15:52:29 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #er
15:52:29 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2005/10/11-er-irc
15:52:36 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #er
15:52:45 <shadi> zakim, this will be ert
15:52:45 <Zakim> ok, shadi; I see WAI_ERTWG()12:00PM scheduled to start in 8 minutes
15:52:57 <shadi> meeting: ERT WG
15:53:01 <JibberJim> JibberJim has joined #er
15:53:35 <shadi> agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-ert/2005Oct/0023.html
15:53:47 <shadi> regrets: Carlos, Sandor
15:53:58 <shadi> chair: Shadi
15:54:12 <shadi> agenda+ Sortable Tools List
15:54:24 <shadi> agenda+ BNF for EARL
15:54:36 <shadi> agenda+ Updated F2F Agenda
15:54:46 <shadi> scribe: Charles
15:56:01 <JohannesK> JohannesK has joined #er
15:56:45 <niq> niq has joined #er
15:59:35 <ChrisR> ChrisR has joined #er
16:00:06 <Zakim> WAI_ERTWG()12:00PM has now started
16:00:08 <Zakim> +Shadi
16:00:19 <Zakim> +Klaus/Johannes/Thomas
16:00:20 <Zakim> -Klaus/Johannes/Thomas
16:00:21 <Zakim> +Klaus/Johannes/Thomas
16:00:58 <shadi> scribe: Johannes
16:01:08 <shadi> scribenick: JohannesK
16:01:22 <Zakim> +Jim_Ley
16:01:46 <JohannesK> Zakim, this will be ERT
16:01:48 <Zakim> ok, JohannesK, I see WAI_ERTWG()12:00PM already started
16:02:09 <JohannesK> Agenda+ Sortable Tools List
16:02:34 <Zakim> +??P4
16:03:01 <niq> Zakim: ?p4 is me
16:03:13 <niq> Zakim, ?p4 is me
16:03:15 <Zakim> sorry, niq, I do not recognize a party named '?p4'
16:03:31 <niq> Zakim, ??p4 is me
16:03:31 <Zakim> +niq; got it
16:03:31 <shadi> zakim, drop agendum 4
16:03:31 <Zakim> agendum 4, Sortable Tools List, dropped
16:04:31 <Zakim> +??P5
16:04:38 <JohannesK> Meeting: ERT WG
16:05:29 <JohannesK> Zakim, take up agendum 1
16:05:29 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Sortable Tools List" taken up [from shadi]
16:06:25 <JohannesK> SAZ: tools list discussed on EOWG
16:06:56 <JohannesK> SAZ: data available in RDF
16:07:25 <JohannesK> SAZ: everyone can build interface, add annotation
16:08:11 <JohannesK> SAZ: database is incomplete
16:08:58 <JohannesK> SAZ: when interface is ok, then add more information about tools
16:10:02 <JohannesK> SAZ: any further ideas? how useful is it? more usecases?
16:10:29 <JohannesK> CR: nice to have the list
16:11:06 <JohannesK> CR: add guidelines?
16:11:09 <JohannesK> SAZ: already available
16:11:47 <JohannesK> SAZ: can already be searched for
16:12:38 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ER/tools/
16:14:08 <chaals> chaals has joined #er
16:14:28 <JohannesK> SAZ: point taken
16:14:49 <chaals> sorry I am late - just got back into the office...
16:15:07 <JohannesK> JL: agree with CMN
16:16:16 <JohannesK> JL: give disclaimer per tool?
16:17:28 <niq> maybe per-tool should have source-of-info; e.g. vendor-supplied, scraped, along with date
16:17:47 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2005/10/11-er-irc#T16-17-28
16:18:13 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:19:51 <JohannesK> SAZ: each tool vendors publishes information for their tool, then link to this info from tool list
16:21:00 <JohannesK> NK: aggregate information provided by tool vendors
16:22:01 <JohannesK> SAZ: problem is how to get all the information, when vendors don't provide it
16:22:54 <chaals> ack me
16:22:56 <Zakim> -??P5
16:23:07 <JohannesK> SAZ: what is the developer's problem to provide info
16:25:03 <JohannesK> CMN: translation of information?
16:25:23 <JohannesK> CMN: different languages
16:25:51 <JohannesK> SAZ: develop a form for developers to add information
16:28:27 <JohannesK> NK: automatic check of external vendor information
16:29:22 <JohannesK> SAZ: level of trust
16:29:54 <JibberJim> SVG WG take a direct feed from svg.org ...
16:31:03 <chaals> +1 to Nick's suggestion
16:31:33 <Zakim> +??P5
16:31:46 <JohannesK> NK: automatic update with email notification to maintainer
16:36:17 <JohannesK> CMN: what about adding reviews?
16:37:11 <JohannesK> SAZ: would be difficult because of W3C's vendor-neutrality
16:37:39 <chaals> [yes, definitely reviews from elsewhere, not providing W3C resources to do them...]
16:39:11 <niq> Hiving off responsibility: something like <a href="google?q=accessibility+review+wcag+earl">some reviews</a>
16:39:23 <JohannesK> SAZ: test suite could be used later
16:40:35 <JohannesK> SAZ: main thing is collecting information now
16:41:37 <JohannesK> SAZ: later this week there will be an updated list of tools
16:41:45 <JohannesK> Zakim, close agendum 1
16:41:45 <Zakim> agendum 1, Sortable Tools List, closed
16:41:46 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:41:47 <Zakim> 2. BNF for EARL [from shadi]
16:42:23 <JohannesK> SAZ: suggestion from Opera
16:43:01 <JohannesK> SAZ: unsure if BNF is the right tool
16:44:25 <JohannesK> CMN: we want RDF schema to be trimmed
16:47:33 <JohannesK> SAZ: developers tend to look at it from an XML perspective instead of RDF
16:48:11 <niq> shadi admits RDF is too obscure for real people :-)
16:48:59 <JohannesK> CMN: does definition in BNF hold up work for RDF schema?
16:49:06 <JohannesK> CMN: what's the benefit?
16:49:25 <JohannesK> SAZ: 1. understand model/conformance
16:50:04 <JohannesK> SAZ: 2. why not write up in formal grammar
16:50:36 <JohannesK> SAZ: let's talk about that at F2F
16:51:31 <JohannesK> Zakim, close agendum 2
16:51:31 <Zakim> agendum 2, BNF for EARL, closed
16:51:32 <Zakim> I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
16:51:33 <Zakim> 3. Updated F2F Agenda [from shadi]
16:53:24 <JohannesK> SAZ: hopefully we can come up with a timeline after F2F
16:53:35 <JibberJim> beer.
16:54:01 <niq> .de beer.  especially weizenbier :-)
16:55:05 <JohannesK> SAZ: come prepared to F2F
16:56:21 <Zakim> -niq
16:56:21 <JohannesK> Zakim, close agendum 3
16:56:22 <Zakim> agendum 3, Updated F2F Agenda, closed
16:56:24 <ChrisR> ChrisR has left #er
16:56:24 <Zakim> I see nothing remaining on the agenda
16:56:26 <Zakim> -??P5
16:56:27 <Zakim> -Klaus/Johannes/Thomas
16:56:28 <Zakim> -Jim_Ley
16:56:37 <Zakim> -chaals
16:56:58 <Zakim> -Shadi
16:56:59 <Zakim> WAI_ERTWG()12:00PM has ended
16:57:01 <Zakim> Attendees were Shadi, Klaus/Johannes/Thomas, Jim_Ley, niq, chaals
17:05:28 <shadi> zakim, bye
17:05:28 <Zakim> Zakim has left #er
17:05:39 <shadi> rrsagent, make logs world
17:05:47 <shadi> rrsagent, make minutes
17:05:47 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2005/10/11-er-minutes.html shadi
17:05:59 <shadi> rrsagent, bye
17:05:59 <RRSAgent> I see no action items