IRC log of tsdtf on 2006-11-14

Timestamps are in UTC.

12:54:48 [RRSAgent]
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logging to
12:54:56 [Zakim]
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12:55:08 [shadi]
zakim, this will be tsdtf
12:55:08 [Zakim]
ok, shadi; I see WAI_TSDTF()8:30AM scheduled to start in 35 minutes
12:55:18 [shadi]
meeting: TSD TF
12:55:30 [shadi]
chair: CarlosV, Christophe
12:56:02 [shadi]
12:56:09 [shadi]
scribe: Daniela
12:56:23 [shadi]
agenda+ Updated usage document
12:56:35 [shadi]
agenda+ CVS directory structure and first tests
13:16:27 [Christophe]
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13:22:24 [Daniela]
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13:25:18 [Zakim]
WAI_TSDTF()8:30AM has now started
13:25:25 [Zakim]
13:29:59 [ChrisR]
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13:31:08 [CarlosV]
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13:32:30 [Zakim]
13:32:43 [CarlosV]
I might join a couple of minutes
13:32:52 [CarlosI]
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13:33:12 [Zakim]
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13:33:42 [Christophe]
Zakim, [IP is ChrisR
13:33:42 [Zakim]
+ChrisR; got it
13:35:00 [shadi]
regrets: Vangelis
13:37:53 [Zakim]
13:38:04 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 1
13:38:04 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Updated usage document" taken up [from shadi]
13:38:18 [shadi]
13:38:27 [shadi]
13:38:59 [Zakim]
13:39:13 [Daniela]
CS: summarizes chages done in usage document
13:39:17 [shadi]
zakim, Johannes is really CarlosV
13:39:17 [Zakim]
+CarlosV; got it
13:41:05 [Daniela]
SAZ: will update usage document according to changes in TCDL 2.0
13:42:43 [Daniela]
SAZ: wasn't there a general agreement about adoption of HTTP Vocabulary and EARL location pointers?
13:42:50 [shadi]
action: SAZ to add the elements that were recently added to TCDL 2.0 to the "usage document"
13:43:01 [Daniela]
CS: currently working on last changes to be online later this week
13:43:08 [Zakim]
13:43:17 [shadi]
s/was't there general agreement/there was general agreement
13:43:30 [Michael_Cooper]
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13:44:21 [shadi]
action: CS notify mailing list once TCDL 2.0 document is updated
13:45:33 [Daniela]
SAZ: two more questions: first one about nesting of locations and techniques
13:45:51 [Daniela]
CS: techniques are after location (original proposal has been kept)
13:46:05 [Daniela]
SAZ: does this need further discussion?
13:46:10 [Daniela]
CS: not from my side
13:47:46 [Daniela]
CS: request came from error (techniques used at two locations)
13:49:00 [Daniela]
action: everybody review this part about locations and techniques and make sure you agree
13:49:22 [Daniela]
CI: could someone summarize the information in the mailing list?
13:49:25 [shadi]
start of thread:
13:50:09 [Daniela]
SAZ: second question about usage document: naming convention
13:50:51 [Daniela]
SAZ: naming convention works for metadata files pretty well, but when you start to name the content files, you could get problems if you want to reuse files
13:51:25 [Daniela]
SAZ: one test could be useful for more than one success criteria
13:51:47 [Daniela]
SAZ: how do we deal with that? copy?
13:53:46 [Zakim]
+ +1.202.638.aaaa
13:53:54 [Daniela]
CS: some techniques are relevant to more than 1 SC
13:54:34 [shadi]
zakim, aaaa is really Tim
13:54:35 [Zakim]
+Tim; got it
13:55:23 [Daniela]
SAZ: how are you dealing with this problem in the BenToWeb project?
13:55:38 [Daniela]
CS: we copy them
13:57:13 [Daniela]
SAZ: reusing creates a dependency, e.g. when you change the content for a certain reason you have to consider also the other success criteria that are attached to this test.
13:58:19 [Daniela]
SAZ: naming conventions currently only reflects success criteria
13:58:34 [Daniela]
SAZ: techniques are referred in metadata
13:59:17 [Daniela]
SAZ: is it a resolution to do duplication rather than directly reusing it?
13:59:34 [Daniela]
SAZ: any objections to duplication?
14:00:18 [Daniela]
RESOLUTION: test files used for more than one success criteria will be duplicated
14:03:59 [CarlosV]
14:04:23 [CarlosV]
14:06:47 [Daniela]
CV: there are subdirectories "metadata" and "testfiles" on first level in CVS which sould not be there
14:06:55 [Daniela]
SAZ: will delete those folders
14:08:08 [Daniela]
SAZ: any other questions or remarks on the usage document?
14:08:35 [shadi]
14:08:37 [Daniela]
SAZ: also working on an overview page (link "test samples" on the left hand side)
14:09:24 [Daniela]
SAZ: document should give an idea about the test samples repository
14:11:17 [Daniela]
SAZ: process for test samples does not yet exist - task force has to set that up
14:13:29 [Daniela]
SAZ: summarize: TCDL2.0 will use earl location pointers and http vocabulary, but that has not been in the document when I wrote usage document
14:13:43 [Daniela]
SC: currently work on http vocabulary
14:13:49 [shadi]
zakim, close agendum 1
14:13:49 [Zakim]
agendum 1, Updated usage document, closed
14:13:50 [Zakim]
I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
14:13:51 [Zakim]
2. CVS directory structure and first tests [from shadi]
14:13:54 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 2
14:13:54 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "CVS directory structure and first tests" taken up [from shadi]
14:14:50 [shadi]
14:14:58 [Daniela]
SAZ: have already talked about directory structure that before.
14:15:48 [Daniela]
SAZ: regarding the process, the document linked above could be a good starting point
14:17:44 [Daniela]
SAZ: have tests been developed according to this process?
14:18:04 [Daniela]
CR: yes
14:19:12 [Daniela]
MC: challenge was to get people to submit test samples
14:20:24 [Daniela]
MC: the process is ok, the problem is getting stuff into it
14:20:53 [Daniela]
SAZ: this task force is not a working group and has very specific goals - so this could be a benefit of this task force
14:21:13 [Daniela]
SAZ: we have stuff available, what we need is the process
14:21:37 [Daniela]
SAZ: what are the experiences from BenToWeb?
14:22:13 [Daniela]
CV: BenToWeb is currently working on review process.
14:23:46 [Daniela]
CV: there were heavy discussions about "test mode"
14:24:04 [Daniela]
when author creates test sample, the status is "draft"
14:25:18 [Daniela]
Then the first validator takes a look at the documents - any requests to the author to change, then "pending bugfix" - no requests, then "accepted by first validator"
14:25:37 [Daniela]
Then we still have a second validator and end user test
14:26:21 [Daniela]
ACTION: CV summarizes how process is done in BenToWeb
14:27:23 [Daniela]
SAZ: the test samples cannot be more stable than WCAG 2.0 and corresponding techniques, any changes in techniques need to have another review round
14:27:40 [Daniela]
CV: status of test case and status of WCAG 2.0 should be independent
14:28:38 [Daniela]
SAZ: new version of techniques would need new version of test samples.
14:29:23 [Daniela]
SAZ: this task force is not a decision making group within W3C process.
14:30:02 [Daniela]
SAZ: have to take that into account in our process
14:31:34 [Daniela]
SAZ: another aspect: how is a test sample assigned to somebody?
14:34:56 [Zakim]
14:35:01 [Zakim]
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14:35:03 [ChrisR]
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14:35:04 [Zakim]
14:35:05 [Zakim]
14:35:07 [Zakim]
14:35:08 [Zakim]
14:35:10 [Zakim]
14:35:11 [Zakim]
WAI_TSDTF()8:30AM has ended
14:35:12 [Zakim]
Attendees were Daniela, [IPcaller], Shadi, Christophe_Strobbe, ChrisR, CarlosI, CarlosV, Cooper, +1.202.638.aaaa, Tim
14:35:32 [shadi]
zakim, bye
14:35:32 [Zakim]
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14:35:39 [shadi]
rrsagent, make logs world
14:35:44 [shadi]
rrsagent, make minutes
14:35:44 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate shadi
14:35:45 [shadi]
rrsagent, make logs world
14:35:49 [shadi]
rrsagent, bye
14:35:49 [RRSAgent]
I see 4 open action items saved in :
14:35:49 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: SAZ to add the elements that were recently added to TCDL 2.0 to the "usage document" [1]
14:35:49 [RRSAgent]
recorded in
14:35:49 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: CS notify mailing list once TCDL 2.0 document is updated [2]
14:35:49 [RRSAgent]
recorded in
14:35:49 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: everybody review this part about locations and techniques and make sure you agree [3]
14:35:49 [RRSAgent]
recorded in
14:35:49 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: CV summarizes how process is done in BenToWeb [4]
14:35:49 [RRSAgent]
recorded in