14:25:50 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dawg
14:25:50 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/02/13-dawg-irc
14:25:54 <LeeF> zakim, this will be DAWG
14:25:54 <Zakim> ok, LeeF; I see SW_DAWG()9:30AM scheduled to start in 5 minutes
14:26:02 <LeeF> Meeting: RDF DAWG Weekly
14:26:09 <LeeF> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JanMar/0075.html
14:26:14 <LeeF> Chair: LeeF
14:26:17 <LeeF> Scribe: ericP
14:26:25 <ericP> afs, can i get a write lock for a moment?
14:26:33 <LeeF> agenda + convene
14:26:36 <LeeF> agenda + review action items
14:26:43 <LeeF> agenda + test suite
14:26:44 <Zakim> SW_DAWG()9:30AM has now started
14:26:47 <LeeF> agenda + base IRI
14:26:51 <Zakim> +??P7
14:26:53 <AndyS> zakim, ??P7 is me
14:26:53 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it
14:26:56 <LeeF> agenda + minimal test suite
14:26:56 <ericP> AndyS, can i get a write lock for a moment?
14:27:01 <LeeF> agenda + rq25 status
14:27:12 <Zakim> +EliasT
14:27:32 <Zakim> +[IBMCambridge]
14:27:38 <Zakim> +Simon_Raboczi
14:27:40 <LeeF> zakim, IBMCambridge is me
14:27:40 <Zakim> +LeeF; got it
14:27:46 <AndyS> EricP - I have some changes out (on the other machine :-) - is it one area or doc-wide?  I've only chnaged a small section in the hope that merge works :-|
14:28:49 <EliasT> Zakim, mute me
14:28:49 <Zakim> EliasT should now be muted
14:28:57 <EliasT> Zakim, mute me por favor
14:28:57 <Zakim> I don't understand 'mute me por favor', EliasT
14:29:00 <ericP> AndyS, i want to globally replace... ^Q i want to put in an anchor for lee
14:29:03 <EliasT> Zakim, por favor mute me
14:29:03 <Zakim> I don't understand 'por favor mute me', EliasT
14:29:55 <LeeF> relIRIs
14:30:29 <ericP> Zakim, s'il-te-plaît, rendre EliasT muet
14:30:29 <Zakim> I don't understand 's'il-te-plaît, rendre EliasT muet', ericP
14:30:31 <AndyS> Appendix?  or 4.1? that should "just work" 
14:30:46 <LeeF> 4.1 i think
14:31:01 <LeeF> go ahead, Eric
14:31:29 <Zakim> + +33.9.52.56.aaaa
14:31:39 <ericP> Zakim, 33.9.52.56.aaaa is me
14:31:39 <Zakim> sorry, ericP, I do not recognize a party named '33.9.52.56.aaaa'
14:31:44 <ericP> Zakim, +33.9.52.56.aaaa is me
14:31:44 <Zakim> +ericP; got it
14:31:53 <LeeF> zakim, who's on the phone?
14:31:53 <Zakim> On the phone I see AndyS, EliasT (muted), LeeF, Simon_Raboczi, ericP
14:32:23 <SimonR> We have regrets from Souri (from previous minutes) and PatH (http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JanMar/0077.html)
14:32:35 <LeeF> Regrets: Souri, PatH
14:32:46 <ericP> Meeting: Data Access Working Group weekly telecon
14:32:52 <ericP> Chair: LeeF
14:33:07 <ericP> Scribe: ericP
14:33:09 <LeeF> minutes from two weeks ago: http://www.w3.org/2007/01/30-dawg-minutes
14:33:20 <ericP> zakim, take up first agendum
14:33:20 <Zakim> I don't understand 'take up first agendum', ericP
14:33:26 <ericP> zakim, take up agendum 1
14:33:26 <Zakim> agendum 1. "convene" taken up [from LeeF]
14:34:14 <LeeF> minutes from last week: http://www.w3.org/2007/02/06-dawg-minutes
14:34:43 <ericP> RESOLVED: accept http://www.w3.org/2007/01/30-dawg-minutes as a true record of the 30 Jan meeting
14:35:22 <ericP> RESOLVED: accept http://www.w3.org/2007/02/06-dawg-minutes as a true record of the 6 Feb meeting
14:35:42 <EliasT> I'll scribe.
14:35:56 <ericP> Next Meeting: 20 Feb, scribe: EliasT 
14:36:07 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
14:36:12 <jeen> Zakim, [IPcaller] is me
14:36:12 <Zakim> +jeen; got it
14:36:25 <ericP> Zakim, take up next agendum
14:36:25 <Zakim> agendum 2. "review action items" taken up [from LeeF]
14:37:28 <LeeF> ACTION: Lee to adapt text from 4.1.1 to specify how the protocol can  contribute to the base IRI for query evaluation as per #relIRIs in the QL spec [DONE]
14:37:35 <LeeF> ACTION: LeeF to add Andy's bnode label scope tests to CVS as unapproved syntax tests [DONE]
14:37:45 <Zakim> +Orri_Erling
14:37:45 <ericP> [DONE] ACTION: Lee to adapt text from 4.1.1 to specify how the protocol can  contribute to the base IRI for query evaluation as per #relIRIs in the QL spec
14:37:52 <LeeF> [CONTINUES] ACTION: AndyS to add text clarifying the prohibition on blank node labels in multiple BGPs to rq25
14:38:02 <ericP> [DONE] ACTION: LeeF to add Andy's bnode label scope tests to CVS as unapproved syntax tests
14:38:31 <ericP> action -1
14:38:34 <ericP> action -2
14:38:50 <ericP> ACTION: AndyS to add text clarifying the prohibition on blank node labels in multiple BGPs to rq25 [CONTINUES]
14:39:38 <ericP> ACTION: EricP to run the yacker tool over and annotate the existing tests [CONTINUES]
14:39:42 <ericP> ACTION: LeeF to remember that the wee, lost filter tests should be put [CONTINUES]
14:39:44 <ericP> ACTION: Lee to talk to protocol editors re: POSTing application/sparql-query [CONTINUES]
14:39:59 <ericP> Zakim, take up next agendum
14:39:59 <Zakim> agendum 3. "test suite" taken up [from LeeF]
14:40:01 <LeeF> Andy's blank node label tests: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JanMar/0068.html
14:40:52 <Zakim> -Simon_Raboczi
14:40:55 <LeeF> My results for these tests: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JanMar/0074.html
14:43:17 <Zakim> +Simon_Raboczi
14:44:59 <Zakim> -Simon_Raboczi
14:45:32 <LeeF> PROPOSE: to approve the syntax tests in data-r2/syntax-sparql4/manifest.ttl
14:45:59 <ericP> APPROVED
14:46:46 <Zakim> +Simon_Raboczi
14:47:06 <ericP> http://www.w3.org/2007/02/06-dawg-minutes.html
14:47:27 <ericP> -> http://www.w3.org/2007/02/13-dawg-minutes.html today's minutes
14:47:34 <LeeF> zakim, take up next agendum 
14:47:34 <Zakim> agendum 4. "base IRI" taken up [from LeeF]
14:48:03 <LeeF> re: base IRI and rfc 3986:
14:48:03 <LeeF>   http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JanMar/0067.html
14:48:07 <LeeF> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JanMar/0074.html
14:48:14 <ericP> LeeF: most substantial issue was the base IRI
14:48:28 <EliasT> Zakim, please unmute me
14:48:28 <Zakim> EliasT should no longer be muted
14:48:45 <ericP> ... RFC3986 contains a series of resolution steps for base URIs
14:49:00 <ericP> ... there was text in rq?? but not in protocol
14:49:30 <EliasT> http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc3986.txt
14:49:31 <jeen> fixed manifest checked in now.
14:49:53 <ericP> ... when drafting, I had a different interpretation than ericP
14:50:54 <ericP> [[
14:50:55 <ericP> if a URI was used to retrieve the
14:50:56 <ericP>    representation, that URI shall be considered the base URI
14:50:57 <ericP> ]]
14:51:23 <ericP> ... base URI should be HTTP GET with query parameters at the end
14:51:42 <ericP> ... in the SOAP/POST query, it should be just the endpoint
14:52:46 <LeeF> Otherwise, the  
14:52:46 <LeeF> "Retrieval URI" identified in 5.1.3, Base "URI from the Retrieval URI", is  
14:52:46 <LeeF>  
14:52:46 <LeeF> the complete URL used to send a particular SPARQL query to a SPARQL  
14:52:46 <LeeF> protocol service implementing the SparqlQuery  
14:52:47 <LeeF> interface.Determining the Base IRI 
14:52:49 <LeeF>  
14:52:51 <LeeF> Relative IRIs that appear in a [SPARQL] query are resolved against a base  
14:52:54 <LeeF> IRI as per [RFC3986] section 5.1, "Establishing a Base URI". If present in  
14:52:55 <LeeF> the query, the BASE keyword defines the Base IRI used to resolve relative  
14:52:57 <LeeF> IRIs per RFC3986 section 5.1.1, "Base URI Embedded in Content". Otherwise,  
14:52:59 <LeeF> Section 5.1.2, "Base URI from the Encapsulating Entity", defines how the  
14:53:01 <LeeF> Base IRI may come from an encapsulating document, such as a SOAP envelope  
14:53:03 <LeeF> with an xml:base directive. (See 2.3 SOAP Envelope. 
14:53:05 <LeeF>  If none of the above specifies the Base URI, the default Base  
14:53:07 <LeeF> URI (section 5.1.4, "Default Base URI") is used.
14:55:10 <LeeF> (scratch that text, copy/paste issues)
14:58:45 <EliasT> Zakim, mute me
14:58:45 <Zakim> EliasT should now be muted
14:59:53 <ericP> http://service.exmaple/SPARQL?quer=..+++++...&named="sdfd3434554654#$$5"
15:00:16 <ericP> WHERE { <.> ?s ?o }
15:00:26 <ericP> <http://service.exmaple/SPARQL
15:00:28 <ericP> >
15:00:32 <ericP> <http://service.exmaple/>
15:00:35 <EliasT> so the worry is simply if we explicitly say the endpoint URI and resolution is impacted by slashes we are in trouble.
15:00:55 <AndyS> Only case Lee and I found was <#foo>
15:02:35 <Zakim> -jeen
15:02:51 <LeeF> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2007JanMar/0073.html
15:03:11 <EliasT> Zakim, please unmute me
15:03:11 <Zakim> EliasT should no longer be muted
15:03:39 <ericP> [[
15:03:42 <ericP> The "Retrieval URI" identified in 5.1.3, Base "URI from the Retrieval URI", is the URL from which a particular SPARQL query was retrieved.
15:03:45 <ericP> ]]
15:06:39 <jeen> jeen has joined #dawg
15:09:33 <LeeF> from 1.2.2 (from Andy's email)
15:09:37 <LeeF> [[ 
15:09:37 <LeeF> ... 
15:09:37 <LeeF> To use that access mechanism to perform an action on the 
15:09:37 <LeeF>     URI's resource is to "dereference" the URI. 
15:09:37 <LeeF>  
15:09:38 <LeeF> When URIs are used within information retrieval systems to identify 
15:09:40 <LeeF>     sources of information, the most common form of URI dereference is 
15:09:42 <LeeF>     "retrieval": making use of a URI in order to retrieve a 
15:09:44 <LeeF>     representation of its associated resource. 
15:09:46 <LeeF> ]]
15:09:54 <Zakim> +??P32
15:10:02 <jeen> Zakim, ??P32 is me
15:10:02 <Zakim> +jeen; got it
15:11:59 <ericP> does "from which a particular SPARQL query was retrieved." contradict using http://service.exmaple/SPARQL?quer=..+++++...&named="sdfd3434554654#$$5" as the endpoint?
15:12:06 <ericP> s/endpoint/base/
15:12:13 <ericP> EliasT: no
15:12:59 <ericP> "from which a particular SPARQL query was retrieved. (Please note XXX in the SPARQL Protocol.)"
15:16:44 <SimonR> Are we talking about where the query was retrieved from (e.g. an .rq file somewhere) or where the result set was retrieved from (the endpoint)?
15:17:25 <EliasT> SimonR: both, sort of.
15:17:26 <LeeF> SimonR, well we need the base IRI for the query... so the reading of 3986 should be the retrieval URI of the query -- but that could be either of your choices, right?
15:18:12 <SimonR> Well, no...I'd say it would be the first.  If we were being super-pedantic.
15:18:36 <EliasT> right, but that's *if*, we currently don't support retrieving .rq queries.
15:19:02 <LeeF> If you're processing http://example.org/sparql?query=SELECT...
15:19:02 <LeeF> and I ask you for the retrieval URI of the query, is the correct answer "none" or "http://example.org/sparql?query=SELECT..." ?
15:19:34 <AndyS> If there is a secondary retrive to get the query then that is the new base.  c.f.
15:19:45 <AndyS> SELECT FROM <http://example/daat
15:20:10 <AndyS> SELECT FROM <http://example/data> which resets the base for reading the FROM
15:25:02 <Zakim> -jeen
15:26:01 <LeeF> 04 01If you're processing http://example.org/sparql?query=SELECT...
15:26:01 <LeeF>  
15:26:01 <LeeF>  and I ask you for the retrieval URI of the query, is the correct answer "none" or "http://example.org/sparql?query=SELECT..." ?
15:26:51 <ericP> base OR xml:base OR resolutionURI OR service-defined
15:27:42 <ericP> | service-defined is advised to default to service?mush
15:28:02 <LeeF>  
15:28:02 <LeeF> [[ 
15:28:02 <LeeF> ... 
15:28:02 <LeeF> To use that access mechanism to perform an action on the 
15:28:02 <LeeF>     URI's resource is to "dereference" the URI. 
15:28:04 <LeeF>  
15:28:06 <LeeF> When URIs are used within information retrieval systems to identify 
15:28:08 <LeeF>     sources of information, the most common form of URI dereference is 
15:28:10 <LeeF>     "retrieval": making use of a URI in order to retrieve a 
15:28:12 <LeeF>     representation of its associated resource. 
15:28:14 <LeeF> ]]
15:29:01 <ericP> does "http://example.org/sparql?query=SELECT..." give a representation of a SPARQL query?
15:30:45 <SimonR> +1 to extend
15:31:46 <ericP> i think rfc3986.5.1.3("http://example.org/sparql?query=SELECT...") gives a base URI for the result set
15:32:22 <EliasT> Zakim, mute me
15:32:22 <Zakim> EliasT should now be muted
15:34:51 <EliasT> Zakim, unmute me
15:34:52 <Zakim> EliasT should no longer be muted
15:35:28 <LeeF> <h20>
15:35:32 <LeeF> <h2o>
15:35:48 <ericP> { ?chem :bondsTo <h2o> }
15:36:18 <AndyS> also   FROM <data.rdf>
15:41:57 <ericP> PROPOSED: base uri resolution in sparql protocol comes from: base OR xml:base OR resolutionURI OR service-defined where service-defined is advised to default to service?mush
15:44:30 <ericP> PROPOSED: The SPARLQ Protocol does not derefrence query URIs so 5.1.3 does not apply. Per 5.1.4, services must define their own base URI, which may be the service invocation URI.
15:48:20 <ericP> PROPOSED: ed(The SPARLQ Protocol does not derefrence query URIs so 5.1.3 does not apply. Per 5.1.4, services must define their own base URI, which may be the service invocation URI.)
15:48:36 <LeeF> seconded by EliasT
15:49:04 <LeeF> approved, SimonR abstaining
15:49:05 <ericP> APPROVED: SimonR abstains
15:49:25 <LeeF> ACTION: Elias to add wording for PROPOSED: ed(The SPARLQ Protocol does not derefrence query URIs so 5.1.3 does not apply. Per 5.1.4, services must define their own base URI, which may be the service invocation URI.)
15:49:36 <LeeF> zakim, agenda?
15:49:36 <Zakim> I see 3 items remaining on the agenda:
15:49:37 <Zakim> 4. base IRI [from LeeF]
15:49:38 <Zakim> 5. minimal test suite [from LeeF]
15:49:40 <Zakim> 6. rq25 status [from LeeF]
15:49:51 <ericP> LeeF: tx all for muddling through this
15:50:05 <ericP> ... tx to SimonR for review start
15:50:19 <ericP> ... all: please keep the reviews flowing
15:50:25 <Zakim> -Orri_Erling
15:50:26 <Zakim> -EliasT
15:50:33 <SimonR> Adjourned at 15:50 Z.
15:50:34 <Zakim> -LeeF
15:51:09 <Zakim> -Simon_Raboczi
16:02:38 <Zakim> -AndyS
16:02:51 <ericP> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:02:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/02/13-dawg-minutes.html ericP
16:03:01 <ericP> Zakim, please make logs world-visible
16:03:13 <Zakim> I don't understand 'please make logs world-visible', ericP
16:03:13 <ericP> zakim?
16:03:18 <ericP> ugh
16:03:47 <ericP> RRSAgent, please make logs world-visible
16:03:58 <ericP> huh, i thought it was different agents for the two
16:04:02 <Zakim> -ericP
16:04:04 <Zakim> SW_DAWG()9:30AM has ended
16:04:08 <Zakim> Attendees were AndyS, EliasT, Simon_Raboczi, LeeF, ericP, jeen, Orri_Erling
16:04:52 <LeeF> ericP, it's like you've never worked here before :-)
16:05:32 <ericP> yes, every day
16:22:43 <EliasT> EliasT has left #dawg
16:28:18 <ericP> minutes sent within 24 mins of getting off the phone -- a new record for me
16:28:35 <LeeF> hear hear!