IRC log of ua on 2006-06-29

Timestamps are in UTC.

17:56:16 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #ua
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/06/29-ua-irc
17:56:29 [JR]
Zakim, this will be UAWG
17:56:29 [Zakim]
ok, JR; I see WAI_UAWG()2:00PM scheduled to start in 4 minutes
17:56:43 [JR]
Meeting: WAI UA
17:56:55 [JR]
Scribe: JR
17:57:05 [JR]
Chair: Jim Allan
17:57:40 [JR]
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2006AprJun/0075.html
18:00:06 [Zakim]
WAI_UAWG()2:00PM has now started
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+[IBM]
18:00:56 [jallan]
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18:01:13 [Zakim]
+[IPcaller]
18:02:02 [parente]
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18:02:07 [JR]
Zakim, IPcaller is really JR
18:02:07 [Zakim]
+JR; got it
18:02:11 [Zakim]
+Jim_Allan
18:05:31 [JR]
JA: Came up with techs that seemed pretty simple, but didn't get comments...
18:05:43 [jallan]
CP 2.3 Render conditional content
18:05:44 [jallan]
18:05:44 [jallan]
example technique:
18:05:44 [jallan]
Use onscreen text (linked to the long description) indicating presence of a
18:05:44 [jallan]
long description.
18:06:19 [JR]
JA: HPR actually does this now
18:06:53 [JR]
JA: PP does your browser do this?
18:07:21 [JR]
PP: Yes we can get long desc if the browser passes it through
18:07:49 [JR]
JA: JAWS does it somehow - maybe walking DOM...
18:08:47 [JR]
JA: So your screen reader isn't walking the DOM...it's waiting for the browser to pass through the stuff
18:08:47 [Zakim]
+DPoehlman
18:08:58 [JR]
PP: Right?
18:09:03 [JR]
?=.
18:09:22 [parente]
yes, right :)
18:10:24 [JR]
JA: Brings DP up to date on discussion.
18:10:39 [JR]
DP: If I'm navving will it show up?
18:10:58 [JR]
JA: Yes - we are just documenting something that does already exist.
18:12:23 [JR]
DP: What does Safari do?
18:12:29 [JR]
JA: Don't know?
18:12:34 [JR]
DP: Firefox?
18:12:47 [JR]
PP: On windows, don't know.
18:14:32 [JR]
JA: Question is: should we right a technique for this? - e.g. if long desc is available expose this through the right API
18:14:37 [JR]
DP: Hope so
18:16:18 [JR]
These are the current "Sufficient Techs":
18:16:19 [JR]
To satisfy provision one of this checkpoint, the configuration may be a switch that, for all content, turns on or off the access mechanisms described in provision two.
18:16:19 [JR]
To satisfy provision two of this checkpoint, the user agent may provide access on a per-element basis (e.g., by allowing the user to query individual elements) or for all elements (e.g., by offering a configuration to render conditional content all the time).
18:16:19 [JR]
To satisfy the requirement of provision two of this checkpoint to allow the user to view the content associated with each placeholder, the user agent may either render the associated content in a separate viewport or in place of the placeholder.
18:16:38 [JR]
JA: HPR does the third.
18:17:48 [JR]
DP: Are you saying typically the info is meta info?
18:18:22 [JR]
JA: Sometimes...longdesc is tricky - browsers aren't sure what to do.
18:18:42 [JR]
JA: IE ignores, and other browsers to a variety of things.
18:19:03 [jallan]
antother technique: user agent to send/expose information to the platform accessibility API for use by assistive technology that would make the information available to the user.
18:20:33 [jallan]
add note: this technique is for user agent with assistive technology.
18:21:21 [JR]
JR: Spirit of 2.3 may be "Render" - a tech to punt to AT may not be enough...
18:21:42 [JR]
JR: Communication of things via API is covered in guideline 6
18:22:41 [JR]
JA, JR: Maybe under 6.1 or 6.10.
18:24:05 [JR]
PP: Just as good if browser handles it natively.
18:24:43 [parente]
http://gnome.org/~billh/at-spi-new-idl/html/html/interfaceAccessibility_1_1Image.html
18:24:49 [JR]
JA: So maybe we'll add to 6.1
18:25:10 [parente]
http://gnome.org/~billh/at-spi-new-idl/html/html/index.html
18:25:21 [JR]
PP: That's a link to case with long desc
18:25:51 [JR]
PP: May not be the most stable URL's
18:26:25 [jallan]
CP 2.4 allow time independent interaction
18:26:25 [jallan]
The techniques for this checkpoint seem to be narrowly focused on
18:26:25 [jallan]
multimedia. I think is should be broadened to address meta refresh, AJAX
18:26:25 [jallan]
refresh, security timeouts, etc.
18:26:36 [JR]
Topic: CP 2.4
18:28:49 [JR]
JA: Right now it seems Multimedia centric...
18:31:17 [JR]
JR: Should prob put in some rebognition that some typres of situations are out of ua control
18:32:13 [JR]
PP: In Linux SR case DOM won't be exposed, but system does allow browser to pass along meta information etc
18:32:50 [JR]
action JA: Craft a few more points specifically for checkpoint 2.4.
18:33:41 [JR]
JA: So IBM is doing work on AJAX...is screen reader involved?
18:34:20 [JR]
PP: Approach: Basic stuff where page is acting like an app, the SR just tracks focus events...
18:35:11 [JR]
PP: For more complicated stuff like updated status information...there is lots of work on "watching" different areas, with different priorities etc.
18:35:40 [JR]
PP: So far on windows, but on Linux side they will throw everything to accessibility platform
18:37:35 [jallan]
*jim pf is member private? right?
18:38:10 [JR]
Topic: CP 2.5
18:38:27 [JR]
CP 2.5 Make captions, transcripts, audio descriptions available
18:38:28 [JR]
example technique:
18:38:28 [JR]
Allow configuration for embedded media player objects to be opened in
18:38:28 [JR]
standalone non-embedded players to allow full access to the complete range
18:38:28 [JR]
of functionality allowed in a particular player.
18:39:33 [JR]
JA: Once documents what some browsers already do
18:40:25 [JR]
Once=Just
18:41:47 [JR]
JA: Important that UA doesn't know what the object is...
18:43:24 [JR]
JA: Prob some kind of "embedded mode" for players like QT...
18:43:52 [JR]
JA: Embedded mode versions often don't have the same options as standalone versions
18:44:22 [JR]
JR: So we are really speaking to players that can embed themselves
18:44:41 [jallan]
may add a note: user agent does not know what is in an object element, user only has control that the embedded play allows
18:45:11 [jallan]
limited functionality. opening in a full player allows greater user control and functionality
18:45:50 [JR]
JA: This true for PDF also...but user can say if they want it to open embedded or not
18:46:49 [JR]
DP: Possible now to have PDF doc inside an HTML doc...with small embedded viewer
18:48:08 [JR]
JA:Can screen reader get in?
18:48:32 [JR]
DP: Yes but most screen reader controls don't work.
18:50:37 [JR]
JA: That's it for the day...
18:53:31 [Zakim]
-DPoehlman
18:53:36 [Zakim]
-[IBM]
19:03:55 [Zakim]
-JR
19:03:56 [Zakim]
WAI_UAWG()2:00PM has ended
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Attendees were [IBM], JR, Jim_Allan, DPoehlman
19:04:14 [jallan]
jallan has left #ua
19:04:57 [JR]
RRSAgent, make minutes
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I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2006/06/29-ua-minutes.html JR
19:05:10 [JR]
RRSAgent, set logs public
19:05:18 [JR]
Zakim, bye
19:05:18 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #ua
19:05:27 [JR]
RRSAgent, bye
19:05:27 [RRSAgent]
I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/29-ua-actions.rdf :
19:05:27 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: JA to Craft a few more points specifically for checkpoint 2.4. [1]
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recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/06/29-ua-irc#T18-32-50