IRC log of tagmem on 2005-11-08

Timestamps are in UTC.

17:59:15 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #tagmem
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2005/11/08-tagmem-irc
17:59:23 [Zakim]
TAG_Weekly()12:30PM has now started
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+??P0
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-??P0
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TAG_Weekly()12:30PM has ended
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Attendees were
18:00:38 [Zakim]
TAG_Weekly()12:30PM has now started
18:00:40 [Zakim]
+DanC
18:00:48 [Zakim]
+??P0
18:01:09 [DanC]
Zakim, ??P0 is Ed
18:01:09 [Zakim]
+Ed; got it
18:01:12 [Norm]
zakim, what's the passcode?
18:01:12 [Zakim]
the conference code is 0824 (tel:+1.617.761.6200), Norm
18:02:15 [DanC]
Topic: Administrative
18:02:23 [DanC]
Regrets: Tim, Henry, Vincent
18:02:30 [DanC]
Chair: Ed
18:02:32 [DanC]
Scribe: DanC
18:02:59 [Zakim]
+Norm
18:03:49 [Norm]
zakim, who's here?
18:03:49 [Zakim]
On the phone I see DanC, Ed, Norm
18:03:50 [Zakim]
On IRC I see RRSAgent, Ed, Zakim, noah_lunch, Norm, DanC
18:04:06 [DanC]
Regrets + DavidO
18:04:08 [Zakim]
+[IBMCambridge]
18:04:15 [Norm]
zakim, [IBM is oah
18:04:15 [Zakim]
+oah; got it
18:04:20 [DanC]
Zakim, IBMCambridge holds Noah
18:04:20 [Zakim]
sorry, DanC, I do not recognize a party named 'IBMCambridge'
18:04:22 [Norm]
zakim, oah is noah
18:04:22 [Zakim]
+noah; got it
18:06:35 [DanC]
Next teleconference: propose 15 November
18:06:44 [Norm]
Norm: regrets for 15 November
18:07:04 [noah]
I will chair next week.
18:07:10 [DanC]
regrets 15 Nov: Norm, Vincent; Ed; at risk: Tim, Dan
18:08:37 [DanC]
RESOLVED: to cancel 15 Nov and meet next 22 Nov, VQ to chair
18:09:02 [noah]
zakim, who is here?
18:09:02 [Zakim]
On the phone I see DanC, Ed, Norm, noah
18:09:03 [Zakim]
On IRC I see RRSAgent, Ed, Zakim, noah, Norm, DanC
18:09:07 [DanC]
agenda comments?
18:09:14 [DanC]
DanC: some auth stuff... and norm's ns8 stuff
18:09:40 [DanC]
agenda + Administrative
18:09:54 [DanC]
NM: without henry, endpointRefs might be tricky
18:10:09 [DanC]
agenda + # Preparing agenda for Dec. f2f at MIT
18:10:15 [DanC]
agenda + Issue endPointRefs-47
18:10:23 [DanC]
agenda + authentication
18:10:28 [DanC]
agenda + namespaceDocument-8
18:10:57 [DanC]
-> http://www.w3.org/2005/11/01-tagmem-minutes.html minutes 1 Nov
18:11:11 [DanC]
RESOLVED to accept
18:11:22 [DanC]
Zakim, next item
18:11:22 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Administrative" taken up [from DanC]
18:11:27 [DanC]
Zakim, take up item 1
18:11:27 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Administrative" taken up [from DanC]
18:11:28 [DanC]
Zakim, take up item 2
18:11:28 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "# Preparing agenda for Dec. f2f at MIT" taken up [from DanC]
18:11:35 [DanC]
Zakim, close item 1
18:11:37 [Zakim]
agendum 1, Administrative, closed
18:11:37 [Zakim]
I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
18:11:38 [Zakim]
2. # Preparing agenda for Dec. f2f at MIT [from DanC]
18:11:58 [DanC]
CONFIRMED: 12-14 June
18:12:10 [DanC]
CONFIRMED: 12-14 June 2006 in Western MA
18:13:00 [DanC]
NM summarizes msg of Tue, 8 Nov 2005 12:27:32 -0500
18:13:02 [Ed]
* Followup to Edinburgh discussions of versioning: we seemed to be off to a useful if somewhat slow start in settling terminology, etc., and I think there was some sense that versioning-related work could be a key theme for the TAG's work in the coming year or two.
18:13:20 [Ed]
(from Noah's email)
18:13:29 [Ed]
* Self-describing documents: I don't think we have an issue around this, but Tim at least informally seemed to feel it would be worth attention. I agree, and I might be convinced to do some work on a finding (though we'll have to set priorities relative to TAG commitments already made).
18:14:42 [DanC]
q+ to note progress on versioning
18:15:24 [DanC]
ack danc
18:15:24 [Zakim]
DanC, you wanted to note progress on versioning
18:16:10 [DanC]
agenda + versioning
18:16:11 [Ed]
* schemeProtocols-49: I owe the TAG a reworked position to be available within the next few weeks, allowing time for TAG members to read and consider before the F2F. I think a couple of hours on this would be worthwhile. The goal would be either to finally agree that there's something worth pursuing, or to formally put it aside for the forseeable future.
18:16:29 [DanC]
agenda 6 = versioning, esp. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2005Sep/0136.html
18:17:21 [DanC]
DanC: Self-describing documents .. umm... yeah... worth some time... not sure how.
18:19:37 [DanC]
DanC: on schemeProtocols-49 ... I should get in touch with some of the proponents of http: synonyms...
18:19:44 [DanC]
NM: mms: is relevant there too
18:19:45 [Ed]
* Web Services and the Web: I think we're using endPointRefs-47 as an excuse for the TAG to come up to speed on Web Services and perhaps to discover new issues worth pursuing. Henry's worked example seems useful.
18:21:27 [DanC]
NM: perhaps "principle of least power" merits some time at the ftf too.
18:22:35 [DanC]
Ed: perhaps focus more on this bit of our charter: "when setting future directions, help establish criteria for starting new work at W3C, and help W3C coordinate its work with that of other organizations."
18:23:14 [DanC]
DanC: how would that be different from what we're doing now?
18:23:45 [DanC]
Ed: e.g. mobile web... perhaps put together something on content/presentation before mobile web inititative publishes something
18:24:49 [Zakim]
+Norm.a
18:24:52 [Zakim]
-Norm
18:25:12 [DanC]
DanC: I can see both sides of that, but I'm concerned about whether we're doing what we say we're going to do... long list of actions with slow progress... which things to preempt?
18:25:49 [Norm]
zakim, Norm.a is Norm
18:25:49 [Zakim]
+Norm; got it
18:25:54 [DanC]
NM: it occurs to me that there will [may] be some turn-over... we could think about what we're going to hand to the incoming folks
18:26:19 [DanC]
NM: "issue list and assignments"?
18:26:35 [DanC]
Ed: anything else? well, that's it for now; we can add more later
18:26:52 [DanC]
Ed: priorities?
18:27:12 [DanC]
DanC: prioritize stuff based on work that gets done before the meeting
18:28:29 [DanC]
Ed: hmm...
18:28:56 [DanC]
NM: agenda seems fluid enough to let incoming writing influence it
18:29:07 [DanC]
Zakim, close item 2
18:29:07 [Zakim]
agendum 2, # Preparing agenda for Dec. f2f at MIT, closed
18:29:08 [Zakim]
I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
18:29:09 [Zakim]
3. Issue endPointRefs-47 [from DanC]
18:29:13 [Zakim]
+Roy_Fielding
18:29:36 [DanC]
postponed pending DO, HT's availability
18:29:58 [DanC]
Zakim, close item 3
18:29:58 [Zakim]
agendum 3, Issue endPointRefs-47, closed
18:29:59 [Zakim]
I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
18:30:00 [Zakim]
4. authentication [from DanC]
18:30:08 [Norm]
Norm has joined #tagmem
18:30:11 [DanC]
agenda?
18:30:13 [Roy]
Roy has joined #tagmem
18:30:54 [DanC]
Zakim, take up item 5
18:30:54 [Zakim]
agendum 5. "namespaceDocument-8" taken up [from DanC]
18:31:00 [Norm]
http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/nsDocuments/
18:31:17 [DanC]
-> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/nsDocuments/ Associating Resources with Namespaces 7 November 2005
18:32:44 [DanC]
NDW: pls excuse encoding noise... working on .htaccess
18:33:10 [DanC]
DNW: am I on the right track?
18:33:18 [DanC]
s/DNW/NDW/
18:33:32 [DanC]
DanC: it's not so much "instead of" RDDL... we're also endorsing RDDL as is, right?
18:33:37 [DanC]
NDW: right.
18:33:45 [noah]
Noah thinks that Norm's "We hope to: 1)... 2)... 3)..." is balanced on the status of RDDL.
18:34:50 [DanC]
DanC: I'm not in a good position to review... I'll just see what I want to see
18:34:56 [DanC]
Ed: I'm OK to review it.
18:35:15 [DanC]
ACTION NDW: fill in section 5 of http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/nsDocuments/
18:35:39 [DanC]
ACTION Ed: review http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/doc/nsDocuments/ after NDW updates w.r.t section 5, perhaps by 22 Nov
18:36:07 [Norm]
Funny characters fixed
18:37:11 [DanC]
DanC: status... hmm... it's in the shape of a finding... we've been asked for a REC... a finding is OK by me, at least for now
18:37:20 [DanC]
NDW: let's shop it around as a finding for now
18:37:37 [DanC]
Zakim, close this item
18:37:37 [Zakim]
agendum 5 closed
18:37:38 [Zakim]
I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
18:37:39 [Zakim]
4. authentication [from DanC]
18:37:53 [DanC]
-> http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2005/09/auth453.html Web Auth: state of the art
18:39:10 [noah]
If you mean Microsoft Infocard, Noah is surprised that it is purely WS-Trust based. I thought it was a general repository and associated "non scary to ordinary mortals" UI for all credentials.
18:40:38 [DanC]
[missed lots by danc]
18:40:46 [DanC]
NDW: that was SAML
18:42:03 [DanC]
NM: I got the impression InfoCard was more federated than just ws-trust
18:42:45 [DanC]
... sorta like web browsers mostly use http, though they can use other uri schemes
18:42:54 [DanC]
DC: I got the impression ws-trust played the pivotal role
18:43:41 [DanC]
DC: I hear a workshop might be in progress
18:43:51 [noah]
FWIW: the Microsoft Web Page about Infocard appears to be at: http://msdn.microsoft.com/windowsvista/building/infocard/default.aspx
18:43:57 [DanC]
Ed: perhaps we should recommend that W3C do a workshop?
18:44:49 [DanC]
... on web authentication
18:45:18 [Roy]
*shrug*
18:45:38 [noah]
Following up on scope of Infocard, see specifically: http://msdn.microsoft.com/windowsvista/building/infocard/default.aspx?pull=/library/en-us/dnwebsrv/html/identitymetasystem.asp#identitymetasy_topic9
18:45:47 [DanC]
DanC: I'm conflicted... I'm not sure I'll be able to go. If I could go, I'd like it to happen.
18:46:16 [DanC]
ACTION DanC: to write a report on the state of the art authentication in the web [continues]
18:46:20 [DanC]
Zakim, next item
18:46:20 [Zakim]
agendum 4. "authentication" taken up [from DanC]
18:46:26 [DanC]
Zakim, take up item 5
18:46:26 [Zakim]
agendum 5. "namespaceDocument-8" taken up [from DanC]
18:46:28 [DanC]
Zakim, take up item 6
18:46:28 [Zakim]
agendum 6. "versioning, esp. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2005Sep/0136.html" taken up
18:50:40 [noah]
q+ to say we're not in 100% total agreement on the use of the term "language"
18:52:50 [Zakim]
+Dave_Orchard
18:55:23 [DanC]
ACTION: DanC to derive RDF/RDFS/OWL version of terminology from whiteboard /
18:56:32 [DanC]
violet
18:56:35 [Norm]
ty
18:57:20 [Norm]
FYI: http://www.horstmann.com/violet/
18:57:30 [Ed]
ack noah
18:57:30 [Zakim]
noah, you wanted to say we're not in 100% total agreement on the use of the term "language"
18:58:37 [DanC]
I think stringset is what we got in http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2005/09/22-diagram1.png
18:59:37 [Ed]
noah: I think we should set down instructions on how we should read that diagram we had on the white board
19:00:33 [Norm]
brb
19:00:45 [DanC]
DC: tx for feedback... this week and next are kinda shot, but the following week might work
19:01:02 [DanC]
meanwhile... ACTION DaveO to update finding with ext/vers
19:03:04 [DanC]
DC: I guess my target is to tell this "HTML 2 sublanguage of HTML4" story
19:06:01 [DanC]
DO: ok, let's hope that folds into the finding
19:06:30 [DanC]
Zakim, close item 4
19:06:30 [Zakim]
agendum 4, authentication, closed
19:06:31 [Zakim]
I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
19:06:32 [Zakim]
6. versioning, esp. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2005Sep/0136.html
19:06:35 [DanC]
Zakim, close item 6
19:06:35 [Zakim]
agendum 6, versioning, esp. http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2005Sep/0136.html, closed
19:06:37 [Zakim]
I see nothing remaining on the agenda
19:06:37 [Ed]
http://www.w3.org/2001/tag/2005/03/action-summary.html
19:07:22 [DanC]
Topic: action review
19:07:38 [DanC]
NM: I see my CDF review action marked done.
19:08:46 [DanC]
RF: made a little progress on mime/respect item. (RF to update Authoritative Metadata finding to include resolution of putMediaType-38)
19:09:00 [Zakim]
-Dave_Orchard
19:09:08 [DanC]
ADJOURN.
19:09:16 [Zakim]
-Norm
19:09:17 [Zakim]
-noah
19:09:18 [Zakim]
-DanC
19:09:22 [Zakim]
-Ed
19:35:00 [Zakim]
disconnecting the lone participant, Roy_Fielding, in TAG_Weekly()12:30PM
19:35:05 [Zakim]
TAG_Weekly()12:30PM has ended
19:35:06 [Zakim]
Attendees were DanC, Ed, Norm, [IBMCambridge], noah, Roy_Fielding, Dave_Orchard
21:31:20 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #tagmem
23:20:06 [Norm]
Norm has joined #tagmem