08:14:04 RRSAgent has joined #dawg 08:14:04 logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/03/03-dawg-irc 08:14:34 Meekting: RDF Data Access Working Group (DAWG) Face to Face 08:14:41 Chair: ericP 08:14:58 Scribe: LeeF 08:15:06 Meeting: RDF Data Access Working Group (DAWG) Face to Face 08:15:10 http://www.w3.org/Search/Mail/Public/search?keywords=request+for+testcase&hdr-1-name=subject&hdr-1-query=&index-grp=Public__FULL&index-type=t&type-index=public-rdf-dawg -> requests for test cases 08:15:56 Present: AndyS, ericP, SerT, SvenGroppe, AndyS, EliasT 08:20:58 EliasT_ has joined #dawg 08:22:18 Present+ SteveH 08:26:57 SteveH has joined #dawg 08:27:37 EliasT has joined #dawg 08:28:25 SerT has joined #dawg 08:33:46 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2005OctDec/thread#msg52 -> schema 08:51:31 LeeF has left #dawg 08:51:54 LeeF has joined #dawg 08:52:33 (discussion of test case schema vocabulary) 08:54:56 SerT: do we have any cases in which we need multiple test cases to cover a requirement? 08:55:04 Group: we think we can avoid that 08:55:45 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/test-dawg.n3 08:58:36 SteveH: To start to clean up the tests, we could reject (or delete) the tests that use the old syntax 08:59:54 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data/simple2/ 09:00:09 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data/simple2/manifest.n3 09:00:48 -> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data/simple2/manifest.n3 old syntax tests 09:01:29 ericP: as per W3c persistence policy, keep everything in current test directories (mark with big red Xes if they are misleading) 09:01:40 ... also provide a tarball of approved tests 09:02:48 AndyS: target audience is SPARQL implementors who will provide experience reports during CR, so we should have a download which is only the approved tests 09:03:43 SteveH: why are the tests in an rdf:List 09:04:18 AndyS: ordering is nice when running tests - if a test fails, the failure alwats occurs at the same place in the testing procedure 09:04:24 s/alwats/always 09:05:30 ericP: other WGs produce and publish tests. do we want to publish our approved tests as a Note, a subset of which are the ones that support requirements which apply to CR exit criteria 09:06:25 SerT: Test cases should not be used to show the conformance of implementations 09:06:48 SerT: keep implementation/conformance requirements distinguished from requirements of defining the query language 09:08:59 AndyS: w3c doesn't have authority to draw conclusions from implementations that pass certain tests 09:09:23 SteveH: "approved" tests mean that the WG believes that the test accurately reflects the specification of the QL 09:09:38 ericP: 3 options here 09:09:57 ... 1) keep everything in 2001/.../tests/data annotated appropriately to allow informed use of that data 09:10:18 ...2) sequester the tests that support requirements in a separate place to allow implementors to run those tests to support our CR exit criteria 09:10:36 ... 3) that in addition to 2, or in a separate place, we have the approved tests that do not support requirements 09:11:00 SerT: -1 on other approved tests in a separate place due to concerns of maintaining consistency 09:14:44 (discussion of how to avoid lists in the test schema) 09:16:04 EliasT: we don't need tests in a list for the protocol tests 09:16:42 AndyS: To the projector! 09:17:30 (AndyS shows us the following:) 09:17:42 running a JUnit test cuite inside Eclipse 09:17:51 a green bar grows across the screen 09:18:16 1140 tests are run, displayed in groups 09:18:51 about 400 of the tests are scripted -- they come from manfiest files 09:25:24 ericP: one approach is to stay with lists -- people running the manifests in that case cannot use SPARQL-- 09:25:34 SteveH: that's not true because you can query based on other predicates 09:27:29 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2005OctDec/0052.html 09:28:30 http://unagi/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data/SyntaxFull/manifest.ttl -> SyntaxFull manifest 09:29:02 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data/SyntaxFull/manifest.ttl -> SyntaxFull manifest 09:30:36 SerT: by using SPARQL to query for items which have an action, you can't find which group a particular test belongs to 09:31:55 SteveH: use GRAPH ?g to associate actions with manifest origin 09:32:16 SteveH: that way we can build everything with a single CONSTRUCT query 09:32:33 SerT: we can preprocess the data and shortcut the list structure with the rdf:member property 09:33:53 ericP: we still need pub;lication mechanism and (b) ???? 09:33:58 AndyS: and who is the test case editor? 09:35:11 s/???/publication contents/ 09:35:26 s/publication contents?/publication contents/ 09:35:27 Sergio suggested adding mf:member property to directly connect the manifest to the action 09:35:58 AndyS: This could be as well as the list structure. 09:35:59 ericP: publish 1 directory structure and tarball thathas every manifest entry that is approved 09:36:16 ... The addition properties can be added mechanically. 09:37:02 ericP: people who are doing CR testing will do a query for supportsRequirements 09:37:14 ... this leads to our matrix of test case coverage 09:39:32 SerT: only concern is that we maintain coherence in the entire tests structure 09:39:42 ericP: Manifest of manifests (a la AndyS) will do this 09:40:29 everyone agrees on publishing this as a Note 09:41:04 ericP: should we have unapproved tests in the structure that we publish as a Note? 09:41:07 ericP: No. 09:41:12 err 09:41:14 SerT: No. 09:41:56 ericP: master will continue to be 2001/.../tests/data 09:44:55 ericP: add fromManifest property pointing from manifest entries to the manifest itself 09:46:10 [ coffee break while ericP does homework ] 10:00:04 [ Eric starts homework ] 10:15:41 Issue: protocol examples use URIs (http://www.example/) that don't actually have an RDF graph behind them. 10:16:11 ... so we can't just publish the protocol examples and have implementers execute them directly. 10:23:38 [ WG works on designing the query test manifest ] 10:35:58 PROPOSED: 1) create manifest manifest 2) add the includes, fromManifest and supportsRequirement per photo from meeting record 3) publish a copy of 2001/test/data/ that includes all approved tests 10:37:04 PROPOSED: 1) create manifest manifest 2) add the includes, fromManifest and supportsRequirement per photo from meeting record 3) publish a WG test note that includes a copy of 2001/test/data/ that includes all approved tests 10:37:14 http://www.w3.org/2005/09/27-dawg-minutes.html#action16 10:38:11 PROPOSED: 1) create manifest manifest 2) add the includes, fromManifest and supportsRequirement per photo from meeting record 3) publish a WG test note that extracts the ManifestManifest, manifests and all approved tests from 2001/test/data/ that 10:38:29 PROPOSED: 1) create manifest manifest 2) add the includes, fromManifest and supportsRequirement per photo from meeting record 3) publish a WG test note that extracts the ManifestManifest, manifests and all approved tests from 2001/test/data/ 10:39:41 APPROVED, AndyS abstains 10:41:59 Present+ DanC 10:42:02 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/lc-status-report -> LC status report (note open and pending threads) 10:42:06 jeen has joined #dawg 10:45:44 DanC_lap has joined #dawg 10:45:52 ScribeNick: ericP 10:46:39 scribe: ericP 10:47:30 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/lc-status-report -> LC status report (note open and pending threads) 10:51:46 that's ok jeen. Now you may come in to the room. 10:54:06 # 2005-09-08T01:26:59Z Peter F. Patel-Schneider 10:54:49 ACTION: DanC to join the [2005-09-08T01:26:59Z Peter F. Patel-Schneider] thread with PPS's late Feb comments 10:56:25 resolution path on [2005-09-09T20:39:31Z Dan Connolly]: ask if Ian Horrocks is satisfied with DAWG resolution of owlDisjunction 10:56:44 which isn't novel from this meeting; that's just a matter of course 11:00:14 ACTION: patH to respond to PFPS comments [WITHDRAWN] 11:00:21 action -2 11:00:33 overtaken by pfpf's late feb comments 11:02:06 ACTION: SergioT to ask Ian Horrocks if he is satisfied with DAWG resolution of owlDisjunction 11:02:39 i.e. reply to http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2005Sep/0049 11:05:01 SerT, i've just bounced efb2f1492677c59ad7c4459e134425f6@cs.man.ac.uk to you 11:05:19 (steveh is excused for a bit) 11:07:56 ACTION: DanC to fix the "inconsistent use of terminology" [2005-09-23T14:34:50Z Peter F. Patel-Schneider] thread 11:57:36 http://unagi/2001/sw/DataAccess/rq23/#optionals 11:59:37 1.595 (aseaborn 19-Dec-05):

The OPTIONAL keyword is lef 11:59:37 t-associative :

11:59:41 investigating ter Horst's comments. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2005Oct/0068 12:18:47 EliasT has joined #dawg 12:20:25 2006-02-22T14:46:35Z Arjohn Kampman 12:20:27 ACTION: AndyS to respond to [2006-02-22T14:46:35Z Arjohn Kampman] 12:21:22 SteveH has joined #dawg 12:22:43 ACTION: LeeF to create test case resulting from 2006-03-03T11:15Z (before lunch, 2nd day) whiteboard discussion 12:23:07 ACTION: EricP to respond to [2006-02-23T09:38:05Z Arjohn Kampman] 12:23:47 # SPARQL Dataset Graph Pattern 12:23:47 * 2006-02-23T16:02:59Z Olivier Corby 12:23:56 ACTION: AndyS to respond to [2006-02-24T08:45:23Z Olivier Corby] 12:25:53 # Typos in SPARQL 12:25:54 * 2006-02-24T08:45:23Z Olivier Corby 12:26:32 ACTION: EricP to work on [2006-02-24T08:45:23Z Olivier Corby], potentially automating examples2tests 12:29:17 ACTION: SvenG to follow up with Reto Krummenacher on [2006-02-24T16:40:55Z Reto Krummenacher] 12:33:00 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/lc-status-report -> lc-status-report 12:39:13 ACTION: SergioT to respond to [2005-09-18T15:02:48Z Peter F. Patel-Schneider] 12:43:36 ACTION: AndyS to change "this is" to "RDF graphs are" in response to both [2006-02-22T20:32:56Z Peter F. Patel-Schneider] and [2006-02-22T23:56:54Z Peter F. Patel-Schneider] 12:47:28 EliasT has joined #dawg 12:50:34 ACTION : Jeen to figure out whether he can become test case editor and report back by telecon on Mar 14 12:51:10 Scribe: AndyS 12:51:23 ScribeNick: AndyS 12:51:35 Process matters being considered 12:54:03 No support for UC&R on rec track 12:54:15 Agenda: JSON 12:58:48 DanC_lap has joined #dawg 12:59:44 --> http://www.mindswap.org/~kendall/sparql-results-json/ 13:01:13 JSON defined at http://json.org/ 13:02:18 Variable name used in hash tables for solutions 13:05:16 Discussion on whether it should a W3C WG Note 13:11:06 ACTION: Elias When finialized, email the WG for review as possible WG Note 13:11:33 Review offered by: AndyS, Sergio, Steve 13:13:06 13:13:26 Back to tests: 13:14:28 Review testing actions in the agenda 13:14:52 * ACTION: JosD to make test case from Sergio's basic query patterns examples. progress 13:14:52 * ACTION: EricP to fix test schema to match manifest with negative tests [recorded in 09/27-dawg-minutes.html#action16] 13:14:52 * ACTION: DanC to follow up re optional test based on op:dateTime triple 13:14:52 * ACTION DaveB: add to test suite the temperature case from comment on truth tables in commentor's message 13:15:37 JosD action overtaken 13:16:02 libby has joined #dawg 13:16:04 ACTION: JosD to make test case from Sergio's basic query patterns examples. progress [WITHDRAWN] 13:16:13 action -15 13:16:19 Sergio to email EricP with test case files 13:17:49 ACTION: SerT to make test case for bnode scope in different BGPs 13:22:13 EricP outlines changes to testing format for bad syntax queries 13:23:06 Change incolves formalizing the idea that an action is a blank node always 13:25:23 Discussion on structure of testing vocabularies 13:26:31 There are two vocabs: one for manifests/actions , one for query tests 13:27:08 Discussion around negative syntax tests 13:30:30 and the modelling in the manifest 13:36:17 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/data/SyntaxDev/Syntax-SPARQL3/manifest.ttl 13:38:52 SyntaxDev/* tests are a donation of the ARQ tests that test the parser generated from the javacc used to make the BNF in rq23 13:40:02 ls 13:40:39 ACTION: EricP to fix test schema to match manifest with negative tests [WITHDRAWN] 13:40:41 EricP: Negative tests not on the critical path to CR 13:40:47 action -17 13:41:03 that was EricP echoing SteveH 13:42:33 ACTION: DanC to follow up re optional test based on op:dateTime triple [CONTINUED] 13:44:23 ACTION: DaveB: add to test suite the temperature case from comment on truth tables in commentor's message [WITHDRAWN] 13:44:27 action -19 13:44:46 13:48:29 ADJOURNED 13:56:33 http://www.json.org/java/index.html 14:04:46 pfps has joined #dawg 14:10:36 SerT has joined #dawg 14:24:28 ericP has joined #dawg