IRC log of owl on 2007-10-17

Timestamps are in UTC.

16:49:04 [RRSAgent]: RRSAgent has joined #owl
16:49:04 [RRSAgent]: logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/10/17-owl-irc
16:49:07 [Zakim]: Zakim has joined #owl
16:49:14 [sandro]: zakim, this will be owl
16:49:14 [Zakim]: ok, sandro; I see SW_OWL()1:00PM scheduled to start in 11 minutes
16:49:27 [bmotik]: bmotik has joined #owl
16:49:50 [Zakim]: SW_OWL()1:00PM has now started
16:49:57 [Zakim]: +Sandro
16:50:02 [sandro]: Meeting: OWL Working Group
16:50:17 [sandro]: Chair: Alan Ruttenberg, Ian Horrocks
16:50:34 [sandro]: RRSAgent, make record public
16:50:34 [Zakim]: +??P39
16:50:45 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
16:50:45 [Zakim]: sorry, bijan, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
16:50:52 [bijan]: zakim, ??p39 is me
16:50:52 [Zakim]: +bijan; got it
16:51:07 [FabianN]: FabianN has joined #owl
16:52:26 [achille]: achille has joined #owl
16:54:03 [Zakim]: +??P42
16:54:12 [Zakim]: +[IBM]
16:54:32 [sandro]: Zakim, ??P42 is Boris
16:54:32 [Zakim]: +Boris; got it
16:54:58 [sandro]: Zakim, IBM is temporarily Achille
16:54:58 [Zakim]: +Achille; got it
16:55:27 [MikeSmith]: MikeSmith has joined #owl
16:55:57 [MarkusK]: MarkusK has joined #owl
16:56:27 [Elisa]: Elisa has joined #owl
16:56:55 [vipul]: vipul has joined #owl
16:57:03 [Zakim]: +Alan_Ruttenberg
16:57:03 [bmotik]: Zakim, Boris is bmotik
16:57:04 [Zakim]: +bmotik; got it
16:57:05 [Zakim]: + +1.301.975.aaaa
16:57:17 [Zakim]: + +1.202.408.aabb
16:57:22 [Zakim]: -Alan_Ruttenberg
16:57:36 [alanr]: alanr has joined #owl
16:57:43 [Zakim]: +Elisa_Kendall
16:58:02 [sandro]: zakm, who is here?
16:58:13 [Zakim]: + +018652aacc
16:58:21 [Zakim]: +??P44
16:58:24 [Zakim]: +Vipul_Kashyap
16:58:25 [IanH]: IanH has joined #owl
16:58:28 [Zakim]: +Alan_Ruttenberg
16:58:32 [pfps]: zakim, ??p44 is me
16:58:32 [Zakim]: +pfps; got it
16:58:44 [sandro]: zakim, who is on the call?
16:58:44 [Zakim]: On the phone I see Sandro, bijan, bmotik, Achille, +1.301.975.aaaa, MikeSmith, Elisa_Kendall, +018652aacc, pfps, Vipul_Kashyap, Alan_Ruttenberg
16:59:58 [sandro]: Zakim, aaaa is Fabien
16:59:58 [Zakim]: +Fabien; got it
17:00:15 [bmotik]: bmotik has joined #owl
17:00:16 [Zakim]: +[IPcaller]
17:00:19 [jjc]: Zakim, IPCaller is me
17:00:19 [Zakim]: +jjc; got it
17:00:24 [sandro]: Zakim, aacc is Ian
17:00:24 [Zakim]: +Ian; got it
17:00:29 [jjc]: Zakim, mute me
17:00:29 [Zakim]: jjc should now be muted
17:00:29 [sandro]: zakim, who is on the call?
17:00:30 [Zakim]: On the phone I see Sandro, bijan, bmotik, Achille, Fabien, MikeSmith, Elisa_Kendall, Ian, pfps, Vipul_Kashyap, Alan_Ruttenberg, jjc (muted)
17:00:42 [pfps]: zakim, mute me
17:00:42 [Zakim]: pfps should now be muted
17:01:06 [JeffP]: JeffP has joined #owl
17:01:11 [pfps]: i'll volunteer
17:01:15 [jjc]: Note: I have not completed paperwork to join WG yet, technically I guess I am observer or something.
17:01:16 [pfps]: zakim, unmute me
17:01:16 [Zakim]: pfps should no longer be muted
17:01:18 [bmotik]: bmotik has joined #owl
17:01:20 [pfps]: zakim, mute me
17:01:20 [Zakim]: pfps should now be muted
17:01:37 [pfps]: what do I need to do to set up as scribe?
17:01:48 [bijan]: one sec
17:01:53 [sandro]: zakim, who is on the call?
17:01:53 [Zakim]: On the phone I see Sandro, bijan, bmotik, Achille, Fabien, MikeSmith, Elisa_Kendall, Ian, pfps (muted), Vipul_Kashyap, Alan_Ruttenberg, jjc (muted)
17:02:05 [Zakim]: + +012242aadd
17:02:09 [bmotik]: bmotik has joined #owl
17:02:15 [JeffP]: zakim, aadd is me
17:02:15 [Zakim]: +JeffP; got it
17:02:16 [Zakim]: +??P11
17:02:19 [ekw]: ekw has joined #owl
17:02:28 [achille]: achille has joined #owl
17:02:28 [bijan]: Peter, see: http://dev.w3.org/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
17:02:44 [pfps]: zakim, unmute me
17:02:44 [Zakim]: pfps should no longer be muted
17:03:50 [pfps]: zakim, this will be owl
17:03:50 [Zakim]: ok, pfps, I see SW_OWL()1:00PM already started
17:03:59 [bijan]: Here: http://dev.w3.org/2002/scribe/scribedoc.htm
17:04:29 [pfps]: Scribe: pfps
17:04:42 [pfps]: Scribe: Peter Patel-Schneider
17:04:47 [pfps]: ScribeNick: pfps
17:05:00 [pfps]: Meeting: OWL WG Teleconference
17:05:00 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
17:05:00 [Zakim]: bijan should now be muted
17:05:07 [bijan]: zakim, who's making noise
17:05:07 [Zakim]: I don't understand 'who's making noise', bijan
17:05:11 [Zakim]: +Evan_Wallace
17:05:15 [bijan]: zakim, noise
17:05:15 [Zakim]: I don't understand 'noise', bijan
17:05:30 [pfps]: Chair: Alan Ruttenberg
17:05:31 [jjc]: Zakim, who is speaking?
17:05:42 [Zakim]: jjc, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Alan_Ruttenberg (100%), Ian (32%), bmotik (4%)
17:05:50 [jjc]: q+ to note I am here before joining WG
17:06:03 [sandro]: zakim, who is on the call?
17:06:03 [Zakim]: On the phone I see Sandro, bijan (muted), bmotik, Achille, Fabien, MikeSmith, Elisa_Kendall, Ian, pfps, Vipul_Kashyap, Alan_Ruttenberg, jjc (muted), JeffP, MarkusK (muted),
17:06:06 [Zakim]: ... Evan_Wallace
17:06:33 [sandro]: Topic: Roll Call
17:06:34 [bmotik]: Zakim, mute me
17:06:34 [Zakim]: bmotik should now be muted
17:06:38 [sandro]: zakim, who is on the call?
17:06:38 [Zakim]: On the phone I see Sandro, bijan (muted), bmotik (muted), Achille, Fabien, MikeSmith, Elisa_Kendall, Ian, pfps, Vipul_Kashyap, Alan_Ruttenberg, jjc (muted), JeffP, MarkusK (muted),
17:06:42 [Zakim]: ... Evan_Wallace
17:07:17 [jjc]: Zakim, uniute me
17:07:17 [Zakim]: I don't understand 'uniute me', jjc
17:07:17 [JeffP]: q?
17:07:24 [sandro]: ack jjc
17:07:25 [Zakim]: jjc, you wanted to note I am here before joining WG
17:07:34 [FabianN]: zakim, could you mute me, too?
17:07:34 [Zakim]: I don't understand your question, FabianN.
17:07:57 [JeffP]: zakim, mute FabianN
17:07:57 [Zakim]: sorry, JeffP, I do not know which phone connection belongs to FabianN
17:08:07 [jjc]: Zakim, mute me
17:08:07 [Zakim]: jjc should now be muted
17:08:12 [pfps]: jjc: not a member of the WG
17:08:20 [pfps]: sandro: jjc is invited
17:08:23 [sandro]: jjc is Jeremy Carroll of HP
17:08:23 [FabianN]: zakim, mute me
17:08:23 [Zakim]: sorry, FabianN, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
17:08:31 [pfps]: Topic: Agenda amendments
17:08:51 [pfps]: ianh: no amendments
17:09:04 [pfps]: Topc: Accept minutes
17:09:15 [sandro]: Topic: Accept Minutes
17:09:21 [pfps]: ianh: any corrections to minutes?
17:09:57 [pfps]: pfps has joined #owl
17:09:59 [sandro]: PROPOSED: Accept Previous Minutes: http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Teleconference.2007.10.10/Minutes
17:10:11 [sandro]: RESOLVED: Accept Previous Minutes: http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/Teleconference.2007.10.10/Minutes
17:10:40 [pfps]: Topic: Action items status
17:11:24 [pfps]: alan: action1 (login alignment) still in progress
17:11:37 [pfps]: ianh: action item 2 html is possible
17:11:46 [vipul]: q+ login alignment
17:11:58 [pfps]: ianh: action item 3 comments on RIF BLD done
17:11:58 [sandro]: Peter's comments <http://www.w3.org/mid/20071016.102615.212787570.pfps@research.bell-labs.com>
17:12:07 [pfps]: Topic: Charter Review
17:12:27 [pfps]: ianh: assumption is that everyone has read all the documents (including the charter)
17:12:50 [pfps]: ianh: quick run-through of charter followed by discussion
17:13:15 [pfps]: ianh: scope of WG is extensions to OWL (logic, datatypes, expressive power)
17:13:31 [pfps]: ianh: plus language fragment definition
17:13:44 [pfps]: ianh: OWL 1.1 submission is starting point
17:14:01 [pfps]: ianh: starting issue list is OWL 1.1. issue list plus postponed issues from WebOnt
17:14:09 [bijan]: q+ to talk about backwards compat
17:14:14 [pfps]: ianh: backwards compatability is important
17:14:35 [pfps]: ianh: feature addition is to be conservative
17:14:39 [alanr]: alanr has joined #owl
17:14:41 [alanr]: here now
17:15:00 [sandro]: welcome, Alan-on-IRC :-)
17:15:04 [alanr]: zakim, mute me
17:15:04 [Zakim]: Alan_Ruttenberg should now be muted
17:15:18 [bijan]: Structural specification
17:15:38 [pfps]: ianh: deliverables (not necessary documents) - overview, requirements, formal spec (3 docs), outreach (...), test suite, language fragments
17:15:48 [pfps]: ianh: XML exchange syntax also possible deliverable
17:16:13 [pfps]: ianh: timeline is quite tight, first documents beginning of Feb
17:16:48 [pfps]: ianh: last call august 2008, ...,
17:17:05 [pfps]: ianh: first F2F is december
17:17:17 [pfps]: ianh: dependencies from other workings groups (on agenda)
17:17:38 [bijan]: zakim, unmute me
17:17:38 [Zakim]: bijan should no longer be muted
17:17:40 [JeffP]: q?
17:17:41 [sandro]: RRSAgent, make minutes
17:17:41 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/10/17-owl-minutes.html sandro
17:17:44 [alanr]: q?
17:17:59 [sandro]: RRSAgent, make record public
17:18:38 [alanr]: question, or discussion point?
17:18:43 [pfps]: bijan: backwards compability is good but not absolute
17:18:58 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
17:18:58 [Zakim]: bijan should now be muted
17:19:01 [sandro]: q?
17:19:12 [bijan]: q-
17:19:20 [bijan]: q-
17:19:23 [alanr]: q-
17:19:24 [pfps]: ianh: let's not make a decision, but make it a case by case basis
17:19:25 [sandro]: q- login
17:19:30 [sandro]: q- alignment
17:19:43 [alanr]: a+
17:19:44 [alanr]: q+
17:19:56 [bijan]: This is off topic, isn't it?
17:19:59 [pfps]: vipul: multiple wikis (W3C and ESW) mean multiple logins, can they be aligned?
17:20:08 [pfps]: sandro: no
17:20:29 [alanr]: zakim, unmute me
17:20:29 [Zakim]: Alan_Ruttenberg should no longer be muted
17:20:38 [jjc]: q+ to suggest backward compatibility will resolve itself
17:20:49 [IanH]: ?q
17:20:55 [sandro]: Present: Sandro, Bijan, bmotik, Achille, Fabien, MikeSmith, Elisa_Kendall, Ian, pfps, Vipul_Kashyap, Alan_Ruttenberg, jjc, JeffP, MarkusK, Evan_Wallace
17:21:00 [IanH]: q?
17:21:04 [jjc]: q-
17:21:08 [alanr]: zakim, mute me
17:21:08 [Zakim]: Alan_Ruttenberg should now be muted
17:21:11 [pfps]: alanr: questions on charter need resolution in the future, e.g., backwards compatability
17:21:14 [alanr]: q- alanr
17:21:17 [jjc]: ack
17:21:22 [IanH]: q?
17:21:25 [Zakim]: -Vipul_Kashyap
17:21:43 [alanr]: it's in the charter already
17:21:50 [alanr]: no need to put it on the queue
17:21:51 [Zakim]: +Vipul_Kashyap
17:22:01 [sandro]: RRSAgent, make minutes
17:22:01 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/10/17-owl-minutes.html sandro
17:22:12 [bijan]: +1 to ianh saying "wait until backwards compt comes up to discuss it"
17:22:25 [achille]: +1 to ianh
17:22:38 [sandro]: Ian: Let's not talk about Backward Compatibility until we come up with a specific instance of a question about it? Any objections? No.....
17:22:39 [pfps]: Topic: Deliverables
17:22:52 [bijan]: I just wanted to make sure it was *open* so that we *will* have that discussion rather
17:23:09 [pfps]: sandro: w3c has software for tracking issues and action items (TRACKER)
17:23:22 [sandro]: trackbot-ng, help
17:23:22 [trackbot-ng]: See http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/ for help (use the IRC bot link)
17:23:49 [alanr]: zakim, unmute me
17:23:49 [Zakim]: Alan_Ruttenberg should no longer be muted
17:23:50 [sandro]: http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/wiki/OWL_Working_Group
17:24:10 [pfps]: sandro: trackbot-ng sits on the IRC and records things
17:24:29 [pfps]: sandro: the owl wg home page has a pointer to the information gathered
17:25:23 [pfps]: sandro: the web page allows management of actions and issues
17:26:18 [pfps]: sandro: products (documents or tasks) are linked to issues and actions
17:26:22 [bmotik]: bmotik has joined #owl
17:26:48 [bijan]: I got an email
17:26:55 [sandro]: http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/tracker/
17:26:59 [bijan]: With: Subject: ISSUE-1 (test): Test Issue
17:27:13 [bijan]: I see the webpage too
17:28:15 [pfps]: sandro: using the names of issues, (actions, etc) verbatim (ALLCAPS-#) in email links them in
17:28:59 [pfps]: sandro: wiki integration is not yet available (but might be coming)
17:29:28 [pfps]: ianh: are we going to use this?
17:29:41 [bijan]: zakim, unmute me
17:29:41 [Zakim]: bijan should no longer be muted
17:29:46 [pfps]: alan: PROPOSED: move all current issues to trackbot
17:29:46 [alanr]: PROPOSED Move current issues to tracker
17:30:04 [pfps]: sandro: there was discussion of this offline
17:30:17 [pfps]: bijan: let's discuss this on email
17:31:02 [pfps]: sandro: one issue is that it would be nice to have proposed issues and accepted issues
17:31:03 [alanr]: ok. wait one week. withdraw proposed
17:31:14 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
17:31:14 [Zakim]: bijan should now be muted
17:31:45 [pfps]: alanr: will there be an open-to-the-world issues list?
17:31:51 [bijan]: Isn't that what I'm sending email about?
17:32:05 [alanr]: yes
17:32:09 [alanr]: +1
17:32:10 [pfps]: sandro: interest but no decision yet
17:32:26 [pfps]: ianh: for next week's agenda: discuss this
17:32:36 [pfps]: Topic: Publication Schedule
17:32:53 [pfps]: sandro: process requirements for WGs
17:33:38 [sandro]: Sandro: Very roughly, our job, as a W3C Working Group, is to create specifications which everyone in the world regards as "good enough". ("Good enough", perhaps to by not worthwhile to produce a competing spec.)
17:33:43 [sandro]: Sandro: The W3C process has evolved over the past ~13 years to help us achieve this goal.
17:33:49 [trackbot-ng]: trackbot-ng has joined #owl
17:33:49 [sandro]: Sandro: Step 1 - we come up with a design that's a starting point; ask the world for input. (First Public Working Draft - WD1)
17:33:55 [trackbot-ng]: Tracking ISSUEs and ACTIONs from http://www.w3.org/2007/OWL/tracker/
17:34:06 [sandro]: Sandro: Step 2 - we iterate the design until we think it's good enough (more Working Drafts, Last Call Working Draft - LC)
17:34:31 [sandro]: Sandro: Step 3 - we incorporate any LC feedback to produce an even better spec, and ask for people to implement it. (Candidate Recommendation - CR)
17:35:06 [sandro]: Sandro: Step 5 - once there is proof of interoperability, we incorporate feedback into another draft (Proposed Recommendation - PR)
17:35:27 [sandro]: Sandro: Step 6 - the PR is evaluated by W3C members; if they approve, it becomes a Recommendation (REC).
17:35:54 [sandro]: Sandro: If a problem comes up in the later stages, we may have to go back to step 2, iterating the design some more.
17:36:11 [jjc]: q+ to comment on step 6
17:36:18 [alanr]: qq?
17:36:21 [alanr]: q?
17:36:27 [jjc]: Zakim, unmute me
17:36:27 [Zakim]: jjc should no longer be muted
17:36:28 [sandro]: ack Jjc
17:36:29 [Zakim]: jjc, you wanted to comment on step 6
17:37:13 [pfps]: jjc: step 6 is not a note, but something different involving the director
17:37:21 [pfps]: s/note/vote
17:37:34 [pfps]: sandro: no observable differences yet
17:38:55 [pfps]: sandro: there is internal consultation within the W3C staff to make decisions
17:38:59 [jjc]: Zakim, mute me
17:38:59 [Zakim]: jjc should now be muted
17:39:32 [pfps]: PROPOSED: Our first working drafts are: Structural Specification, Semantics, RDF Mapping
17:39:48 [bijan]: q+ to say we should publish earlier than F2F
17:40:07 [pfps]: alanr: this means focussing on the core documents, not to say that the current versions are what the first working draft would be
17:40:15 [jjc]: Comment: it would be more usual to publish requirements before the answers ...
17:40:22 [bijan]: zakim, unmute me
17:40:22 [Zakim]: bijan should no longer be muted
17:40:29 [alanr]: q?
17:40:40 [alanr]: ack bijan
17:40:40 [Zakim]: bijan, you wanted to say we should publish earlier than F2F
17:40:42 [pfps]: bijan: working drafts are not commitments
17:41:03 [pfps]: bijan: we should publish working drafts before the F2F
17:41:35 [pfps]: bijan: this makes transition from webont.org to w3c space
17:41:57 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
17:41:57 [Zakim]: bijan should now be muted
17:42:03 [pfps]: bijan: PROPOSE making the documents as WDs ASAP
17:42:16 [bijan]: yes
17:42:19 [bijan]: zakim, unmute me
17:42:19 [Zakim]: bijan should no longer be muted
17:42:34 [pfps]: alanr: two steps in resolution 1/ are these docs OK for WDs, 2/ when to publish
17:42:53 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
17:42:53 [Zakim]: bijan should now be muted
17:43:01 [jjc]: q+ to note requirements logically precede
17:43:06 [bijan]: zakim, unmute me
17:43:06 [Zakim]: bijan should no longer be muted
17:43:07 [pfps]: RESOLUTION: existing webont documents are first WDs (appropriately edited)
17:43:08 [jjc]: Zakim, unmute me
17:43:08 [Zakim]: jjc should no longer be muted
17:43:37 [sandro]: NOT RESOLVED
17:43:44 [vipul]: q+
17:43:44 [pfps]: s/RESOLUTION/PROPOSED/
17:43:44 [vipul]: q+
17:43:48 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
17:43:48 [Zakim]: bijan should now be muted
17:44:08 [IanH]: PROPOSED: Our first working drafts are: Structural Specification, Semantics, RDF Mapping
17:44:46 [sandro]: this is as-per http://www.webont.org/owl/1.1/ ?
17:45:14 [pfps]: jjc: deliverables have a requirements document, which logically should preceed the technical document
17:45:16 [jjc]: Requirements:
17:45:16 [jjc]: A description of the goals and requirements that have motivated the design of OWL 1.1.
17:45:33 [sandro]: ie http://www.webont.org/owl/1.1/owl_specification.html http://www.webont.org/owl/1.1/semantics.html and http://www.webont.org/owl/1.1/rdf_mapping.html
17:46:08 [bijan]: q+
17:46:18 [Zakim]: -Alan_Ruttenberg
17:46:19 [JeffP]: zakim, who is talking
17:46:19 [Zakim]: I don't understand 'who is talking', JeffP
17:46:41 [pfps]: alanr: jeremy, would doing things with requirements later damage our process
17:46:44 [sandro]: q?
17:46:47 [IanH]: Note: charter says that requirements are "A description of the goals and requirements that have motivated the design of OWL 1.1"
17:46:49 [sandro]: ack jjc
17:46:49 [Zakim]: jjc, you wanted to note requirements logically precede
17:47:01 [Zakim]: +Alan_Ruttenberg
17:47:35 [pfps]: ianh: charter says that requirement doc is a description of how owl 1.1 was developed
17:47:37 [JeffP]: +1 IanH
17:47:52 [jjc]: Zakim, mute me
17:47:52 [Zakim]: jjc should now be muted
17:47:54 [IanH]: q?
17:47:55 [sandro]: ack vipul
17:48:14 [bijan]: -1 to internal review
17:48:26 [pfps]: vipul: shouldn't there be an internal review before the WDs are published
17:49:43 [IanH]: q?
17:50:30 [pfps]: vipul: my votes on other issues depend on this issue
17:50:43 [bijan]: zakim, unmute me
17:50:43 [Zakim]: bijan should no longer be muted
17:51:17 [pfps]: bijan: first WG is first *public* WD
17:51:39 [pfps]: ianh: can we move the documents to editor's drafts to have the same effect
17:52:04 [pfps]: alanr: Q1 are the three documents the ones to target for first WDs
17:52:25 [sandro]: PROPOSED-1 :Our first working drafts, to be published before the 3-month heartbeat, will be: Structural Specification, Semantics, RDF Mapping, based closely on http://www.webont.org/owl/1.1/
17:52:26 [pfps]: alanr: Q2 when should we make the three documents be WDs
17:52:32 [ekw]: +q
17:53:08 [IanH]: ?q
17:53:16 [sandro]: PROPOSED: Our first working drafts, to be published before the 3-month heartbeat, will be: Structural Specification, Semantics, RDF Mapping, based on the text for each of these at http://www.webont.org/owl/1.1/
17:53:55 [jjc]: q+ to suggest s/will be:/will be one or more of:/
17:53:57 [sandro]: PROPOSED: Our first working drafts, to be published before the 3-month heartbeat, will be: (1) Structural Specification, (2) Semantics, (3) RDF Mapping, based on the text for each of these at http://www.webont.org/owl/1.1/
17:53:58 [pfps]: bijan: there was requirements work going into owl 1.1, but no doc was make
17:54:08 [sandro]: s/make/made
17:54:26 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
17:54:26 [sandro]: zakim, who is talking?
17:54:27 [pfps]: bijan: putting requirements doc first would significantly delay technical work
17:54:27 [Zakim]: bijan should now be muted
17:54:41 [Zakim]: sandro, listening for 12 seconds I heard sound from the following: Alan_Ruttenberg (42%), Sandro (87%)
17:54:44 [bijan]: No
17:55:02 [jjc]: Zakim, unmute me
17:55:02 [Zakim]: jjc should no longer be muted
17:55:11 [sandro]: Evan: Are we implying that SS fills the role of the descriptive spec?
17:55:36 [bijan]: I do think we might evolve the structural specification toward a descriptive as well a formal specification, but that's a distinct decision.
17:55:47 [sandro]: Ian: No -- we're implying that these three dovument form the technical spec
17:56:11 [sandro]: s/dovu/docu/
17:56:13 [sandro]: q?
17:56:18 [sandro]: ack bijan
17:56:22 [sandro]: ack ekw
17:56:24 [sandro]: ack jjc
17:56:24 [Zakim]: jjc, you wanted to suggest s/will be:/will be one or more of:/
17:56:44 [sandro]: PROPOSED: Our first working drafts, to be published before the 3-month heartbeat, will be one or more of: (1) Structural Specification, (2) Semantics, (3) RDF Mapping, based on the text for each of these at http://www.webont.org/owl/1.1/
17:57:24 [sandro]: PROPOSED: Our first working drafts, to be published before the 3-month heartbeat, will be one: (1) Structural Specification, (2) Semantics. We may include (3) RDF Mapping in this list. These are based on the text for each of these at http://www.webont.org/owl/1.1/
17:57:32 [bijan]: The current docuemnts are already hugely public. Publishing as WD does not endorse the current design. We know it will changed. We know all three will be changed. Many times.
17:57:59 [sandro]: jjc: HP may object to (3), so let's make it optional.
17:58:39 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
17:58:39 [Zakim]: bijan should now be muted
17:58:41 [sandro]: RESOLVED: Our first working drafts, to be published before the 3-month heartbeat, will be one: (1) Structural Specification, (2) Semantics. We may include (3) RDF Mapping in this list. These are based on the text for each of these at http://www.webont.org/owl/1.1/
17:58:59 [bijan]: Which discussion?
17:59:06 [Zakim]: -Vipul_Kashyap
17:59:23 [bijan]: +1 to proposing discussion of document roles and task forces to next week
17:59:27 [bijan]: q+
17:59:28 [IanH]: +1
17:59:31 [sandro]: Alan: next topic was to be authors/editors role, task areas.... I propose we put these off until next week.
17:59:34 [pfps]: pfps has joined #owl
17:59:35 [bijan]: zakim, unmute me
17:59:35 [Zakim]: bijan should no longer be muted
17:59:35 [Elisa]: +1
17:59:40 [sandro]: ack bijan
17:59:44 [pfps]: q?
18:00:17 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
18:00:17 [Zakim]: bijan should now be muted
18:00:18 [ekw]: +1 on Bijan's suggestion for email discussion of postponed items
18:00:21 [sandro]: Bijan: When we postpone things, let's talk about it on the mailing list.
18:00:35 [bijan]: zakim, unmute me
18:00:35 [Zakim]: bijan should no longer be muted
18:00:39 [sandro]: Alan: I can create the draft of the next agenda early, and send that out, to help start discussion.
18:00:50 [sandro]: Bijan: It doesn't need to be the whole agenda, although that's fine.
18:00:50 [bijan]: zakim, mute me
18:00:50 [Zakim]: bijan should now be muted
18:00:50 [bmotik]: E-mail discussions can be tedious, though.
18:00:59 [IanH]: +1
18:01:05 [bijan]: There's a secodn proposal
18:01:18 [Zakim]: -Evan_Wallace
18:01:18 [JeffP]: +1 bye
18:01:20 [Zakim]: -jjc
18:01:23 [Zakim]: -MikeSmith
18:01:24 [MarkusK]: bye
18:01:24 [Zakim]: -Fabien
18:01:25 [sandro]: decision to adjourn, as per Alan's proposal.
18:01:25 [Zakim]: -Elisa_Kendall
18:01:26 [Zakim]: -bijan
18:01:27 [sandro]: ADJOURN
18:01:28 [Zakim]: -JeffP
18:01:28 [Zakim]: -Alan_Ruttenberg
18:01:30 [Zakim]: -Ian
18:01:33 [Zakim]: -MarkusK
18:01:41 [Zakim]: -bmotik
18:01:42 [bijan]: So we postpone the second decision as well?
18:01:42 [Zakim]: -Achille
18:02:00 [sandro]: I guess so, Bijan! Oops.
18:02:09 [sandro]: RRSAgent, make minutes
18:02:09 [RRSAgent]: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/10/17-owl-minutes.html sandro
18:02:25 [bijan]: I was trying to unmute to point this out when everyone bailed :)
18:02:56 [bijan]: How about I send an email about this?
18:02:59 [bijan]: Since it's my proposal?
18:04:08 [Zakim]: -Sandro
18:04:12 [Zakim]: -pfps
18:04:13 [Zakim]: SW_OWL()1:00PM has ended
18:04:14 [Zakim]: Attendees were Sandro, bijan, Achille, Alan_Ruttenberg, bmotik, +1.301.975.aaaa, Elisa_Kendall, MikeSmith, +018652aacc, Vipul_Kashyap, pfps, Fabien, jjc, Ian, +012242aadd, JeffP,
18:04:16 [Zakim]: ... MarkusK, Evan_Wallace
18:04:26 [sandro]: I think that makes sense.
18:04:33 [bijan]: Doing so
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