IRC log of ua on 2007-07-12

Timestamps are in UTC.

17:44:43 [RRSAgent]

RRSAgent has joined #ua

17:44:43 [RRSAgent]

logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-ua-irc

17:44:58 [AllanJ]

rrsagent, set logs public

17:45:10 [AllanJ]

zakim, this will be wai_u

17:45:10 [Zakim]

ok, AllanJ; I see WAI_UAWG()2:00PM scheduled to start in 15 minutes

17:45:38 [AllanJ]

title: UAWG teleconference

17:45:43 [AllanJ]

Chair: Jim Allan

17:46:57 [AllanJ]

agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2007JulSep/0002.html

17:47:17 [AllanJ]

regrets: cklaws, kford

17:47:49 [JR]

JR has joined #ua

17:50:43 [JR]

Scribe: JR

17:58:15 [Zakim]

WAI_UAWG()2:00PM has now started

17:58:23 [Zakim]

+Allanj

17:59:23 [Zakim]

+??P4

17:59:48 [JR]

zakim, ??P4 is really JR

17:59:48 [Zakim]

+JR; got it

18:01:14 [Zakim]

+[IBM]

18:01:35 [JR]

zakim, [IBM] is really pparente

18:01:35 [Zakim]

+pparente; got it

18:02:10 [JR]

Topic: Changing Meeting time (move meeting time ahead 1 hour)

18:02:17 [JR]

All: No prob

18:03:51 [parente]

parente has joined #ua

18:04:28 [JR]

zakim, parente is really pparente

18:04:28 [Zakim]

sorry, JR, I do not recognize a party named 'parente'

18:04:34 [JR]

zakim, pparente is really parente

18:04:34 [Zakim]

+parente; got it

18:04:52 [JR]

Topic: Ideas for topics for Tech Plenary day

18:06:02 [JR]

JA: Describing Plenary...

18:06:22 [JR]

JA: Wednesday will be plenary talks

18:06:31 [JR]

JA: Shadi had idea of test suites

18:11:16 [JR]

Topic: Wiki - review edits

18:11:45 [JR]

JA: Let's start with 3 (http://www.w3.org/WAI/UA/wiki/ConfigToNotRender)

18:12:04 [JR]

PP: Mostly commented on issues...

18:12:20 [JR]

PP: Mostly questions

18:13:05 [JR]

PP: Hard to answer questions for 3.1

18:13:29 [JR]

PP: Are we talking about all background images.. or just things in the background

18:13:52 [JR]

JA: Went back to archives...people from Opera raised same issue

18:13:58 [JR]

JA: Couldn't find response

18:14:48 [JR]

JA: Second point on background images and AJAX widgets...points to this guideline needing an overhaul

18:15:30 [JR]

JA: Had always assumed this was meant to cover whole page...

18:15:52 [JR]

JA: Maybe need to put up implementation details...

18:16:16 [JR]

JA: Seems like in past we tried to document current practice plus extend them.

18:16:46 [JR]

JA: e.g. Turn off images in IE just turns off IMG

18:17:01 [JR]

JA: We should be informed by the implmentation in browsers

18:17:15 [JR]

JA: Why beat dead horse?

18:19:03 [JR]

JA: History has passed some of these things by

18:19:15 [JR]

JA: We may break AJAX...

18:20:51 [JR]

JA: if not careful.

18:21:46 [JR]

PP: 3.2 Toggle audio, video, animated images (P1)

18:22:26 [JR]

PP: Issue browser doesn't necessarily know what it is displaying....underlying comment - maybe written as "if the browser does know"

18:23:00 [JR]

PP: e..g animated gifs...but not some other techs

18:24:19 [JR]

PP: In this case, turn on or off is fairly straightforward.

18:26:28 [AllanJ]

JR: this is all filters what to turn on and off

18:26:47 [JR]

PP: Also good to think about extensions...

18:26:59 [JR]

PP: There are add blockers...

18:27:15 [JR]

PP: Ad blockers...

18:27:29 [JR]

PP: Sees things and pulls it out of the DOM...

18:28:16 [AllanJ]

PP: does the extension become part of the Chrome and conformance

18:29:03 [AllanJ]

JR: if to many filters, then configuration becomes troublesome

18:29:06 [JR]

JR: How much configurability...

18:29:49 [JR]

PP: Fairly low - just grabs rules from Web

18:30:16 [JR]

PP: Plus can block individual things

18:30:50 [JR]

JA: Can determine how far back to go ...doublick.com...doubleclick/autos...etc

18:32:55 [JR]

Action JR: Expand on idea of blocking functional areas: animation, low contrast, etc.

18:33:55 [JR]

PP, JA: Should call out that also applies to chrome

18:34:33 [JR]

PP: 3.3 Toggle animated or blinking text (P1)

18:34:41 [JR]

PP: Essentially the same as 3.2

18:34:55 [JR]

JA: But different set of tags

18:35:08 [JR]

PP: Should combine

18:35:24 [JR]

PP: Fall into category of animations the author knows a bout

18:38:20 [JR]

Action PP: Proposal to combine 3.2 and 3.3

18:40:11 [JR]

Action JR: Proposal to limit "background image" to body of document

18:41:34 [JR]

PP: 3.4 Toggle scripts (P1)

18:42:07 [JR]

PP: wants to point out that browser to decide to pen a 3rd party apps or not

18:43:03 [AllanJ]

JR: question about javascript

18:43:18 [JR]

JR: Like PP's "Toggle executable content,"

18:45:33 [JR]

All: Discuss ways of toggling flash

18:46:50 [JR]

PP: There is a way to toggle SVG off in Firefox...

18:46:59 [JR]

PP: Though not in a proper option

18:47:17 [JR]

PP: And extensions can pull these things back up into chrome

18:47:33 [JR]

JA: Is this totally outdated?

18:47:44 [JR]

JA: Everything going executable...

18:47:57 [JR]

JA: If turning things off then you can have nothing.

18:49:00 [JR]

PP: Maybe site by site...prob too much config for base UA

18:50:46 [JR]

Action JA: Get thoughts together about 3.4 "All executable content", managing configuration

18:52:09 [JR]

JA: Brought up before that pop-up window sometimes has no UA control but if fonts to big can't see it all

18:54:08 [JR]

Action JR: Proposal to have config uration not to have stripped down user agent windoews

18:54:45 [JR]

JA: Riminds me that all of 3.1, 3.2 etc are fallbacks for WCAG problems.

18:55:42 [JR]

PP: 3.5 Toggle automatic content retrieval (P1)

18:55:57 [JR]

PP: Originally intended to apply to full page

18:57:09 [JR]

PP: Idea had here is that ARAI live regions can be leveraged...live regions can be not refreshed etc

18:58:37 [JR]

PP: Different politeness settings can be used

18:59:59 [JR]

Action PP: Proposal on ways User Agents could use live regions.

19:00:47 [AllanJ]

JR: perhaps a setting...i need a least a minute to review changes....user has ability to set a time for refresh

19:02:18 [JR]

JA: Work being done on what should be paid attention to

19:02:32 [JR]

PP: All recs I've seen say don't move focus

19:03:18 [JR]

JA: If focus is in live region and it changes, UA should block change to the region

19:03:36 [JR]

PP: Ties into the guideline on automatic focus change

19:04:55 [JR]

JA: Just finding no event on change

19:05:17 [JR]

JA: Oh found it...

19:07:55 [JR]

Action JA: Proposal that if a live region has focus, it shouldn't update.]

19:08:39 [JR]

PP: Hmmm...could be just a timer etc.

19:10:06 [JR]

PP: Different than blocking all of the HTTP requests...this blocks once request returns

19:10:30 [JR]

PP: 3.6 Toggle images (P2)

19:11:21 [JR]

JR: What's accessiblity rationale?

19:13:54 [JR]

JA: Lists cognitive disabilities (overly rich visuals)

19:14:07 [JR]

JA: We're way over

19:14:57 [Zakim]

-parente

19:27:16 [Zakim]

-JR

19:27:17 [Zakim]

WAI_UAWG()2:00PM has ended

19:27:18 [Zakim]

Attendees were Allanj, JR, parente

19:27:40 [JR]

RRSAgent, make minutes

19:27:40 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-ua-minutes.html JR

19:27:50 [JR]

RRSAgent, set logs public

19:27:55 [JR]

Zakim, bye

19:27:55 [Zakim]

Zakim has left #ua

19:28:02 [JR]

RRSAgent, bye

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

I see 7 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-ua-actions.rdf :

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: JR to Expand on idea of blocking functional areas: animation, low contrast, etc. [1]

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-ua-irc#T18-32-55

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: PP to Proposal to combine 3.2 and 3.3 [2]

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-ua-irc#T18-38-20

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: JR to Proposal to limit "background image" to body of document [3]

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-ua-irc#T18-40-11

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: JA to Get thoughts together about 3.4 "All executable content", managing configuration [4]

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-ua-irc#T18-50-46

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: JR to Proposal to have config uration not to have stripped down user agent windoews [5]

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-ua-irc#T18-54-08

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: PP to Proposal on ways User Agents could use live regions. [6]

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-ua-irc#T18-59-59

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: JA to Proposal that if a live region has focus, it shouldn't update.] [7]

19:28:02 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/07/12-ua-irc#T19-07-55