14:04:43 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dawg
14:04:43 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/11/21-dawg-irc
14:04:47 <kendallclark> zakim, this will be dawg
14:04:47 <Zakim> ok, kendallclark; I see SW_DAWG()9:30AM scheduled to start in 26 minutes
14:05:21 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda+ convene, bootup(), etc
14:05:21 <Zakim> agendum 1 added
14:05:29 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda+ sparql algebra
14:05:29 <Zakim> agendum 2 added
14:05:41 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda+ LHS of OPTIONAL
14:05:41 <Zakim> agendum 3 added
14:06:56 <AndyS> LHS of optional should be shortish - overtaken by events (in item 1)
14:07:16 <kendallclark> yeah, i thought that might be the case, but another agenda item can't hurt since we have so few :)
14:07:17 <AndyS> s/item 1/item 2/- opps
14:07:48 <AndyS> What about the comments list?  BobMcG's msg is about requirements more than anything else.
14:08:10 <kendallclark> ah, yeah, i forgot about that message... we do need to respond
14:08:24 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda+ Bob McGregor's uber-post on comments list
14:08:24 <Zakim> agendum 4 added
14:08:26 <kendallclark> thx andy
14:09:57 <AndyS> we can skip the personal bits :-|
14:10:45 <kendallclark> yes, please :)
14:11:02 <SteveH> has the telecon started?
14:11:32 <SteveH> oh, no, just seen zakim
14:21:47 <kendallclark> nice to see mark baker still has time to slander sparql protocol all over town :)
14:22:01 <kendallclark> i will give  him credit for one thing: he is doggedly persistent
14:22:56 <AndyS> I thought the "use a different verb (PATCH)" amounted to defining an update language (over POST) -- except one is more deployable.
14:23:24 <kendallclark> i don't like fundamentalists of any stripe
14:23:27 <kendallclark> good point, andy
14:23:57 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #dawg
14:29:50 <Zakim> SW_DAWG()9:30AM has now started
14:29:57 <Zakim> +Keio
14:30:00 <Zakim> +Kendall_Clark
14:30:18 <Zakim> +??P5
14:30:20 <AndyS> zakim, ??P5 is me
14:30:20 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it
14:30:26 <kendallclark> hmm, i don't see Elias, who offered to scribe this meeting
14:30:27 <ericP> Zakim, keio is me
14:30:27 <Zakim> +ericP; got it
14:30:42 <LeeF> zakim, code?
14:30:42 <Zakim> the conference code is 7333 (tel:+1.617.761.6200), LeeF
14:31:26 <EliasT> EliasT has joined #dawg
14:31:26 <kendallclark> zakim, who's on the phone?
14:31:26 <Zakim> On the phone I see ericP, Kendall_Clark, AndyS
14:31:52 <kendallclark> EliasT: you dialing in?
14:32:04 <EliasT> yes
14:32:07 <kendallclark> good :)
14:32:12 <kendallclark> zakim, who's making noise?
14:32:26 <Zakim> kendallclark, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Kendall_Clark (14%)
14:32:31 <LeeF> zakim, why won't you answer the phone?
14:32:31 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, LeeF.
14:32:33 <AndyS> just got quieter here
14:32:39 <Zakim> -Kendall_Clark
14:32:41 <Zakim> +Lee_Feigenbaum
14:32:45 <kendallclark> i don't think it's me, but i'll redial
14:32:48 <LeeF> zakim, Lee_Feigenbaum is me
14:32:49 <Zakim> +LeeF; got it
14:32:53 <Zakim> +Elias_Torres
14:32:59 <EliasT> Zakim, Elias_Torres is me
14:32:59 <Zakim> +EliasT; got it
14:32:59 <LeeF> zakim, mute me
14:33:00 <Zakim> LeeF should now be muted
14:33:02 <EliasT> Zakim, mute me
14:33:02 <Zakim> EliasT should now be muted
14:33:03 <Zakim> +Kendall_Clark
14:33:07 <AndyS> It's not you :  its there , when yr not
14:33:11 <kendallclark> ok
14:33:20 <kendallclark> i think it might be eric
14:33:44 <kendallclark> zakim, who's making noise
14:33:44 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who's making noise', kendallclark
14:33:51 <kendallclark> zakim, who's making noise?
14:34:00 <AndyS> some noise
14:34:02 <Zakim> kendallclark, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ericP (28%), AndyS (45%)
14:34:09 <kendallclark> zakim, mute ericP
14:34:09 <Zakim> ericP should now be muted
14:34:15 <Zakim> -AndyS
14:34:19 <EliasT> Scribe: EliasT
14:34:23 <kendallclark> zakim, unmute ericP
14:34:23 <Zakim> ericP should no longer be muted
14:34:26 <EliasT> Chair: kendallclark
14:34:32 <AndyS> zakim, who is making noise?
14:34:42 <kendallclark> it went away when i muted me
14:34:42 <Zakim> AndyS, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ericP (73%), Kendall_Clark (30%)
14:34:46 <kendallclark> sorry, when i m uted eric
14:35:05 <Zakim> +??P5
14:35:06 <AndyS> zakim, ??P5 is me
14:35:06 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it
14:35:11 <EliasT> Meeting: DAWG Weekly Meeting
14:35:33 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda+ meeting schedule for December
14:35:33 <Zakim> agendum 5 added
14:35:39 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda?
14:35:39 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda:
14:35:40 <Zakim> 1. convene, bootup(), etc [from kendallclark]
14:35:41 <Zakim> 2. sparql algebra [from kendallclark]
14:35:42 <Zakim> 3. LHS of OPTIONAL [from kendallclark]
14:35:44 <Zakim> 4. Bob McGregor's uber-post on comments list [from kendallclark]
14:35:45 <Zakim> 5. meeting schedule for December [from kendallclark]
14:35:57 <kendallclark> zakim, who's on the phone?
14:35:57 <Zakim> On the phone I see ericP, LeeF (muted), EliasT (muted), Kendall_Clark, AndyS
14:36:00 <ericP> was better with me muted?
14:36:38 <EliasT> Regrets: JeenB
14:37:00 <EliasT> Regrets+ FredZ
14:37:56 <kendallclark> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006OctDec/att-0149/14-dawg-minutes.html
14:38:32 <kendallclark> PROPOSED to approve those minutes as a record of the 14 Nov meetingh
14:38:43 <EliasT> Second it.
14:39:18 <EliasT> Next meeting - 28th Nov
14:39:21 <EliasT> Next meeting -- 28th Nov
14:39:32 <ericP> no!
14:39:33 <EliasT> Next meeting -- 28th Nov -- Scribe = ericP
14:39:38 <ericP> sorry, wrong day
14:39:47 <ericP> AC meeting
14:39:55 <ericP> right
14:40:33 <EliasT> Next meeting -- 28th Nov -- Scribe = AndyS
14:40:48 <kendallclark> zakim, take up agendum 5
14:40:48 <Zakim> agendum 5. "meeting schedule for December" taken up [from kendallclark]
14:41:41 <AndyS> Andy can make 5/12/19 Dec then 2/Jan/07
14:42:34 <EliasT> and me..
14:42:35 <ericP> XML2006 is Dec 5-7
14:43:16 <ericP> that's on the 6th
14:44:01 <kendallclark> zakim, take up agendum 2
14:44:01 <Zakim> agendum 2. "sparql algebra" taken up [from kendallclark]
14:44:26 <kendallclark> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006OctDec/0150.html
14:44:41 <kendallclark> SPARQL Algebra
14:44:43 <kendallclark> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/rq23/rq24-algebra.html
14:46:01 <kendallclark> Andy reviews SPARQL Algebra
14:46:52 <kendallclark> there's a kind of 'reduction' phase; turns groups into join combos
14:48:44 <kendallclark> to come: stuff on manipulating solution sequences
14:49:08 <LeeF> "where are the hooks for extending?" 
14:51:37 <kendallclark> +1 to that, Andy
14:52:18 <EliasT> ericP: I suggest you use unicode and specific XSLT to replace specific chars with images.
14:53:02 <EliasT> kendallclark: AndyS, will you add some fabric to connect the algebra with the prose?
14:53:32 <EliasT> AndyS: I was thinking of a stand-alone section with the algebra in rq24. I wanted to keep the terse presentation.
14:54:49 <AndyS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006OctDec/0140.html
14:54:52 <LeeF> pluggable BGP solution generating?
14:54:55 <AndyS> BGP matching
14:55:24 <LeeF> +1 to pluggable at that level rather than pluggable parameters to E-entailment regimes
14:55:52 <EliasT> ericP: Would it help to have a WG decision whether we'd support multiple rows???
14:56:22 <kendallclark> i think i don't support pluggable at all at this point, but i won't squawk about it
14:57:02 <EliasT> ericP: The reason for having bags/multiset is to support count/aggregate in the future.
14:57:16 <EliasT> ericP: I'm fired up about it and so is FredZ.
14:57:34 <EliasT> kendallclark: I think it's useful, so it's probably useful to have a decision.
14:58:00 <EliasT> ericP: I wrote a test that expresses bags if we want to discuss.
14:58:14 <EliasT> ACTION: ericP to bring up test on bags for next meeting.
14:58:38 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda?
14:58:38 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda:
14:58:39 <Zakim> 1. convene, bootup(), etc [from kendallclark]
14:58:42 <Zakim> 2. sparql algebra [from kendallclark]
14:58:43 <Zakim> 3. LHS of OPTIONAL [from kendallclark]
14:58:44 <Zakim> 4. Bob McGregor's uber-post on comments list [from kendallclark]
14:58:45 <Zakim> 5. meeting schedule for December [from kendallclark]
14:59:04 <kendallclark> zakim, take up agendum 4
14:59:04 <Zakim> agendum 4. "Bob McGregor's uber-post on comments list" taken up [from kendallclark]
14:59:12 <kendallclark> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2006Nov/0004.html
14:59:41 <ericP> tests on bags: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/#rdfsemantics-var-type-var and http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/#rdfsemantics-bnode-type-var
15:01:19 <EliasT> AndyS: I'm unsure of some of the claims regardng the WHERE clause. I'd like to see some more details on their language.
15:02:02 <EliasT> kendallclark: Bob is asking for sub-select queries. If so, we'll reiterate the reasons from our UC&R.
15:03:18 <EliasT> kendallclark: We should review with Bijan on the UNBOUND comment.
15:03:30 <EliasT> kendallclark: Is anybody willing to draft a response to Bob?
15:03:46 <kendallclark> sure, why not?
15:03:48 <EliasT> ericP: I can take a first stab on a response and ask for more details on his email.
15:05:11 <ericP> ACTION: ericP to seek clarification on http://www.w3.org/mod/20061110085518567.00000002912@bmacgregor1
15:05:37 <EliasT> PROPOSED: adjourn
15:05:44 <EliasT> AndyS seconds it.
15:05:49 <EliasT> ADJOURNED
15:05:54 <EliasT> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
15:05:54 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/11/21-dawg-minutes.html EliasT
15:06:00 <LeeF> happy thanksgiving, kendall. 
15:06:05 <kendallclark> you too Lee :)
15:06:10 <kendallclark> and everyone else who celebrates it
15:06:16 <AndyS> AndyS has left #dawg
15:06:20 <Zakim> -Kendall_Clark
15:06:33 <AndyS> AndyS has joined #dawg
15:07:24 <LeeF> We could at least ask whether the reason for no-shows is due to the time of the telecon... it's been a while since we considered a new time-of-week
15:07:43 <AndyS> Good point
15:08:03 <LeeF> ack
15:08:12 <LeeF> zakim, unmute me
15:08:12 <Zakim> LeeF should no longer be muted
15:10:04 <kendallclark> well, we considered it very recently, but didn't change :)
15:10:10 <kendallclark> SimonR isn't showing because of time
15:10:13 <kendallclark> FWIW
15:10:44 <LeeF> kendallclark -- recent change was just 14:30 vs. 15:30 consideration though, right?
15:11:00 <EliasT> ericP, could you make the minutes public?
15:11:00 <kendallclark> no, yr right
15:11:33 <kendallclark> the dwindling numbers do make life more difficult
15:11:47 <kendallclark> i'm not sure changing the time/day would help, but it's worth a discussion
15:12:02 <ericP> zakim, lake lots public
15:12:02 <Zakim> I don't understand 'lake lots public', ericP
15:12:09 <LeeF> i thought it also made a good... pretext... to ask people why they're not showing up and remind them of their responsibility to the group
15:12:11 <ericP> i never get this right
15:12:20 <EliasT> RRSAgent, make logs public
15:12:32 <ericP> zakim, lake logs public
15:12:32 <Zakim> I don't understand 'lake logs public', ericP
15:12:42 <ericP> zakim, lake logs world-readable
15:12:42 <Zakim> I don't understand 'lake logs world-readable', ericP
15:13:01 <LeeF> RRSAgent, make logs world-access
15:13:09 <AndyS> wine lake?
15:13:22 <ericP> sweet
15:13:44 <AndyS> Its late for him in Japan.
15:14:10 <EliasT> Japan?
15:14:18 <LeeF> AC mtg
15:14:20 <EliasT> nice.
15:14:35 <EliasT> me
15:14:41 <EliasT> Zakim, unmute me
15:14:41 <Zakim> EliasT should no longer be muted
15:15:25 <AndyS> zakim, who is on the phone?
15:15:25 <Zakim> On the phone I see ericP, LeeF, EliasT, AndyS
15:19:41 <Zakim> -LeeF
15:20:02 <Zakim> -EliasT
15:20:07 <Zakim> -ericP
15:20:09 <Zakim> SW_DAWG()9:30AM has ended
15:20:10 <Zakim> Attendees were Kendall_Clark, AndyS, ericP, LeeF, EliasT
15:20:34 <AndyS> AndyS has left #dawg
16:00:19 <Zakim> SW_DAWG()9:30AM has now started
16:00:22 <patH> patH has joined #dawg
16:00:31 <Zakim> +PatH
16:00:33 <Zakim> -PatH
16:00:37 <Zakim> SW_DAWG()9:30AM has ended
16:00:41 <Zakim> Attendees were PatH
16:01:17 <ericP> heya pat, hour off
16:03:50 <LeeF> LeeF has left #dawg
16:16:54 <patH> patH has joined #dawg
16:17:15 <ericP> "Fixing BGP matching" -- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006OctDec/0140
16:17:46 <ericP> "Status of the SPARQL algebra" -- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006OctDec/0150
17:40:00 <Zakim> Zakim has left #dawg