19:32:09 RRSAgent has joined #wai-wcag 19:32:09 logging to http://www.w3.org/2006/02/02-wai-wcag-irc 19:32:15 rrsagent, make log world 19:32:23 zakim, this will be WAI 19:32:23 ben, WAI_UAWG()2:00PM is already associated with an irc channel; use 'move WAI to here' if you mean to reassociate the channel 19:32:35 zakim, list conferences 19:32:35 I see XML_EXI()1:30PM, WAI_UAWG()2:00PM active 19:32:36 also scheduled at this time is SVG_WG()2:00PM 19:33:09 zakim, this will be WAI_WCAG 19:33:09 ok, ben; I see WAI_WCAG()3:00PM scheduled to start in 27 minutes 19:33:21 Meeting: WCAG Weekly Teleconference 19:36:07 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2006JanMar/0193.html 19:36:30 agenda+ Questions related to transcripts and levels from 26 January Open 19:36:30 issues and techniques for Guideline 1.2 19:36:38 agenda+ Techniques for SC 1.3.1 19:36:48 agenda+ 26 January Open issues and proposed techniques for guideline 1.4 19:36:57 agenda+ 26 January Open issues and proposed techniques for guideline 2.3 19:37:06 gregg has joined #wai-wcag 19:37:11 agenda+ 26 January Issues and proposed techniques for guideline 1.1 19:37:20 agenda+ Guideline 4.2 Issues 19:37:29 agenda+ Draft Techniques and Issues for Guideline 2.4 19:37:38 agenda+ Techniques for Guideline 2.1 19:37:46 agenda+ Draft Techniques for Guideline 1.2 19:37:57 agenda+ Draft Techniques and proposals for Guideline 3.2 19:41:28 agenda? 19:41:33 Sorcha has joined #wai-wcag 19:55:04 Yvette has joined #wai-wcag 19:55:10 Hi y'all 19:55:58 Christophe has joined #wai-wcag 19:57:02 rellero has joined #wai-wcag 19:59:54 WAI_WCAG()3:00PM has now started 20:00:01 +Michael_Cooper 20:00:29 Andi has joined #wai-wcag 20:00:30 +John_Slatin 20:00:35 +??P20 20:00:42 zakim, ??P20 is Bengt_Farre 20:00:42 +Bengt_Farre; got it 20:00:49 jslatin has joined #wai-wcag 20:00:50 +Yvette_Hoitink 20:01:20 for Gregg: Roberto Scano says regrets by phone :-) 20:01:21 +Sorcha_Moore 20:01:40 +Christophe_Strobbe 20:01:43 +Andi_Snow_Weaver 20:02:14 Sorcha has left #wai-wcag 20:02:19 +David_MacDonald 20:02:24 Becky has joined #wai-wcag 20:02:24 +Loretta_Guarino_Reid 20:02:25 +Judy 20:02:38 +Becky_Gibson 20:02:45 +[IPcaller] 20:02:45 zakim, mute me 20:02:45 Yvette_Hoitink should now be muted 20:02:52 +??P3 20:03:00 -Yvette_Hoitink 20:03:01 zakim, ??P3 is Ben_Caldwell 20:03:02 +Ben_Caldwell; got it 20:03:04 zakim, I am Becky_Gibson 20:03:04 ok, Becky, I now associate you with Becky_Gibson 20:03:06 zakim, who is on the phone? 20:03:09 On the phone I see Michael_Cooper, John_Slatin, Bengt_Farre, Sorcha_Moore, Christophe_Strobbe, Andi_Snow_Weaver, David_MacDonald, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Judy, Becky_Gibson, 20:03:11 ... [IPcaller], Ben_Caldwell 20:03:16 zakim, [IP is Judy_Brewer 20:03:16 +Judy_Brewer; got it 20:03:30 zakim, mute me 20:03:33 +Yvette_Hoitink 20:03:38 Christophe_Strobbe should now be muted 20:03:39 zakim, Judy_Brewer is Gregg_Vanderheiden 20:03:43 +Gregg_Vanderheiden; got it 20:03:54 judy has joined #wai-wcag 20:03:54 +[IPcaller] 20:03:59 10 01zakim, [IP is rellero 20:04:10 zakim, [IP is rellero 20:04:10 +rellero; got it 20:04:38 Sorcha has joined #wai-wcag 20:04:38 zakim, who's making noise? 20:04:38 +Tim_Boland 20:04:44 zakim, mute rellero 20:04:44 rellero should now be muted 20:04:59 judy, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Yvette_Hoitink (90%), Michael_Cooper (19%), David_MacDonald (9%), Judy (9%) 20:05:05 David has joined #wai-wcag 20:05:19 sorry i'm setting audio 20:05:42 scribe: Michael 20:06:06 scribe: Yvette 20:07:06 zakim, who is on the phone? 20:07:06 On the phone I see Michael_Cooper, John_Slatin, Bengt_Farre, Sorcha_Moore, Christophe_Strobbe (muted), Andi_Snow_Weaver, David_MacDonald, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Judy, Becky_Gibson, 20:07:09 ... Gregg_Vanderheiden, Ben_Caldwell, Yvette_Hoitink, rellero (muted), Tim_Boland 20:07:25 +??P11 20:07:28 agenda+ Questions related to transcripts and levels from 26 January Open 20:07:29 issues and techniques for Guideline 1.2 20:07:40 zakim, ??P11 is Cynthia_Shelly 20:07:40 +Cynthia_Shelly; got it 20:07:50 zakim, drop agendum 11 20:07:50 agendum 11, Questions related to transcripts and levels from 26 January Open, dropped 20:07:58 topic: 1.2 20:09:40 zakim, unmute me 20:09:40 Christophe_Strobbe should no longer be muted 20:10:19 Tim has joined #wai-wcag 20:11:10 Resolution: accept all resolutions that were unanimous in the survey or unanimous with edits only 20:11:35 todo: add numbers 20:15:49 q+ 20:15:53 q+ 20:16:30 ack Yvette 20:16:58 -David_MacDonald 20:17:13 ack john 20:17:37 +David_MacDonald 20:18:01 q+ 20:18:25 q+ to say "Lots of things at level 1 don't have an acceptable alternative" 20:19:16 ack Michael 20:19:33 q+ 20:21:10 q- 20:21:15 ack Cyn 20:21:49 g+ 20:21:54 Q+ 20:21:55 ack Yvette 20:21:56 Yvette, you wanted to say "Lots of things at level 1 don't have an acceptable alternative" 20:23:28 ack John 20:25:33 q+ 20:26:33 q- 20:26:35 q+ 20:26:43 ack gregg 20:28:26 ack M 20:28:31 ack Mich 20:30:36 ack John 20:38:32 zakim, who's on the phone? 20:38:32 On the phone I see Michael_Cooper, John_Slatin, Bengt_Farre, Sorcha_Moore, Christophe_Strobbe, Andi_Snow_Weaver, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Judy, Becky_Gibson, Gregg_Vanderheiden, 20:38:36 ... Ben_Caldwell, Yvette_Hoitink, rellero (muted), Tim_Boland, Cynthia_Shelly, David_MacDonald 20:39:14 +Sofia_Celic 20:44:43 zakim, rellero is Roberto_Ellero 20:44:43 +Roberto_Ellero; got it 20:45:14 zakim, unmute Roberto_Ellero 20:45:21 Roberto_Ellero should no longer be muted 20:45:21 zakim, mute Roberto_Ellero 20:45:21 Roberto_Ellero should now be muted 20:45:43 captions and transcr L1 20:46:14 sorry i've currently audio problems 20:46:23 roberto, do you mean "and" or "or"? 20:46:31 pair surely 20:46:39 but i prefer and 20:46:43 if posssible 20:47:15 +Alex_Li 20:48:05 excuse me, i notice now that my preference for "and" is near first answer, captions only 20:48:31 captions are necessary in my opinion, L1 20:48:50 Yes, captions L1 20:53:15 q+ 20:56:04 reference: http://www.w3.org/2005/10/Process-20051014/policies.html#def-Consensus 20:56:36 Consensus: A substantial number of individuals in the set support the decision and nobody in the set registers a Formal Objection. 20:56:45 the relevant part is: Abstention is either an explicit expression of no opinion or silence by an individual in the set. 20:57:01 A Formal Objection to a group decision is one that the reviewer requests that the Director consider as part of evaluating the related decision 20:57:31 no means abstention unless one goes formal 20:58:09 q? 21:00:10 action: Gregg to document techniques for captioning when you don't have access to the source file 21:00:22 I'm logging. I don't understand 'remove action 1', Michael. Try /msg RRSAgent help 21:00:31 I'm logging. I don't understand 'droop action 1', Michael. Try /msg RRSAgent help 21:00:43 action: Gregg to research techniques for easier captioning 21:02:26 Sofia has joined #wai-wcag 21:02:58 Resolution: retain current wording about captions at level 1 21:03:34 q+ 21:03:42 ack c 21:03:44 ack y 21:04:16 Vote was 8 for requiring captions at level 1 versus 5 for requiring captions or corrected screenplay at level 1 AND captions at level 2 21:04:39 scribe: Michael 21:06:52 +Kerstin_Goldsmith 21:08:37 topic: 1.2.2 21:08:45 topic: 1.2.2 21:08:47 http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/2006-01-26-multimedia/results#xadtranso 21:09:15 ack andi 21:09:20 zakim, mute me 21:09:20 Yvette_Hoitink should now be muted 21:09:42 ack Cynthia 21:09:59 zakim, mute me 21:09:59 Sofia_Celic should now be muted 21:10:26 ack Alex 21:10:35 Question: Audio descriptions at level 1, or option of audio descriptions or edited screenplay at level 1 plus audio descriptions at level 2 21:12:31 q+ to say I think our decision should be consistent with the previous one, so maybe we can fast-trak? 21:14:22 ack John 21:16:31 ack Michael 21:16:31 Michael_Cooper, you wanted to say I think our decision should be consistent with the previous one, so maybe we can fast-trak? 21:17:17 ack Cynthia 21:18:42 rellero_ has joined #wai-wcag 21:18:54 q+ 21:18:59 -Roberto_Ellero 21:19:21 q- 21:19:45 q+ to address question of skillset 21:20:40 ack j 21:20:40 judy, you wanted to address question of skillset 21:20:46 +[IPcaller] 21:20:58 zakim, [IP is rellero 21:20:58 +rellero; got it 21:21:03 zakim, mute me 21:21:03 sorry, rellero_, I do not see a party named 'rellero_' 21:21:13 zakim, mute rellero 21:21:13 rellero was already muted, rellero_ 21:21:19 zakim, rellero is Roberto_Ellero 21:21:19 +Roberto_Ellero; got it 21:21:50 sorry for line, I agree with consistency with previous, my vote is Audio descriptions at level 1, text transcript of all audio intermixed with a text description is not a acceptable experience for blind people (not synchronized and spoken by synthesis not by actor: loss of expression, not multimedia experience) 21:22:11 q+ 21:23:04 problems with mic 21:23:25 q+ to pass on Roberto's comment 21:24:02 q+ 21:24:10 q- 21:24:10 ops 21:24:17 q- 21:24:19 zakim, mute me 21:24:19 Christophe_Strobbe should now be muted 21:24:25 ack David 21:24:28 q+ to pass on Roberto's comment 21:24:35 ack m 21:24:35 Michael_Cooper, you wanted to pass on Roberto's comment 21:25:57 zakim, unmute me 21:25:57 Yvette_Hoitink should no longer be muted 21:26:54 zakim, unmute me 21:26:54 Sofia_Celic should no longer be muted 21:27:33 zakim, unmute me 21:27:33 Christophe_Strobbe should no longer be muted 21:28:50 zakim, who is on the phone? 21:28:50 On the phone I see Michael_Cooper, John_Slatin, Bengt_Farre, Sorcha_Moore (muted), Christophe_Strobbe, Andi_Snow_Weaver, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Judy, Becky_Gibson, 21:28:53 ... Gregg_Vanderheiden, Ben_Caldwell, Yvette_Hoitink, Tim_Boland, Cynthia_Shelly, David_MacDonald, Sofia_Celic, Alex_Li, Kerstin_Goldsmith (muted), Roberto_Ellero (muted) 21:30:09 Audio descriptions at level 1 21:30:23 zakim, mute me 21:30:23 Yvette_Hoitink should now be muted 21:30:36 zakim, mute me 21:30:36 Sofia_Celic should now be muted 21:31:54 i've made tests and a compatibility table in progress 21:32:18 zakim, unmute me 21:32:18 Sofia_Celic should no longer be muted 21:32:32 zakim, mute me 21:32:32 Sofia_Celic should now be muted 21:32:52 q+ 21:32:58 resolution: No change to SC 1.2.2 (vote 6 for no change, 5 for change, 4 abstentions) 21:33:19 q- 21:33:38 results are good with 2 audio tracks in win http://www.webaccessibile.org/argomenti/documento.asp?DocID=570 21:33:39 ...reason for abstentions usually because need more info 21:33:50 ack c 21:35:37 q+ to say "Consensus speaks about substantial number support" 21:36:00 q+ 21:37:30 q- 21:37:56 Present: Michael_Cooper, John_Slatin, Bengt_Farre, Sorcha_Moore, Christophe_Strobbe, Andi_Snow_Weaver, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Judy, Becky_Gibson, Gregg_Vanderheiden, Ben_Caldwell, Yvette_Hoitink, Roberto_Ellero, Tim_Boland, Cynthia_Shelly, David_MacDonald, Sofia_Celic, Alex_Li, Kerstin_Goldsmith 21:38:04 Chair: Gregg_Vanderheiden and John_Slatin 21:38:12 Regrets: Roberto_Castaldo, Luca_Mascaro 21:38:16 q? 21:39:35 rrsagent, do not start a new log 21:40:03 q+ 21:40:05 vote adjusted: 6 for solo, 6 for pair, 3 abstentions, no change to resolution 21:40:44 chair breaks tie with a vote for solo, making it 7 21:41:13 q+ to respond on alex's qu about content lost or not 21:41:18 q- 21:41:26 ack Alex 21:41:35 final vote: 7 for solo, 6 for pair, 3 abstentions 21:41:46 zakim, unmute me 21:41:46 Yvette_Hoitink should no longer be muted 21:41:56 ack y 21:43:28 -Andi_Snow_Weaver 21:43:34 zakim, next item 21:43:34 agendum 1. "Questions related to transcripts and levels from 26 January Open" taken up [from ben] 21:43:45 zakim, next item 21:43:45 agendum 1 was just opened, Michael 21:43:52 zakim, close this agendum 21:43:52 agendum 1 closed 21:43:53 I see 9 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 21:43:54 2. Techniques for SC 1.3.1 [from ben] 21:44:10 zakim, take up agendum 2 21:44:10 agendum 2. "Techniques for SC 1.3.1" taken up [from ben] 21:45:23 skipping this in favor of ones we're prepared for today 21:45:27 zakim, next item 21:45:27 agendum 3. "26 January Open issues and proposed techniques for guideline 1.4" taken up [from ben] 21:45:42 +Andi_Snow_Weaver 21:45:48 http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/2006-26-01-contrast/results 21:47:03 zakim, mute me 21:47:03 Yvette_Hoitink should now be muted 21:47:07 Item 1618: http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/2006-26-01-contrast/results#xi1618 21:48:15 q+ 21:49:08 zakim, unmute me 21:49:08 Michael_Cooper should no longer be muted 21:49:54 resolution: close 1618, making the changes proposed in the survey 21:49:56 ack d 21:50:34 Item 1842a http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/2006-26-01-contrast/results#xi1842a 21:56:27 ack John 21:57:29 q+ 21:58:07 q+ 21:58:10 zakim, unmute me 21:58:10 Yvette_Hoitink should no longer be muted 21:58:33 q- 21:58:38 q+ 21:58:40 q+ 21:58:42 ack a 21:59:06 Christophe has left #wai-wcag 21:59:13 -Christophe_Strobbe 21:59:30 ack s 22:00:05 ack y 22:00:13 ack j 22:00:44 q+ to say "do not require visual, title etc should suffice" 22:01:01 q+ 22:01:10 ack y 22:01:10 Yvette, you wanted to say "do not require visual, title etc should suffice" 22:02:57 scribe: Andi 22:03:06 zakim, mute me 22:03:06 Yvette_Hoitink should now be muted 22:04:24 ack gregg 22:06:06 resolution: 1842A accept proposal to move 1.3.4, "Any information that is conveyed by color is visually evident when color is not available" to L1 22:06:07 zakim, unmute me 22:06:07 Yvette_Hoitink should no longer be muted 22:08:57 resolution: 1.3.2 is referred back to committee to determine whether it is still required. 22:10:14 resolution: 1842b reject proposal to move 1.3.4, "Any information that is conveyed by color is visually evident when color is not available" to L1 22:11:03 resolution: 1842c reject proposal to move 1.4.3, "Text or diagrams, and their background, have a luminosity contrast ratio of at least 10:1" to L2 22:12:02 zakim, close this item 22:12:02 agendum 3 closed 22:12:03 I see 7 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 22:12:04 4. 26 January Open issues and proposed techniques for guideline 2.3 [from ben] 22:12:09 zakim, take up agendum 4 22:12:09 agendum 4. "26 January Open issues and proposed techniques for guideline 2.3" taken up [from ben] 22:14:57 ack John 22:15:09 -Cynthia_Shelly 22:15:25 q+ 22:16:11 q+ to say that this doesn't just affect kids 22:19:14 ack ben 22:19:18 ack judy 22:19:18 judy, you wanted to say that this doesn't just affect kids 22:19:21 q- 22:20:51 q+ 22:23:11 ack alex 22:24:46 ack ben 22:29:51 q+ 22:30:12 ack judy 22:31:15 When content violates either the general flash threshold or the red flash threshold, users cannot access the content without first seeing and dismissing a warning. 22:34:26 zakim, unmute me 22:34:26 Yvette_Hoitink was not muted, Yvette 22:39:50 q+ 22:40:14 q+ 22:40:39 ack alex 22:40:47 ack lore 22:41:28 ack judy 22:43:40 q- 22:43:55 q+ 22:45:02 ack Becky 22:45:58 q+ to say "doability is issue for L1 and L2, so doesn't matter" 22:46:28 q+ 22:48:15 zakim, mute me 22:48:15 Yvette_Hoitink should now be muted 22:50:27 resolution: delete 2.3.1 and move 2.3.1 to Level 1 22:50:44 s/2.3.2/2.3.1/ 22:51:17 resolution: replaces last resolution - delete 2.3.1 and move 2.3.2 to Level 1 22:53:30 -Tim_Boland 22:53:54 above resolution closes 1785, 1796 and 1793 22:53:59 zakim, close this item 22:53:59 agendum 4 closed 22:54:01 I see 6 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 22:54:02 5. 26 January Issues and proposed techniques for guideline 1.1 [from ben] 22:54:07 zakim, take up agendum 5 22:54:07 agendum 5. "26 January Issues and proposed techniques for guideline 1.1" taken up [from ben] 22:54:50 resolution: close issue 1104 as proposed in the survey 22:55:23 zakim, close this item 22:55:23 agendum 5 closed 22:55:24 I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 22:55:25 6. Guideline 4.2 Issues [from ben] 22:55:27 * 1665 22:55:29 * 1668 22:55:30 * 1670 22:55:32 * 1776 22:55:33 zakim, take up agendum 6 22:55:33 agendum 6. "Guideline 4.2 Issues" taken up [from ben] 22:57:43 zakim, unmute me 22:57:43 Yvette_Hoitink should no longer be muted 23:01:21 ack l 23:01:23 ack d 23:01:24 q- 23:01:26 ack y 23:01:47 q+ 23:02:10 q- 23:02:12 ack John 23:03:18 -Yvette_Hoitink 23:03:27 I got kicked off 23:03:32 but want to vote against closing 23:03:55 resolution: close 1666 as proposed but modify comment as proposed by John 23:05:06 +Yvette_Hoitink 23:09:29 -Roberto_Ellero 23:11:23 -Michael_Cooper 23:11:27 -Yvette_Hoitink 23:13:04 -Kerstin_Goldsmith 23:13:29 resolution: close issue 1667 with modified rationale 23:23:24 resolution: add an advisory technique to GL 1.3 called "providing resizable fonts" 23:24:22 zakim, close this item 23:24:22 agendum 6 closed 23:24:23 I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 23:24:24 7. Draft Techniques and Issues for Guideline 2.4 [from ben] 23:24:31 agenda? 23:24:38 zakim, take up agendum 8 23:24:38 agendum 8. "Techniques for Guideline 2.1" taken up [from ben] 23:24:51 Topic: Failure due to using plugins in a way that traps users inside plugin content 23:30:08 resolution: accept proprosal for "Failure due to using plugins in a way that traps users inside plugin content." with edits to address Loretta's and Andi's comments. Examples would be really helpful. 23:31:46 -Andi_Snow_Weaver 23:31:47 -Alex_Li 23:31:48 -Judy 23:31:50 -Sofia_Celic 23:31:51 -John_Slatin 23:31:52 Sorcha has left #wai-wcag 23:31:52 -Loretta_Guarino_Reid 23:31:54 -Bengt_Farre 23:31:55 -David_MacDonald 23:31:57 -Ben_Caldwell 23:31:58 -Gregg_Vanderheiden 23:32:07