14:27:40 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dawg
14:27:40 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/08/08-dawg-irc
14:27:45 <kendallclark> zakim, this is DAWG
14:27:45 <Zakim> ok, kendallclark; that matches SW_DAWG()10:30AM
14:28:09 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda+ 1. Convene [1]RDF Data Access WG meeting of Tuesday, 8 August, 2006  
14:28:09 <Zakim> agendum 1 added
14:28:30 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda+ ACTION updates
14:28:30 <Zakim> agendum 2 added
14:29:44 <kendallclark> zakim,  agenda+ Approving some value tests
14:29:44 <Zakim> agendum 3 added
14:29:56 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda+ DAWG Formal Semantics
14:29:56 <Zakim> agendum 4 added
14:30:13 <Zakim> +??P6
14:30:19 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda+ A brief word about mailing list etiquette
14:30:19 <Zakim> agendum 5 added
14:30:27 <ericP> zakim, ??P6 is ericP
14:30:27 <Zakim> +ericP; got it
14:30:54 <Zakim> +PatH
14:31:01 <Zakim> +??P12
14:31:06 <AndyS> zakim, ??P12 is AndyS
14:31:06 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it
14:32:05 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda?
14:32:05 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda:
14:32:06 <Zakim> 1. 1. Convene [1]RDF Data Access WG meeting of Tuesday, 8 August, 2006 [from kendallclark]
14:32:08 <Zakim> 2. ACTION updates [from kendallclark]
14:32:09 <Zakim> 3. Approving some value tests [from kendallclark]
14:32:10 <Zakim> 4. DAWG Formal Semantics [from kendallclark]
14:32:11 <Zakim> 5. A brief word about mailing list etiquette [from kendallclark]
14:32:42 <Zakim> +FredZ
14:33:06 <kendallclark> zakim, who's on the phone?
14:33:06 <Zakim> On the phone I see Kendall_Clark, ericP, PatH, AndyS, FredZ
14:37:39 <ericP> Meeting: Data Access Working Group Telecon
14:37:48 <ericP> Chair: Kendall Clark
14:37:53 <ericP> Scribe: ericP
14:37:56 <fred> fred has joined #dawg
14:38:33 <kendallclark> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006JulSep/0058.html
14:39:02 <ericP> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006JulSep/0058 minutes from 1 Aug 2006
14:39:26 <ericP> PROPOSED: approve minutes from 1 Aug 2006 as a true record
14:39:30 <ericP> APPROVED
14:40:04 <ericP> PROPOSED: meet 15 Aug at 14:30, scribe TDB
14:40:06 <ericP> APPROVED
14:40:20 <kendallclark> zakim, take up next agendum
14:40:20 <Zakim> agendum 1. "1. Convene [1]RDF Data Access WG meeting of Tuesday, 8 August, 2006" taken up [from kendallclark]
14:40:29 <kendallclark> zakim, take up agendum 2
14:40:29 <Zakim> agendum 2. "ACTION updates" taken up [from kendallclark]
14:42:02 <ericP> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006JulSep/0049 "proof" of nonmonotonicity in current text
14:42:32 <ericP> ACTION: EricP to respond to PatH's new test with a proof of whether it's monotonic to extended datatype support
14:43:11 <ericP> DONE
14:43:12 <ericP> action -1
14:43:44 <ericP> ACTION: KendallClark to reopen punctuationSyntax to take up commas in SELECT clause. CONTINUED
14:44:19 <ericP> ACTION: LeeF to make a test case out of the nested GRAPH scenario from DAWG email list CONTINUED
14:44:30 <ericP> ACTION: LeeF to To review rq24. CONTINUED
14:44:38 <kendallclark> zakim, take up next agendum
14:44:38 <Zakim> agendum 1. "1. Convene [1]RDF Data Access WG meeting of Tuesday, 8 August, 2006" taken up [from kendallclark]
14:44:55 <ericP> CTION: PatH to To write another open world value test to add to Andy's. WITHDRAWN
14:45:18 <ericP> ACTION: PatH to To write another open world value test to add to Andy's. WITHDRAWN
14:45:24 <ericP> ACTION: DanC to review PFPS's comments for more test cases CONTINUED
14:45:41 <ericP> ACTION: EricP to turn FredZ's test case sketches into tests. CONTINUED
14:46:31 <ericP> kendallclark, what is "ACTION: take up new issue concatenated nestedOptional" ???
14:47:35 <kendallclark> a new issue i decided to open the meeting before the June break, which I cannot at this moment describe w/out consulting the meeting minutes from that meeting
14:50:39 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda+ rq24 update?
14:50:39 <Zakim> agendum 6 added
14:50:53 <LeeF> LeeF has joined #dawg
15:03:42 <ericP> I think that "'II'^^roman:numeral = 2" has the same behavoir if backed by either "sop:value-compare(A,B) == -1" or "op:numeric-less-than(A, B)"
15:04:39 <AndyS> "'II'^^roman:numeral = 2" is error if Roman numerals are unknown 
15:05:31 <ericP> A = B  RDF termRDF termRDFterm-equal(A, B)
15:05:55 <ericP> A = B   RDF term   RDF term   RDFterm-equal(A, B)
15:09:15 <kendallclark> Does anyone have a proposal for leading us out of this? It's starting to seem a bit like a morass...
15:10:16 <patH> if I followed it, this seems to work
15:10:32 <AndyS> I believe sop:value-comapre does it - I'm willing to flesh it out.
15:11:24 <AndyS> It obeys the "every problem needs an extra level of indirection" maxim
15:11:36 <kendallclark> :)
15:13:23 <patH> whoops, that was a reference to andys mesage of a few days ago.
15:22:20 <ericP> number = number
15:22:27 <ericP> date = date
15:22:41 <ericP> string = string
15:22:49 <ericP> --------------------
15:22:58 <ericP> IRI = IRI
15:23:04 <ericP> bNode = bNode
15:23:06 <fred> literal = literal: true or error
15:23:19 <fred> iri = iri: true or false
15:23:26 <fred> bnode = bnode: true or false
15:23:33 <fred> allother cells always false
15:24:15 <ericP> 2=3
15:24:58 <AndyS> Yes, Fred - that's the table I was thing of.
15:25:38 <AndyS> bNode = literal (not bNode in query) may be valid
15:26:21 <AndyS> Separate sameLiteral operator.
15:26:31 <AndyS> if we want a syntactic comparision
15:31:51 <AndyS> "(x,y)"^^:geo
15:35:42 <AndyS> If you want help with this, do ask - I'm the one keen to have this extensibility so I feel responsible here.
15:35:51 <kendallclark> ACTION EricP: redraft section 11 to support extensible datatypes
15:37:14 <AndyS> sop:vaue-compare should return symbols for LE, GT, EQ and NE (or error)
15:38:05 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda
15:38:05 <Zakim> I don't understand 'agenda', kendallclark
15:38:09 <kendallclark> zakim, agenda?
15:38:09 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda:
15:38:11 <Zakim> 1. 1. Convene [1]RDF Data Access WG meeting of Tuesday, 8 August, 2006 [from kendallclark]
15:38:13 <Zakim> 3. Approving some value tests [from kendallclark]
15:38:14 <Zakim> 4. DAWG Formal Semantics [from kendallclark]
15:38:15 <Zakim> 5. A brief word about mailing list etiquette [from kendallclark]
15:38:16 <Zakim> 6. rq24 update? [from kendallclark]
15:38:29 <kendallclark> zakim, take up agendum 4
15:38:29 <Zakim> agendum 4. "DAWG Formal Semantics" taken up [from kendallclark]
15:39:32 <SteveH> ok, I dont have anything to add to format sem. anyway
15:43:40 <kendallclark> I've also heard problems re: DISTINCT because the spec doesn't really define identity sufficiently rigorously...
15:45:17 <AndyS> DISTINCT does not mean identity because it's separated from the entailment by the algebra.
15:46:03 <AndyS> It is systems that onlt answer BGPs that could do that - in general, there is no connection there.
15:46:08 <kendallclark> distinct requires some notion of identity, separated from entailment, it seems to me
15:46:45 <AndyS> It sort of has - it's term uniqueness.
15:47:42 <ericP> i am utterly convinced that one of PatH and FredZ may be right
16:00:37 <kendallclark> So we're 1 minute past our expire time :)
16:04:06 <Zakim> -Kendall_Clark
16:09:00 <AndyS> Fred -- I think the practical outcome is BGP's need a DISTINCT applied.  That's easily doable.
16:30:00 <Zakim> -ericP
16:30:12 <ericP> weak!
16:30:46 <Zakim> -FredZ
16:30:51 <Zakim> -PatH
16:30:52 <Zakim> SW_DAWG()10:30AM has ended
16:30:54 <Zakim> Attendees were Kendall_Clark, ericP, PatH, AndyS, FredZ
16:31:04 <AndyS> EricP - we finished as you'd gone.
16:31:11 <ericP> yeah, makes sense
16:31:18 <ericP> i think my phone got tired
16:31:18 <AndyS> Minutes machine?
16:31:28 <ericP> ADJOURN
16:31:36 <ericP> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:31:36 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/08/08-dawg-minutes.html ericP
16:31:40 <AndyS> Thx
16:31:45 <ericP> RRSAgent, please make minutes public
16:31:45 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'please make minutes public', ericP.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
16:31:45 <AndyS> CU - off now.
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