IRC log of er on 2005-10-04

Timestamps are in UTC.

16:00:18 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #er
16:00:18 [RRSAgent]
logging to
16:00:25 [shadi]
zakim, this will be ert
16:00:25 [Zakim]
ok, shadi; I see WAI_ERTWG()12:00PM scheduled to start now
16:00:50 [Zakim]
WAI_ERTWG()12:00PM has now started
16:00:59 [Zakim]
16:01:19 [Zakim]
16:01:22 [Zakim]
16:01:40 [JohannesK]
JohannesK has joined #er
16:01:45 [shadi]
zakim, code?
16:01:45 [Zakim]
the conference code is 3794 (tel:+1.617.761.6200), shadi
16:02:06 [Zakim]
16:02:13 [Zakim]
16:03:02 [Sandor]
16:03:12 [Sandor]
meeting: ERT WG
16:03:23 [CarlosI]
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16:03:26 [Sandor]
Scribe: Sandor
16:03:35 [Sandor]
Chair: Shadi
16:03:59 [Sandor]
Regrets: Charles
16:04:21 [shadi]
16:04:42 [shadi]
zakim, drop agendum 1
16:04:42 [Zakim]
agendum 1, , dropped
16:04:47 [shadi]
agenda+ Proposal for Location
16:05:18 [Zakim]
16:05:20 [shadi]
zakim, p1 is really Chris
16:05:20 [Zakim]
sorry, shadi, I do not recognize a party named 'p1'
16:05:25 [shadi]
zakim, ??p1 is really Chris
16:05:25 [Zakim]
+Chris; got it
16:05:31 [shadi]
zakim, ??p3 is really Nick
16:05:31 [Zakim]
+Nick; got it
16:05:38 [shadi]
zakim, ??p6 is really Carlos
16:05:38 [Zakim]
+Carlos; got it
16:05:55 [niq]
JibberJim: your turn ....
16:06:12 [shadi]
agenda+ Evidence
16:06:22 [shadi]
agenda+ F2F Topics
16:06:29 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 1
16:06:29 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "" taken up [from Sandor]
16:06:33 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 2
16:06:33 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "Proposal for Location" taken up [from shadi]
16:08:00 [Sandor]
SA: Location can be single pointer, range, shadow location, compound (for unstructured)
16:09:15 [Sandor]
SA: todo: figure out composites. one location is for one mapping. several location pointers if there is more than instances
16:11:11 [Sandor]
SA: misuse of compound location a problem?
16:11:37 [Zakim]
16:12:07 [niq]
you don't want to hear cough .. splutter .. blow nose
16:12:45 [niq]
no, I'm fine with what you wrote
16:13:07 [CarlosI]
16:13:15 [shadi]
ack CarlosI
16:13:18 [Sandor]
SA: are there other types of location?
16:16:26 [Sandor]
CI: heuristic tests in doc where error not located exactly - can we describe?
16:17:34 [Sandor]
SA: probably possible with compound location
16:19:04 [Sandor]
CI: case can occur where it's not clear what location type should be used
16:19:25 [JibberJim]
16:19:38 [shadi]
ack JibberJim
16:20:27 [Sandor]
JL: no problem if we can not always point to the exact problem
16:21:21 [Sandor]
SA: ambiguity on the location types, clarify which type to which scenario to use
16:21:56 [Sandor]
SA: will diff developers use different loc types?
16:22:30 [niq]
something like line/char or byte-offsets can't hope to correspond exactly over different tools
16:23:54 [niq]
see the example in what I posted before: different validators
16:24:24 [Sandor]
SA: <nik> ambiguity anyway with respect to line/char byte-offset, etc.
16:24:41 [niq]
urls at the bottom of
16:25:05 [niq]
not big problem, it's the same error
16:25:26 [niq]
v.w.o: "Line 10 column 20:"
16:25:44 [niq]
valet: "Line 11 char 1"
16:26:00 [Sandor]
SA: have to provide good description of how to use line etc.
16:26:00 [niq]
htmlhelp: "Line 11 char 2"
16:27:04 [Sandor]
CI: problem for e.g. one specific testcase - and not knowing how to handle
16:27:36 [Sandor]
SA: tool would expect one of the four locs.
16:30:03 [Sandor]
CI: will tools understand error independent of the location types used to describe it
16:32:07 [Sandor]
CR: ok
16:32:20 [Sandor]
JK: ok
16:33:01 [Sandor]
SA: all agree
16:34:04 [Sandor]
SA: earl consuming tools must be able to handle all different loc. types
16:34:29 [Sandor]
SA: next steps, refining classes, properties, etc
16:35:09 [niq]
hmmm ....
16:35:34 [niq]
will think about it, not sure if I have much to add to earlier discussion
16:35:48 [Sandor]
SA: working on everything that belongs to single loc. class?
16:35:56 [shadi]
16:36:31 [niq]
ah, that's what you're talkin'bout
16:36:56 [Sandor]
SA: e.g. line (domain, range, line col have superclass)
16:36:59 [niq]
can give that a try ...
16:37:06 [Sandor]
NK: ok
16:37:08 [niq]
16:37:31 [Sandor]
action: work on sinle location location
16:38:00 [Sandor]
zakim, close 2
16:38:00 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'close 2', Sandor
16:38:21 [Sandor]
zakim, close agendum 2
16:38:21 [Zakim]
agendum 2, Proposal for Location, closed
16:38:22 [Zakim]
I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:38:23 [Zakim]
3. Evidence [from shadi]
16:38:48 [niq]
*and* 'cos chaals disagreed with everyone ...
16:39:37 [Sandor]
SA: ruleset part of testcase - special part of testcase?
16:40:54 [niq]
16:42:08 [Sandor]
SA: waiting for charles' responds, continue on later call or f2f
16:43:19 [Sandor]
SA: overall structure of the evidence class: properties to ease queries
16:43:49 [niq]
16:43:57 [Sandor]
SA: what to do with annotated reports - add assertor?
16:44:27 [niq]
audit trail for assertions/assertors?
16:44:27 [JibberJim]
maybe it was his illness finally killing him?
16:45:19 [niq]
it's a new assertion - the previous assertion is evidence for the new one, yesno?
16:45:38 [Sandor]
JL: modified assertion - more sort of signing the report (outside of the earl model)
16:46:48 [Sandor]
JL: like signature of the file, trusted places, etc.
16:46:52 [niq]
talking of trust, should we support pgp-signed reports?
16:49:24 [niq]
16:51:34 [Sandor]
zakim, close agendum 3
16:51:34 [Zakim]
agendum 3, Evidence, closed
16:51:35 [Zakim]
I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
16:51:36 [Zakim]
4. F2F Topics [from shadi]
16:51:53 [Sandor]
SA: add evidence
16:52:26 [niq]
aob is always the best item
16:54:55 [niq]
beer brakes if you please - this is .de!
16:54:56 [Sandor]
zakim, close agendum 4
16:54:56 [Zakim]
agendum 4, F2F Topics, closed
16:54:57 [Zakim]
I see nothing remaining on the agenda
16:55:10 [Zakim]
16:55:17 [Zakim]
16:55:19 [Zakim]
16:55:20 [ChrisR]
ChrisR has left #er
16:55:21 [Zakim]
16:55:25 [Zakim]
16:55:48 [Zakim]
16:58:54 [JibberJim]
Hmm, I wonder if I could get from CGN to the meeting on the monday morning...
17:05:00 [Zakim]
disconnecting the lone participant, Chris, in WAI_ERTWG()12:00PM
17:05:04 [Zakim]
WAI_ERTWG()12:00PM has ended
17:05:06 [Zakim]
Attendees were Sandor_Herramhof, Klaus/Johannes/Thomas, Shadi, Chris, Nick, Carlos, Jim_Ley
19:01:52 [Zakim]
Zakim has left #er
20:13:14 [shadi]
rrsagent, make logs world
20:13:19 [shadi]
rrsagent, make minutes
20:13:19 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate shadi
20:13:42 [shadi]
rrsagent, bye
20:13:42 [RRSAgent]
I see 1 open action item saved in :
20:13:42 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: work on sinle location location [1]
20:13:42 [RRSAgent]
recorded in