IRC log of ws-addr on 2005-10-24

Timestamps are in UTC.

19:48:15 [RRSAgent]
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logging to http://www.w3.org/2005/10/24-ws-addr-irc
19:48:37 [Zakim]
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19:49:17 [Marsh]
Zakim,this will be WS
19:49:17 [Zakim]
ok, Marsh; I see WS_AddrWG()4:00PM scheduled to start in 11 minutes
19:49:52 [Marsh]
RRSAgent, set log member
19:53:36 [Zakim]
WS_AddrWG()4:00PM has now started
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+Gilbert_Pilz
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+YinLeng_Husband
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-YinLeng_Husband
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19:55:37 [Zakim]
+??P2
19:55:46 [TonyR]
zakim, ??p2 is me
19:55:46 [Zakim]
+TonyR; got it
19:56:05 [mnot]
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19:56:13 [mnot]
zakim, this will be ws_addrwg
19:56:13 [Zakim]
ok, mnot, I see WS_AddrWG()4:00PM already started
19:56:27 [mnot]
Meeting: Web Services Addressing Working Group Teleconference
19:56:30 [mnot]
Chair: Mark Nottingham
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19:56:52 [mnot]
Agenda: http://www.w3.org/mid/5D90BB85-F6C0-46FE-97F3-085690F13E63@bea.com
19:57:20 [Zakim]
+Rebecca_Bergersen
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19:57:41 [Nilo]
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19:58:26 [Gil]
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19:58:32 [mnot]
zakim, who is on the phone?
19:58:32 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Gilbert_Pilz, TonyR, Rebecca_Bergersen
19:58:48 [Zakim]
+Jonathan_Marsh
19:59:07 [Zakim]
+Mark_Nottingham
19:59:12 [Arun]
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+[Sun]
19:59:41 [Arun]
zakim, [Sun] is me
19:59:41 [Zakim]
+Arun; got it
20:00:06 [Zakim]
+Bob_Freund
20:00:09 [Zakim]
+MSEder
20:00:17 [Zakim]
+Hugo
20:00:43 [uyalcina]
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20:00:58 [Zakim]
+Mark_Little
20:01:11 [Zakim]
+Tom_Rutt
20:01:14 [Zakim]
+Andreas_Bjarlestam
20:01:14 [Zakim]
+Nilo_Mitra
20:02:01 [bob]
bob has joined #ws-addr
20:02:10 [Katy]
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+Umit_Yalcinalp
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+Mark_Peel
20:03:03 [andreas]
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20:03:33 [Zakim]
+Katy_Warr
20:03:45 [Zakim]
+[Microsoft]
20:04:09 [Gil]
zakim, who is on the phone?
20:04:09 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Gilbert_Pilz, TonyR, Rebecca_Bergersen, Jonathan_Marsh, Mark_Nottingham, Arun, Bob_Freund, MSEder, Hugo, Mark_Little, Tom_Rutt, Andreas_Bjarlestam (muted),
20:04:13 [Zakim]
... Nilo_Mitra, Umit_Yalcinalp, Mark_Peel, Mark_Peel/Katy_Warr, [Microsoft]
20:04:24 [Zakim]
+Paco:Francisco_Curbera
20:04:24 [anish]
anish has joined #ws-addr
20:04:37 [Paco]
Paco has joined #ws-addr
20:04:40 [Zakim]
+Anish
20:05:20 [Zakim]
+Vikas_Deolaliker
20:05:39 [Zakim]
+Dave_Orchard
20:06:13 [Zakim]
+Paul_Knight
20:06:33 [vikas]
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+GlenD
20:07:00 [PaulKnight]
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20:07:16 [bob]
scribe:bob
20:07:35 [glen-away]
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20:08:21 [Zakim]
+??P24
20:09:31 [Zakim]
+ +41.22.580.aaaa
20:10:07 [TomRutt]
Narita express runs every 1/2 hour or so
20:10:17 [bob]
discussion concerning final arrangements for Yokohama F2F
20:10:40 [hugo]
Zakim, aaaa is Paul_Downey
20:10:45 [Zakim]
+Paul_Downey; got it
20:11:02 [bob]
Afenda item 3, last meeting minutes
20:11:19 [bob]
Oct 17 minutes approved without objection
20:11:25 [TonyR]
s/Afenda/Agenda/
20:11:56 [bob]
Acrion item review
20:12:21 [TonyR]
s/Acrion/Action/
20:12:37 [bob]
s/scribe/scribbler/
20:13:09 [mnot]
i059 proposal: http://www.w3.org/mid/2BA6015847F82645A9BB31C7F9D6416556A801@uspale20.pal.sap.corp
20:13:27 [mnot]
Topic: i059
20:13:48 [bob]
Umit: Important requirements:
20:14:12 [bob]
Umit: requirements of wsdl / addressing bindings
20:14:23 [bob]
Umit: outlined areas not covered
20:14:47 [bob]
Umit: discussed addressing faults
20:15:32 [bob]
Umit:major issue is to get SOAP response over HTTP response
20:15:51 [bob]
Umit: Requiment is to get actual response over a new connection
20:16:49 [bob]
Umit: responses sent over the same connection if replyto: is anonymous
20:17:16 [bob]
Umit: response is sent over a new connection if replyto: is not anonymous
20:18:30 [bob]
Umit: points 5 and 6 in the proposal are not necessarily agreed to be requirements and are open to discussion
20:19:40 [bob]
Umit: continues to go over the requirements contained in the proposal as written
20:20:30 [bob]
Umit: proposal introduces a nre element the "async element"
20:20:56 [bob]
s/nre/new/
20:22:45 [bob]
details of this new element are outlined in the proposal
20:24:56 [bob]
Umit: New fault is introduced if an endpoint is unable to support async operation
20:26:07 [bob]
Umit: open issues, 5 and 6
20:26:37 [mnot]
ack hugo
20:26:37 [Zakim]
hugo, you wanted to ask about extensibility
20:27:59 [bob]
Hugo: Asked if async is tied to use of the SOAP binding, is it that specific and was that intended?
20:29:32 [bob]
Umit: problem was kicked around for some tme, and there was no intent to "re-write wsdl". Her observation is that the proposal discussed the specific need to address SOAP over http
20:30:21 [Zakim]
+David_Hull
20:30:22 [bob]
Paco: Yes, it may be appropriate to come to a specific solution, but there is need to separate issues for clarity of discussion
20:30:36 [Zakim]
-??P24
20:30:47 [bob]
Jonathan: question concerning requirement 7 and how it mapps to the proposal
20:31:15 [glen-brb]
q+
20:31:24 [bob]
Umit: that requirement (number 7) is not fulfilled by the proposal
20:31:32 [mnot]
zakim, who is on the phone?
20:31:32 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Gilbert_Pilz, TonyR, Rebecca_Bergersen, Jonathan_Marsh, Mark_Nottingham, Arun, Bob_Freund, MSEder, Hugo, Mark_Little, Tom_Rutt, Andreas_Bjarlestam (muted),
20:31:35 [Zakim]
... Nilo_Mitra, Umit_Yalcinalp, Mark_Peel, Mark_Peel/Katy_Warr, [Microsoft], Paco:Francisco_Curbera, Anish, Vikas_Deolaliker, Dave_Orchard, Paul_Knight, GlenD, Paul_Downey (muted),
20:31:37 [Zakim]
... David_Hull
20:32:16 [bob]
Umit: other requirements not met are the "always async" requirement (5) and the rpc style of use (6)
20:32:58 [dhull]
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20:33:01 [anish]
q+
20:33:27 [GlenD]
ack glen
20:33:51 [mnot]
ack anish
20:33:58 [bob]
Glen: There may be more agreement than disagrrment on some of these unmet requirements, but the group has not reached a final decision
20:34:21 [GlenD]
er, that's not really what I said...
20:34:46 [GlenD]
Glen: We did have substantial agreement on requirement 7, being able to express the available "response bindings". That would be easy to add to this.
20:35:08 [bob]
thanks glen
20:35:11 [GlenD]
np
20:35:59 [bob]
Umit: This proposal may be simplified further should the requirements be pared down
20:36:33 [bob]
issue i065
20:37:22 [bob]
Katy: Sent out two proposals, feels that proposal 2 might impact CR status of our spec
20:38:21 [bob]
Jonathan: Proposal 0 (status quo) would have no impact on CR
20:38:47 [bob]
Katy: that does not provide a solution if the SOAP action does not match the wsa:Action
20:39:19 [bob]
Jonathan: Feels that this can be closed with no action by just not dealing with the migration issue
20:40:05 [bob]
Mnot: let it sit until the f2f or discuss on email
20:40:17 [bob]
issue: cr9
20:40:35 [mnot]
http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/addr/cr-issues/#cr9
20:40:52 [bob]
WSA Action for undefined faults
20:41:53 [bob]
Jonathan: Original submission had a single fault mechanism, but didn't say what to do about SOAP faults
20:42:40 [bob]
Jonathan: Leaning toward proposal 3 to define a new URI for dealing with SOAP faults
20:43:35 [bob]
Jonathan/Mnot: feels that change would not be substantive especially with the use of MAY
20:44:58 [mlittle]
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20:45:02 [bob]
Jonathan: goal is to define one action for SOAP faults so that developer has a clear answer
20:45:05 [anish]
q+
20:45:46 [mnot]
ack anish
20:46:20 [bob]
Anish: What would happen if we defined a default action value?
20:46:56 [bob]
Jonathan: This was done just for SOAP, not clear what to do about other bindings
20:47:18 [dhull]
+1 to reserving but not mandating
20:47:25 [bob]
Action: Jonathan to develop a more detailed proposal
20:47:30 [RebeccaB]
q+
20:47:43 [mnot]
ack rebeccab
20:48:00 [PaulKnight]
+1 to Paco
20:48:18 [bob]
Hugo: voices weak lack of support for proposal 1, but would not hold his breath and turn blue if it were adopted
20:49:05 [bob]
Agenda item 7, CR testing report
20:50:20 [bob]
Paul: not a lot of new status, some work on the quality of the test cases we have
20:50:30 [dhull]
q+
20:51:05 [bob]
Paul: There is not complete test coverage now, but there is significant coverage and feels that they are doing quite well
20:52:19 [bob]
ACTION: Paul and Glen send times to mnot for times for a test team call
20:52:29 [mnot]
ack dhull
20:53:50 [bob]
David: Is looking for more detail that would describe what was looking for what when
20:55:07 [bob]
David: would be nice to have more explanatory material describing the test senarios
20:55:56 [bob]
Paul: clarifies that all tests are observed on the wire
20:56:50 [bob]
David: I am concerned that we have missed something
20:57:27 [bob]
David: A standard test harness would be useful, and expands on his extended thoughts of testing
20:58:24 [bob]
MNot: We can get through CR with manual test cases although automation would be good for the community, just don't focus on infrastructure at the expense of tests
20:59:08 [Zakim]
-Anish
20:59:22 [bob]
David: No, I am not talking about tool creation, I am talking about defining the tests and success/failure criteria
20:59:56 [bob]
Paul: Defends tests by stating that each test is linked to a specific request and response
21:03:32 [GlenD]
q+
21:04:19 [mnot]
ack glen
21:04:22 [bob]
David: Clarifies by asking for as much specificity as possible
21:09:21 [bob]
MNot: will try to schedule a meeting for more detailed and in-depth discussion on testing perhaps this Wednesday
21:09:58 [bob]
MNot: New W3C process requires a heartbeat publication each three months, that will be discussed at futre time
21:10:02 [hugo]
Zakim, make log public
21:10:02 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'make log public', hugo
21:10:07 [hugo]
RRSAgent, make log public
21:11:05 [Zakim]
-Mark_Little
21:11:32 [bob]
Meeting ajourns at 17:11 EDT
21:11:33 [Zakim]
-Paco:Francisco_Curbera
21:11:34 [Zakim]
-Arun
21:11:35 [Zakim]
-Vikas_Deolaliker
21:11:36 [Zakim]
-Andreas_Bjarlestam
21:11:37 [Zakim]
-Hugo
21:11:37 [bob]
bob has left #ws-addr
21:11:38 [Zakim]
-Jonathan_Marsh
21:11:39 [Zakim]
-Mark_Peel
21:11:40 [Zakim]
-Paul_Downey
21:11:42 [Zakim]
-Rebecca_Bergersen
21:11:43 [Zakim]
-Nilo_Mitra
21:11:44 [Zakim]
-Mark_Nottingham
21:11:46 [Zakim]
-Umit_Yalcinalp
21:11:47 [TonyR]
TonyR has left #ws-addr
21:11:48 [Zakim]
-David_Hull
21:11:50 [Zakim]
-Paul_Knight
21:11:52 [Zakim]
-Mark_Peel/Katy_Warr
21:11:54 [Zakim]
-GlenD
21:11:56 [Zakim]
-Gilbert_Pilz
21:11:58 [Zakim]
-MSEder
21:12:01 [Zakim]
-Tom_Rutt
21:12:02 [Zakim]
-TonyR
21:12:04 [Zakim]
-Dave_Orchard
21:12:06 [Zakim]
-Bob_Freund
21:18:17 [mnot]
rrsagent, generate minutes
21:18:23 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2005/10/24-ws-addr-minutes.html mnot
21:18:35 [mnot]
zakim, who is here/
21:18:35 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'who is here/', mnot
21:30:59 [Zakim]
-[Microsoft]
21:31:01 [Zakim]
WS_AddrWG()4:00PM has ended
21:31:03 [Zakim]
Attendees were Gilbert_Pilz, YinLeng_Husband, TonyR, Rebecca_Bergersen, Jonathan_Marsh, Mark_Nottingham, Arun, Bob_Freund, MSEder, Hugo, Mark_Little, Tom_Rutt, Andreas_Bjarlestam,
21:31:07 [Zakim]
... Nilo_Mitra, Umit_Yalcinalp, Mark_Peel, Katy_Warr, [Microsoft], Paco:Francisco_Curbera, Anish, Vikas_Deolaliker, Dave_Orchard, Paul_Knight, GlenD, +41.22.580.aaaa, Paul_Downey,
21:31:09 [Zakim]
... David_Hull
21:36:47 [Katy]
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