IRC log of swd on 2007-10-23

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:52:17 [RRSAgent]

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14:52:17 [RRSAgent]

logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/10/23-swd-irc

14:52:21 [Tom]

rrsagent, bookmark

14:52:21 [RRSAgent]

See http://www.w3.org/2007/10/23-swd-irc#T14-52-21

14:52:26 [Tom]

zakim, this will be swd

14:52:26 [Zakim]

ok, Tom, I see SW_SWD()11:00AM already started

14:52:30 [Tom]

Meeting: SWD WG

14:52:32 [Tom]

Chair: Tom

14:52:45 [Zakim]

+[LC]

14:52:57 [Tom]

Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Oct/0095.html

14:53:14 [Tom]

zakim, LC is Clay

14:53:14 [Zakim]

+Clay; got it

14:54:57 [Antoine]

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14:55:00 [Tom]

Previous: http://www.w3.org/2007/10/09-swd-minutes.html

14:55:10 [Tom]

Regrets: Ralph

14:55:41 [Tom]

rrsagent, please make record public

14:55:53 [edsu]

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14:56:45 [Tom]

Scribe: Clay

14:56:51 [Tom]

scribenick: clay

14:57:12 [Guus]

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14:57:49 [Zakim]

+[LC]

14:58:06 [Tom]

zakim, LC is Edsu

14:58:06 [Zakim]

+Edsu; got it

14:59:18 [vit]

vit has joined #swd

14:59:32 [seanb]

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14:59:49 [Zakim]

+ +20420aaaa

15:00:08 [Antoine]

zakim, aaaa is Antoine

15:00:08 [Zakim]

+Antoine; got it

15:00:33 [JonP]

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15:01:00 [Zakim]

+??P38

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15:02:22 [Zakim]

+ +012242aabb

15:02:46 [seanb]

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15:02:52 [Zakim]

+??P40

15:04:38 [Clay]

TOPIC: Actions from pre-Amsterdam telecon (Oct 2)

15:04:46 [Zakim]

+??P53

15:04:55 [Clay]

ACTION: Ben to send formal request to send mail proposing Draft of RDFa Syntax and Publish new version of RDFa Primer, both on REC track) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/02-swd-minutes.html#action06]

15:05:00 [Clay]

--done

15:05:07 [seanb]

zakim, ??P53 is seanb

15:05:12 [Zakim]

+seanb; got it

15:05:13 [Clay]

ACTION: Alistair to state the difference between the two flavours of the SimpleExtension proposal for issue 26 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-minutes.html#action05]

15:05:16 [Clay]

--done

15:05:32 [Clay]

ACTION: all to register (indicate also that you're not planning to attend and/or want to attend via telecon) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/02-swd-minutes.html#action09

15:05:37 [Clay]

--done

15:05:51 [Clay]

ACTION: Antoine to make wiki page or list posting summarizing issues for "Concept Semantics" [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/09/18-swd-minutes.html#action07]

15:05:53 [Clay]

--done

15:06:04 [Clay]

ACTION: Diego, Ed and Justin to review RDFa syntax document prior to f2f [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/09/25-swd-minutes.html#action10

15:06:06 [Clay]

--done

15:06:18 [Clay]

ACTION: Elisa to ask for feedback on VM draft [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/21-swd-minutes.html#action06]

15:06:19 [Clay]

--done

15:06:30 [Clay]

ACTION: Guus to email a proposal to the list about Issue-36 ConceptSchemeContainment [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/24-swd-minutes.html#action01]

15:06:32 [Clay]

--done

15:07:03 [Clay]

ACTION: Guus to move ISSUE-26 forward [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action04]

15:07:05 [Clay]

--done

15:07:30 [Clay]

ACTION: Guus to post user experience reports for ISSUE-25 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action05]

15:07:33 [Clay]

--continues

15:07:41 [Clay]

ACTION: Ralph propose resolution to ISSUE-16 "Default behavior" [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/01/22-swd-minutes.html#action14]

15:07:43 [Clay]

--continues

15:08:08 [Clay]

TOPIC: Admin

15:08:37 [Clay]

TomB: propose to accept minutes

15:08:49 [Zakim]

+Guus_Schreiber

15:08:57 [Clay]

...including minutes from face-to-face

15:08:58 [Zakim]

+Jon_Phipps

15:09:48 [Clay]

Antoine: notes some resolutions might not have been properly recorded

15:09:59 [JonP]

zakim, Jon_Phipps is me

15:09:59 [Zakim]

+JonP; got it

15:10:31 [Clay]

Guus: postpone the decision accepting the minutes

15:10:37 [Clay]

--continues

15:11:34 [Clay]

TomB: next telecon on 10/30 will be altered by one hour for London, Amsterdam due to time changes

15:12:25 [Clay]

... possibly cancel 11/06 meeting?

15:12:43 [Clay]

Proposal to telecon meet for 11/06

15:13:37 [Clay]

RESOLVED: that 11/06 meeeting will take place and 11/13 meeting will not. 1600 UTC time for 11/06.

15:14:42 [Clay]

TOPIC: SWD review of "Cool URIs for the Semantic Web"

15:15:06 [Clay]

TomB: Michael has drafted some sentences for the authors

15:15:48 [aliman]

which URI is TOm reading?

15:15:56 [edsu]

http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/ReviewCoolURIs

15:16:51 [Clay]

TomB: have a brief discussion or agree that these sentence capture the points we want to make. The SWEO is looking forward to the feedback. Propose to accept comments as stated and forward to SWEO.

15:17:08 [Clay]

Ed: wants to go on record as saying that the wording is a bit strong.

15:17:31 [Clay]

TomB: agreed. Authors can take the comments as input.

15:18:46 [Clay]

Ed: feels that the recommendations of the Cool URI document and RDFa are not mutually exclusive

15:19:06 [aliman]

+1 on what Ed said, RDFa and cool URIs needs more thought

15:20:06 [Clay]

TomB: leave it to the SWEO folks to wordsmith. Wording could be improved.

15:20:14 [Clay]

Ed: agrees

15:20:15 [JonP]

+1 wrt the wording is perhaps too exclusionary

15:20:39 [Clay]

RESOLVED: Michael to forward comments to SWEO noting that the wording could be wordsmithed

15:20:55 [Clay]

TOPIC: SKOS

15:21:18 [Clay]

TomB: I transcribed the resolutions from Amsterdam, mostly from labelling properties discussion

15:22:22 [Clay]

... resolution on concept semantics might not have been caputred fully?

15:23:40 [Clay]

Antoine: these were not formalized. there were 3. 1. SKOS concepts are of type RDFS class. 2. SKOS Concept is of owl:Class. 3. SKOS Concept instance of classes and disjoint with owl:Class.

15:24:01 [Clay]

s/RDFS class/rdfs:Class/

15:24:07 [aliman]

s/disjoint/no statement about disjoint/

15:24:29 [aliman]

q+ to comment about skos reference

15:25:03 [Clay]

TomB: propose action on Antoine to formulate 3 resolutions for Amsterdam topic Concept Semantics posted to the list.

15:25:12 [Clay]

... as a basis for amending meeting record.

15:25:50 [Clay]

ACTION: Antoine to formulate 3 resolutions for Amsterdam topic Concept Semantics posted to the list. as a basis for amending meeting record.

15:26:06 [JonP]

q+ to ask about deprecation of inScheme

15:26:34 [Clay]

Sean: semantic relation properties: fine.

15:28:05 [Clay]

ACTION: Tom to amend proposals to for accepting minimal relation labels

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15:30:11 [aliman]

q+ to comment on label relations resolution

15:30:52 [Clay]

TomB: recalls that we decided to accept the resolution and to have an action of proposing label resource.

15:30:58 [Tom]

ack aliman

15:30:58 [Zakim]

aliman, you wanted to comment about skos reference and to comment on label relations resolution

15:31:36 [aliman]

http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/SKOS/Reference

15:31:42 [Clay]

Alistair: tried to put all resolutions in a new WIki draft of a skos reference document

15:31:53 [Simone]

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15:31:59 [Clay]

... if this isn't what people remember, ping Alistair

15:32:14 [Zakim]

+??P22

15:33:19 [aliman]

http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/SKOS/Reference/LabelRelations

15:33:57 [Clay]

Alistair: skos reference label relations section. skos:labelRelated is in there tentatively, etc.

15:34:24 [Antoine]

q+ to add a resolution on concept scheme topic

15:35:49 [aliman]

I understood we could always go back to an issue and change our mind in the light of further discussion ... no double jeopardy :)

15:36:54 [Tom]

ack JonP

15:36:54 [Zakim]

JonP, you wanted to ask about deprecation of inScheme

15:36:57 [Clay]

Guus: we took a resolution on the general approach.

15:37:04 [Clay]

... resolutions can be reopened

15:37:14 [Tom]

ack Antoine

15:37:14 [Zakim]

Antoine, you wanted to add a resolution on concept scheme topic

15:38:01 [Clay]

Antoine: in end of minutes there are lines about concept scheme. Decisions were made that were not compiled in the list as resolved.

15:38:46 [Clay]

ACTION: Antoine to list decisions made about concept scheme

15:38:54 [Tom]

ack JonP

15:39:44 [Clay]

Jon: I don't believe that we voted on deprecating inScheme in favor of isDefinedBy. If this is resolved, it needs further discussion.

15:39:59 [Clay]

s/in favor of/inFavorOf/

15:40:14 [Clay]

s/inFavorOf/in favor of/

15:40:44 [Clay]

ACTION: Guus to post an interpretation of the Amsterdam discussion of isDefinedBy

15:41:57 [aliman]

Btw I forgot about skos:inScheme and skos:hasTopConcept when I did the first bake of SKOS reference, have just added some TODOs to http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/SKOS/Reference/ConceptSchemes

15:42:18 [edsu]

aliman++

15:42:23 [Clay]

Tom: 1. what did we decide in Amsterdam, and Guus needs the interepretation of the discussion

15:43:02 [Clay]

Alistair: added some TODOs

15:43:30 [aliman]

q+ to ask Jon P to raise a new issue for skos:inScheme, with feedback

15:43:34 [Clay]

--continues

15:43:36 [Clay]

--continues

15:43:57 [Clay]

TOPIC: RDFa

15:44:12 [aliman]

q-

15:45:14 [edsu]

Antoines review: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Oct/0090.html

15:45:39 [Clay]

ACTION: antoine to review RDFa Primer before next telecon (within two weeks). [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/08-swd-minutes.html#action01]

15:45:44 [Clay]

--done

15:47:14 [aliman]

JonP -- I've heard some similar feedback on losing skos:inScheme, it'd be great if you could capture in a new issue. If we do keep skos:inScheme, I think it needs to be clarified, because it was in a way weaker than rdfs:isDefinedBy -- a SKOS concept could be skos:inScheme any number of schemes; but rdfs:isDefinedBy suggests only one scheme. So do we want to express a notion of one distinguished s

15:47:16 [aliman]

cheme for any concept, in which it is defined? Do we also want to allow concepts to be "in" other schemes too? How does this interact with using owl:imports?

15:47:21 [Clay]

RESOLVED: to approve publications of RDFa Primer as a working draft

15:47:49 [Clay]

ACTION: Ben and Michael to address comments by Tom [regarding maintenance of wiki document http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RDFa] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/08-swd-minutes.html#action05]

15:47:51 [Clay]

--continues

15:47:58 [Clay]

ACTION: Ben to update RDFa schedule in wiki [http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RDFa#RDFa_schedule] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/08-swd-minutes.html#action04]

15:48:01 [Clay]

--continues

15:48:08 [Clay]

ACTION: Ben to prepare draft implementation report for RDFa (with assistance from Michael) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/08-swd-minutes.html#action03]

15:48:10 [edsu]

JonP: i would be interested in the feedback you got as well

15:48:10 [Clay]

--continues

15:48:17 [Clay]

ACTION: Guus/Tom to propose joint decisions for reviews for major [RDFa] steps/transition requests. Informal agreement about working drafts. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/08-swd-minutes.html#action02]

15:48:24 [Clay]

--continues

15:48:29 [Clay]

TOPIC: Recipes

15:50:12 [Clay]

ACTION: Diego to recast Recipe 6 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/09-swd-minutes.html#action02]

15:50:15 [Clay]

--continues

15:50:24 [Clay]

ACTION: Jon to add words that acknowledge the existence of RDFa as potential mechanisms, but it's out of scope here. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/09-swd-minutes.html#action06]

15:50:26 [Clay]

--continues

15:50:33 [Clay]

ACTION: Jon to make changes as proposed [with regard to Issue-23] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/09-swd-minutes.html#action05]

15:50:36 [Clay]

--continues

15:50:44 [Clay]

ACTION: Ralph to come up with a URI for wiki page [for Recipes implementations] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/09-swd-minutes.html#action04]

15:50:46 [Clay]

--continues

15:50:56 [Clay]

ACTION: Ralph/Diego to work on Wordnet implementation [of Recipes] [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/09-swd-minutes.html#action03]

15:50:58 [Clay]

--continues

15:51:07 [Clay]

ACTION: TF leaders to prepare a version of Recipes for review in December [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/09-swd-minutes.html#action09]

15:51:08 [Clay]

--continues

15:51:22 [Clay]

ACTION: Guus/Tom to solicit reviewers for the Recipes document. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/09-swd-minutes.html#action08]

15:51:25 [Clay]

--continues

15:51:48 [JonP]

aliman, edsu: I'll put together an email to the list wrt inScheme deprecation feedback

15:51:51 [Clay]

ACTION: Dan to ask apache about conditional redirects [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/09-swd-minutes.html#action07]

15:51:56 [Clay]

--continues

15:52:08 [Clay]

Alistair's half of that task is done

15:52:14 [Clay]

TOPIC: Vocabulary management

15:52:26 [Clay]

ACTION: Vit and Elisa to include in the document all the target sections plus an allocation of sections to people and potentially a standard structure for sections [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/10/08-swd-minutes.html#action07]

15:52:34 [Clay]

--continues

15:55:59 [Guus]

q+

15:56:01 [edsu]

aliman's reference document: http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/SKOS/Reference

15:56:09 [Clay]

Alistair: talks in greater detail about the SKOS Reference, was SKOS Semantics, referenced earlier in the meeting. SKOS Semantics is deprecated.

15:57:01 [edsu]

JonP: thanks, that would be very useful for me here at LC

15:57:32 [Clay]

Guus: asking about Alistair's recording semantics in documents.

15:58:01 [Clay]

Alistair: didn't add them in verbatim from meeting, but made editorial adjustments

16:00:08 [Zakim]

-??P22

16:00:09 [Zakim]

-Quentin

16:00:10 [Zakim]

-vit

16:00:11 [Zakim]

-Aliman

16:00:12 [Zakim]

-Guus_Schreiber

16:00:13 [Clay]

meeting adjourned

16:00:13 [Zakim]

-Edsu

16:00:15 [Zakim]

-Antoine

16:00:16 [Zakim]

-JonP

16:00:18 [Zakim]

-seanb

16:00:28 [edsu]

Antoine: you still there?

16:00:38 [Tom]

zakim, who attended

16:00:38 [Zakim]

I don't understand 'who attended', Tom

16:00:46 [Clay]

zakim, list attendees

16:00:46 [Zakim]

As of this point the attendees have been Clay, Edsu, +20420aaaa, Antoine, vit, TomB, +012242aabb, Quentin, Aliman, seanb, Guus_Schreiber, JonP

16:01:47 [Tom]

rrsagent, please draft minutes

16:01:47 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/10/23-swd-minutes.html Tom

16:02:13 [edsu]

Antoine: i'm not on call either -- it's ok, i was wondering about a couple things 1) if you had played with lcsh/rameau/skos at all 2) if we need an action re: the primer

16:02:41 [Zakim]

-Clay

16:02:55 [Zakim]

-TomB

16:02:56 [Zakim]

SW_SWD()11:00AM has ended

16:02:57 [Zakim]

Attendees were Clay, Edsu, +20420aaaa, Antoine, vit, TomB, +012242aabb, Quentin, Aliman, seanb, Guus_Schreiber, JonP

16:03:55 [edsu]

Antoine: absolutely :)

16:04:20 [edsu]

Antoine: things are heating up here with respect to lcsh/skos -- so i'm likely to be doing some conversions in the next week or so

16:04:50 [edsu]

Antoine: i'll email you with any developments

16:05:22 [seanb]

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edsu has left #swd

16:06:53 [Antoine]

Antoine has left #swd