IRC log of swd on 2007-01-09

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:54:04 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #swd
15:54:04 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2007/01/09-swd-irc
15:54:08 [RalphS]
zakim, this will be swd
15:54:08 [Zakim]
ok, RalphS; I see SW_SWD()11:00AM scheduled to start in 6 minutes
15:54:15 [RalphS]
Meeting: SemWeb Deployment WG
15:55:55 [TomB]
TomB has joined #swd
15:57:02 [Zakim]
SW_SWD()11:00AM has now started
15:57:09 [Zakim]
+??P1
15:57:19 [Guus]
Guus has joined #swd
15:57:24 [TomB]
zakim, ??P1 is TomB
15:57:24 [Zakim]
+TomB; got it
15:57:31 [Elisa]
Elisa has joined #swd
15:58:16 [Zakim]
+Ralph
15:58:20 [Zakim]
+Elisa_Kendall
15:58:44 [berrueta]
berrueta has joined #swd
15:58:46 [JonP]
JonP has joined #swd
15:58:54 [RalphS]
rrsagent, please make record public
15:58:57 [Zakim]
+??P31
15:58:58 [dlrubin]
dlrubin has joined #swd
15:59:03 [Antoine]
Antoine has joined #swd
15:59:33 [Zakim]
+[VrijeUni]
15:59:41 [Zakim]
+Jon_Phipps
15:59:59 [Guus]
zakim, [VrijeUni] is Guus
15:59:59 [Zakim]
+Guus; got it
16:00:03 [RalphS]
zakim, ??p31 is Daniel
16:00:03 [Zakim]
+Daniel; got it
16:00:11 [aliman]
aliman has joined #swd
16:00:27 [Zakim]
+Antoine_Isaac
16:00:32 [Zakim]
+CarlosI
16:00:44 [berrueta]
Zakim, CarlosI is me
16:00:44 [Zakim]
+berrueta; got it
16:00:50 [Zakim]
+??P40
16:01:00 [JonP]
zakim, JonP is Jon_Phipps
16:01:01 [Zakim]
+Jon_Phipps; got it
16:01:01 [Bern]
Bern has joined #swd
16:01:03 [seanb]
seanb has joined #swd
16:01:06 [Guus]
zakim, ??p40 is aliman
16:01:07 [Zakim]
+aliman; got it
16:01:10 [Zakim]
+Bernnard_Horan
16:01:45 [RalphS]
zakim, Bernnard_Horan is really Bernard_Horan
16:01:48 [Zakim]
+Bernard_Horan; got it
16:01:58 [Guus]
zakim, who is here?
16:02:00 [Zakim]
On the phone I see TomB, Ralph, Elisa_Kendall, Daniel, Guus, Jon_Phipps.a, Antoine_Isaac, berrueta, aliman, Bernard_Horan
16:02:15 [Zakim]
On IRC I see seanb, Bern, aliman, Antoine, dlrubin, JonP, berrueta, Elisa, Guus, TomB, RRSAgent, Zakim, RalphS
16:02:31 [RalphS]
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Jan/0008.html
16:02:46 [RalphS]
Previous: 2006-12-19 http://www.w3.org/2006/12/19-swd-minutes.html
16:02:50 [RalphS]
zakim, pick a victim
16:02:59 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Guus
16:03:02 [RalphS]
zakim, pick a victim
16:03:03 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Jon_Phipps.a
16:03:05 [RalphS]
zakim, pick a victim
16:03:05 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose TomB
16:03:07 [RalphS]
zakim, pick a victim
16:03:09 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Antoine_Isaac
16:03:12 [RalphS]
zakim, pick a victim
16:03:12 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Daniel
16:03:33 [RalphS]
zakim, pick a victim
16:03:33 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Guus
16:03:34 [RalphS]
zakim, pick a victim
16:03:37 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Bernard_Horan
16:03:56 [Zakim]
+??P46
16:04:12 [Guus]
zakim, ??p46 is Sean
16:04:17 [Zakim]
+Sean; got it
16:04:19 [RalphS]
Scribe: Ralph
16:04:29 [RalphS]
Guus: best new year wishes to everyone
16:04:38 [RalphS]
Chair: Guus
16:04:44 [dlrubin]
dlrubin has left #swd
16:04:45 [RalphS]
Topic: Admin
16:05:02 [Guus]
zakim, who is here?
16:05:19 [dlrubin]
dlrubin has joined #swd
16:05:42 [Zakim]
On the phone I see TomB, Ralph, Elisa_Kendall, Daniel, Guus, Jon_Phipps.a, Antoine_Isaac, berrueta, aliman, Bernard_Horan, Sean
16:05:50 [RalphS]
RESOLVED: http://www.w3.org/2006/12/19-swd-minutes.html accepted as minutes of 2006-12-19 meeting
16:06:09 [RalphS]
RESOLVED: next meeting 16 January, 1600 UTC
16:06:11 [Zakim]
On IRC I see dlrubin, seanb, Bern, aliman, Antoine, JonP, berrueta, Elisa, Guus, TomB, RRSAgent, Zakim, RalphS
16:07:00 [RalphS]
ACTION: TomB and Guus to look at proposal for assigning scribe duties [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/05-swd-minutes.html#action01]
16:07:02 [RalphS]
-- continues
16:07:17 [RalphS]
next scribe: Daniel
16:07:48 [RalphS]
Topic: Face-to-Face Organizational Issues
16:08:05 [RalphS]
-> http://www.w3.org/2007/01/MGMoverview.html Multi-Group Meeting Logistics
16:08:18 [RalphS]
-> http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/Agenda20060122 F2F Agenda
16:08:30 [RalphS]
Guus: we have 8 WG participants registered as of today, with 4 observers
16:08:51 [TomB]
scribenick: TomB
16:09:14 [TomB]
RalphS: TBL wants to create Boston SW Users Group.
16:09:35 [TomB]
...since we are convening on Jan 22-23, opportunity to have "pre-launch" event
16:09:55 [TomB]
...so has asked if we could participate on Mon or Tues evening in some event
16:10:06 [TomB]
...could mean short presentations
16:10:58 [TomB]
Guus: no objections.
16:11:33 [TomB]
Regrets: Ben
16:12:20 [TomB]
Diego: not Tues evening
16:12:23 [TomB]
Antoine: ok
16:12:27 [TomB]
RalphS: ok
16:12:46 [TomB]
Bernard: no
16:12:49 [TomB]
Alistair: ok
16:12:56 [TomB]
Jon: ok both days
16:13:23 [TomB]
RalphS: meet for hors d'oeuvres then shorter dinner.
16:14:04 [TomB]
Guus: can present.
16:14:43 [TomB]
RalphS: Will be Web access - will be in MIT office area. Near WG meeting room.
16:14:55 [TomB]
ACTION: RalphS inform group on evening event.
16:15:12 [RalphS]
scribenick: RalphS
16:15:51 [RalphS]
Topic: SKOS Requirements
16:16:05 [RalphS]
[WITHDRAWN] ACTION: Alistair to prepare issues list for January meeting [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/11/28-swd-minutes.html#action06]
16:16:17 [RalphS]
[DONE] ACTION: Alistair will send the outstanding issues to the list and Jon will paste into the formatted page [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/19-swd-minutes.html#action05]
16:16:37 [RalphS]
[DONE] ACTION: Jon to create an issues page on the wiki [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/12-swd-minutes.html#action07]
16:17:29 [RalphS]
Guus: I plan to propose an issues-management process next meeting
16:18:11 [RalphS]
[DONE] ACTION: sean to submit SKOS and rules issue using agreed issue format, directly into issues wiki page (waiting for Jon) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/05-swd-minutes.html#action04]
16:18:20 [Guus]
q?
16:18:50 [RalphS]
-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Jan/0000.html Cookbook Issues page [Jon]
16:18:55 [RalphS]
Guus: accepted
16:19:38 [RalphS]
-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Jan/0001.html issues process ideas from Ralph
16:20:35 [TomB]
q+ to ask where (in the wiki?) we will describe "issues process"
16:20:49 [RalphS]
Ralph: there is another issue tracking tool that is available to the WG
16:20:59 [RalphS]
... I will send mail about it today or tomorrow
16:21:02 [Zakim]
TomB, you wanted to ask where (in the wiki?) we will describe "issues process"
16:21:10 [TomB]
http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/Deliverables
16:21:33 [RalphS]
Tom: do we want to capture the issues process in another wiki document?
16:22:11 [RalphS]
Jon: I copied the issues process from RIF
16:23:01 [RalphS]
Ralph: the records of whatever process refinement we agree to after Guus' proposal next week warrant their own Wiki page IMHO
16:23:41 [RalphS]
Guus: the substance of my proposal is whether to add potential-issues to the wiki before discussion or discuss first then add to the list
16:24:29 [RalphS]
Daniel: I have received input with feedback for one use case, partial input on a second and am awaiting 2 more
16:24:35 [RalphS]
... expect a total of four use cases from me
16:24:48 [Antoine]
http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RawUCs
16:25:03 [RalphS]
Antoine: there is a wiki page that sums up the use case descriptions we've received
16:25:13 [RalphS]
... the edited use case that Daniel submitted is included there
16:25:20 [RalphS]
... with placeholders for others
16:25:45 [RalphS]
... I have also cited other use cases that have been mentioned on the WG list
16:26:09 [RalphS]
... the idea is to check the correctness of these descriptions w.r.t. the questionnaire then move them to another page
16:26:17 [Antoine]
http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/EditedUCs
16:26:32 [RalphS]
... EditedUCs may be more usable for preparation of the document itself
16:26:59 [Bern]
Bern has left #swd
16:27:13 [RalphS]
Daniel: also the BirnLex UC [ready for EditedUCs]
16:27:36 [Bern]
Bern has joined #swd
16:27:52 [RalphS]
Antoine: I wanted the editors to take responsibility for moving items from RawUCs to EditedUCs
16:28:19 [RalphS]
Guus: we want to have documents for the f2f ready one week in advance
16:28:33 [RalphS]
... is it feasible to have a raw SKOS UC document in that time?
16:28:49 [RalphS]
Antoine: I intend to work on this in the coming week
16:29:05 [RalphS]
... prior to that I want to talk about the length of the descriptions
16:29:25 [RalphS]
... the existing Use Case documents use shorter descriptions than the ones submitted to us
16:29:46 [RalphS]
... should we summarize in our SKOS UC document or would we prefer to keep the full data?
16:29:53 [RalphS]
Guus: my preference is to keep the full data
16:30:10 [RalphS]
... might be nice to have in addition a short summary in terms of SKOS requirements
16:30:22 [RalphS]
... perhaps 2 paragraphs that summarize the key points
16:31:33 [RalphS]
Antoine: I can contribute an icon class use case
16:32:23 [TomB]
q+ to suggest including full data that is edited (e.g., questions removed) to improve readability
16:32:36 [RalphS]
Daniel: what are the tasks for the editors for this week?
16:33:10 [RalphS]
Guus: I would like the UCR editors to create a document that includes all the submitted use cases
16:34:36 [TomB]
http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/EditedUCs
16:34:59 [RalphS]
Ralph: I am quite happy leaving it to the UCR editors' discretion whether or how much to summarize a use case description
16:35:21 [RalphS]
Daniel: is there a document started already?
16:35:25 [RalphS]
Antoine: no, just wiki data
16:36:14 [RalphS]
Guus: just a compilation of responses is fine for now
16:36:16 [Zakim]
TomB, you wanted to suggest including full data that is edited (e.g., questions removed) to improve readability
16:36:33 [RalphS]
Tom: there are some things in the raw data that could be omitted just for readability
16:36:50 [RalphS]
... e.g. repeating the questions verbatim
16:36:52 [TomB]
http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/wiki/RucAims
16:37:29 [RalphS]
Tom: editors can use discretion in dropping repetitive information
16:37:50 [RalphS]
Daniel: I was thinking of an executive summary that captures what is important for SKOS
16:37:58 [RalphS]
Guus: sounds good
16:38:19 [RalphS]
Topic: SKOS branding
16:38:32 [RalphS]
-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2006Dec/0085.html [SKOS] branding [Alistair]
16:38:44 [RalphS]
Alistair: the issue is presenting SKOS in a way that is easier to understand
16:39:03 [RalphS]
... previously we'd divided SKOS into 3 pieces and the old Web site reflects that division
16:39:27 [RalphS]
... I think it makes more sense now to present all of SKOS as one thing, not divide into Core, Vocabulary
16:39:29 [aliman]
http://www.w3.org/2004/02/skos/webstage/
16:39:45 [RalphS]
Alistair: so I'm halfway through refactoring the SKOS website
16:40:01 [RalphS]
... to make a single introduction to the area
16:40:30 [RalphS]
... any objections to my continuing with this or suggestions?
16:41:48 [RalphS]
-> http://www.w3.org/Help/whereami which W3C mirror are you getting?
16:42:47 [RalphS]
Ralph: the wereami page may help in diagnosing access problems to the W3C servers
16:43:16 [RalphS]
RESOLVED: Alistair's refactoring of SKOS pages can proceed
16:43:33 [RalphS]
Topic: Other Deliverables
16:43:40 [RalphS]
Topic: RDFa
16:44:14 [RalphS]
-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Jan/0015.html [RDFa] Documents ready for review [Ben]
16:44:24 [RalphS]
Guus: I volunteered to review these documents
16:44:35 [RalphS]
ACTION: guus to review RDFa documents [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/05-swd-minutes.html#action08]
16:44:37 [RalphS]
-- continues
16:47:41 [TomB]
scribenick: TomB
16:47:52 [TomB]
RalphS: In BPD, had two reviewers.
16:48:08 [TomB]
Guus: Same process here - two reviewers not involved, then group decides.
16:48:37 [TomB]
RalphS: Guus is one reviewer. So essentially Ben is asking for a second reviewer.
16:49:24 [TomB]
Guus: For publishing first working draft, need to assess - "is it suitable for discussion with public?" - only
16:50:15 [TomB]
RalphS: No minimal definitions. Only real requirement: pass publication rules. Is it reasonable for publication?
16:51:20 [TomB]
Guus: At some point, editors say "we think it is ready". Two others send comments. There is a short discussion. Then chairs propose a decision for WG as a whole and WG decides.
16:52:05 [TomB]
...Diff from Recommendation. For WG, only "sufficient info for which we want feedback from public". Don't have to agree on everything. Must be of interest to public.
16:52:23 [TomB]
...Would expect new primer version, and Use Case document, to be good candidates.
16:52:27 [TomB]
Bernard: deadline?
16:52:46 [TomB]
Guus: pubn decision Jan 22-23 and review in the coming week.
16:53:30 [TomB]
...need one week for process.
16:54:23 [TomB]
Guus: people besides reviewers are welcome to comment.
16:55:02 [TomB]
ACTION: Daniel will review RDFa.
16:55:22 [RalphS]
Topic: Recipes for Publishing RDF Vocabularies
16:55:35 [RalphS]
[DONE] ACTION: Jon will choose one of the three issues pages, create a proposed format, and then post to the list for discussion [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/19-swd-minutes.html#action11]
16:55:48 [RalphS]
-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2007Jan/0000.html Cookbook Issues Page [Jon]
16:56:01 [RalphS]
Jon: I have to add a clarification to an issue that Diego posted
16:56:35 [RalphS]
Guus: the chairs open [accept] an issue and assign an owner
16:56:56 [RalphS]
... is Diego willing to be the owner of this issue?
16:56:59 [RalphS]
Diego: accepted
16:57:22 [RalphS]
s/this issue/issue COOKBOOK-I1.1/
16:57:40 [RalphS]
ACTION: Diego progress issue COOKBOOK-I1.1
16:58:22 [RalphS]
Topic: Deliverable 3: Principles for Managing RDF Vocabularies (namespaces, change management, versioning)
16:58:33 [RalphS]
Guus: leave this for next week or f2f as we're out of time
16:58:36 [RalphS]
[adjourn]
16:58:41 [Zakim]
-Daniel
16:58:42 [Zakim]
-Bernard_Horan
16:58:43 [Zakim]
-aliman
16:58:44 [Zakim]
-Guus
16:58:45 [Zakim]
-Elisa_Kendall
16:58:47 [Zakim]
-Sean
16:58:48 [Zakim]
-Jon_Phipps.a
16:58:49 [Zakim]
-Antoine_Isaac
16:58:51 [seanb]
seanb has left #swd
16:58:53 [Zakim]
-berrueta
17:00:12 [dlrubin]
dlrubin has left #swd
17:00:14 [Zakim]
-Ralph
17:00:18 [Zakim]
-TomB
17:00:35 [Zakim]
SW_SWD()11:00AM has ended
17:00:38 [RalphS]
rrsagent, please draft minutes
17:00:38 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2007/01/09-swd-minutes.html RalphS
17:00:39 [Zakim]
Attendees were TomB, Ralph, Elisa_Kendall, Jon_Phipps, Guus, Daniel, Antoine_Isaac, berrueta, aliman, Bernard_Horan, Sean
17:02:07 [RalphS]
rrsagent, bye
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
I see 5 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2007/01/09-swd-actions.rdf :
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: TomB and Guus to look at proposal for assigning scribe duties [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/05-swd-minutes.html#action01] [1]
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/01/09-swd-irc#T16-07-00
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: RalphS inform group on evening event. [2]
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/01/09-swd-irc#T16-14-55
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: guus to review RDFa documents [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/12/05-swd-minutes.html#action08] [3]
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/01/09-swd-irc#T16-44-35
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Daniel will review RDFa. [4]
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/01/09-swd-irc#T16-55-02
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Diego progress issue COOKBOOK-I1.1 [5]
17:02:07 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2007/01/09-swd-irc#T16-57-40