14:55:55 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #swd
14:55:55 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-irc
14:56:00 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #swd
14:56:03 <RalphS> zakim, this is swd
14:56:03 <Zakim> ok, RalphS; that matches SW_SWD()11:00AM
14:56:06 <RalphS> zakim, who's on the call?
14:56:06 <Zakim> On the phone I see ??P10, [LC]
14:56:14 <RalphS> Meeting: SWD WG
14:56:19 <aliman> aliman has joined #swd
14:56:24 <RalphS> rrsagent, please make record public
14:56:50 <RalphS> -> http://www.w3.org/2007/07/10-swd-minutes.html previous 2007-07-10
14:57:10 <RalphS> RalphS has changed the topic to: SWD WG 17 July agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Jul/0104.html
14:57:13 <Zakim> +??P7
14:58:00 <TomB> Scribe: Clay
14:58:04 <TomB> scribenick: Clay
14:58:34 <Zakim> +[LC]
15:00:02 <Zakim> +??P2
15:00:05 <dlrubin> dlrubin has joined #swd
15:00:19 <Elisa> Elisa has joined #swd
15:00:26 <Zakim> +Ralph
15:00:50 <RalphS> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Jul/0104.html
15:01:08 <RalphS> Chair: Tom
15:01:12 <Zakim> +[LC]
15:01:32 <Simone> Simone has joined #swd
15:01:35 <RalphS> zakim, lc is Justin
15:01:35 <Zakim> +Justin; got it
15:01:55 <Antoine> Antoine has joined #swd
15:02:05 <JonP> JonP has joined #swd
15:02:08 <Zakim> +Elisa_Kendall
15:02:09 <Zakim> +CarlosI
15:02:23 <berrueta> Zakim: CarlosI is me
15:02:23 <RalphS> zakim, carlos is really Diego
15:02:24 <Zakim> +Diego; got it
15:02:41 <vit> vit has joined #swd
15:02:59 <Zakim> +Antoine_Isaac
15:03:13 <Zakim> +Jon_Phipps
15:03:35 <JonP> zakim, Jon_Phipps is me
15:03:35 <Zakim> +JonP; got it
15:03:43 <Clay> Topic: Admin
15:03:53 <Zakim> +??P27
15:04:01 <RalphS> zakim, ??p27 is Vit
15:04:01 <Zakim> +Vit; got it
15:04:14 <Clay> Resolved accept minutes of July 10 telecon
15:04:30 <Clay> http://www.w3.org/2007/07/10-swd-minutes.html
15:04:43 <Clay> ACTION: Guus to propose dates in Oct for Amsterdam meeting on SKOS [recorded in [43]http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action01]
15:04:48 <Zakim> +??P30
15:04:49 <Clay> --continues
15:04:55 <Simone> Zakim, ??P30 is me
15:04:55 <Zakim> +Simone; got it
15:05:19 <Clay> Topic: SKOS
15:05:28 <Clay> ACTION: Antoine to raise issue of adding broader/narrower relations in skos [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action03]
15:06:24 <Antoine> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/56
15:06:31 <Clay> --done
15:08:01 <Clay> ACTION: Guus to move ISSUE-26 forward [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action04].
15:08:04 <Clay> --continues
15:08:04 <aliman> q+ to comment on ISSUE 26
15:08:12 <Clay> ACTION: Guus to post user experience reports for ISSUE-26 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action05]
15:08:14 <Clay> --continues
15:08:43 <RalphS> Regrets: Sean
15:09:49 <Clay> Alistair: re: simple extension proposal.  There are two distinct "flavors".  Guus assumed one, Antoine the other.  A need exists to clearly distinguish those flavors.
15:11:51 <TomB> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Jun/0060.html
15:12:56 <TomB> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Jun/0078.html
15:13:23 <Clay> ... about interpretaion of skos label and RDF plain literals
15:14:58 <Clay> ... not ready to discuss the SimpleExtension issue, and awaiting Guus' user experience report re: different flavors
15:15:35 <Clay> ACTION: Alistair to state the difference between the two labels
15:16:25 <aliman> s/the two labels/the two flavours of the SimpleExtension proposal for issue 26/
15:16:33 <RalphS> Alistair: in -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Jun/0060.html my bijection message I mistakenly referred to issue 33 rather than issue 26
15:16:47 <Clay> s/the two labels/the two flavours of the SimpleExtension proposal for issue 26/
15:19:32 <Clay> Proceed with issue 33?
15:19:48 <Clay> Ed: will grouping constructs be documented somewhere?
15:21:34 <Clay> Alistair: suggested procedure is to work on 2 wiki drafts: 1) skos primer with grouping constructs overview; 2) skos semantics with formal specifications discussing grouping constructs.  Once first drafts exist, the WG considers as whole.
15:22:29 <Clay> ... the 2 drafts are linked
15:23:18 <Clay> Tom: goal is to have W3C recommendation, one of the docs would be on semantics, as part of a larger package.
15:24:28 <Clay> Antoine: supports getting consensus on semantics doc 
15:24:42 <Clay> s/getting consensus on semantics doc//
15:24:46 <Clay> Ed: supports
15:27:05 <Clay> Alistair: propose resolution for issue 33
15:27:18 <Zakim> +Ben
15:27:48 <benadida> benadida has joined #swd
15:28:10 <Clay> Post 166 is the technical resolution for issue 33
15:29:02 <RalphS> PROPOSED: ISSUE 33 is resolved with the design in http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/SKOS/Semantics/Grouping?action=recall&rev=4
15:31:09 <Clay> Alistair: I expect us to revisit this issue.
15:31:17 <RalphS> Alistair: I expect there to be issues with this grouping module but we can raise those as separate issues
15:31:47 <Clay> Tom: we can resolve for now, but if at a later point we need to reopen this we can.  For momentum we should resolve.
15:32:36 <Clay> Alistair: more specific issues can be addressed separately as needed
15:33:42 <Clay> RESOLVED: ISSUE 33 is resolved with the design in http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/SKOS/Semantics/Grouping?action=recall&rev=4
15:34:57 <Clay> Jon: how do we mark an issue as resolved?  Can mark it manually and move state to "closed".
15:35:16 <RalphS> rrsagent, pointer?
15:35:16 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-irc#T15-35-16
15:36:22 <Clay> Tom: Issue 31 Alistair proposed a way forward on BasicLexicalLabelSemantics
15:36:44 <RalphS> -> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/track/issues/31 issue 31: BasicLexicalLabelSemantics
15:39:12 <Clay> Alistair: idea of makring triples as optional was the only way at the time I could see that people will want to use SKOS with OWL DL
15:39:29 <Clay> ... also thinking about namespace
15:41:05 <Clay> ... re: skos semantics, OWL flavors, and inference engines
15:41:19 <Clay> Dan: get DL people involved in discussion
15:44:15 <Clay> Alistair: the triple is optional in case where you want to stay within DL.
15:44:15 <RalphS> Alistair: I meant the notation "[DL-optional]" to mean that the triple is optional in the case that the application wants to be within OWL-DL
15:44:27 <Antoine> Annotation properties must not be used in property axioms. Thus, in OWL DL one cannot define subproperties or domain/range constraints for annotation properties.
15:45:46 <Clay> Alistair: some triples will take us out of DL into OWL Full.  How to mark that?  If you want to stay within DL, it's marked as optional?
15:48:38 <Clay> Tom: AListair is trying to say that if you want to remain within OWL DL you don't use this triple.
15:49:19 <Clay> Alistair: there could be a subset of SKOS that allows this, akin to OWL Full and OWL DL
15:49:42 <RalphS> Ralph: we seem to be heading toward having SKOS-FULL and SKOS-DL.  (ugh)
15:51:04 <Clay> Antoine: if we accept the triple then we're in OWL Full
15:51:39 <RalphS> Antoine: suggest the notation "[OWL-Full]" in place of "[DL-optional]"
15:51:39 <Clay> Ed: are there use cases for inferencing using OWL Full as opposed to OWL DL
15:53:18 <RalphS> zakim, who's on the phone?
15:53:18 <Zakim> On the phone I see TomB, Clay, aliman, edsu, dlrubin, Ralph, Justin, Elisa_Kendall, Diego, Antoine_Isaac, JonP, Vit, Simone, Ben
15:54:06 <Clay> TOPIC: RDFa
15:54:22 <Clay> ACTION: Ralph to Discuss possibility of meeting for RDFa in Cambridge [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action02]
15:54:35 <Clay> --done
15:55:13 <RalphS> q+ to thank the WG for input on @class / @role / @instanceof
15:56:54 <Zakim> aliman, you wanted to comment on ISSUE 26
15:56:58 <Zakim> RalphS, you wanted to thank the WG for input on @class / @role / @instanceof
15:57:15 <Clay> TOPIC: Recipes
15:57:29 <Clay> ACTION: Ralph propose resolution to Recipe issue 1.3 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/04/24-swd-minutes.html#action09] 
15:57:32 <Clay> --continues
15:59:31 <Clay> ???: re: .htaccess 'accept header' and header which EXACTLY matches "application/rdf+xml"
16:01:13 <RalphS> q+
16:03:35 <Clay> ACTION: Diego to write test to confirm what's broken about recipes as stated re: ISSUE 58 
16:03:46 <Zakim> -dlrubin
16:03:53 <RalphS> Ralph: issue 58 came up in the context of when the HTTP spec permits multiple Accept: headers
16:03:57 <Clay> TOPIC:  Vocabulary Management
16:04:29 <dlrubin> dlrubin has left #swd
16:04:41 <RalphS> Ralph: the question for issue 58 is really wether our current recipe permits a comma-separated list of acceptable content types
16:04:54 <Clay> Elisa: I've thrown in some paragraphs in Wiki.  I took Alistair's comment on re-titling section, and have added paragraph on 404 errors.
16:05:15 <Clay> ... possibility to add Vocab Mgmt. on agenda for 10 mins. next week?
16:05:35 <Clay> ... will try to have more substantial text for discussion
16:05:57 <Zakim> -edsu
16:05:59 <Zakim> -Justin
16:06:00 <Clay> zakim, list attendees
16:06:01 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been TomB, Clay, aliman, edsu, Ralph, dlrubin, Justin, Elisa_Kendall, CarlosI, Diego, Antoine_Isaac, JonP, Vit, Simone, Ben
16:06:03 <Zakim> -Antoine_Isaac
16:06:04 <Zakim> -aliman
16:06:05 <Zakim> -Elisa_Kendall
16:06:06 <Zakim> -Vit
16:06:07 <Zakim> -Ben
16:06:08 <Zakim> -JonP
16:06:08 <Antoine> Antoine has left #swd
16:06:11 <Zakim> -Diego
16:06:13 <Zakim> -Simone
16:06:24 <Clay> rrsagent, please draft minutes
16:06:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-minutes.html Clay
16:06:28 <Zakim> -TomB
16:07:01 <Zakim> -Ralph
16:07:03 <Zakim> -Clay
16:07:03 <Zakim> SW_SWD()11:00AM has ended
16:07:04 <Zakim> Attendees were TomB, Clay, aliman, edsu, Ralph, dlrubin, Justin, Elisa_Kendall, CarlosI, Diego, Antoine_Isaac, JonP, Vit, Simone, Ben
16:09:54 <benadida> benadida has left #swd
16:20:55 <RalphS> zakim, bye
16:20:55 <Zakim> Zakim has left #swd
16:20:59 <RalphS> rrsagent, bye
16:20:59 <RRSAgent> I see 8 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-actions.rdf :
16:20:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Guus to propose dates in Oct for Amsterdam meeting on SKOS [recorded in [43]http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action01] [1]
16:20:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-irc#T15-04-43
16:20:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Antoine to raise issue of adding broader/narrower relations in skos [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action03] [2]
16:20:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-irc#T15-05-28
16:20:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Guus to move ISSUE-26 forward [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action04]. [3]
16:20:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-irc#T15-08-01
16:20:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Guus to post user experience reports for ISSUE-26 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action05] [4]
16:20:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-irc#T15-08-12
16:20:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Alistair to state the difference between the two labels [5]
16:20:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-irc#T15-15-35
16:20:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ralph to Discuss possibility of meeting for RDFa in Cambridge [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/03-swd-minutes.html#action02] [6]
16:20:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-irc#T15-54-22
16:20:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ralph propose resolution to Recipe issue 1.3 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/04/24-swd-minutes.html#action09]  [7]
16:20:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-irc#T15-57-29
16:20:59 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Diego to write test to confirm what's broken about recipes as stated re: ISSUE 58  [8]
16:20:59 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/17-swd-irc#T16-03-35