IRC log of ua on 2007-02-22

Timestamps are in UTC.

18:33:14 [RRSAgent]
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-irc
18:33:41 [AllanJ]
zakim, set minutes public
18:33:41 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'set minutes public', AllanJ
18:33:55 [AllanJ]
rrsagent, set minutes public
18:33:55 [RRSAgent]
I'm logging. I don't understand 'set minutes public', AllanJ. Try /msg RRSAgent help
18:35:54 [AllanJ]
rrsagent, set logs public
18:36:12 [AllanJ]
meeting: UAWG teleconference
18:36:19 [AllanJ]
Chair: Jim Allan
18:36:29 [AllanJ]
scribe: Jan Richards
18:37:01 [AllanJ]
agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2007JanMar/0028.html
18:54:27 [KFord]
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WAI_UAWG()2:00PM has now started
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+Jim_Allan
18:55:59 [JR]
JR has joined #ua
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+??P1
18:58:25 [AllanJ]
zakim, ??P1 is KFord
18:58:25 [Zakim]
+KFord; got it
18:59:27 [Zakim]
+??P2
18:59:53 [AllanJ]
zakim, ??P2 is JR
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+JR; got it
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-JR
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+[IBM]
19:00:40 [parente]
parente has joined #ua
19:00:47 [AllanJ]
zakim, [ibm] is parente
19:00:47 [Zakim]
+parente; got it
19:00:48 [Zakim]
+Jan_Richards
19:01:14 [JR]
zakim, Jan_Richards is really JR
19:01:14 [Zakim]
+JR; got it
19:02:22 [JR]
scribe: JR
19:04:39 [JR]
Topic: Review and discuss proposed expansions "Requirements Document"
19:04:51 [JR]
JA: PP did 1d...nicely done
19:05:11 [JR]
JA: Really liked external and internal
19:05:43 [JR]
JA: Where from
19:05:46 [JR]
PP: I wrote it
19:06:10 [JR]
JA: Internal extensions...maybe need diff term for third party extensions
19:06:37 [JR]
Link: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2007JanMar/0026.html
19:07:00 [JR]
PP: But maybe internal is wrong word, meant in-process but maybe that's too technical
19:07:19 [JR]
PP: And external meant out-of-process (ie. assitive techs)
19:07:36 [JR]
PP: Technically can have in-process AT's like Firevox
19:08:12 [JR]
JA: There is another external thing - external players
19:08:24 [Zakim]
+[IBM]
19:09:05 [cklaws]
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19:09:14 [AllanJ]
zakim, [ibm] is cklaws
19:09:14 [Zakim]
+cklaws; got it
19:10:00 [JR]
JR: agree "extensions" is ok
19:10:26 [JR]
JA: OK should we just go with "Assistive Technologies" and drop external?
19:11:26 [JR]
CL: HPR had browser embedded in it
19:11:33 [JR]
PP: HPR is a browser
19:12:19 [JR]
JA: Base browser, extensions, assistive technologies
19:12:20 [JR]
?
19:12:42 [JR]
KF: That's ok, distinctions are not critical at this point
19:13:06 [JR]
CL: May run into it later then we can handle it
19:13:19 [JR]
JA: OK, will incorporate PP's things with this change
19:14:23 [JR]
CL: maybe use comprehended instead of apprehended
19:15:58 [JR]
Topic: CL to will do 3a,b,c,d
19:16:08 [JR]
CL: Tried to take defining approach...
19:16:41 [JR]
CL: What are W3c techs, non-w3c techs,...
19:17:00 [JR]
CL: Should we limit ourselves a bit?
19:18:06 [JR]
JA: Let's just word as an example
19:18:54 [JR]
CL: Non-W3c techs are just things we've spoken about before
19:19:15 [JR]
JA: SHould we add in video formats...QT, Real, etc
19:19:45 [JR]
KF: The more specific, the less flexible the format will be
19:20:54 [JR]
CL: Compound doc - just wording from compound docs page
19:21:17 [JR]
CL: Then tried to define platforms...
19:21:24 [JR]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2007JanMar/0031.html
19:21:40 [JR]
CL: Then programming interfaces...
19:22:04 [JR]
CL: THen finally emerging techs
19:22:42 [JR]
CL: So 3a has most of the info
19:23:25 [JR]
PP: XUL in wrong place
19:23:35 [JR]
KF: Working on 1e...
19:23:46 [KFord]
ACTION: KF to 3f
19:23:47 [KFord]
f. Consider UI extensions that modify/manipulate the view (e.g. Grease monkey, allow users to modify rendered content through scripting)
19:23:47 [KFord]
Ensure UAG 2.0 addresses behavior of extensions and related technologies that allow the user to modify the view through scripting and other techniques such that these changes are made available to all appropriate accessibility mechanisms.
19:25:44 [JR]
KF: The risk is that sometimes ua's don't propogate textension things all the way back
19:27:42 [JR]
KF: example...let's say User Agent extension allow an element to be removed from the view but access API not updated
19:28:51 [JR]
JR, KF: Thinks it's a good point.
19:29:06 [JR]
oops, Jr, JA
19:30:01 [JR]
Topic: KF will do 1f
19:30:08 [JR]
KF: What was the point again...
19:30:52 [JR]
JA: Point is that 70-80% of UAAG has some amount of configuration attached....
19:31:32 [JR]
JA: Can be burdensome to require a huge amount of customization
19:31:47 [JR]
JR: agree
19:32:00 [JR]
KF: OK, strightforward
19:32:19 [JR]
JA: We do have a profiles requirement
19:33:32 [JR]
JA: OK what ext...
19:33:49 [JR]
CL: Not sure what to do with 3d
19:34:28 [JR]
action CL: Resend combined 3abc
19:34:49 [JR]
action JA: Will combine KF's 3f and 3d
19:35:00 [JR]
action KF: Send 1f text
19:35:24 [JR]
JA: question on 3d...
19:36:31 [JR]
CL: In process things don't really need to ignore DOM for access APIs
19:36:43 [JR]
CL: Extensions only use DOM.
19:37:44 [JR]
JA: Web API is new W3 activity.
19:38:14 [JR]
CL: Aaron L and also PF group looking at it
19:38:46 [JR]
JA: SHould we limit ourselves to the accessibility APIs..
19:39:02 [JR]
JA: Jump back...
19:39:18 [JR]
JA: On platform, do mobile devices fit?
19:39:30 [JR]
CL: Yes, probably.
19:40:21 [JR]
CL: OK will add
19:40:36 [JR]
Topic: JR to will do 3e
19:42:17 [AllanJ]
JR: PF says 3e should be a protocol not in requirements
19:42:19 [JR]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2007JanMar/0023.html
19:42:38 [JR]
Al's comment: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2007JanMar/0024.html
19:43:35 [AllanJ]
JA: Ubiquitous Web in still emerging
19:44:51 [JR]
KF: This needs to be here
19:44:56 [AllanJ]
KF: customization needs to be addressed
19:45:00 [JR]
KF: At least in req doc stage
19:46:28 [JR]
CL: It's already in current UAAG
19:47:22 [JR]
ACtion JR: Add a sentence to 3e saying we'll keep an eye on emerging protocols in this area
19:48:00 [JR]
Topic: JA JR Work 3 points at bottom into section 2
19:48:38 [AllanJ]
http://www.w3.org/2007/02/15-ua-minutes.html#action11
19:48:58 [AllanJ]
JR: so we can drop the extra verbage.
19:49:05 [AllanJ]
JA: yes
19:49:41 [AllanJ]
JR: incorporate various points into existing outline as stated
19:50:21 [AllanJ]
JR: aDD AS 3 a iv.: Web applications using custom controls, not recognized by browsers (ARIA will be relevant).
19:51:07 [AllanJ]
JR: this should be covered in CLs new information.
19:51:11 [JR]
Topic: JR,JA will do 2a, 2b
19:51:15 [AllanJ]
JA: right.
19:51:30 [AllanJ]
JR: review 2a and 2b
19:52:02 [AllanJ]
JR: Recommends combining with new wording
19:52:10 [AllanJ]
...2a. Consider modularizing the UAAG 2.0 document. One module would
19:52:12 [AllanJ]
address "core" browser capabilities (i.e. features for people needing
19:52:14 [AllanJ]
some accessibility support, but who do not use assistive technologies)
19:52:16 [AllanJ]
Other modules might address voice browsers, speech input, etc. that,
19:52:17 [AllanJ]
while important, are not as relevant to "basic" browsers.
19:53:07 [AllanJ]
JA: like the combination
19:54:11 [JR]
Topic: JA to will do 3h
19:54:27 [JR]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2007JanMar/0030.html
19:55:00 [JR]
JA: Think skins is a non issue
19:55:44 [JR]
JA: Animated icons in address bar just gets covered by guidelines - no need for special mention
19:56:30 [JR]
JA: Teasers that there may be possible hacking possibilities but no clear info
19:57:05 [JR]
ACTION: JA to will do 1c
19:57:10 [JR]
ACTION: JA to will do 1e
19:57:23 [JR]
ACTION: JA to Will do 2c
19:57:35 [JR]
ACTION: JA to Clarify thoughts about use cases.
19:57:53 [JR]
CL : Just resent #a-c
19:57:57 [JR]
CL : Just resent 3a-c
19:57:58 [Zakim]
-KFord
19:58:00 [Zakim]
-parente
19:58:00 [Zakim]
-cklaws
20:02:36 [Zakim]
-Jim_Allan
20:02:37 [Zakim]
-JR
20:02:38 [Zakim]
WAI_UAWG()2:00PM has ended
20:02:41 [Zakim]
Attendees were Jim_Allan, KFord, JR, parente, cklaws
20:03:05 [JR]
RRSAgent, make minutes
20:03:05 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-minutes.html JR
20:03:12 [JR]
RRSAgent, set logs public
20:03:19 [JR]
Zakim, bye
20:03:19 [Zakim]
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20:03:30 [JR]
RRSAgent, bye
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
I see 9 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-actions.rdf :
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: KF to 3f [1]
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-irc#T19-23-46
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: CL to Resend combined 3abc [2]
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-irc#T19-34-28
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: JA to Will combine KF's 3f and 3d [3]
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-irc#T19-34-49
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: KF to Send 1f text [4]
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-irc#T19-35-00
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: JR to Add a sentence to 3e saying we'll keep an eye on emerging protocols in this area [5]
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-irc#T19-47-22
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: JA to will do 1c [6]
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-irc#T19-57-05
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: JA to will do 1e [7]
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-irc#T19-57-10
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: JA to Will do 2c [8]
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-irc#T19-57-23
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: JA to Clarify thoughts about use cases. [9]
20:03:30 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/02/22-ua-irc#T19-57-35