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14:48:46 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/09/27-rdfa-irc
14:48:57 <Steven> rrsagent, make log public
14:49:06 <Steven> zakim, this will be rdfa
14:49:06 <Zakim> ok, Steven; I see SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM scheduled to start in 11 minutes
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14:58:55 <ShaneM> ShaneM has joined #rdfa
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14:59:44 <RalphS> Meeting: RDFa Task Force
15:00:23 <Zakim> SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM has now started
15:00:24 <RalphS> -> http://www.w3.org/2007/09/20-rdfa-minutes.html previous 2007-09-20
15:00:30 <Zakim> +ShaneM
15:00:44 <RalphS> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Sep/0242.html
15:02:00 <msporny> msporny has joined #rdfa
15:02:31 <Zakim> +??P15
15:03:09 <Zakim> +Ralph
15:03:34 <RalphS> zakim, ??p15 is Manu
15:03:34 <Zakim> +Manu; got it
15:04:01 <benadida> benadida has joined #rdfa
15:04:23 <Zakim> +benadida
15:04:31 <benadida> zakim, who is on the call?
15:04:32 <Zakim> On the phone I see ShaneM, Manu, Ralph, benadida
15:06:28 <markbirbeck> markbirbeck has joined #rdfa
15:06:37 <markbirbeck> zakim, code?
15:06:37 <Zakim> the conference code is 7332 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck
15:06:52 <RalphS> Regrets: Michael
15:06:55 <RalphS> Chair: Ben
15:08:02 <Steven> zakim, dial steven-617
15:08:02 <Zakim> ok, Steven; the call is being made
15:08:04 <Zakim> +Steven
15:08:34 <Zakim> +??P31
15:08:40 <markbirbeck> zakim, i am ?
15:08:40 <Zakim> +markbirbeck; got it
15:09:49 <benadida> zakim, pick a victim
15:09:49 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Steven
15:10:02 <Steven> Scribe: Steven
15:10:29 <Steven> Topic: Action Items
15:10:29 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/2007/09/20-rdfa-minutes.html#ActionSummary
15:11:22 <Steven> ACTION: Manu draft some partitioning language that is technology-neutral [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/09/20-rdfa-minutes.html#action14]
15:11:29 <Steven> -- done
15:11:41 <Steven> Manu: Is it worked in?
15:11:44 <Steven> Mark: Yes, sort of
15:12:12 <Steven> ACTION: Ben to look into Science Commons use case [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/11-htmltf-minutes.html#action04]
15:12:16 <Steven> -- pending
15:12:28 <Steven> ACTION: Ben, Mark, Elias, and other implementors to add xml:lang support [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html#action11]
15:12:38 <Steven> -- pending
15:12:59 <Steven> ACTION: Michael look for a more semantically correct predicate for tests 42-45 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/09/06-rdfa-minutes.html#action14]
15:13:02 <Steven> --pending
15:13:11 <Steven> ACTION: Michael make sure to confirm a design for checking that the ASK SPARQL queries evaluate (yes/no) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/09/06-rdfa-minutes.html#action07]
15:13:13 <Steven> -- pending
15:13:22 <Steven> ACTION: Michael to create "Microformats done right -- unambiguous taxonomies via RDF" on the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/08/23-rdfa-minutes.html#action06]
15:13:24 <Steven> -- pending
15:13:53 <Steven> Ben: I'm working through some issues this week, but we're making progress
15:14:00 <Steven> Topic: FtF Planning
15:14:17 <Steven> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/AmsterdamAgenda
15:14:51 <Steven> ACTION: Ben to remind the WG reviewers about FtF
15:15:40 <Steven> s/FtF/review for FtF/
15:15:51 <Steven> q+
15:16:11 <Steven> Ben: Mark will lead the discussion, it will be Monday morning
15:16:15 <benadida> agenda for f2f: http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/AmsterdamAgenda
15:16:46 <Steven> Ben: I hope you will demo some stuff
15:17:40 <msporny> q+
15:18:01 <Steven> Ben: Shane, you are joining by phone?
15:18:09 <Steven> Shane: My plan, but I need to see a schedule
15:18:15 <Steven> Ben: Ralph, going?
15:18:23 <Steven> Ralph: Not sure yet
15:18:35 <Steven> Manu: Mark, beware of live demos
15:19:20 <Steven> Steven: Yes, I had a similar problem yesterday at a talk
15:19:57 <Steven> Ben: Please demo my clipboard if you have time
15:19:59 <msporny> q-
15:23:17 <msporny> q+
15:23:50 <Steven> q-
15:24:29 <Steven> [Discussion of current uses of RDFa]
15:24:46 <msporny> q-
15:26:39 <Steven> Topic: Status of Implementations
15:27:25 <RalphS> q+
15:27:45 <Steven> Ben: We need this information to show that there is progress
15:30:15 <Steven> Mark: My implementation is coming on nicely
15:30:32 <Steven> ... the RDFa part needs to be modularised still
15:30:42 <Steven> ... so that people could pick it up separately
15:30:49 <msporny> q+
15:30:50 <Steven> Ben: Is it a part of Sidewinder?
15:31:00 <Steven> Mark: No, it is 3 or 4 javascript files
15:31:04 <Steven> ... in libXH
15:31:09 <Steven> ... as I call it
15:31:18 <Steven> Ben: Can it manage the test cases?
15:31:20 <Steven> Mark: Yep
15:31:34 <Steven> Ben: We have Ivan's Distiller
15:32:23 <Steven> ... Elias's Pythion implementation, not up to date
15:32:29 <Steven> ... there is Operator
15:32:34 <Steven> Manu: Not up to date yet
15:33:14 <Steven> s/Distiller/Distiller, up to date/
15:33:39 <Steven> Manu: Operator will be in Firefox 3, and then in SOngbird
15:33:49 <Steven> ... so RDFGa will be just there
15:33:53 <Steven> s/SO/So/
15:34:04 <Steven> s/RDFGa/RDFa/
15:34:28 <Steven> Ben: My Javascript implementation is not yet up to date
15:34:41 <Steven> ... the bookmarklet
15:34:55 <Steven> ... then RDFa Monkey, I don't know the state
15:35:28 <RalphS> -> http://www.avthasselt.sohosted.com/rdfamonkey/ RDFa monkey
15:35:37 <Steven> ... Fabien's XSLT, it is up to date, modulo a whitespace issue
15:36:14 <RalphS> (RDFa monkey home page cites Elias' test files, not the more recent ones)
15:36:22 <Steven> ACTION: Ben to add implementations page to RDFa.info
15:36:38 <benadida> implementations -> http://esw.w3.org/topic/RDFa#head-681001ee6c73e87bd692e29693b3904e462fd9f2
15:36:40 <Steven> Ben: there are some other implementations, Java and Python
15:38:36 <Steven> Manu: How about IE? I heard they are adding microformats
15:39:00 <Steven> Shane: How about Chris Wilson?
15:39:15 <Steven> Ben: Do you want to talk to him?
15:39:32 <Steven> ACTION: Shane to contact Chris Wilson
15:39:34 <Steven> \--done
15:39:37 <Steven> -- done
15:39:52 <RalphS> -> http://esw.w3.org/topic/RDFa list of some RDFa implementations
15:43:13 <Steven> Topic: Status of Test Cases
15:43:20 <Steven> Ben: Deferred til next time
15:43:25 <Steven> s/til/till/
15:44:05 <Steven> Ben: Isee your message about href everywhere Shane
15:44:11 <Steven> ... we did resolve to accept that
15:44:27 <Steven> Shane: Yes, and I have today fixed that
15:45:07 <Steven> Ben: Should we update the editor's draft and tell the reviewers?
15:45:13 <Steven> Ralph: It would be good
15:45:39 <Steven> Shane: I made a couple of editorial fixes too
15:45:52 <Steven> ACTION: Shane to send a link to Ben
15:46:06 <Steven> s/link/link to new editor's draft/
15:46:30 <Steven> Topic: XHTML1.1 Namespace for rels
15:46:30 <Steven> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-in-xhtml-tf/2007Sep/0216
15:46:52 <Steven> Ben: There is a problem that the XHTML namespace doesn't end with a hash or slash
15:48:20 <Steven> Mark: In the section on unprefixed values, I say that it uses the XHTML namespace with a hash on the end
15:48:42 <Steven> ... but we should move away from the idea that these are namespaces
15:49:13 <Steven> ... so we are not talking about changing the XHTML namespace, but defining the prefix
15:49:57 <Steven> ... but there is a problem with overlap with the role attribute
15:50:22 <Steven> ... they are so close, they ought to use the same system
15:50:45 <Steven> Shane: There can't be multiple default prefixes for CURIES
15:51:23 <Steven> Ben: But rel can have a magic property using reserved words
15:52:28 <Steven> Steven: I would be happy if we could avoid special rules and magic
15:53:15 <Steven> Ben: I think it is a special case because of backwards compatibility
15:53:30 <Steven> ... rel="foobar" is not even allowed
15:53:41 <Steven> Mark: It is if you have a @profile
15:54:01 <Steven> ... so there are docs with a profile, with non-HTML rels
15:54:07 <Steven> ... and quite valid therefore
15:54:55 <Steven> Ben: So the specific issue
15:55:19 <Steven> ... we do need a default prefix URL, alsoi that ends in a hash or slash
15:55:52 <Steven> Steven: Why does it matter?
15:56:09 <Steven> Mark: Because of round-tripping, which strictly RDF doesn't support
15:56:33 <Steven> ... but is a sort of standard practice
15:56:56 <Steven> .. in one case we would have the concept of xhtmlnext, as opposed to xhtml:next
15:57:12 <Steven> ... it is only convention
15:57:20 <Steven> s/.. in/... in/
15:59:44 <Steven> Ralph: I like the idea of Shane's to use Apache redirecting to redirect xhtmlnext to something else
16:00:34 <Steven> Mark: WHy do we care; we can add a hash without a problem
16:00:46 <Steven> s/WH/Wh/
16:01:28 <Steven> Mark: We can add the relations to their own subnamespace
16:01:37 <Steven> ... otherwise just straght to the XHTML namespace
16:02:08 <Steven> s/strag/straig/
16:02:13 <benadida> example http://creativecommons.org/ns#
16:02:24 <Steven> Ben: THat is the CC namesapce
16:02:28 <RalphS> Shane: XHTML already has things under xhtml/ so I would expect objections to  the simple concatenation xhtmlnext
16:02:30 <Steven> s/TH/Th/
16:03:00 <benadida> /1999/xhtml/ns#
16:03:50 <Steven> Mark: In the Modularization schemas we have 1999/xhtml/datatypes
16:04:03 <benadida> /1999/xhtml/vocab#
16:04:11 <benadida> /1999/xhtml/?#
16:04:12 <Steven> ... so we could have 1999/xhtml/vocab# or something
16:04:41 <Steven> Ben: I like the word vocab as being general
16:04:53 <Steven> ... anyone object?
16:05:16 <Steven> SHane: Mostly harmless
16:05:21 <Steven> s/SH/Sh/
16:07:00 <benadida> PROPOSE that we use 1999/xhtml/vocab# as the prefix for next, prev, etc...
16:07:31 <Steven> Ben: Deciding about nofollow is another issue
16:07:52 <Steven> Ralph: Second
16:07:58 <Steven> Ben: Opposed?
16:08:50 <Steven> Mark: We can't speak for the whole XHTML2 WG, but I think it is the best option
16:08:58 <Steven> Mark: +1 to it
16:09:20 <Steven> RESOLUTION:  that we use 1999/xhtml/vocab# as the prefix for next, prev, etc..
16:09:56 <ShaneM> New draft of rdfa-syntax is at http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/2007/ED-rdfa-syntax-20070927/ 
16:10:19 <Steven> Ben: This doesn't solve the issue of whether we should special-case the the legacy rels
16:10:26 <Steven> ... we'll treat that another week
16:10:32 <Steven> ADJOURN
16:10:39 <Zakim> -markbirbeck
16:10:42 <Zakim> -Ralph
16:10:43 <Zakim> -Manu
16:10:44 <Zakim> -Steven
16:10:46 <Zakim> -ShaneM
16:11:04 <Zakim> -benadida
16:11:05 <Zakim> SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM has ended
16:11:06 <Zakim> Attendees were ShaneM, Ralph, Manu, benadida, Steven, markbirbeck
16:11:09 <Steven> rrsagent, make minutes
16:11:09 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/09/27-rdfa-minutes.html Steven
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