IRC log of rif on 2006-08-22

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:29:54 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #rif
14:29:54 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/08/22-rif-irc
14:30:01 [Zakim]
Zakim has joined #rif
14:30:05 [ChrisW]
zakim, this will be rif
14:30:05 [Zakim]
ok, ChrisW; I see SW_RIF()11:00AM scheduled to start in 30 minutes
14:30:16 [ChrisW]
rrsagent, make logs public
14:51:24 [AlexKozlenkov]
AlexKozlenkov has joined #rif
14:55:15 [FrankMcCabe]
FrankMcCabe has joined #rif
14:57:19 [Harold]
Harold has joined #rif
14:57:21 [Zakim]
SW_RIF()11:00AM has now started
14:57:28 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller]
14:57:38 [FrankMcCabe]
FrankMcCabe has changed the topic to: 22 Aug 06 RIF Agenda: zakim, ipcaller is me
14:57:52 [FrankMcCabe]
zakim, ipcaller is me
14:57:52 [Zakim]
+FrankMcCabe; got it
14:57:54 [igor]
igor has joined #rif
14:57:56 [ChrisW]
ChrisW has changed the topic to: 22 Aug 06 RIF Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2006Aug/0017.html
14:58:03 [Zakim]
+Sandro
14:58:05 [Francois]
Francois has joined #rif
14:58:19 [mdean]
mdean has joined #rif
14:58:25 [MoZ]
Zakim, what is the code ?
14:58:25 [Zakim]
the conference code is 74394 (tel:+1.617.761.6200), MoZ
14:58:43 [sandro]
zakim, who is here?
14:58:43 [Zakim]
On the phone I see FrankMcCabe, Sandro
14:58:44 [Zakim]
On IRC I see mdean, Francois, igor, Harold, FrankMcCabe, AlexKozlenkov, Zakim, RRSAgent, ChrisW, sandro, MoZ
14:58:51 [Zakim]
+??P19
14:59:05 [Francois]
zakim, +??P19
14:59:05 [Zakim]
I saw ??P19 just arrive
14:59:08 [LeoraMorgenstern]
LeoraMorgenstern has joined #rif
14:59:10 [Hassan]
Hassan has joined #rif
14:59:10 [AxelPolleres]
AxelPolleres has joined #rif
14:59:23 [Francois]
zakim, please mute me.
14:59:31 [sandro]
zakim, ??P19 is Francois
14:59:33 [Zakim]
sorry, Francois, I do not see a party named 'Francois'
14:59:39 [Zakim]
+Francois; got it
14:59:49 [Zakim]
+??P11
14:59:51 [Zakim]
+Hassan_Ait-Kaci
14:59:52 [Deborah_Nichols]
Deborah_Nichols has joined #rif
14:59:53 [Zakim]
+[NRCC]
14:59:59 [Zakim]
+Mike_Dean
15:00:00 [sandro]
zakim, please mute Francois
15:00:01 [Zakim]
Francois should now be muted
15:00:01 [igor]
zakim, ??P11 is me
15:00:05 [Zakim]
+igor; got it
15:00:16 [igor]
zakim, mute me
15:00:16 [Zakim]
igor should now be muted
15:00:22 [Harold]
zakim, [NRCC] is me
15:00:22 [Zakim]
+Harold; got it
15:00:24 [Zakim]
+Peter_PS
15:00:33 [patranja]
patranja has joined #rif
15:00:35 [Zakim]
+[IBM]
15:00:36 [Zakim]
+Leora_Morgenstern
15:00:37 [Zakim]
+Deborah_Nichols
15:00:45 [LeoraMorgenstern]
zakim, please mute me
15:00:45 [Zakim]
Leora_Morgenstern should now be muted
15:00:46 [ChrisW]
zakim, [ibm] is temporarily me
15:00:46 [Zakim]
+ChrisW; got it
15:00:53 [johnhall]
johnhall has joined #rif
15:00:58 [ChrisW]
zakim, who is here?
15:00:58 [Zakim]
On the phone I see FrankMcCabe, Sandro, Francois (muted), igor (muted), Harold, Hassan_Ait-Kaci (muted), Mike_Dean, Peter_PS, Deborah_Nichols (muted), ChrisW, Leora_Morgenstern
15:01:02 [Zakim]
... (muted)
15:01:04 [Zakim]
On IRC I see johnhall, patranja, Deborah_Nichols, AxelPolleres, Hassan, LeoraMorgenstern, mdean, Francois, igor, Harold, FrankMcCabe, AlexKozlenkov, Zakim, RRSAgent, ChrisW,
15:01:07 [Zakim]
... sandro, MoZ
15:01:09 [Zakim]
+??P34
15:01:11 [Zakim]
+Axel_Polleres
15:01:25 [MoZ]
Zakim, ? is MoZ
15:01:25 [Zakim]
+MoZ; got it
15:01:25 [Allen]
Allen has joined #rif
15:01:42 [Deborah_Nichols]
hello from the muted
15:01:58 [StellaMitchell]
StellaMitchell has joined #rif
15:02:02 [pfps]
pfps has joined #rif
15:02:09 [Zakim]
+[LMU]
15:02:12 [pfps]
zakim, who is on the call
15:02:12 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'who is on the call', pfps
15:02:24 [Zakim]
+Allen_Ginsberg
15:02:34 [Allen]
zakim, mute me
15:02:34 [Zakim]
Allen_Ginsberg should now be muted
15:02:54 [Zakim]
+[IBM]
15:03:02 [StellaMitchell]
zakim, [ibm] is temporarily me
15:03:02 [Zakim]
+StellaMitchell; got it
15:03:20 [pfps]
zakim, who is here?
15:03:20 [Zakim]
On the phone I see FrankMcCabe, Sandro, Francois (muted), igor (muted), Harold, Hassan_Ait-Kaci (muted), Mike_Dean, Peter_PS, Deborah_Nichols (muted), ChrisW, Leora_Morgenstern
15:03:23 [Zakim]
... (muted), MoZ, Axel_Polleres (muted), PaulaP (muted), Allen_Ginsberg (muted), StellaMitchell (muted)
15:03:25 [Zakim]
On IRC I see pfps, StellaMitchell, Allen, johnhall, PaulaP, Deborah_Nichols, AxelPolleres, Hassan, LeoraMorgenstern, mdean, Francois, igor, Harold, FrankMcCabe, AlexKozlenkov,
15:03:27 [Zakim]
... Zakim, RRSAgent, ChrisW, sandro, MoZ
15:04:04 [Zakim]
+??P51
15:04:15 [ChrisW]
allen, can you scribe today?
15:04:38 [sandro]
Allen?
15:04:54 [AlexKozlenkov]
zakim, ??P51 is me
15:04:54 [Zakim]
+AlexKozlenkov; got it
15:04:54 [AlexKozlenkov]
zakim, ??P51 is me
15:04:55 [Zakim]
I already had ??P51 as AlexKozlenkov, AlexKozlenkov
15:05:00 [sandro]
zakim, unmute Allen_Ginsberg
15:05:00 [Zakim]
Allen_Ginsberg should no longer be muted
15:05:54 [AlexKozlenkov]
zakim, mute me
15:05:54 [Zakim]
AlexKozlenkov should now be muted
15:06:07 [johnhall]
CAn't get in on phone - have tried 3 times
15:06:15 [ChrisW]
zakim, unmute alex
15:06:15 [Zakim]
AlexKozlenkov should no longer be muted
15:06:22 [sandro]
What happens when you try, John?
15:06:47 [johnhall]
after entering code - silence then cut-off
15:07:24 [ChrisW]
zakimj, unmute leora
15:07:30 [ChrisW]
zakim, unmute leora
15:07:30 [Zakim]
Leora_Morgenstern should no longer be muted
15:08:31 [SaidTabet]
SaidTabet has joined #RIF
15:08:49 [Zakim]
+??P1
15:08:56 [AlexKozlenkov]
zakim, mute me
15:08:56 [Zakim]
AlexKozlenkov should now be muted
15:08:59 [SaidTabet]
zakim, ??P1 is me
15:08:59 [Zakim]
+SaidTabet; got it
15:09:05 [SaidTabet]
zakim, mute me
15:09:05 [Zakim]
SaidTabet should now be muted
15:10:15 [AlexKozlenkov]
zakim, who is here?
15:10:15 [Zakim]
On the phone I see FrankMcCabe, Sandro, Francois (muted), igor (muted), Harold, Hassan_Ait-Kaci (muted), Mike_Dean, Peter_PS, Deborah_Nichols (muted), ChrisW, Leora_Morgenstern,
15:10:17 [ChrisW]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rif-wg/2006Aug/0022.html
15:10:18 [Zakim]
... MoZ, Axel_Polleres (muted), PaulaP (muted), Allen_Ginsberg, StellaMitchell (muted), AlexKozlenkov (muted), SaidTabet (muted)
15:10:20 [LeoraMorgenstern]
LeoraMorgenstern has joined #rif
15:10:21 [Zakim]
On IRC I see SaidTabet, pfps, johnhall, PaulaP, AxelPolleres, Hassan, mdean, Francois, igor, Harold, FrankMcCabe, AlexKozlenkov, Zakim, RRSAgent, ChrisW, sandro, MoZ
15:10:43 [StellaMitchell]
StellaMitchell has joined #rif
15:10:44 [sandro]
resolved: Minutes from July 18th approved
15:10:49 [JosDeRoo]
JosDeRoo has joined #rif
15:11:02 [LeoraMorgenstern]
I'm in again, and I can scribe
15:11:19 [sandro]
Deferring discussion of Said's minutes, since we only got them yesterday.
15:11:26 [ChrisW]
scribenick: leoramorgenstern
15:11:51 [Zakim]
+??P3
15:12:17 [SaidTabet]
zakim, unmute me
15:12:18 [Zakim]
SaidTabet should no longer be muted
15:12:34 [AxelPolleres]
q+
15:13:12 [AlexKozlenkov]
said must be?
15:13:24 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Chris: SPARQL liaison (fill in later)
15:13:38 [SaidTabet]
zakim, mute me
15:13:38 [Zakim]
SaidTabet should now be muted
15:14:02 [SaidTabet]
zakim, unmute me
15:14:02 [Zakim]
SaidTabet should no longer be muted
15:14:16 [JeffP]
JeffP has joined #rif
15:14:18 [Deborah_Nichols]
Deborah_Nichols has joined #rif
15:14:27 [SaidTabet]
zakim, mute me
15:14:27 [Zakim]
SaidTabet should now be muted
15:14:52 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Chris: SPARQL is in candidate recommendation.,
15:15:16 [LeoraMorgenstern]
lots of discussion as to whether or not it is good.
15:16:16 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Sandro: after candidate recommendation, still need proposed recommendation
15:16:28 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Chris: Any news on SVR? ODM?
15:16:34 [LeoraMorgenstern]
No answers
15:16:49 [johnhall]
SBVR - Donald has established good liaison with ISO terminology groups. He is is Beijing this week at an ISO workshop.
15:17:21 [ChrisW]
http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/track/issues/open
15:17:30 [Deborah_Nichols]
chris, there are also open issues related to the UCR
15:17:39 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Moving on to use cases
15:18:35 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Chris: Deborah Nichols has moved all issues with the document into Issues Tracker. This will be our official vehicle for tracking issues
15:19:49 [Deborah_Nichols]
could we look at issues 3, 4, 9-11, and 21
15:20:15 [ChrisW]
zakim, unmute deborah
15:20:15 [Zakim]
Deborah_Nichols should no longer be muted
15:20:31 [ChrisW]
q?
15:20:37 [AxelPolleres]
q-
15:21:55 [ChrisW]
once again, we are here: http://www.w3.org/2005/rules/wg/track/issues/open
15:21:57 [LeoraMorgenstern]
(By the way, half of what I put into IRC isn't showing up, but I am keeping a separate off line copy)
15:22:19 [JeffP]
Sorry for the late, I seem to have problem dailing in
15:22:33 [ChrisW]
ok, thanks
15:23:24 [LeoraMorgenstern]
(I typed that in 5 minutes ago. Nothing is showing up. Will send out off line minutes later.)
15:24:16 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Deborah Nichols has moved all issues with the document into Issues Tracker
15:24:28 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Chris: This will be our official vehicle for tracking issues
15:24:48 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Chris: Everyone should be aware of open issues.
15:27:34 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Chris: Start looking at it, be ready to discuss next week
15:29:30 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Allen: Did issues of coverage ever make it into Open Issues?
15:29:48 [ChrisW]
zakim, who is on the phone?
15:29:48 [Zakim]
On the phone I see FrankMcCabe, Sandro, Francois (muted), igor (muted), Harold, Hassan_Ait-Kaci (muted), Mike_Dean, Peter_PS, Deborah_Nichols, ChrisW, Leora_Morgenstern, MoZ,
15:29:51 [Zakim]
... Axel_Polleres (muted), PaulaP (muted), Allen_Ginsberg, StellaMitchell (muted), AlexKozlenkov (muted), SaidTabet (muted), JosDeRoo (muted)
15:30:11 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Deborah: Issues 14 and 16 are related to coverage. Put one sentence into document about OWL-RDF coverage.
15:31:20 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Deborah: Would like to discuss several issues. 9,10, and 11 seem to be directly related to editing of docuemnt. Perhaps Allen and David could take these and just do them.
15:32:21 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Deborah: Issue 3: concerns XML syntax but raises a question. Who was it that raised the question? It needs to be sharpened.
15:32:43 [Zakim]
-SaidTabet
15:33:39 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Deborah: Should it be linked to critical success factor in document?
15:34:07 [johnhall]
Sorry, but with no phone and Zakim on a go-slow, I'm not getting much out of this
15:34:17 [johnhall]
I'll sign off and wait for the minutes
15:34:46 [JosDeRoo]
JosDeRoo has joined #rif
15:34:57 [Hassan]
q+
15:35:18 [ChrisW]
zakim, who is talking?
15:35:29 [Zakim]
ChrisW, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Peter_PS (14%), FrankMcCabe (21%), ChrisW (88%), Hassan_Ait-Kaci (12%)
15:35:32 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Chris: What were we talking about when we raised this issue?
15:36:16 [Zakim]
+ +1.503.317.aaaa
15:36:33 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Sandro: Don't remember any real discussion about this (xml requirement), Everyone thought this was obvious --- a basic requirement.
15:36:52 [ChrisW]
action: hassan to work with Frank to augment type discriminators proposal
15:36:58 [pfps]
zakim, mute me
15:36:58 [Zakim]
sorry, pfps, I do not see a party named 'pfps'
15:37:12 [MichaelKifer]
MichaelKifer has joined #rif
15:37:23 [pfps]
zakim, mute peter_ps
15:37:23 [Zakim]
Peter_PS should now be muted
15:37:30 [Hassan]
q?
15:37:33 [Deborah_Nichols]
Deborah_Nichols has joined #rif
15:37:34 [Hassan]
q-
15:37:41 [Deborah_Nichols]
q-
15:38:14 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller]
15:38:41 [AxelPolleres]
Can it be that the IRC problems are only on the web-interface?
15:38:44 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Frank: Big discussion about supporting w3c and supporting take up of the spec.
15:38:53 [AxelPolleres]
... I don't have any
15:40:07 [ChrisW]
action axel to add wiki page on "types of negation" by Sept
15:41:03 [ChrisW]
action axel to add paula's discriminators to questionnaire
15:41:14 [MichaelKifer]
zakim, mute me
15:41:14 [Zakim]
sorry, MichaelKifer, I do not see a party named 'MichaelKifer'
15:41:19 [ChrisW]
zakim, who is here?
15:41:19 [Zakim]
On the phone I see FrankMcCabe, Sandro, Francois (muted), igor (muted), Harold, Hassan_Ait-Kaci (muted), Mike_Dean, Peter_PS (muted), Deborah_Nichols (muted), ChrisW,
15:41:22 [Zakim]
... Leora_Morgenstern, MoZ, Axel_Polleres, PaulaP (muted), Allen_Ginsberg, StellaMitchell (muted), AlexKozlenkov (muted), JosDeRoo (muted), +1.503.317.aaaa, [IPcaller]
15:41:25 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Deborah_Nichols, MichaelKifer, JosDeRoo, JeffP, StellaMitchell, LeoraMorgenstern, pfps, PaulaP, AxelPolleres, Hassan, mdean, Francois, igor, Harold, FrankMcCabe,
15:41:28 [Zakim]
... AlexKozlenkov, Zakim, RRSAgent, ChrisW, sandro, MoZ
15:41:32 [MichaelKifer]
zakim, IPcaller is me
15:41:32 [Zakim]
+MichaelKifer; got it
15:41:36 [Hassan]
q+
15:41:36 [MichaelKifer]
zakim, mute me
15:41:37 [Zakim]
MichaelKifer should now be muted
15:42:27 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Sandro: this should be taken as an action to answer this question.
15:42:39 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Chris: applies to widespread adoption, perhaps.
15:42:47 [LeoraMorgenstern]
(that is, the XML requirement)
15:42:54 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Action on Frank to address issue 3.
15:43:33 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Deborah: issue #21: What does this mean? Rif isn't going to be translating from XML to XML as part of the spec. RIF representation of XML will be XML.
15:43:49 [AlexKozlenkov]
zakim, unmute me
15:43:49 [Zakim]
AlexKozlenkov should no longer be muted
15:43:53 [AlexKozlenkov]
q+
15:45:58 [Hassan]
q-
15:47:41 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Chris: That (embedding XML in RIF) is the idea.
15:52:01 [ChrisW]
action: alex to record questionnaire answers for JBoss and XUL in an email
15:52:42 [AlexKozlenkov]
zakim, mute me
15:52:42 [Zakim]
AlexKozlenkov should now be muted
15:53:11 [AxelPolleres]
ACTION: Axel to dump questionaire questions back to RAF wiki page
15:53:30 [AxelPolleres]
ACTION: Axel to include Paula's questions to questionnaire
15:53:33 [PaulaP]
+1
15:53:34 [Hassan]
+1
15:53:35 [Zakim]
-Peter_PS
15:53:38 [AxelPolleres]
+1
15:53:43 [PaulaP]
bye
15:53:43 [Zakim]
-Harold
15:53:44 [Zakim]
-AlexKozlenkov
15:53:46 [Zakim]
-Allen_Ginsberg
15:53:48 [Zakim]
-Sandro
15:53:49 [Zakim]
-StellaMitchell
15:53:50 [Zakim]
-Deborah_Nichols
15:53:50 [PaulaP]
PaulaP has left #rif
15:53:51 [Zakim]
- +1.503.317.aaaa
15:53:53 [Zakim]
-PaulaP
15:53:55 [Zakim]
-igor
15:53:56 [Zakim]
-Hassan_Ait-Kaci
15:53:59 [Zakim]
-JosDeRoo
15:54:04 [Zakim]
-MoZ
15:54:12 [Zakim]
-Axel_Polleres
15:54:18 [Zakim]
-Francois
15:54:30 [LeoraMorgenstern]
Deborah: Can clear up open issues page to make this clear.
15:54:49 [Zakim]
-Mike_Dean
15:55:01 [Zakim]
-ChrisW
15:55:03 [Zakim]
-Leora_Morgenstern
15:55:11 [Zakim]
-FrankMcCabe
15:55:15 [Zakim]
-MichaelKifer
15:55:16 [Zakim]
SW_RIF()11:00AM has ended
15:55:17 [Zakim]
Attendees were FrankMcCabe, Sandro, Francois, Hassan_Ait-Kaci, Mike_Dean, igor, Harold, Peter_PS, Leora_Morgenstern, Deborah_Nichols, ChrisW, Axel_Polleres, MoZ, Allen_Ginsberg,
15:55:20 [Zakim]
... PaulaP, StellaMitchell, AlexKozlenkov, SaidTabet, JosDeRoo, +1.503.317.aaaa, MichaelKifer
15:55:26 [ChrisW]
rrsagent, make minutes
15:55:26 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/08/22-rif-minutes.html ChrisW
15:56:13 [ChrisW]
rrsagent, make logs public
15:56:38 [ChrisW]
sandro?
15:56:45 [ChrisW]
rrsagent, list actions
15:56:46 [RRSAgent]
I see 4 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2006/08/22-rif-actions.rdf :
15:56:46 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: hassan to work with Frank to augment type discriminators proposal [1]
15:56:46 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/08/22-rif-irc#T15-36-52
15:56:46 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: alex to record questionnaire answers for JBoss and XUL in an email [2]
15:56:46 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/08/22-rif-irc#T15-52-01
15:56:46 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Axel to dump questionaire questions back to RAF wiki page [3]
15:56:46 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/08/22-rif-irc#T15-53-11
15:56:46 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: Axel to include Paula's questions to questionnaire [4]
15:56:46 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/08/22-rif-irc#T15-53-30
15:58:22 [sandro]
ChrisW?
15:58:37 [ChrisW]
can't get to the formatted minutes (permissions)
15:58:52 [sandro]
zakim, make record public
15:58:53 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'make record public', sandro
15:59:34 [sandro]
zakim, make minutes
15:59:34 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'make minutes', sandro
15:59:47 [sandro]
weird
15:59:51 [sandro]
zakim, pointer
15:59:51 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'pointer', sandro
15:59:51 [ChrisW]
rrsagent
15:59:55 [sandro]
right.
16:00:00 [sandro]
RRSAgent, make record public
16:00:06 [sandro]
RRSAgent, pointer?
16:00:06 [RRSAgent]
See http://www.w3.org/2006/08/22-rif-irc#T16-00-06
16:00:22 [sandro]
RRSAgent, make minutes
16:00:22 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/08/22-rif-minutes.html sandro
16:00:42 [sandro]
okay now, ChrisW ?
16:00:43 [ChrisW]
(I did all that before)
16:00:54 [ChrisW]
but it seems to have worked
16:01:07 [ChrisW]
is there a dif between "make logs public" and "make record public"???
16:01:12 [sandro]
I'm sure you did -- but I have a +4 ring of Demo Karma.
16:01:18 [ChrisW]
ah
16:01:22 [ChrisW]
mine is only +2
16:01:46 [sandro]
I'm not sure about "record" vs "logs". Maybe "logs" is only IRC and not also the geenerated minutes.
16:02:06 [ChrisW]
i'll try (to remember to try) that next time
17:51:33 [sandro]
sandro has joined #rif
18:08:22 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #rif
19:23:28 [pfps_]
pfps_ has joined #rif