12:21:06 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #tsdtf
12:21:06 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-tsdtf-irc
12:21:21 <shadi> zakim, this will be TSD
12:21:21 <Zakim> ok, shadi; I see WAI_TSDTF()8:30AM scheduled to start in 9 minutes
12:21:30 <shadi> meeting: TSD TF
12:21:37 <shane> hi shadi
12:21:40 <shadi> chair: CarlosV, Christophe
12:21:48 <shane> I have been playing around here
12:22:04 <shane> since I am scribe today
12:22:11 <shadi> i see you got zakim on board
12:22:17 <shane> yep
12:22:20 <shadi> thanks in advance for scribing!
12:22:25 <shadi> scribe: Shane
12:22:26 <shane> but that is about it
12:22:39 <shane> np
12:23:00 <shadi> did you see these scribing directions: http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/scribes#scribing ?
12:23:13 <Christophe> Christophe has joined #tsdtf
12:23:21 <Vangelis> Vangelis has joined #tsdtf
12:23:38 <shadi> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-ert-tsdtf/2006Oct/0012.html
12:23:52 <shadi> agenda+ Quick final overview on TCDL 2.0
12:24:09 <shadi> agenda+ Progress on document for TCDL 2.0 use within the TF
12:24:20 <shadi> agenda+ First samples on SC 2.5.1.
12:25:18 <shane> I didn't see those notes
12:25:20 <shane> thanks
12:25:32 <shadi> zakim, code?
12:25:32 <Zakim> the conference code is 8783 (tel:+1.617.761.6200), shadi
12:28:22 <Daniela> Daniela has joined #tsdtf
12:30:06 <Zakim> WAI_TSDTF()8:30AM has now started
12:30:13 <Zakim> +Daniela
12:30:31 <Zakim> +Shadi
12:30:34 <ChrisR> ChrisR has joined #tsdtf
12:31:09 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
12:31:28 <Zakim> +[IPcaller.a]
12:31:29 <shadi> zakim, ipcaller is really Chris
12:31:29 <Zakim> +Chris; got it
12:31:41 <shadi> zakim, ipcaller is really Shane
12:31:41 <Zakim> sorry, shadi, I do not recognize a party named 'ipcaller'
12:31:43 <Zakim> +Christophe_Strobbe
12:31:46 <shadi> zakim, ipcaller.a is really Shane
12:31:46 <Zakim> +Shane; got it
12:32:04 <CarlosI> CarlosI has joined #tsdtf
12:32:07 <Zakim> +Vangelis_Karkaletsis
12:33:03 <shadi> zakim, who is on the phone?
12:33:03 <Zakim> On the phone I see Daniela, Shadi, Chris, Shane, Christophe_Strobbe, Vangelis_Karkaletsis
12:33:14 <Zakim> +??P8
12:33:38 <shadi> zakim, ??p8 is really CarlosI
12:33:38 <Zakim> +CarlosI; got it
12:34:52 <shadi> zakim, take up agendum 1
12:34:52 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Quick final overview on TCDL 2.0" taken up [from shadi]
12:36:15 <shane> cs: will needs to clean up  some minor details with TCDL 2
12:36:47 <shane> saz: everyone will need to review documents that are online
12:37:30 <shane> saz: need one week formal review before the docs go to review by other WG
12:40:21 <shane> sa: what is the main goal with TCDL
12:41:18 <shane> saz: TCDL provides metadata for the test samples for WCAG2
12:43:37 <shane> cs: TCDL files will demonstrate success and failure of a WCAG 2.0 technique
12:43:52 <Zakim> +Cooper
12:44:00 <Michael> Michael has joined #tsdtf
12:44:12 <shane> saz: TCDL is the metadata format for doining this
12:44:23 <Christophe> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/tests/usingTCDL
12:45:09 <shane> saz: since shane has missed a few calls, he can take a fresh look at using TCDL document
12:49:54 <shane> sa: how do we demonstrate examples such as explicit vs implicit form label association
12:50:58 <shane> sa: to what level of detail do we describe the test
12:51:12 <shane> saz: if it is an error we point to the error
12:51:17 <CarlosV> CarlosV has joined #tsdtf
12:52:14 <Zakim> +??P9
12:52:43 <shadi> zakim, ??p9 is really CarlosV
12:52:43 <Zakim> +CarlosV; got it
12:53:25 <shane> saz: TCDL links specific tests to WCAG 2.0 technique
12:53:52 <shadi> zakim, close agendum 1
12:53:52 <Zakim> agendum 1, Quick final overview on TCDL 2.0, closed
12:53:54 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
12:53:55 <Zakim> 2. Progress on document for TCDL 2.0 use within the TF [from shadi]
12:53:59 <shadi> zakim, take up agendum 2
12:53:59 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Progress on document for TCDL 2.0 use within the TF" taken up [from shadi]
12:54:25 <shane> cv: there was no reaction to the TCDL 2 document
12:54:29 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/tests/usingTCDL
12:55:56 <shane> cs: we decided to require link to WCAG2 technique
12:56:08 <shane> cs: that is not in the usage document yet 
12:57:32 <shane> RESOLUTION: each test sample developed by TF must be linked to a WCAG 2.0 technique or failure
12:58:28 <shane> saz: will be compiling a few editorial issue on document and will be sending them to the list
12:59:19 <shane> cv: do we need to look at the introduction
13:00:24 <shane> ci: I have no problem with the introduction
13:00:38 <shane> saz: worried that it is not friendly to new visitors
13:01:25 <shane> ci: small paragraph describing each element would be good
13:01:48 <shane> ci: also provide a template with each element
13:02:20 <shane> saz: templates and examples are good and clear but we should not describe element
13:02:34 <shane> saz: this will keep size of document smaller
13:03:12 <shane> ci: a small description would be helpful
13:03:32 <shane> saz: some elements (ie title) don't need a description
13:04:40 <shane> saz: elements that need extra consideration will have expanded description
13:05:42 <shane> ci: global TCDL should be global structure of the metadata
13:05:57 <Zakim> +Tim_Boland
13:06:28 <shane> saz: many headers and subheaders link to specification
13:06:44 <Tim> Tim has joined #tsdtf
13:06:53 <shane> saz: would like to see a more descriptive document
13:08:46 <shane> tb: are there two levels of audience 
13:09:12 <shane> saz: primary audience is the public
13:09:22 <shane> saz: and how they contribute test samples
13:09:53 <shane> tb: will there be a way to track test samples to avoid repetition
13:10:06 <shane> saz: there will be a web view of the samples
13:10:19 <shane> saz: we will also provide examples and templates
13:11:27 <shane> cv: the document is still rough but it may be difficult to keep it short
13:12:12 <shane> saz: overview section listing all the terms
13:12:24 <shane> saz: each term is linked to specification
13:12:47 <shane> saz: terms with specific usage get described in more detail
13:13:30 <shane> cs: there is a section called "terms and definitions"
13:13:48 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/TR/EARL10-Schema/#terms-list
13:14:28 <shane> saz: a listing similar to that used for earl might be good
13:17:27 <shane> ACTION: Shadi will work with Christophe in fine tuning the usage document
13:20:09 <shane> sa: would like to create a sample TCDL file
13:20:23 <shane> saz: learning by doing is good
13:21:37 <shane> saz: we need to compare samples to see if we are all thinking the same
13:22:50 <shane> saz: we can start on level 1 techniques for creating TCDL sample files
13:24:03 <shadi> zakim, close agendum 2
13:24:03 <Zakim> agendum 2, Progress on document for TCDL 2.0 use within the TF, closed
13:24:04 <Zakim> I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
13:24:05 <Zakim> 3. First samples on SC 2.5.1. [from shadi]
13:24:08 <shadi> zakim, take up agendum 3
13:24:08 <Zakim> agendum 3. "First samples on SC 2.5.1." taken up [from shadi]
13:24:14 <shane> do: adopted a benToWeb file should she use another example as a template
13:26:57 <shane> saz: samples that are uploaded belong to the group
13:28:08 <shane> saz: copyright for the uploaded documents belongs to w3c
13:29:09 <Tim> http://www.w3.org/QA/WG/2005/01/test-faq#legal
13:29:25 <shane> saz: any work done in the group is a collective work of the group
13:29:30 <Tim> Test FAQ Question on legal issues link
13:29:50 <shane> do: what do we expect at the end
13:30:01 <shane> saz: a repository of test samples
13:31:37 <shane> cs: will update his samples
13:31:58 <shane> saz: we need to start using the CVS system
13:33:08 <shane> ACTION: Christophe will add information about the file heirarchy to the usage document.
13:33:50 <shane> ACTION: Daniela and Vlachogiannis will upload their test samples to CVS
13:34:16 <shane> ACTION: Everyone will review tests and send comments to the list
13:34:34 <shane> ACTION: Shane will also upload a test sample
13:36:01 <Zakim> -CarlosV
13:36:02 <Zakim> -Vangelis_Karkaletsis
13:36:03 <Zakim> -Shadi
13:36:04 <Zakim> -Christophe_Strobbe
13:36:05 <ChrisR> ChrisR has left #tsdtf
13:36:06 <Zakim> -Daniela
13:36:08 <Zakim> -Chris
13:36:09 <Zakim> -Cooper
13:36:11 <Zakim> -Shane
13:36:13 <Zakim> -Tim_Boland
13:36:15 <Zakim> -CarlosI
13:36:17 <Zakim> WAI_TSDTF()8:30AM has ended
13:36:19 <Zakim> Attendees were Daniela, Shadi, Chris, Christophe_Strobbe, Shane, Vangelis_Karkaletsis, CarlosI, Cooper, CarlosV, Tim_Boland
13:37:00 <Vangelis> Vangelis has left #tsdtf
13:44:54 <shadi> zakim, bye
13:44:54 <Zakim> Zakim has left #tsdtf
13:45:00 <shadi> rrsagent, make logs world
13:45:06 <shadi> rrsagent, make minutes
13:45:06 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-tsdtf-minutes.html shadi
13:45:07 <shadi> rrsagent, make logs world
13:45:11 <shadi> rrsagent, bye
13:45:11 <RRSAgent> I see 5 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-tsdtf-actions.rdf :
13:45:11 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shadi will work with Christophe in fine tuning the usage document [1]
13:45:11 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-tsdtf-irc#T13-17-27
13:45:11 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Christophe will add information about the file heirarchy to the usage document. [2]
13:45:11 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-tsdtf-irc#T13-33-08
13:45:11 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Daniela and Vlachogiannis will upload their test samples to CVS [3]
13:45:11 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-tsdtf-irc#T13-33-50
13:45:11 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Everyone will review tests and send comments to the list [4]
13:45:11 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-tsdtf-irc#T13-34-16
13:45:11 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane will also upload a test sample [5]
13:45:11 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/10/17-tsdtf-irc#T13-34-34