18 <MichaelKifer> MichaelKifer has joined #rif
16:11:03 <barry_b> Will have a way to avoid invisible extensions.
16:11:43 <barry_b> Will have a BLD without equality.
16:12:09 <Zakim> +MichaelKifer
16:12:26 <barry_b> Discussed whether al extensions must extend BLD or BRD
16:12:46 <MichaelKifer> zakim, mute me
16:12:46 <Zakim> MichaelKifer should now be muted
16:13:29 <MichaelKifer> we did NOT make a decision to exclude equality
16:13:38 <Zakim> +Sandro
16:13:52 <barry_b> Fallback mechanism - trim part of tree that is not understood?
16:15:23 <IgorMozetic> As far as I remember, we decided that CORE (not BLD) will be without equality
16:16:00 <sandro> sandro has joined #rif
16:16:55 <barry_b> Received public review of BLD - actions assigned.
16:17:10 <MichaelKifer> yes, only the core (whatever it will be). BLD is anyway quite large and many systems won't implement it in full.
16:17:21 <barry_b> Introduced PRD in one session.
16:18:08 <barry_b> PRD will be discussed in future telecon - concensus was that PRD should include as much of BLD as possible.
16:19:49 <barry_b> Condition language between PRD and BLD should as far as possible be described in the terms.
16:21:16 <barry_b> Re. partial semantics - conflict resolution - pick up rule in agenda that will actually be fired. Should have simple default strategy.
16:21:49 <csma> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/wiki/Conflict_Resolution_Strategies
16:22:00 <barry_b> Will do survey of resolution strategy in commercial systems.
16:22:16 <Zakim> -IgorMozetic
16:23:07 <Zakim> +??P11
16:23:15 <barry_b> Session on test cases - decided people should start submitting test cases.
16:23:15 <IgorMozetic> zakim, ??P11 is me
16:23:15 <Zakim> +IgorMozetic; got it
16:23:20 <IgorMozetic> zakim, mute me
16:23:20 <Zakim> IgorMozetic should now be muted
16:23:44 <StellaMitichell> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/wiki/Arch/Test_Cases
16:23:55 <StellaMitichell> I added to the end of that existing pate
16:23:59 <StellaMitichell> s/pate/page/
16:24:10 <Zakim> -Doug
16:24:59 <barry_b> Compliance defnition discussed. Yes/No or levels. Clear that simplest approach supported, i.e. yes/no.
16:26:00 <barry_b> Discussed which documents need to be published, UCR, CORE, BLD, PRD, framework/architectute, extensibility
16:26:46 <barry_b> Also discussed - WG extension for 6 months requested.
16:27:11 <barry_b> If we can't agree BLD in 6 months then WG has problems
16:27:34 <barry_b> Should prioritise open issues - which ones are on critical path.
16:27:39 <Zakim> -Gary_Hallmark
16:28:49 <barry_b> Also next working draft of BLD - issues regarding lists, meta data, etc must be resolved.
16:29:22 <barry_b> Michael should be able to propose a draft by mid-december.
16:29:36 <csma> looks like I have been disconnected...
16:29:37 <Hassan> I lost the phone line ....
16:29:50 <Zakim> -Hassan_Ait-Kaci
16:29:52 <Zakim> -IgorMozetic
16:29:53 <Zakim> -PaulaP
16:30:02 <Zakim> -MichaelKifer
16:30:06 <Zakim> -StellaMitchell
16:30:18 <Zakim> +Hassan_Ait-Kaci
16:30:23 <Zakim> -csma
16:30:33 <sandro> sound seems to have stopped.
16:30:40 <PaulVincent> Ah there was a French answer to the call...
16:30:41 <Zakim> +[IBM]
16:30:50 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:30:56 <sandro> zakim, who is on the call?
16:30:56 <Zakim> On the phone I see Dave_Reynolds, barry_b (muted), ??P18, LeoraMorgenstern (muted), Sandro, Hassan_Ait-Kaci, [IBM], [IPcaller]
16:30:58 <StellaMitichell> zakim, [ibm] is temporarily StellaMitchell
16:30:59 <Zakim> +StellaMitchell; got it
16:31:03 <Zakim> +PaulaP
16:31:20 <csma> trying to rejoin...
16:31:31 <Zakim> +??P7
16:31:34 <Zakim> -[IPcaller]
16:31:46 <PaulVincent> I guess that was the Zakim drone filter... :)
16:31:57 <Zakim> +Gary_Hallmark
16:32:03 <csma> zakim, who is on the phone?
16:32:03 <Zakim> On the phone I see Dave_Reynolds, barry_b (muted), ??P18, LeoraMorgenstern (muted), Sandro, Hassan_Ait-Kaci, StellaMitchell, PaulaP (muted), ??P7, Gary_Hallmark
16:32:03 <Zakim> -LeoraMorgenstern
16:32:13 <Zakim> +??P16
16:32:32 <Zakim> +Sandro.a
16:32:41 <Zakim> -Sandro
16:32:58 <IgorMozetic> IgorMozetic has joined #rif
16:32:58 <sandro> zakim, Sandro.a is Sandro
16:32:58 <Zakim> +Sandro; got it
16:32:59 <csma> zakim, ??P7 is me
16:32:59 <Zakim> +csma; got it
16:33:02 <Zakim> +??P19
16:33:04 <csma> ack csma
16:33:05 <Zakim> -??P16
16:33:08 <csma> ack ??P7
16:33:31 <GaryHallmark> GaryHallmark has joined #rif
16:33:42 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:33:51 <IgorMozetic> zakim, [IPcaller] is me
16:33:51 <Zakim> +IgorMozetic; got it
16:34:05 <LeoraMorgenstern> zakim, ??P7 is me
16:34:05 <Zakim> I already had ??P7 as csma, LeoraMorgenstern
16:34:09 <LeoraMorgenstern> Oh, sorry
16:34:19 <LeoraMorgenstern> zakim, ??P19 is me
16:34:19 <Zakim> +LeoraMorgenstern; got it
16:34:25 <LeoraMorgenstern> zakim, mute me
16:34:25 <Zakim> LeoraMorgenstern should now be muted
16:35:19 <barry_b> Implementation break-out notes on minutes
16:35:20 <Zakim> +MichaelKifer
16:35:31 <MichaelKifer> zakim, mute me
16:35:31 <Zakim> MichaelKifer should now be muted
16:35:37 <barry_b> No further comments on F2F
16:36:29 <csma> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/wiki/F2F9
16:36:30 <barry_b> Need 2 more F2F meetings, F2F9 in february, with 3 proposals for hosting.
16:38:35 <IgorMozetic> Feb 18-22 is not possible for F2F9 at Bled
16:39:04 <IgorMozetic> all other options areopen
16:39:18 <IgorMozetic> s/areopen/are open/
16:39:37 <barry_b> 3 proposals are: DERI galway, Joseph Stefan Institut (18.02 - 22.02 not possible), ...
16:40:08 <PaulVincent> When is F2F10?
16:40:30 <barry_b> ...18.02 or 19.02 possible in France.
16:40:32 <sandro> probably May, Paul.....    but no decision
16:42:47 <barry_b> Neeed to poll early for dates for F2F9
16:43:12 <IgorMozetic> zakim, mute me
16:43:12 <Zakim> IgorMozetic should now be muted
16:45:02 <PaulVincent> F2F10: April 14-18 might be OK for TIBCO/me to host... London Maidenhead in UK
16:45:12 <barry_b> Date for F2F10. May too late? April might be better for technical decisions to be made before publication decisions.
16:45:49 <Zakim> -MichaelKifer
16:46:37 <barry_b> No more on F2F
16:48:39 <barry_b> Actions for BLD reviewed.
16:49:14 <IgorMozetic> zakim, unmute me
16:49:14 <Zakim> IgorMozetic should no longer be muted
16:49:34 <IgorMozetic> zakim, mute me
16:49:34 <Zakim> IgorMozetic should now be muted
16:53:44 <csma> http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/track/issues/open
16:55:32 <Zakim> -Dave_Reynolds
17:00:18 <Zakim> +Doug
17:01:14 <PaulaP> yes
17:01:25 <PaulaP> I did start a list with built-ins
17:01:40 <PaulaP> I would actually do the modules  :)
17:02:18 <PaulaP> ok, I can do that 
17:05:41 <PaulaP> I can try to look also at modules
17:05:59 <PaulaP> ok :)
17:07:26 <barry_b> Conslusion: F2F update, open issues discussed.
17:07:28 <PaulaP> +1
17:07:32 <Hassan> +1
17:07:32 <barry_b> AOB?
17:07:34 <Zakim> -Doug
17:07:39 <Zakim> -IgorMozetic
17:07:47 <Zakim> -PaulVincent
17:07:48 <Zakim> -LeoraMorgenstern
17:07:55 <Zakim> -Hassan_Ait-Kaci
17:08:00 <barry_b> Yes
17:08:01 <Zakim> -Gary_Hallmark
17:08:03 <Zakim> -StellaMitchell
17:08:05 <PaulaP> bye
17:08:13 <Zakim> -PaulaP
17:08:23 <csma> zakim, who is on the phone?
17:08:23 <Zakim> On the phone I see barry_b (muted), csma, Sandro
17:08:29 <barry_b> Zakim, ack
17:08:29 <Zakim> I don't understand 'ack', barry_b
17:08:36 <csma> rrsagent, make minutes
17:08:36 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/11/13-rif-minutes.html csma
17:08:55 <barry_b> No access!
17:09:07 <csma> rrsagent, make record public
17:09:23 <csma> rrsagnet, make minutes
17:09:33 <csma> rrsagent, make minutes
17:09:33 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/11/13-rif-minutes.html csma
17:09:53 <barry_b> Yes, I can see this now!
17:10:30 <barry_b> Ok! No problem!
17:10:41 <barry_b> a
17:10:51 <Zakim> -barry_b
17:11:39 <barry_b> barry_b has left #rif
17:12:00 <csma> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meeting.html
17:13:53 <csma> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingtime.html?day=13&month=11&year=2007&p1=43&p2=195&p3=235&p4=-1
17:15:05 <Zakim> -csma
17:15:11 <Zakim> -Sandro
17:15:13 <Zakim> SW_RIF()11:00AM has ended
17:15:14 <Zakim> Attendees were Dave_Reynolds, Hassan_Ait-Kaci, csma, PaulaP, +43.512.507.9aaaa, barry_b, IgorMozetic, StellaMitchell, Doug, Gary_Hallmark, LeoraMorgenstern, MichaelKifer, Sandro,
17:15:16 <Zakim> ... PaulVincent
17:50:42 <csma> csma has left #rif