IRC log of swd on 2006-10-31

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:49:28 [RRSAgent]

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logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-irc

15:53:53 [TomB]

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15:54:34 [Zakim]

SW_SWD()11:00AM has now started

15:54:42 [Zakim]

+Tom_Baker

15:54:55 [Zakim]

+Ralph

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16:00:37 [TomB]

RalphS, I lost my phone connection! Re-dialing...

16:01:46 [Zakim]

+ +1.781.442.aaaa

16:01:57 [Zakim]

+Tom_Baker.a

16:02:01 [berrueta]

berrueta has joined #swd

16:02:09 [seanb]

seanb has joined #swd

16:02:18 [RalphS]

zakim, aaaa is Bernard

16:02:18 [Zakim]

+Bernard; got it

16:02:36 [Elisa]

Elisa has joined #swd

16:03:12 [RalphS]

zakim, drop tom_baker

16:03:25 [Zakim]

+??P36

16:03:33 [berrueta]

zakim, P36 is me

16:03:34 [Zakim]

Tom_Baker is being disconnected

16:03:36 [Zakim]

-Tom_Baker

16:03:45 [Zakim]

sorry, berrueta, I do not recognize a party named 'P36'

16:03:47 [Zakim]

+??P37

16:04:12 [RalphS]

zakim, ??p37 is SeanB

16:04:12 [Zakim]

+SeanB; got it

16:04:26 [RalphS]

Meeting: SWD WG

16:04:26 [Zakim]

+Elisa_Kendall

16:04:28 [RalphS]

Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2006Oct/0054.html

16:04:33 [RalphS]

Previous: http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-swd-minutes.html

16:05:06 [dlrubin]

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16:05:29 [dlrubin]

could someone point me to the link where the dialin instructions live for this tcon?

16:05:47 [RalphS]

zakim, ??p36 is Diego

16:05:49 [Zakim]

+Diego; got it

16:05:58 [berrueta]

thanks, RalphS

16:06:00 [RalphS]

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2006Oct/0054.html

16:06:09 [RalphS]

agenda contains dialing instructions, Daniel

16:06:12 [fgandon]

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16:07:33 [seanb]

If Alistair Miles hasn't yet emailed to the list, he sends his apologies. He's been in Manchester for a meeting and will be travelling back now.

16:07:47 [Zakim]

+??P39

16:07:54 [RalphS]

Regrets: Guus Schreiber, Antoine Isaac, Alistair

16:08:06 [RalphS]

zakim, ??p39 is DanielR

16:08:06 [Zakim]

+DanielR; got it

16:08:16 [dlrubin]

Thanks very much. It would be nice if you put a link to the tcon details on the SWD web page (at least, I don't see it there)

16:08:34 [RalphS]

noted, Daniel

16:09:15 [Zakim]

+Rachel_Yager

16:10:31 [ryager]

ryager has joined #swd

16:11:00 [RalphS]

Scribe: Daniel

16:11:07 [RalphS]

scribenick: dlrubin

16:11:32 [TomB]

dlrubin: can you illustrate that please?

16:11:36 [dlrubin]

Tom: explaining how to scribe

16:11:44 [TomB]

...this is an example.

16:12:07 [dlrubin]

...continuing to explain

16:12:29 [dlrubin]

RalphS: need to say who scribenick is

16:13:06 [RalphS]

Topic: Admin

16:13:15 [dlrubin]

TomB: roll call. encourage people to do self-intros

16:13:20 [RalphS]

[Topic: introduces each agenda item]

16:13:22 [dlrubin]

...write a paragraph and post to list

16:13:36 [dlrubin]

...Motion to accept minutes from oct 24

16:13:48 [dlrubin]

...Seconded by Ralphs

16:13:59 [dlrubin]

...motion passed

16:14:12 [RalphS]

I added Rachel to the list of attendees

16:14:21 [dlrubin]

...two pending actions.

16:14:31 [dlrubin]

...next tcon will be 11/7

16:15:04 [dlrubin]

Elisa: As of Monday, the OMG announced ontology definition metamodel is adopted spec

16:15:24 [Elisa]

http://www.omg.org/cgi-bin/doc?ptc/2006-10-11 - ODM Specification

16:15:25 [RalphS]

[we should continue the incomplete actions explicitly; ala ...

16:15:33 [RalphS]

ACTION: Ralph consider a tutorial on scribe

16:15:33 [RalphS]

conventions [recorded in

16:15:33 [RalphS]

http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-swd-minutes.html#action01]

16:15:38 [dlrubin]

RalphS: pls add to list

16:15:42 [RalphS]

drop action 1

16:15:45 [RalphS]

rrsagent, drop action 1

16:16:01 [dlrubin]

action: Elisa to post announcement to SWD list

16:16:04 [RalphS]

ACTION: Ralph consider a tutorial on scribe conventions [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-swd-minutes.html#action01]

16:16:07 [RalphS]

-- continues

16:16:14 [dlrubin]

Topic: cost requirements

16:16:15 [RalphS]

[DONE] ACTION: Ralph to link to chris' telecon notes from SWD homepage [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-swd-minutes.html#action02]

16:16:24 [RalphS]

s/cost/SKOS/

16:17:09 [RalphS]

ACTION: Alistair give pointers to deployed SKOS systems. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-swd-minutes.html#action06]

16:17:12 [RalphS]

-- continues

16:17:21 [RalphS]

ACTION: Daniel to link his use case to SKOS draft [recorded in [19]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-swd-minutes.html#action01]

16:17:26 [RalphS]

scribenick: RalphS

16:17:36 [RalphS]

Daniel: I've talked with a couple of the groups I mentioned last meeting

16:18:02 [RalphS]

... it's a good opportunity; there interest in contributing to the development of a standard they can use to distribute their terminologies on the Web

16:18:11 [RalphS]

... they'd use SKOS if it meets all their needs

16:18:20 [RalphS]

... they're currently using OWL

16:18:50 [RalphS]

... how should we proceed to develop this use case?

16:19:16 [RalphS]

... the WG could give them a strawman and ask for feedback

16:19:26 [RalphS]

Tom: what is the current state of their terminology?

16:19:43 [RalphS]

Daniel: they are currently expressing their relationships in OWL

16:20:01 [RalphS]

... one group is using Protege frames but are planning to convert this to OWL

16:20:34 [RalphS]

Elisa: I have another similar opportunity; I have been asked by a group working on ISO 11179 to help them put this into OWL

16:20:51 [RalphS]

... they already have a lot of it in UML

16:21:02 [RalphS]

... and I have some tools to convert UML to OWL

16:21:26 [RalphS]

... because their work is evolving we may have the opportunity to impact it

16:21:32 [RalphS]

... Bruce Bargmeyer is my contact

16:22:32 [RalphS]

Tom: ISO 11179 is pretty big; it has 6 parts

16:22:45 [RalphS]

Elisa: parts 2 and 3 are relevant, part 3 is what I think is the focus

16:23:01 [RalphS]

Tom: this is a very interesting opportunity

16:23:35 [RalphS]

Daniel: this is connected to National Cancer Institute work and is a huge opportunity

16:24:18 [RalphS]

Elisa: see XMDR www.xmdr.org and look at latest UML and OWL versions

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16:24:39 [RalphS]

... though a bit out of sync with the document text

16:24:46 [RalphS]

... they've recently sent me XMI stuff

16:25:04 [TomB]

http://hpcrd.lbl.gov/SDM/XMDR/overview.html

16:25:10 [RalphS]

-> http://www.xmdr.org/ eXtended MetaData Registry Project

16:25:25 [RalphS]

Daniel: how much technical expertise is needed?

16:25:39 [RalphS]

Elisa: XMI is an XML serialiaztion of MOF, a subset of UML

16:26:05 [RalphS]

... they've sent me both OWL and XMI; the OWL is OWL-lite

16:26:58 [RalphS]

... also, Frank Olken is now at NSF; he was also involved in 11179

16:27:13 [TomB]

zakim, ack RalphS

16:27:13 [Zakim]

I see no one on the speaker queue

16:27:32 [dlrubin]

Link to ISO/IEC 11179: http://metadata-standards.org/11179/

16:29:08 [TomB]

RalphS: concern we might set too-high expectations re: SWD working group and 11179

16:30:26 [TomB]

Daniel: We use the use cases to drive evolution of SKOS - make sure it supports needs of other communities. Interest in 11179: is there stuff in there that should influence the evolution of SKOS?

16:30:36 [RalphS]

scribenick: tomB

16:31:20 [TomB]

...CABig - NCI Cancer Bioinformatics Grid - metadata for clinical trials uses 11179 for terminologies for data-capture purposes. Interoperability with SKOS would be great.

16:31:36 [TomB]

...Have ISO 11179 map to SKOS - make sure SKOS is compatible.

16:31:41 [dlrubin]

scribnick: Daniel

16:32:02 [TomB]

Elisa: Any review on SKOS compatibility would be very helpful - even informal.

16:32:13 [dlrubin]

Elisa: any help in making skos compatible with iso 11179 would be good

16:32:44 [dlrubin]

action: Elisa to keep us posted as SKOS/iso 11179 compatibility issue evolves

16:32:56 [dlrubin]

Ralph: there is already a working draft of skos

16:33:16 [TomB]

RalphS: Looking for Alistair informal presentation earlier this year...

16:33:23 [dlrubin]

...we should consider that to be the strawman

16:33:25 [TomB]

...our task is to finish the SKOS WD...

16:33:32 [TomB]

...based on feedback from 11179 and others...

16:34:27 [dlrubin]

...the reason to to skos work in this WG, it's important to have OWL expertise involved

16:34:41 [dlrubin]

...it could appear that OWL and SKOS are trying to represent similar types of relationships

16:35:10 [dlrubin]

...we want to make sure there is enough expertise to understand what OWL subclassing and SKOS broader/narrower is doing

16:35:29 [dlrubin]

...people familar with OWL would be good to be involved in setting skos reqirements

16:35:53 [dlrubin]

Elisa: we are still a smal group. Will there be more OWL best practices people

16:36:04 [dlrubin]

Ralph: not necessarily. We have 15 people in the WG

16:36:28 [dlrubin]

...Mike is interested

16:36:35 [dlrubin]

...we may persuade him to stay involved

16:36:46 [dlrubin]

Elisa: Deb has been travelling a lot...

16:37:01 [dlrubin]

...conf call conflict with rif call

16:37:28 [dlrubin]

...there are many people in Best Practices in the rif group

16:38:29 [dlrubin]

Ralph: probably can't move the call later

16:38:38 [TomB]

Elisa: Conflict with RIF call - SWD could potentially have more participants involved in RIF.

16:38:55 [dlrubin]

Action: Tom to discuss with Juus

16:39:02 [RalphS]

scribenick: dlrubin

16:39:20 [TomB]

Elisa: any day of the week at this time. Or move up one hour.

16:39:21 [dlrubin]

Elisa: any day of the week is fine, preferably after 7am.

16:39:44 [dlrubin]

Daniel: any day except Tues, preferably after 7am Pacific

16:39:59 [RalphS]

(elisa:7am == 7am US Pacific Time == 1500 UTC now)

16:40:00 [ryager]

I prefer to stay with the current time.

16:40:04 [TomB]

Daniel: same - any other day of the week. No earlier than 7am.

16:40:14 [dlrubin]

Seanb: likes this current time

16:40:17 [TomB]

Sean: likes this time. Could potentially change.

16:40:31 [dlrubin]

berrueta: likes this time

16:40:35 [TomB]

Bernard: rearranged this week around this time.

16:40:47 [dlrubin]

Rachel: prefer the current time

16:40:50 [TomB]

Rachel: prefer to stay with current.

16:41:26 [dlrubin]

Topic: short-term deliverables

16:41:42 [dlrubin]

TomB: anyone else able to report on RDF and XHTML tcon?

16:41:51 [dlrubin]

Ralph: Ben is traveling

16:42:00 [dlrubin]

...Nothing new to report since last week

16:42:42 [dlrubin]

tomb: We have finished the agenda

16:42:53 [dlrubin]

..propose we close early today

16:43:25 [RalphS]

-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2006Mar/0021.html rough minutes from Mandelieu informal meeting

16:43:43 [RalphS]

-> http://www.w3.org/2006/03/03-swbp-minutes.html#item07 Alistair on SKOS, RDFS, & OWL

16:44:16 [dlrubin]

TomB: meeting adjourned

16:44:17 [Zakim]

-Bernard

16:44:18 [Zakim]

-Rachel_Yager

16:44:19 [RalphS]

-> http://www.w3.org/2006/03/03-swbp-minutes.html#item04 SKOS discusssion

16:44:24 [Zakim]

-Elisa_Kendall

16:44:25 [Zakim]

-SeanB

16:44:35 [Zakim]

-Diego

16:44:39 [RalphS]

zakim, list attendees

16:44:39 [Zakim]

As of this point the attendees have been Tom_Baker, Ralph, +1.781.442.aaaa, Bernard, SeanB, Elisa_Kendall, Diego, DanielR, Rachel_Yager

16:45:23 [dlrubin]

rrsagent, list attendees

16:45:23 [RRSAgent]

I'm logging. I don't understand 'list attendees', dlrubin. Try /msg RRSAgent help

16:46:30 [dlrubin]

rrsagent, please draft minutes

16:46:30 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-minutes.html dlrubin

16:46:30 [dlrubin]

rrsagent, please draft minutes

16:46:30 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-minutes.html dlrubin

16:46:30 [dlrubin]

rrsagent, please draft minutes

16:46:30 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-minutes.html dlrubin

16:47:06 [seanb]

seanb has left #swd

16:47:08 [RalphS]

rrsagent, make record public

16:49:34 [TomB]

swick@w3.org

16:50:19 [RalphS]

Chair: Tom

16:56:02 [RalphS]

http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-swd-minutes.html

16:58:08 [RalphS]

http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-irc#T16-16-04

17:08:23 [RalphS]

http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/

17:08:24 [TomB]

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/2006Oct/0054.html

17:09:02 [RalphS]

http://www.w3.org/2006/07/SWD/

17:09:07 [RalphS]

http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swd-wg/

17:14:15 [dlrubin]

rrsagent, please draft minutes

17:14:15 [RRSAgent]

I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-minutes.html dlrubin

17:16:45 [Zakim]

-DanielR

17:17:33 [dlrubin]

Is there a problem that the minutes still have not appeared?

17:17:47 [TomB]

what do you mean?

17:17:50 [RalphS]

?? we've been looking at http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-minutes.html

17:18:13 [dlrubin]

I meant the new minutes that should be re-generated to show Tom as chair

17:18:35 [RalphS]

http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/wiki/TeleconEtiquette

17:20:05 [RalphS]

http://esw.w3.org/topic/FrontPage

17:25:19 [RalphS]

http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg

17:28:30 [Zakim]

-Ralph

17:28:31 [Zakim]

-Tom_Baker.a

17:28:32 [Zakim]

SW_SWD()11:00AM has ended

17:28:34 [Zakim]

Attendees were Tom_Baker, Ralph, +1.781.442.aaaa, Bernard, SeanB, Elisa_Kendall, Diego, DanielR, Rachel_Yager

17:28:39 [RalphS]

zakim, bye

17:28:39 [Zakim]

Zakim has left #swd

17:28:41 [RalphS]

rrsagent, bye

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

I see 6 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-actions.rdf :

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Elisa to post announcement to SWD list [2]

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-irc#T16-16-01

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Ralph consider a tutorial on scribe conventions [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-swd-minutes.html#action01] [3]

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-irc#T16-16-04

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Alistair give pointers to deployed SKOS systems. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-swd-minutes.html#action06] [4]

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-irc#T16-17-09

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Daniel to link his use case to SKOS draft [recorded in [19]http://www.w3.org/2006/10/24-swd-minutes.html#action01] [5]

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-irc#T16-17-21

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Elisa to keep us posted as SKOS/iso 11179 compatibility issue evolves [6]

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-irc#T16-32-44

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

ACTION: Tom to discuss with Juus [7]

17:28:41 [RRSAgent]

recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/31-swd-irc#T16-38-55