W3C

- DRAFT -

EOWG

18 Nov 2005

Agenda

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
Alan_Chuter, Doyle_Saylor, Tanguy_Lohéac, Shawn_Lawton_Henry, Andrew_Arch, Barry, Shadi, Pasquale, William_Loughborough, Harvey_Bingham, Wayne_Dick
Regrets
Henk_Snetselaar, Justin_Thorp, Liam_McGee, Roberto_Castaldo, Helle
Chair
SV_MEETING_CHAIR
Scribe
Andrew

Contents


 

 

Outreach Updates

Shadi: short report from Tunis

<shawn> scribe: Andrew

<shawn> scribenick: andrew

<Wayne> I am having a little computer trouble today, I'll join in a couple of minutes.

Shadi: short report from Tunis at WSIS

Barry: reported on the large scale survey across the EU that he has been involved in
... outcomes to be announced next week and the report launched
... Lead partner was RNIB; others included AbilityNet & SOCITM Insight

Harvey: attended presentation by Maria XXX from School for the Blind

Barry: starting point was a common set of services from each state, plus sites the state nominated
... auto scan of all sites (500) plus manual evaluation on subset (30 sites)
... manual eval confirmed auto test plus issues auto testing can't look at
... instead of just WCAG "A", broke it into four categories
... methodologies described in forthcoming report
... tried to pick out particularly good practice, and named state and org
... long list of recommendations also in the report
... most states ahve WCAG "AA" as their objective, even if not many have achieved it

Before/After Demo (BAD)

Shadi: requirements - http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/Drafts/retrofit/requ-basite
... 4 pages that look equivalent but are inaccessible and accessible repsectively
... plus a model evaluation

<Wayne> wayne, unmute me

Shadi: List of Web accessibility barriers selected for demonstration - http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/features
... not comprehensive list of accessibility barries, but representative

<shawn> shadi: can add accessibility barriers later

Shadi: each of the four pages demonstrates different bariers
... before (inaccessible) pages - http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/before/
... not complete, but developing rapidly
... some pages not only break with assistive technology, but also with some browsers
... after (accessible) pages - http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/after/
... the after pages are not as developed as the before pages
... any comments/feedback?

William: it looks pretty good

Andrew: it will be a nice collection for demo purposes

Shawn: is the visual design final?

Shadi: pretty much final, maybe some fine tuning
... does the top yellow warning/notice banner work?

Andrew: yellow stands out, but as it does not match the colour scheme it does not detract from the design

Barry: red on yellow is a bit difficult to read but words are good

All: agree that placement is good

<scribe> ACTION: issues 1) reconsider red on yellow; 2) make banner text scalable; 3) consider link to good site as well as to 'about' [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action01]

<Wayne> wayne, unmute me

<scribe> ACTION: issues 4) add some padding to the text [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action02]

Wayne: the before page works fine with my custom stylesheet

Shadi: it would be good to get some feedback from Wayne so we can possibly break it a bit more

<scribe> ACTION: Wayne to check all 'before' pages and provide feedback to TF [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action03]

Wayne: top banner currently interferes with page for me - rest of page is good

<shawn> ACTION: issues 5) strong bottom border line [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action04]

Barry: likes overall visual design - not as strong concerns as Wayne as can factor out the banner (once you realise it's purpose)

Shawn: is grey boring? Harvey - yes; Barry - no, quite common

<scribe> ACTION: issues 6) are some space around the borders, e.g. 'traffic' should not be against the page boundry [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action05]

Shawn: lets consider navigation for the demo and between the good/bad pages
... do we all agree that best is a tweaking of the top warning banner?

All: all agree that notificayion and navigation can be in the top bar on bother versions

Andrew: what about using the LHS nav to link to the report, and then to the repaired (or damaged) page?

Shadi: please think about use cases - page by page vs site vs report etc

Shawn: Andrew's suggestion may also alow demo of menu hierarchy
... it should always be clear as to whether you are in the before or after site

William: keep is simple

Barry: disagrees with Andrew's suggestion - keep suite navigation separate from model navigation
... keep all suite navigation to the page linked from the banner at the top, might be extra links but simple and discreet
... put the good/bad indicator into the top banner, not on the page (but top banner needs to be kept concise)

Shadi: what about using colour in the banner to help differentiate between good/bad?

Wayne: why not just say BEFORE & AFTER?

Shadi: what about information that is actually informative about accessibility?

William: keep the pages pure - keep accessibility info out

Most: agree with William; Andrew doesn't mind accessibility info

Shawn: discussion seems to be that the top bar should NOT be integrated more into the site, but can still demo best practice such as use of colour

Shadi: thanks to TF members - Steve Faulkner, Liam McGee, Pasquale, Tanguy

<scribe> ACTION: consider links to 'intro', 'before', 'after', 'eval' in the top banner [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action06]

List of Web Accessibility Evaluation Tools

Shadi: update on activities - user interface almost stable; TF collecting data
... see - http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/2005/tools-tf

William: will be collecting the accessibility of the tools themselves?

Andrew: we are trying to gather this information from the vendors/developers

Note EOWG meeting schedule for November and December

See - http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/#meetings

Shawn: may need to progress some activities via email as we are missing several Friday meetings in the next month and a half

<shawn> andrew ***THANKS***

thanks shawn - i was just looking it up

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: consider links to 'intro', 'before', 'after', 'eval' in the top banner [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action06]
[NEW] ACTION: issues 1) reconsider red on yellow; 2) make banner text scalable; 3) consider link to good site as well as to 'about' [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: issues 4) add some padding to the text [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action02]
[NEW] ACTION: issues 5) strong bottom border line [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action04]
[NEW] ACTION: issues 6) are some space around the borders, e.g. 'traffic' should not be against the page boundry [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action05]
[NEW] ACTION: Wayne to check all 'before' pages and provide feedback to TF [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html#action03]
 
[End of minutes]

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Succeeded: s/See/Shadi/
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Default Present: Doyle_Saylor, Sylvie_Duchateau\Tanguy_Lohéac, Shawn, Alan, Andrew, Shadi, Loughborough, Barry, pasquale, Bingham, wayne, Jack, Barry_McMullin
Present: Alan_Chuter Doyle_Saylor Tanguy_Lohéac Shawn_Lawton_Henry Andrew_Arch Barry Shadi Pasquale William_Loughborough Harvey_Bingham Wayne_Dick
Regrets: Henk_Snetselaar Justin_Thorp Liam_McGee Roberto_Castaldo Helle
Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-eo/2005OctDec/0100.html

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Got date from IRC log name: 18 Nov 2005
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2005/11/18-eo-minutes.html
People with action items: 4 add consider issues links padding some wayne

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