IRC log of dawg on 2006-08-08

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:27:40 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #dawg
14:27:40 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/08/08-dawg-irc
14:27:45 [kendallclark]
zakim, this is DAWG
14:27:45 [Zakim]
ok, kendallclark; that matches SW_DAWG()10:30AM
14:28:09 [kendallclark]
zakim, agenda+ 1. Convene [1]RDF Data Access WG meeting of Tuesday, 8 August, 2006
14:28:09 [Zakim]
agendum 1 added
14:28:30 [kendallclark]
zakim, agenda+ ACTION updates
14:28:30 [Zakim]
agendum 2 added
14:29:44 [kendallclark]
zakim, agenda+ Approving some value tests
14:29:44 [Zakim]
agendum 3 added
14:29:56 [kendallclark]
zakim, agenda+ DAWG Formal Semantics
14:29:56 [Zakim]
agendum 4 added
14:30:13 [Zakim]
+??P6
14:30:19 [kendallclark]
zakim, agenda+ A brief word about mailing list etiquette
14:30:19 [Zakim]
agendum 5 added
14:30:27 [ericP]
zakim, ??P6 is ericP
14:30:27 [Zakim]
+ericP; got it
14:30:54 [Zakim]
+PatH
14:31:01 [Zakim]
+??P12
14:31:06 [AndyS]
zakim, ??P12 is AndyS
14:31:06 [Zakim]
+AndyS; got it
14:32:05 [kendallclark]
zakim, agenda?
14:32:05 [Zakim]
I see 5 items remaining on the agenda:
14:32:06 [Zakim]
1. 1. Convene [1]RDF Data Access WG meeting of Tuesday, 8 August, 2006 [from kendallclark]
14:32:08 [Zakim]
2. ACTION updates [from kendallclark]
14:32:09 [Zakim]
3. Approving some value tests [from kendallclark]
14:32:10 [Zakim]
4. DAWG Formal Semantics [from kendallclark]
14:32:11 [Zakim]
5. A brief word about mailing list etiquette [from kendallclark]
14:32:42 [Zakim]
+FredZ
14:33:06 [kendallclark]
zakim, who's on the phone?
14:33:06 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Kendall_Clark, ericP, PatH, AndyS, FredZ
14:37:39 [ericP]
Meeting: Data Access Working Group Telecon
14:37:48 [ericP]
Chair: Kendall Clark
14:37:53 [ericP]
Scribe: ericP
14:37:56 [fred]
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14:38:33 [kendallclark]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006JulSep/0058.html
14:39:02 [ericP]
-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006JulSep/0058 minutes from 1 Aug 2006
14:39:26 [ericP]
PROPOSED: approve minutes from 1 Aug 2006 as a true record
14:39:30 [ericP]
APPROVED
14:40:04 [ericP]
PROPOSED: meet 15 Aug at 14:30, scribe TDB
14:40:06 [ericP]
APPROVED
14:40:20 [kendallclark]
zakim, take up next agendum
14:40:20 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "1. Convene [1]RDF Data Access WG meeting of Tuesday, 8 August, 2006" taken up [from kendallclark]
14:40:29 [kendallclark]
zakim, take up agendum 2
14:40:29 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "ACTION updates" taken up [from kendallclark]
14:42:02 [ericP]
-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2006JulSep/0049 "proof" of nonmonotonicity in current text
14:42:32 [ericP]
ACTION: EricP to respond to PatH's new test with a proof of whether it's monotonic to extended datatype support
14:43:11 [ericP]
DONE
14:43:12 [ericP]
action -1
14:43:44 [ericP]
ACTION: KendallClark to reopen punctuationSyntax to take up commas in SELECT clause. CONTINUED
14:44:19 [ericP]
ACTION: LeeF to make a test case out of the nested GRAPH scenario from DAWG email list CONTINUED
14:44:30 [ericP]
ACTION: LeeF to To review rq24. CONTINUED
14:44:38 [kendallclark]
zakim, take up next agendum
14:44:38 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "1. Convene [1]RDF Data Access WG meeting of Tuesday, 8 August, 2006" taken up [from kendallclark]
14:44:55 [ericP]
CTION: PatH to To write another open world value test to add to Andy's. WITHDRAWN
14:45:18 [ericP]
ACTION: PatH to To write another open world value test to add to Andy's. WITHDRAWN
14:45:24 [ericP]
ACTION: DanC to review PFPS's comments for more test cases CONTINUED
14:45:41 [ericP]
ACTION: EricP to turn FredZ's test case sketches into tests. CONTINUED
14:46:31 [ericP]
kendallclark, what is "ACTION: take up new issue concatenated nestedOptional" ???
14:47:35 [kendallclark]
a new issue i decided to open the meeting before the June break, which I cannot at this moment describe w/out consulting the meeting minutes from that meeting
14:50:39 [kendallclark]
zakim, agenda+ rq24 update?
14:50:39 [Zakim]
agendum 6 added
14:50:53 [LeeF]
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15:03:42 [ericP]
I think that "'II'^^roman:numeral = 2" has the same behavoir if backed by either "sop:value-compare(A,B) == -1" or "op:numeric-less-than(A, B)"
15:04:39 [AndyS]
"'II'^^roman:numeral = 2" is error if Roman numerals are unknown
15:05:31 [ericP]
A = B RDF termRDF termRDFterm-equal(A, B)
15:05:55 [ericP]
A = B RDF term RDF term RDFterm-equal(A, B)
15:09:15 [kendallclark]
Does anyone have a proposal for leading us out of this? It's starting to seem a bit like a morass...
15:10:16 [patH]
if I followed it, this seems to work
15:10:32 [AndyS]
I believe sop:value-comapre does it - I'm willing to flesh it out.
15:11:24 [AndyS]
It obeys the "every problem needs an extra level of indirection" maxim
15:11:36 [kendallclark]
:)
15:13:23 [patH]
whoops, that was a reference to andys mesage of a few days ago.
15:22:20 [ericP]
number = number
15:22:27 [ericP]
date = date
15:22:41 [ericP]
string = string
15:22:49 [ericP]
--------------------
15:22:58 [ericP]
IRI = IRI
15:23:04 [ericP]
bNode = bNode
15:23:06 [fred]
literal = literal: true or error
15:23:19 [fred]
iri = iri: true or false
15:23:26 [fred]
bnode = bnode: true or false
15:23:33 [fred]
allother cells always false
15:24:15 [ericP]
2=3
15:24:58 [AndyS]
Yes, Fred - that's the table I was thing of.
15:25:38 [AndyS]
bNode = literal (not bNode in query) may be valid
15:26:21 [AndyS]
Separate sameLiteral operator.
15:26:31 [AndyS]
if we want a syntactic comparision
15:31:51 [AndyS]
"(x,y)"^^:geo
15:35:42 [AndyS]
If you want help with this, do ask - I'm the one keen to have this extensibility so I feel responsible here.
15:35:51 [kendallclark]
ACTION EricP: redraft section 11 to support extensible datatypes
15:37:14 [AndyS]
sop:vaue-compare should return symbols for LE, GT, EQ and NE (or error)
15:38:05 [kendallclark]
zakim, agenda
15:38:05 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'agenda', kendallclark
15:38:09 [kendallclark]
zakim, agenda?
15:38:09 [Zakim]
I see 5 items remaining on the agenda:
15:38:11 [Zakim]
1. 1. Convene [1]RDF Data Access WG meeting of Tuesday, 8 August, 2006 [from kendallclark]
15:38:13 [Zakim]
3. Approving some value tests [from kendallclark]
15:38:14 [Zakim]
4. DAWG Formal Semantics [from kendallclark]
15:38:15 [Zakim]
5. A brief word about mailing list etiquette [from kendallclark]
15:38:16 [Zakim]
6. rq24 update? [from kendallclark]
15:38:29 [kendallclark]
zakim, take up agendum 4
15:38:29 [Zakim]
agendum 4. "DAWG Formal Semantics" taken up [from kendallclark]
15:39:32 [SteveH]
ok, I dont have anything to add to format sem. anyway
15:43:40 [kendallclark]
I've also heard problems re: DISTINCT because the spec doesn't really define identity sufficiently rigorously...
15:45:17 [AndyS]
DISTINCT does not mean identity because it's separated from the entailment by the algebra.
15:46:03 [AndyS]
It is systems that onlt answer BGPs that could do that - in general, there is no connection there.
15:46:08 [kendallclark]
distinct requires some notion of identity, separated from entailment, it seems to me
15:46:45 [AndyS]
It sort of has - it's term uniqueness.
15:47:42 [ericP]
i am utterly convinced that one of PatH and FredZ may be right
16:00:37 [kendallclark]
So we're 1 minute past our expire time :)
16:04:06 [Zakim]
-Kendall_Clark
16:09:00 [AndyS]
Fred -- I think the practical outcome is BGP's need a DISTINCT applied. That's easily doable.
16:30:00 [Zakim]
-ericP
16:30:12 [ericP]
weak!
16:30:46 [Zakim]
-FredZ
16:30:51 [Zakim]
-PatH
16:30:52 [Zakim]
SW_DAWG()10:30AM has ended
16:30:54 [Zakim]
Attendees were Kendall_Clark, ericP, PatH, AndyS, FredZ
16:31:04 [AndyS]
EricP - we finished as you'd gone.
16:31:11 [ericP]
yeah, makes sense
16:31:18 [ericP]
i think my phone got tired
16:31:18 [AndyS]
Minutes machine?
16:31:28 [ericP]
ADJOURN
16:31:36 [ericP]
RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:31:36 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/08/08-dawg-minutes.html ericP
16:31:40 [AndyS]
Thx
16:31:45 [ericP]
RRSAgent, please make minutes public
16:31:45 [RRSAgent]
I'm logging. I don't understand 'please make minutes public', ericP. Try /msg RRSAgent help
16:31:45 [AndyS]
CU - off now.
16:31:53 [AndyS]
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18:00:03 [Zakim]
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18:01:47 [LeeF_]
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