IRC log of wai-wcag on 2006-04-06

Timestamps are in UTC.

19:57:01 [RRSAgent]: RRSAgent has joined #wai-wcag
19:57:01 [RRSAgent]: logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/04/06-wai-wcag-irc
19:57:42 [David_MacDonald]: David_MacDonald has joined #wai-wcag
19:58:07 [ben]: RRSAgent, do not start a new log
19:58:15 [ben]: RRSAgent, make log world
19:58:22 [ben]: Meeting: WCAG Weekly Telecon
19:58:30 [ben]: Chair: Gregg_Vanderheiden and John_Slatin
19:59:34 [ben]: Regrets: Cynthia_Shelly, Andi_Snow-Weaver, Roberto_Ellero, Roberto_Castaldo, Luca_Mascaro, Yvette_Hoitink
19:59:40 [Zakim]: WAI_WCAG()3:00PM has now started
19:59:47 [Zakim]: +David_MacDonald
19:59:52 [ben]: Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2006AprJun/0006.html
20:00:16 [ben]: agenda+ Team A Surveys
20:00:22 [Zakim]: +Bengt_Farre
20:00:23 [ben]: agenda+ Team B Survey
20:00:25 [Zakim]: -David_MacDonald
20:00:27 [Zakim]: +David_MacDonald
20:00:30 [Zakim]: +[IPcaller]
20:00:33 [ben]: agenda+ Check in on Last Call and Candidate Reccomendation
20:00:38 [rscano]: zakim, [IPcaller is Roberto_Scano
20:00:38 [Zakim]: +Roberto_Scano; got it
20:00:45 [ben]: agenda+ Updated Mapping from Christophe
20:00:49 [Zakim]: + +1.614.456.aaaa
20:01:28 [Zakim]: +Bruce_Bailey
20:01:38 [Becky]: Becky has joined #wai-wcag
20:01:41 [Zakim]: +Judy
20:01:47 [Zakim]: +Wendy
20:01:50 [judy]: judy has joined #wai-wcag
20:01:54 [Zakim]: +Becky_Gibson
20:02:12 [Zakim]: +??P12
20:02:13 [Zakim]: +Loretta_Guarino_Reid
20:02:19 [bengt]: zakim, +1.614.456 is Gregg_and_Ben?
20:02:19 [Zakim]: +Gregg_and_Ben?; got it
20:02:19 [ben]: zakim, ??P12 is Ben_Caldwell
20:02:20 [Zakim]: +Ben_Caldwell; got it
20:02:41 [Zakim]: +Tim_Boland
20:02:51 [Zakim]: +[IPcaller]
20:02:58 [ben]: zakim, Gregg_and_Ben? is Gregg_Vanderheiden
20:02:58 [Zakim]: +Gregg_Vanderheiden; got it
20:03:08 [ben]: zakim, who is on the phone?
20:03:08 [Zakim]: On the phone I see David_MacDonald, Bengt_Farre, Roberto_Scano, Gregg_Vanderheiden, Bruce_Bailey, Judy, Wendy, Becky_Gibson, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Ben_Caldwell, Tim_Boland,
20:03:11 [Zakim]: ... [IPcaller]
20:03:29 [Zakim]: +Christophe_Strobbe
20:03:32 [gregg]: gregg has joined #wai-wcag
20:03:34 [Sorcha]: Sorcha has joined #wai-wcag
20:03:47 [rscano]: zakim, who is on the phone?
20:03:47 [Zakim]: On the phone I see David_MacDonald, Bengt_Farre, Roberto_Scano, Gregg_Vanderheiden, Bruce_Bailey, Judy, Wendy, Becky_Gibson, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Ben_Caldwell, Tim_Boland,
20:03:51 [Zakim]: ... [IPcaller], Christophe_Strobbe
20:03:54 [ben]: zakim, [IP is Sorcha_Moore
20:03:54 [Zakim]: +Sorcha_Moore; got it
20:03:54 [bengt]: zakim, [IP is Sorcha
20:03:55 [Zakim]: sorry, bengt, I do not recognize a party named '[IP'
20:04:07 [rscano]: zakim, [IP is Sorcha
20:04:07 [Zakim]: sorry, rscano, I do not recognize a party named '[IP'
20:04:15 [Christophe]: zakim, [IPcaller] is Sorcha_Moore
20:04:15 [Zakim]: sorry, Christophe, I do not recognize a party named '[IPcaller]'
20:04:19 [Zakim]: +Michael_Cooper
20:04:24 [ben]: zakim, who is on the phone?
20:04:24 [Zakim]: On the phone I see David_MacDonald, Bengt_Farre, Roberto_Scano, Gregg_Vanderheiden, Bruce_Bailey, Judy, Wendy, Becky_Gibson, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Ben_Caldwell, Tim_Boland,
20:04:28 [Zakim]: ... Sorcha_Moore, Christophe_Strobbe, Michael_Cooper
20:05:12 [Michael]: Michael has joined #wai-wcag
20:05:41 [Zakim]: + +1.415.885.aabb
20:05:49 [rscano]: zakim, I am Roberto_Scano
20:05:49 [Zakim]: ok, rscano, I now associate you with Roberto_Scano
20:05:59 [ben]: zakim, +1.415 is John_Slatin
20:05:59 [Zakim]: +John_Slatin; got it
20:06:16 [ben]: scribe: ben
20:06:24 [ben]: Topic: Unanimous Consent
20:06:41 [ben]
20:06:41 [ben]: (from Team A survey #1)
20:06:41 [ben]: Failure due to opening a new window as soon as a new page is loaded without prior warning,Delete "Failure due to opening a new window or a pop-up after a click on content that does not perform a function"
20:06:41 [ben]
20:06:41 [ben]: (from Team A survey #2)
20:06:43 [ben]: Failure due to specifying foreground colors without specifying background colors or vice versa
20:06:45 [ben]
20:06:47 [ben]: (from Team B survey)
20:06:49 [ben]: SC 1.3.3 White Space Failures: General or Text?, Using h1-h6 to identify headings,Proposal to remove SC 2.4.6 Technique: Dynamically adding interactive items into the tab order.
20:06:56 [ben]: RRSAgent, pointer?
20:06:56 [RRSAgent]: See http://www.w3.org/2006/04/06-wai-wcag-irc#T20-06-56
20:07:11 [ben]: zakim, take up agendum 1
20:07:11 [Zakim]: agendum 1. "Team A Surveys" taken up [from ben]
20:07:41 [ben]: Topic: Revisions to SC 1.1.2
20:08:14 [Tim]: Tim has joined #wai-wcag
20:08:46 [ben]: Proposed - 1.1.2 For prerecorded multimedia, a full corrected text screenplay including any interaction, is provided.
20:09:43 [gregg]: ack l
20:10:38 [gregg]: ack j
20:10:43 [gregg]: Q+
20:10:45 [ben]: zakim, who is on the phone?
20:10:45 [Zakim]: On the phone I see David_MacDonald, Bengt_Farre, Roberto_Scano (muted), Gregg_Vanderheiden, Bruce_Bailey, Judy, Wendy, Becky_Gibson, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Ben_Caldwell, Tim_Boland,
20:10:49 [Zakim]: ... Sorcha_Moore, Christophe_Strobbe, Michael_Cooper, John_Slatin
20:10:50 [Zakim]: +??P19
20:10:59 [Sofia]: Sofia has joined #wai-wcag
20:11:33 [Zakim]: +Sofia_Celic
20:12:06 [ben]: zakim, ??P19 is Kerstin_Goldsmith
20:12:06 [Zakim]: +Kerstin_Goldsmith; got it
20:13:41 [David_MacDonald]: q+
20:13:48 [gregg]: ack g
20:13:49 [gregg]: ack d
20:14:56 [Zakim]: -Bruce_Bailey
20:16:11 [ben]: q+ to say, "should be text-alternative, not text equiv."
20:16:33 [Zakim]: +Bruce_Bailey
20:17:03 [gregg]: Q+
20:17:10 [ben]: q-
20:17:11 [Zakim]: +??P21
20:17:16 [gregg]: ack j
20:17:33 [ben]: ack Tim
20:20:11 [gregg]: ack g
20:20:13 [gregg]: ack j
20:21:18 [ben]: zakim, ??P21 is Katie_Haritos_Shea
20:21:18 [Zakim]: +Katie_Haritos_Shea; got it
20:23:32 [ben]: ack Bruce
20:24:24 [ben]: q+
20:26:24 [gregg]: ack b
20:26:26 [gregg]: ack j
20:26:31 [Zakim]: +[IPcaller]
20:26:33 [ben]: resolution: revise 1.1.2 to read, "1.1.2 For prerecorded multimedia, a full multimedia text alternative including any interaction is provided." (replace "full corrected text screenplay" with "full multimedia text alternative")
20:26:35 [Sorcha]: ip caller sorcha moore
20:26:37 [Zakim]: -Sorcha_Moore
20:26:59 [bengt]: zakim, [IP is Sorcha_Moore
20:26:59 [Zakim]: +Sorcha_Moore; got it
20:28:34 [ben]: resolution: revise 1.2.2 to read, "1.2.2 Audio descriptions of video or a full multimedia text alternative including any interaction, are provided for prerecorded multimedia."
20:30:33 [David_MacDonald]: zakim, who's making noise?
20:30:44 [Zakim]: David_MacDonald, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Gregg_Vanderheiden (44%), Ben_Caldwell (20%), Loretta_Guarino_Reid (25%)
20:30:49 [ben]: Topic: Providing a full corrected text screenplay including any interaction
20:30:59 [ben]: resolution: accept proposed technique, "Providing a full corrected text screenplay including any interaction", retitled as "Providing a full multimedia text alternative including any interaction."
20:31:33 [ben]: Topic: Delete Failure due to not collating captions and audio descriptions if revisions to 1.1.2 are accepted
20:32:34 [ben]: resolution: Delete "Failure due to not collating captions and audio descriptions."
20:34:36 [ben]: action: David review revisions to 1.1.2 and 1.2.2 for additional failures.
20:34:50 [ben]: Topic: Should 1.2.2 be listed under guideline 1.2?
20:38:34 [ben]: resolution: move 1.1.2 to guideline 1.2 (remains at level 3).
20:39:40 [ben]: Topic: Providing short text alternatives that provide a brief description of the non-text content
20:48:24 [ben]: zakim, who's making noise?
20:48:29 [Zakim]: -Bruce_Bailey
20:48:35 [Zakim]: ben, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: David_MacDonald (5%), Gregg_Vanderheiden (13%), Bruce_Bailey (13%), Ben_Caldwell (39%), Loretta_Guarino_Reid (4%),
20:48:38 [Zakim]: ... John_Slatin (22%)
20:49:33 [ben]: resolution: accept propsed technique with edits (specifically LGR's edit to intro) and removing step 2 of the procedure.
20:50:38 [ben]: Topic: Failure due to insufficient information in DOM to determine one-to-one relationships (e.g., between labels with same id)
20:50:58 [Zakim]: +Bruce_Bailey
20:51:44 [Zakim]: -Bruce_Bailey
20:52:39 [ben]: Topic: Bengt Farre Accept proposed technique
20:52:39 [ben]: Failure due to opening a new window as soon as a new page is loaded without prior warning
20:52:56 [ben]: Topic: Failure due to opening a new window as soon as a new page is loaded without prior warning
20:53:32 [Zakim]: +Bruce_Bailey
20:53:33 [gregg]: ack j
20:54:06 [gregg]: ack l
20:56:27 [Zakim]: -Bruce_Bailey
20:56:52 [judy]: zakim, who's making noise?
20:57:03 [Zakim]: judy, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Gregg_Vanderheiden (60%), Becky_Gibson (42%), Loretta_Guarino_Reid (19%)
20:57:11 [ben]: resolution: accept with edits
20:57:34 [ben]: Topic: Failure due to insufficient information in DOM to determine one-to-one relationships (e.g., between labels with same id)
20:57:45 [Makoto]: Makoto has joined #wai-wcag
20:57:56 [Zakim]: +Bruce_Bailey
20:58:17 [Becky]: q+
21:00:37 [gregg]: ack b
21:00:41 [Zakim]: -Kerstin_Goldsmith
21:01:56 [Zakim]: -Judy
21:02:28 [gregg]: ack l
21:03:16 [Zakim]: +[IPcaller]
21:03:18 [Makoto]: zakim. [IPcaller] is Makoto_Ueki
21:04:39 [gregg]: ack k
21:04:41 [gregg]: ack j
21:05:02 [ben]: action: team A to consider comments and revise
21:05:32 [ben]: Topic: Team A Survey #2 (06 April)
21:06:01 [ben]: Topic: Failure due to implementing custom controls that do not use an accessibility API
21:07:28 [ben]: resolution: accept with edits
21:07:37 [ben]: Topic: Failure due to generating markup using methods for writing unparsed content
21:09:35 [Zakim]: +Judy
21:11:56 [Zakim]: -Tim_Boland
21:16:41 [ben]: resolution: accept with edits (Team A to confirm w/ Cynthia and Yvetee wrt comments on using these in an accessible way)
21:16:59 [ben]: Topic: Failure due to using proprietary methods and properties to generate content
21:17:32 [Christophe]: q+
21:19:58 [Christophe]: q-
21:20:00 [ben]: resolution: reject this failure and remove it from 4.1.2
21:20:10 [ben]: zakim, close this item
21:20:10 [Zakim]: agendum 1 closed
21:20:11 [Zakim]: I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
21:20:12 [Zakim]: 2. Team B Survey [from ben]
21:20:15 [ben]: zakim, take up agendum 2
21:20:15 [Zakim]: agendum 2. "Team B Survey" taken up [from ben]
21:20:58 [ben]: Topic: Proposal to remove SC 1.3.5 General Technique: Identifying information that is identified by shape or position by additional characteristics that are programmatically determined
21:24:05 [ben]: q+ to say, "propose moving this to the boneyard until someone takes an action to write it"
21:24:54 [judy]: q+
21:25:47 [gregg]: ack l
21:25:48 [judy]: q-
21:25:52 [gregg]: ack b
21:25:52 [Zakim]: ben, you wanted to say, "propose moving this to the boneyard until someone takes an action to write it"
21:26:01 [ben]: resolution: move this to boneyard
21:26:19 [ben]: action: Makoto to look for examples that would address this technique
21:26:40 [ben]: Topic: Proposal to remove SC 1.3.3 CSS Technique: Using CSS to reveal reading order.
21:28:30 [ben]: resolution: remove technique, "Using CSS to reveal reading order" from 1.3.3.
21:28:46 [ben]: Topic: SC 1.3.4 HTML Technique: Using semantic markup to mark emphasized or special text
21:31:43 [gregg]: ack l
21:33:17 [Zakim]: -Michael_Cooper
21:39:00 [Becky]: q+
21:41:29 [Becky]: ack b
21:42:36 [ben]: resolution: accept prposed technique with edits and list user agent support information for other elements that fall into this category
21:42:47 [ben]: Topic: SC 2.4.1, 2.4.6 Failure: Failure due to using tabindex to skip link groups
21:47:54 [gregg]: ack l
21:51:42 [ben]: resolution: move "Failure due to using tabindex to skip link groups" with comments to boneyard.
21:53:01 [ben]: Topic: Proposal to remove SC 2.4.6 HTML Technique: Using frame elements to group blocks of repeated material AND Using the title attribute of the frame element
21:55:42 [ben]: resolution: keep this technique
21:55:51 [ben]: action: Team B to draft
21:56:32 [ben]: Topic: Proposal to remove SC 2.4.7 Failure: Failing to update a site map to reflect changes in a web site
22:00:07 [Zakim]: -Wendy
22:01:46 [ben]: resolution: remove this failure and add something to the test procedure for, "Providing a site map" as proposed.
22:02:56 [ben]: zakim, close this item
22:02:56 [Zakim]: agendum 2 closed
22:02:57 [Zakim]: I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
22:02:58 [Zakim]: 3. Check in on Last Call and Candidate Reccomendation [from ben]
22:08:48 [ben]: zakim, take up agendum 3
22:08:48 [Zakim]: agendum 3. "Check in on Last Call and Candidate Reccomendation" taken up [from ben]
22:13:42 [ben]: action: everyone review Judy's email "Preview - Last Call considerations" - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2006AprJun/0015.html
22:13:48 [Zakim]: -Gregg_Vanderheiden
22:19:27 [Makoto]: zakim. mute me
22:20:38 [Zakim]: +Wendy
22:27:50 [Zakim]: -Katie_Haritos_Shea
22:29:17 [ben]: zakim, close this item
22:29:17 [Zakim]: agendum 3 closed
22:29:18 [Zakim]: I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
22:29:19 [Zakim]: 4. Updated Mapping from Christophe [from ben]
22:29:21 [ben]: Present: David_MacDonald, Bengt_Farre, Roberto_Scano, Gregg_Vanderheiden, Bruce_Bailey, Judy_Brewer, Wendy_Chisholm, Becky_Gibson, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Ben_Caldwell, Tim_Boland, Sorcha_Moore, Christophe_Strobbe, Michael_Cooper, John_Slatin, Kerstin_Goldsmith, Sofia_Celic, Katie_Haritos_Shea, Makoto_Ueki
22:29:25 [Zakim]: -Becky_Gibson
22:29:26 [Zakim]: -Bruce_Bailey
22:29:27 [Zakim]: -Loretta_Guarino_Reid
22:29:28 [Zakim]: -David_MacDonald
22:29:29 [Zakim]: -Christophe_Strobbe
22:29:30 [Zakim]: -Bengt_Farre
22:29:32 [Zakim]: -Sofia_Celic
22:29:33 [Zakim]: -Wendy
22:29:34 [Zakim]: -[IPcaller]
22:29:36 [Zakim]: -Ben_Caldwell
22:29:38 [Zakim]: -Sorcha_Moore
22:29:39 [Zakim]: -Roberto_Scano
22:29:39 [judy]: zakim, who's here?
22:29:40 [Zakim]: On the phone I see John_Slatin, Judy
22:29:46 [Zakim]: On IRC I see Makoto, Sorcha, judy, David_MacDonald, RRSAgent, Christophe, Zakim, bengt, rscano, wendy, ben
22:29:48 [Sorcha]: Sorcha has left #wai-wcag
22:29:52 [bengt]: bengt has left #wai-wcag
22:29:59 [rscano]: rscano has left #wai-wcag
22:30:38 [Christophe]: Christophe has left #wai-wcag
22:31:28 [Zakim]: -Judy
22:31:29 [Zakim]: -John_Slatin
22:31:31 [Zakim]: WAI_WCAG()3:00PM has ended
22:31:32 [Zakim]: Attendees were David_MacDonald, Bengt_Farre, [IPcaller], Roberto_Scano, +1.614.456.aaaa, Bruce_Bailey, Judy, Wendy, Becky_Gibson, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Ben_Caldwell, Tim_Boland,
22:31:37 [Zakim]: ... Gregg_Vanderheiden, Christophe_Strobbe, Sorcha_Moore, Michael_Cooper, +1.415.885.aabb, John_Slatin, Sofia_Celic, Kerstin_Goldsmith, Katie_Haritos_Shea
22:35:27 [judy]: hi ben?
22:36:53 [judy]: ben, i might have someone else to help w/ the XML conversion. i'll send you email.
22:38:11 [ben]: RRSAgent, bye
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: I see 5 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2006/04/06-wai-wcag-actions.rdf :
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: David review revisions to 1.1.2 and 1.2.2 for additional failures. [1]
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/04/06-wai-wcag-irc#T20-34-36
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: team A to consider comments and revise [2]
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/04/06-wai-wcag-irc#T21-05-02
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: Makoto to look for examples that would address this technique [3]
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/04/06-wai-wcag-irc#T21-26-19
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: Team B to draft [4]
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/04/06-wai-wcag-irc#T21-55-51
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: ACTION: everyone review Judy's email "Preview - Last Call considerations" - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2006AprJun/0015.html [5]
22:38:11 [RRSAgent]: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2006/04/06-wai-wcag-irc#T22-13-42
22:38:18 [ben]: Zakim, bye
22:38:18 [Zakim]: Zakim has left #wai-wcag