15:41:48 RRSAgent has joined #tagmem 15:41:48 logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/07/09-tagmem-irc 15:42:02 zakim, this will be tag 15:42:02 ok, Stuart; I see TAG_Weekly()12:00PM scheduled to start in 18 minutes 15:52:23 DanC has joined #tagmem 15:56:53 Rhys has joined #tagmem 15:57:58 TAG_Weekly()12:00PM has now started 15:58:05 + +0196288aaaa 15:58:27 +??P2 15:58:34 zakim, ??P2 is me 15:58:34 +Stuart; got it 15:59:42 DanC has changed the topic to: TAG 9 July http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/tag-weekly scribe: Raman 15:59:48 +DanC 16:00:25 Zakim, aaaa is Rhys 16:00:25 +Rhys; got it 16:00:46 DanC has changed the topic to: TAG 9 July http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/tag-weekly scribe: DanC 16:01:03 agenda + Convene 16:01:12 agenda + Approve Minutes from 25th June 2007 16:01:19 agenda + (Post) Summer 'Recess' 16:01:26 agenda + Issue XMLVersioning-41 16:01:34 agenda + Issue httpRange-14 16:01:50 agenda 2 = Approve Minutes from previous meeting 16:02:07 +Raman 16:02:21 raman has joined #tagmem 16:02:29 zakim, who is here 16:02:29 Stuart, you need to end that query with '?' 16:02:32 zakim, who is here? 16:02:32 On the phone I see Rhys, Stuart, DanC, Raman 16:02:33 On IRC I see raman, Rhys, DanC, RRSAgent, Zakim, Stuart, Norm, trackbot-ng, ht 16:03:23 Zakim, take up item 1 16:03:23 agendum 1. "Convene" taken up [from DanC] 16:03:29 Regrets: Noah, TimBL 16:03:59 PROPOSED: to meet again 16 July, Raman to scribe 16:04:18 raman: OK 16:04:42 for next week: regrets: David, Rhys, Henry 16:05:00 zakim, who is here? 16:05:00 On the phone I see Rhys, Stuart, DanC, Raman 16:05:01 On IRC I see raman, Rhys, DanC, RRSAgent, Zakim, Stuart, Norm, trackbot-ng, ht 16:05:02 SKW: I may cancel if we're thin on agenda 16:05:15 zakim, please call ht-781 16:05:15 ok, ht; the call is being made 16:05:17 +Ht 16:05:44 PROPOSED: to accept http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2007/07/02-minutes as a true record 16:06:16 RESOLVED: to cancel 23rd, 30th July and 6th Aug 16:06:26 SKW: perhaps we did that last week, but just to be sure. 16:06:42 RESOLVED: to accept http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2007/07/02-minutes as a true record 16:06:44 Zakim, close item 2 16:06:44 agendum 2, Approve Minutes from previous meeting, closed 16:06:45 I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 16:06:46 1. Convene [from DanC] 16:06:57 Zakim, next item 16:06:57 agendum 3. "(Post) Summer 'Recess'" taken up [from DanC] 16:07:41 SKW is at risk 13 Aug, i.e. not available to prepare agenda 16:08:13 +DOrchard 16:08:24 SKW: volunteer to chair 13 Aug? [pause...] ok, we'll leave that to later 16:08:31 Zakim, next item 16:08:31 agendum 4. "Issue XMLVersioning-41" taken up [from DanC] 16:08:49 dorchard has joined #tagmem 16:09:25 SKW: withdraw 2 and continue 3 actions? 16:10:44 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2007Jul/0003.html DaveO RE: versioning definitions... 16:11:40 discussing ACTION: DC accepted on 8 Aug 2006 Review definitions of partial understanding, backward compatible, and forward compatible. 16:12:17 DanC made progress 21 May http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2007May/0040.html 16:12:53 Indeed. All 3 reviewers have asked this key question. How about "I1 is 16:12:53 compatible with I2 if all of the information in I1 does not replace or 16:12:53 contradict any information in I2." 16:13:42 ACTION: DC Review definitions of partial understanding, backward compatible, and forward compatible. [CONTINUES] 16:13:42 Created ACTION-4 - Review definitions of partial understanding, backward compatible, and forward compatible. [CONTINUES] [on Dan Connolly - due 2007-07-16]. 16:13:53 DanC: sounds like "consistent" 16:14:02 ... I'll have to think about it. 16:15:13 (the trackbot default of 1 week is not traditional in this group; I'm not sure when I'll get to that action) 16:15:59 DaveO: ... now text-set has a [different relationship] to syntax... 16:16:14 ... I changed the diagram. 16:16:26 q+ to ask about diagram source 16:17:50 DaveO reviews changes... faster than the scribe can summarize 16:19:18 ack dan 16:19:19 DanC, you wanted to ask about diagram source 16:19:20 DaveO: the reviewers seemed to catch many of the same things 16:19:26 +Norm 16:19:46 DaveO: yes, I checked in .violet v6 16:20:16 ... note violet has been updated; it's an eclipse plug-in. quite convenient since I use eclipse for W3C spec editing 16:21:27 SKW: [something from a recent review message...] 16:22:09 I just checked in the .violet v6.. 16:22:51 ACTION SKW: complete review of terminology section of of 4 July versioning draft 16:23:49 ball seems to be with NDW on XML strategies 16:24:44 ACTION: SKW complete review of terminology section of of 4 July versioning draft 16:24:44 Sorry, couldn't find user - SKW 16:25:21 DaveO: I addressed a bunch of "add a link here" editorial comments on [which? strategies?] 16:26:14 (when DaveO says "2.2.2 is important...", that's http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/versioning-strategies-20070704.html#forwardsCompatible , yes?) 16:26:40 yes 16:26:49 -> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/versioning-strategies-20070704.html#forwardsCompatible section 2.2.2 Forwards Compatible 16:27:34 DaveO: section 6, case studies, is now one table. (http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/versioning-strategies-20070704.html#iddiv194353056 ) 16:28:37 DaveO: there's a new strategy 2.5 "some go in a new namespace, some go in an existing namespace" 16:28:55 ... to capture the pattern where [something about ##any and ##other] 16:29:48 DaveO: I also mentioned XSLT [i.e. its versioning policy?] 16:30:27 SKW: a process question... should we aim for last call on this material? 16:30:42 XSLT documents versioning, not versioning XSLT itself from XSLT 2.0 to >2.0. 16:30:56 DanC: umm... sounds good... last call after review of peer groups such as HTML 16:31:03 DaveO: yeah, HTML, XML Schema, XML Core 16:31:14 raman: and CSS, and XHTML 2 16:32:38 DanC: yes, I'd like to think more about the CSS versioning strategy 16:33:56 NDW: yes, I'm working on reviewing "strategies" and the XML part 16:35:15 NW accepted on 12 Dec 2006. Produce some information about NVDL for the finding. [CONTINUES] 16:35:38 ACTION: Norm Produce some information about NVDL for the finding. 16:35:38 Sorry, couldn't find user - Norm 16:35:50 NDW: by 23 July 16:36:07 NDW: maybe some for the 16 July meeting 16:36:20 (trackbot groks due dates, but the scribe doesn't know how to get it to do it) 16:36:48 Zakim, next item 16:36:48 agendum 5. "Issue httpRange-14" taken up [from DanC] 16:37:30 ACTION: Stuart to review "Cool URIs for the Semantic Web" [DONE] 16:37:30 Created ACTION-5 - Review \"Cool URIs for the Semantic Web\" [DONE] [on Stuart Williams - due 2007-07-16]. 16:37:47 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2007Jun/0075 SKW on "Cool URIs for the Semantic Web" 16:38:19 ACTION: Norm to review "Cool URIs for the Semantic Web" [WITHDRAWN] 16:38:19 Sorry, couldn't find user - Norm 16:38:42 DanC: SKW, any impact from your review on our httpRange-14 finding? 16:39:12 SKW: not really; there's stuff they suggest [in "Cool URIs for the Semantic Web"] as best practice that goes beyond what the TAG decided. 16:40:13 http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/fdesc54/slides 16:43:30 Zakim, is dorchard here? 16:43:30 probably, DanC; DOrchard arrived 35 minutes ago 16:46:01 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2007Jul/0021.html HT on terminology 16:51:24 (scribe is hardly even trying to capture the discussion as he leads it) 16:52:42 HT: in the case of the Oxaca weather report and [some common fairy tale I already forgot], the french and english have roughly the same relationship to the resource; not so for french and english versions of Moby Dick 16:53:27 q+ to mention that translations sometimes don't hold is in GEB as well, the example being russian book (can't remember which author) translation should perhaps be Dickens. 16:53:30 DanC: is the question of whether the translation is authorized relevant? 16:53:33 HT: not really 16:53:54 SKW: ... generic resources finding relevant... ? 16:54:00 HT: only trivially. [?] 16:54:46 ... english version of [which?] has special status. e.g. conneg... 16:54:55 ack dave 16:54:58 ack dave 16:55:01 ack d 16:55:01 dorchard, you wanted to mention that translations sometimes don't hold is in GEB as well, the example being russian book (can't remember which author) translation should perhaps be 16:55:05 ... Dickens. 16:55:27 s/[which?]/The Wasteland, by T. S. Eliot/ 16:55:35 DanC: this is _exactly_ the authorized translation question. In conneg, the publisher is making claims. if the publisher says, using conneg, "these are equivalent for my purposes", then they're equivalent for his/her purposes 16:56:15 q? 16:56:26 DaveO: [scribe was totally behind and let himself get distracted] 16:57:14 translations sometimes don't hold is in GEB as well, the example being russian book (can't remember which author) translation should perhaps be Dickens 16:59:02 HST: The somewhat surprising tentative conclusion is that you can't be a responsible Webmaster until you've taken a position on the issue of "The nature of The Work of Art" 17:02:10 DanC walks through Frag Identifier Diagram 17:05:53 HST explains indexicals: "I'm right and you're wrong!"... a phase we can both locally agree because it means different things to both of us. 17:06:57 q? 17:10:14 SKW: Dan, in your investigation, where does 303 come in? 17:10:40 DanC: it's sort of a noop, as far as knowledge exchange, in my thinking. Tim's idea that it constrains things is new to me; I'm still thinking about it 17:10:55 SKW: and Rhys, does this help with httpRange-14? 17:11:30 Rhys: I'm learning a lot about backgrounds that readers bring 17:12:11 SKW: is httpRange-14 a comfortable place for this discussion? 17:12:19 Raman: no, it's opaque 17:12:22 DanC: oops; you're right 17:13:05 Raman: webarch2? 17:13:10 SKW: terminology for webarch2? 17:13:34 DanC: that doesn't narrow it down; does that help? hmm... yes, let's noodle on this a bit 17:14:48 ACTION: RL to revise Dereferencing HTTP URIs finding in response to F2F discussion. [CONTINUES] 17:14:48 Created ACTION-6 - Revise Dereferencing HTTP URIs finding in response to F2F discussion. [CONTINUES] [on Rhys Lewis - due 2007-07-16]. 17:15:00 Topic: Progress on reviewing Enabling Read Access for Web Resources 17:15:16 SKW: I did one half of my action, contacting the chairs 17:15:55 ... that's going well... 17:16:16 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/tag/2007Jul/0015.html 17:16:56 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-tag/2007Jul/0008.html SKW to POWDER/WAF chairs 17:20:48 DanC: tactically, separate messages for separate subjects 17:21:05 DanC: I dunno enough to endorse #6 17:21:06 DO: likewise 17:21:24 SKW: OK, I'll send the ones we discussed (1 and 2) as from the TAG and the others personally 17:22:00 Zakim, take up item 3 17:22:00 agendum 3. "(Post) Summer 'Recess'" taken up [from DanC] 17:22:49 SKW: if we're to meet 13 Aug, I need help with agenda prep 17:24:09 NDW: OK, I'll prepare an agenda (or cancellation notice) for 13 Aug 17:24:25 ADJOURN. 17:24:27 -DOrchard 17:24:33 -Raman 17:24:34 -Norm 17:24:34 -Stuart 17:24:35 -Rhys 17:24:48 -Ht 17:24:58 -DanC 17:24:59 TAG_Weekly()12:00PM has ended 17:25:00 Attendees were +0196288aaaa, Stuart, DanC, Rhys, Raman, Ht, DOrchard, Norm 17:29:58 Stuart has joined #tagmem 17:32:21 Danc... I haven't looked at them yet... but are the Linked Data questions worth an agenda item next week? Bearing in mind likely attendance: we are down Rhys, Henry and David. 17:32:54 hmm 17:33:34 I'd like you to monitor the discussion; e.g. if I don't chime in, you might remind me next week. but without Rhys, prolly not worth substantive telcon discussion 17:34:47 Ok... just looking for worthy items... it's a thread I've put to one side on the, "find a bunch of time and a comfy chair to digest this one "in pile. 17:35:09 GTG... meeting an old college friend this evening. 17:37:39 enjoy 17:38:26 RRSAgent, draft minutes 17:38:26 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/07/09-tagmem-minutes.html DanC 17:38:36 RRSAgent, make logs world-access