IRC log of i18nits on 2007-06-20

Timestamps are in UTC.

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logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-irc

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rrsagent, make log public

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meeting: i18n ITS WG

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chair: Yves

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scribe: Felix

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scribeNick: fsasaki

14:01:01 [Zakim]

I18N_TS()10:00AM has now started

14:01:02 [fsasaki]

agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-i18n-its/2007AprJun/0054.html

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rrsagent, make log public

14:01:07 [Zakim]

+Jirka

14:01:49 [Zakim]

+Felix

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+Yves_Savourel

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14:02:17 [YvesS]

zakim, who is here?

14:02:17 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Jirka, Felix, Yves_Savourel

14:02:19 [Zakim]

On IRC I see chriLi, Jirka, fsasaki, RRSAgent, Zakim, YvesS

14:02:34 [chriLi]

hi guys, I may need some more time to get a phone connection

14:02:50 [YvesS]

ok. will start without you.

14:03:35 [fsasaki]

topic: action items

14:04:04 [fsasaki]

action: Felix to contact JIS people in Japan about possiblity of "ITS as JIS" (DONE)

14:04:30 [fsasaki]

Felix: ITS as JIS is a totally different process than ITS as ISO, and not sure if it worthwhile

14:04:46 [fsasaki]

.. propose to close ITS "ISO / JIS etc." for now

14:04:50 [fsasaki]

Yves: agree

14:04:56 [fsasaki]

.. worry about that later

14:06:24 [fsasaki]

action: yves to check the whole doc for consistency for "attribute" vs "attribute value" (ONGOING)

14:06:41 [fsasaki]

action: Yves to rewrite the description of example 11 (DONE)

14:06:57 [YvesS]

http://www.w3.org/International/its/techniques/its-techniques.html

14:09:38 [fsasaki]

Jirka mentions a type, Yves will fix that

14:10:11 [fsasaki]

Yves: example shows not how to override s.t., but how to implement overriding facilities of DITA

14:10:30 [fsasaki]

Jira, Felix : looks fine to me

14:10:34 [Zakim]

+Claus

14:10:58 [fsasaki]

present+ Christian, Felix, Jirka, Yves

14:11:57 [fsasaki]

action: Christian to make a proposal for "4.1.4 Create your XPath Expressions with Care (DONE)

14:12:28 [YvesS]

http://www.w3.org/International/its/techniques/its-techniques.html#GenXPath

14:12:59 [fsasaki]

Yves: removed the example with XPath simplification

14:13:18 [Jirka]

there is typo "the follwing general dimensions" -> "the following general dimensions"

14:17:51 [fsasaki]

topic: BP restructuring

14:18:03 [fsasaki]

Felix: do we want to do it? When would we do it?

14:19:18 [fsasaki]

Yves: let's discuss this next week

14:19:42 [fsasaki]

.. have an AI for everybody for that

14:20:13 [fsasaki]

action: everybody to look at BP restructuring, including existing threads on the topic, until next meeting

14:20:26 [YvesS]

http://www.w3.org/TR/#last-call

14:20:35 [fsasaki]

topic: Reviewing W3C Work or other work for ITS

14:20:53 [fsasaki]

Yves: nothing new from W3C LC drafts

14:21:12 [fsasaki]

no news on SRX reviews

14:21:30 [fsasaki]

Christian: XLIFF 1xx is now a committee specification

14:21:40 [fsasaki]

s/1xx/1.2/

14:21:51 [fsasaki]

.. next step will probably an OASIS standard

14:22:07 [fsasaki]

Yves: this could need improvement e..g about bidirectionality

14:22:49 [fsasaki]

Christian: past reviews: got reply about EMMA comment

14:23:27 [fsasaki]

.. replier sees an area were ITS fits in, and he will send a reply

14:23:41 [fsasaki]

.. btw, did we hear back from OSCAR people?

14:23:50 [fsasaki]

Yves: just acknowledgement of the comment

14:24:28 [fsasaki]

.. on XForms: we got feedback that ITS would be useful, but they don't have the resource to write the rules

14:24:37 [fsasaki]

.. I have started to work on XForms ITS rules

14:25:01 [fsasaki]

action: Yves to continue work on XForms ITS rules

14:25:14 [fsasaki]

topic: BP discussion

14:25:36 [fsasaki]

Yves: everybody fine with 3 and 4?

14:27:05 [fsasaki]

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-its/2007AprJun/0056.html

14:27:47 [fsasaki]

Christian: fine with the proposal from Yves on 3 in 56 mail

14:28:48 [fsasaki]

Yves: think we will see that in many BPs, so it should be in more generic techniques

14:29:36 [YvesS]

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-its/2007AprJun/0057.html

14:30:04 [fsasaki]

Yves: for 3 and 4, we have agreement on the current text

14:30:35 [fsasaki]

.. now BP 5

14:32:15 [fsasaki]

comment from Christian at http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-its/2007AprJun/0057.html

14:32:54 [YvesS]

http://www.w3.org/International/its/techniques/its-techniques.html#DevTransOver

14:33:01 [fsasaki]

Yves: common issue for many topics: defaults for a schema, and overriding of ITS rules

14:33:23 [fsasaki]

Christian: could use that for a general section possibly

14:36:27 [fsasaki]

Felix makes some rewriting proposals

14:36:29 [fsasaki]

Jirka: current description of BP is fine with me

14:37:56 [fsasaki]

Yves: BP 5 says not that you should not use its:translate if you have a translate attribute in your schema already

14:38:03 [fsasaki]

Felix: it is indirectly said in:

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"If you are working with DTD or a schema where there is a way to override translatability information that is not its:translate, you should provide an ITS rules document where you use the its:translateRule element to associate this mechanism to the ITS Translate data category."

14:38:43 [fsasaki]

Yves: proposal:

14:39:07 [fsasaki]

"If you are working with DTD or a schema where there is a way to override translatability information that is not its:translate, you should use it. You should provide an ITS rules document where you use the its:translateRule element to associate this mechanism to the ITS Translate data category."

14:40:31 [fsasaki]

Christian's proposal "If you are working with DTD or a schema where there is a way to override translatability information that is not its:translate, you should use it. In addition, you should provide an ITS rules document where you use the its:translateRule element to associate this mechanism to the ITS Translate data category."

14:40:48 [fsasaki]

Yves, Felix: looks good

14:41:47 [fsasaki]

Yves: "In some cases, the author of a document may need to change the translatability property on parts of the content, overriding defaults or more general rules." "Why to do this" part is very short, but we leave it like that now

14:42:22 [fsasaki]

.. references are short as well

14:42:36 [fsasaki]

.. close BP 5 for now

14:42:39 [fsasaki]

.. now BP 6

14:43:02 [fsasaki]

input from Christian http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-i18n-its/2007AprJun/0058.html

14:43:47 [fsasaki]

Yves: "document your code" should be an aspect of a general technique

14:44:11 [fsasaki]

.. should we put a new BP about that or have that on the generic techniques?

14:45:07 [fsasaki]

Christian: as a new BP?

14:45:13 [fsasaki]

Felix: sounds like a technique to me

14:45:26 [fsasaki]

Yves: we have s.t. like that already about creating ITS rules

14:45:32 [YvesS]

http://www.w3.org/International/its/techniques/its-techniques.html#DevITSRules

14:46:58 [fsasaki]

Felix: rules are just one kind of documentation, there is also e.g. human readable documentation

14:47:28 [fsasaki]

Christian: schema designers first need to describe "what is (not) translatable"? When they need to apply special mechanisms, i.e. ITS rules

14:47:48 [fsasaki]

Yves: so we need to reword BP 14 to include Christian's input

14:49:35 [fsasaki]

action: everyone to propose rewriting of BP 14 as discussed in 20 June 2007 meeting

14:50:30 [fsasaki]

Yves: back to BP 6 - any other aspect to hink about?

14:50:53 [fsasaki]

.. I need to rewrite the definition of the rule in example 13

14:51:13 [fsasaki]

action: Yves to rewrite the definition of the rule in example 13

14:52:54 [fsasaki]

topic: next meetings AIs

14:52:59 [fsasaki]

Yves: will be 7 and 8

14:53:48 [fsasaki]

topic: republication of BP draft

14:54:22 [fsasaki]

Yves: everybody fine with publication?

14:54:29 [fsasaki]

RESOLUTION: WG agrees with publication of new BP WG

14:54:43 [fsasaki]

Yves: will post the question to ML, wait for answers until Friday

14:55:23 [fsasaki]

Felix: proposed publication date would be 28 June (next week Thursday)

14:55:30 [fsasaki]

topic: requirement document

14:56:37 [fsasaki]

Yves: any deadline

14:56:58 [fsasaki]

Felix: no deadline. I'd propose to wait with publication until the xml i18n BP WG Note publication

14:57:30 [Zakim]

-Felix

14:57:32 [Zakim]

-Christian

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-Jirka

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-Yves_Savourel

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I18N_TS()10:00AM has ended

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Attendees were Jirka, Felix, Yves_Savourel, Christian

14:57:41 [fsasaki]

rrsagent, draft minutes

14:57:41 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-minutes.html fsasaki

15:25:11 [fsasaki]

rrsagent, bye

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

I see 8 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-actions.rdf :

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Felix to contact JIS people in Japan about possiblity of "ITS as JIS" (DONE) [1]

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-irc#T14-04-04

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: yves to check the whole doc for consistency for "attribute" vs "attribute value" (ONGOING) [2]

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-irc#T14-06-24

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Yves to rewrite the description of example 11 (DONE) [3]

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-irc#T14-06-41

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Christian to make a proposal for "4.1.4 Create your XPath Expressions with Care (DONE) [4]

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-irc#T14-11-57

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: everybody to look at BP restructuring, including existing threads on the topic, until next meeting [5]

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-irc#T14-20-13

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Yves to continue work on XForms ITS rules [6]

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-irc#T14-25-01

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: everyone to propose rewriting of BP 14 as discussed in 20 June 2007 meeting [7]

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-irc#T14-49-35

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Yves to rewrite the definition of the rule in example 13 [8]

15:25:11 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/06/20-i18nits-irc#T14-51-13

15:25:13 [fsasaki]

zakim, bye

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