14:27:46 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dawg
14:27:46 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2005/09/13-dawg-irc
14:27:53 <DanC> Meeting: DAWG Weekly
14:28:59 <DanC> Regrets: Souripriya_Das, JeenB
14:29:08 <DanC> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2005JulSep/att-0425/dawg-12sep.html__charset_us-ascii
14:29:16 <DanC> agenda + Toward Protocol Last Call
14:29:25 <DanC> agenda + SPARQL Protocol and WSDL
14:29:30 <LeeF> Zakim, who's on the phone?
14:29:30 <Zakim> sorry, LeeF, I don't know what conference this is
14:29:31 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, Yoshio, Zakim, DaveB, AndyS, EliasT, LeeF, SteveH, afs, ericP, DanC
14:29:33 <AndyS> zakim, who is on the phone
14:29:33 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who is on the phone', AndyS
14:29:34 <DanC> agenda + comment: SPARQL Protocol: inconsistent parameter names
14:29:39 <DanC> Zakim, this will be dawg
14:29:39 <Zakim> ok, DanC, I see SW_DAWG()10:30AM already started
14:29:43 <AndyS> zakim, who is on the phone?
14:29:43 <Zakim> On the phone I see Lee_Feigenbaum, ??P20, ??P19
14:29:45 <Zakim> + +1.978.455.aaaa
14:29:59 <DanC> agenda + issues#valueTesting : "language tag issues"
14:30:01 <EliasT> Zakim, +1.978.455.aaaa is EliasT
14:30:05 <Zakim> +EliasT; got it
14:30:05 <AndyS> zakim, ??P20 is AndyS
14:30:06 <DanC> agenda + BASE IRI resolution comment
14:30:07 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it
14:30:11 <LeeF> Zakim, Lee_Feigenbaum is LeeF
14:30:11 <Zakim> +LeeF; got it
14:30:13 <Zakim> +Yoshio
14:30:13 <DanC> agenda + issues#valueTesting: handling type "error"s
14:30:19 <DanC> agenda + issues#rdfSemantics
14:30:20 <DaveB> Zakim, ??P19 is DaveB
14:30:21 <Zakim> +DaveB; got it
14:30:25 <DanC> agenda + issues#owlDisjunction
14:30:26 <Zakim> +Kendall_Clark
14:30:31 <DanC> agenda + SPARQL QL grammar
14:30:37 <DanC> agenda + issues#badIRIRef
14:30:45 <Zakim> +DanC
14:31:05 <DanC> Zakim, take up item 1
14:31:05 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Convene, take roll, review records and agenda" taken up [from DanC]
14:31:11 <DanC> Zakim, who is on the phone?
14:31:11 <Zakim> On the phone I see LeeF, AndyS, DaveB, EliasT, Yoshio, Kendall_Clark, DanC
14:31:17 <kendall> kendall has joined #dawg
14:31:38 <DanC> Zakim, pick a scribe
14:31:38 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose DaveB
14:32:12 <DanC> DanC has changed the topic to: RDF Data Access 13 Sep scribe: DaveB
14:32:14 <DanC> scribe: DaveB
14:32:16 <SteveH> whats the conf. code?
14:32:20 <EliasT> 7333
14:32:21 <kendall> 7333
14:32:27 <DanC> Regrets+ JosD
14:32:29 <Zakim> +??P24
14:32:40 <SteveH> Zakim, ??P24 is SteveH
14:32:40 <Zakim> +SteveH; got it
14:33:12 <DaveB> minutes approvde 
14:33:35 <DaveB> for 6 sep in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2005JulSep/att-0363/06-dawg-minutes.html
14:33:43 <DaveB> tag conflicts 20sep
14:34:06 <Zakim> +Rachel_Yager
14:34:19 <DaveB> looking for a chair for 20sep
14:34:32 <DaveB> current top canidated is Pat Hayes
14:34:44 <DaveB> as there are a pile of semantics issues
14:35:08 <ericP> DanC, on phone wiht hugo, plh soon
14:35:17 <DanC> roger.
14:35:35 <DanC> Zakim, pick a scribe
14:35:35 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose DanC
14:35:39 <DanC> Zakim, pick a scribe
14:35:39 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Yoshio
14:35:44 <Yoshio> no
14:35:49 <DanC> Zakim, pick a scribe
14:35:49 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose DaveB
14:35:51 <ericP> ...(re lack of output serialization in LC WD)
14:35:51 <DanC> Zakim, pick a scribe
14:35:51 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Yoshio
14:35:53 <DanC> Zakim, pick a scribe
14:35:53 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose SteveH
14:35:59 <DaveB> 20 sep scribe: steveH
14:36:15 <kendall> I'm willing to backup chair, if needed
14:36:16 <DaveB> 20 sep chair: PatH (possibly) or ...
14:36:28 <AndyS> I did my action.
14:37:27 <DaveB> continuing other actions
14:37:39 <DanC> Zakim, next item
14:37:39 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Toward Protocol Last Call" taken up [from DanC]
14:38:02 <DaveB> publishing work happening today
14:38:10 <DaveB> KC action done, ericp action continued
14:38:23 <DaveB> ... had to make up a namespace name for sparql query interface
14:38:58 <DaveB> in http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/proto-wd/sparql-protocol-query.wsdl ?
14:39:09 <DanC> <description targetNamespace="http://www.w3.org/2005/08/sparql-protocol-query/#">
14:39:09 <DaveB> -
14:39:09 <DaveB> 	<description targetNamespace="http://www.w3.org/2005/08/sparql-protocol-query/#">
14:39:25 <DaveB> DanC: now been put in the document
14:39:42 <DaveB> KC: was a namespace under proto-wd
14:39:53 <DanC> (it doesn't occur in the .html ; just in the .wsdl)
14:40:05 <kendall> http://www.w3.org/2005/09/sparql-protocol-types/#
14:40:11 <EliasT> why "/#" vs "#"?
14:40:36 <DanC> KC's action is done...
14:40:45 <DanC> ACTION EricP: publish proto-wd v 1.68 + changes from as LCWD [continues]
14:40:51 <kendall> heh
14:40:54 <EliasT> heh
14:40:56 <kendall> s/joke/policy/
14:40:58 <DanC> Zakim, next item
14:40:58 <Zakim> agendum 3. "SPARQL Protocol and WSDL" taken up [from DanC]
14:41:33 <DanC> ACTION: LeeF to draft WSDL 1.1 for SPARQL thingy with AndyS and Elias ETA 9 sep
14:41:38 <kendall> yay
14:41:38 <DanC> -- continues
14:41:44 <DaveB> LeeF: 1st draft of wsdl1.1 done, needs some polishing.  doing some example java and python impl
14:41:52 <DaveB> ... if LC is this week, should be able to get code out next week
14:42:00 <DaveB> can send out current code pointer
14:42:18 <kendall> :>
14:42:22 <Zakim> +EricP
14:42:23 <LeeF> http://thefigtrees.net/DAWG/sparql-wsdl-1.1-note.html
14:42:47 <LeeF> http://thefigtrees.net/DAWG/SPARQLClient.zip   (Java)
14:42:56 <DanC> ACTION: DanC to ask WSDL WG to review WSDL 1.1 and WSDL 2 SPARQL protocol stuff, once both are available
14:42:59 <DanC> -- continues
14:43:10 <DanC> ACTION: KC to work with WSDL WG on describing POST binding with application/x-form-encoded in WSDL 2
14:43:58 <DaveB> KC - have sent 1 mail with 3 issues, 2 are conceptually similar
14:44:06 <DaveB> one of those has turned into a LC issue with tracking number
14:44:20 <DaveB> and wsdlwg has considered a fix and response
14:44:42 <DaveB> ... will send hugo mail to co-ordinate
14:45:15 <Zakim> +Pat_Hayes
14:45:15 <DanC> -- continues
14:45:30 <Zakim> -EliasT
14:45:53 <patH> patH has joined #dawg
14:46:03 <DaveB> wsdl2.0 lc issues list: http://www.w3.org/2002/ws/desc/5/lc-issues/
14:47:10 <Zakim> +EliasT
14:47:26 <DanC> Zakim, next item
14:47:26 <Zakim> agendum 4. "comment: SPARQL Protocol: inconsistent parameter names" taken up [from DanC]
14:47:26 <DaveB> DanC: you wanted reminding once ericp was back online (chairing?)
14:48:35 <DaveB> PatH is happy to chair
14:48:54 <DaveB> on sep20, ericP backup
14:49:40 <DanC> 2005-09-06T15:25:59Z from arjohn.kampman
14:49:54 <DanC> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2005Sep/0018
14:50:30 <DaveB> action done
14:50:38 <DanC> tracking wierdness. will fix.
14:50:46 <DanC> Zakim, next item
14:50:46 <Zakim> agendum 5. "issues#valueTesting : "language tag issues"" taken up [from DanC]
14:51:07 <DanC> # ACTION: ericp to draft lang-match design, summarizing and citing RFC3066
14:51:12 <DanC> #ACTION: ericp to draft lang-match design, summarizing and citing RFC3066
14:51:15 <DanC> ACTION: ericp to draft lang-match design, summarizing and citing RFC3066
14:51:20 <DanC> -- continues
14:51:40 <DanC> Zakim, next item
14:51:40 <Zakim> agendum 5 was just opened, DanC
14:51:45 <DanC> Zakim, close item 5
14:51:45 <Zakim> agendum 5, issues#valueTesting : "language tag issues", closed
14:51:46 <Zakim> I see 6 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:51:48 <Zakim> 6. BASE IRI resolution comment [from DanC]
14:51:48 <DanC> Zakim, next item
14:51:48 <Zakim> agendum 6. "BASE IRI resolution comment" taken up [from DanC]
14:52:10 <DanC> #
14:52:10 <DanC>   ACTION: ericP to send [OK?] message to Bjoern. re BASE IRI resolution comment
14:52:16 <DanC> -- continues
14:52:27 <DanC> Zakim, move to next agendum
14:52:27 <Zakim> agendum 6 was just opened, DanC
14:52:32 <DanC> Zakim, close this item
14:52:32 <Zakim> agendum 6 closed
14:52:34 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:52:35 <DanC> Zakim, move to next agendum
14:52:36 <Zakim> 7. issues#valueTesting: handling type "error"s [from DanC]
14:52:38 <Zakim> agendum 7. "issues#valueTesting: handling type "error"s" taken up [from DanC]
14:53:33 <DaveB> my mail http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2005JulSep/0410.html
14:53:51 <ericP> A       B   |   NOT A   A && B  A || B
14:53:51 <ericP> -------------------------------------
14:53:51 <ericP> E       E   |   E       E       E
14:53:51 <ericP> E       T   |   E       E       T
14:53:51 <ericP> E       F   |   E       F       E
14:53:53 <ericP> T       E   |   F       E       T
14:53:55 <ericP> T       T   |   F       T       T
14:53:58 <ericP> T       F   |   F       F       T
14:54:00 <ericP> F       E   |   T       F       E
14:54:03 <ericP> F       T   |   T       F       T
14:54:06 <ericP> F       F   |   T       F       F
14:54:35 <kendall> "E" is unknown here?
14:54:43 <kendall> or error?
14:54:44 <LeeF> E is Error
14:54:45 <DanC> "E" is like unkown, but it's type error
14:54:50 <kendall> ACK
14:57:52 <DaveB> the temp example (original comment) http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2005Aug/0030.html
14:58:08 <AndyS> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ternary_logic
14:58:43 <DanC> DaveB: also matches SQL
14:58:57 <DaveB> PatH - there are lots of ternary logics...
14:59:49 <DaveB> we are looking at and going to approve the NOT A, and A&& B
15:00:19 <DanC> SWH: "error or true" is not true in SQL
15:00:21 <SteveH> mysql> SELECT NULL | 1;
15:00:21 <SteveH> +----------+
15:00:21 <SteveH> | NULL | 1 |
15:00:21 <SteveH> +----------+
15:00:21 <SteveH> |     NULL |
15:00:22 <SteveH> +----------+
15:00:40 <DaveB> jeen's doc says T | E -> T for SQL
15:00:55 <DanC> SWH: ah... with || , it does match
15:01:02 <DaveB> we mean logical OR (||)
15:01:25 <SteveH> sorry, typo
15:01:55 <DanC> ACTION DaveB: add to test suite the temperature case from timbl's comment on truth tables
15:02:09 <DaveB> from http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2005Aug/0030.html
15:02:50 <DaveB> PatH - there are other ways to do this, this form is a weak way
15:03:01 <DaveB> DanC - was this part borrowed from XQuery?  ericp: No
15:03:44 <DanC> PROPOSED: to change the value testing truth table as per 2005JulSep/0410.html
15:04:14 <DanC> PROPOSED: to change the value testing truth table as per table 1 of 2005JulSep/0410.html
15:04:40 <DanC> so RESOLVED
15:04:49 <DanC> ACTION EricP: change the value testing truth table as per table 1 of 2005JulSep/0410.html
15:05:44 <kendall> I think this  would all be a lot easier for us if Tim would  just do all the work directly! :>
15:05:57 <DanC> ACTION EricP: respond to commentor http://www.w3.org/mid/B27E3100-A366-496F-AC9A-A0E5257C3F80@w3.org
15:06:34 <ericP> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2005JulSep/0360 ericP's proposal that the above truth table meets TimBl's requirements
15:07:45 <DanC> DanC: note gk's comments too
15:07:50 <DanC> Zakim, next item
15:07:50 <Zakim> agendum 8. "issues#rdfSemantics" taken up [from DanC]
15:08:44 <DaveB> issue http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/issues#rdfSemantics
15:09:08 <ericP> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2005Sep/0002.html gk's comments
15:09:18 <kendall> what's a lean graph?
15:09:30 <DaveB> kendall: it's defned the rdf semantics
15:09:40 <kendall> thx
15:10:15 <LeeF> Kendall - defined here, I think:
15:10:15 <LeeF> http://www.w3.org/TR/2002/WD-rdf-mt-20020429/#Non-entailment
15:10:17 <DaveB> discussion of comments in agenda
15:10:22 <DanC> Zakim, who's on the call?
15:10:22 <Zakim> On the phone I see LeeF, AndyS, DaveB, Yoshio, Kendall_Clark, DanC, SteveH, Rachel_Yager, EricP, Pat_Hayes, EliasT
15:13:24 <DaveB> ACTION AndyS: write email with 2 use cases on rdf-semantics issues for references
15:14:03 <DaveB> options include
15:14:09 <DaveB> deciding current semantics are ok
15:14:29 <DaveB> say what we have now is ok and postpone looking at this till later
15:14:37 <DaveB> other options involve us getting smarter
15:15:07 <DaveB> or, reduce the scope of the language down to one graph some of the semantics work gets easier
15:15:28 <DaveB> --
15:16:04 <Zakim> -Rachel_Yager
15:16:05 <DaveB> SH: would probably get objections from removing multiple graphs.  People have seen it and are expecting it.
15:16:26 <DaveB> KC: would have to explain tradeoffs of compat with owl / multi-graphs & aggregations
15:16:56 <DaveB> AndyS: EnricoF had distinguished core sparql (1 graph) and full sparql
15:18:00 <DaveB> DanC: there is some momentum for a separate semantics doc
15:18:15 <DaveB> ... but whose is it, a paper by Enrico, a WG note, a WG doc?
15:18:44 <DaveB> for such things as soundness and completeness for sparql
15:18:45 <AndyS> Enrico made other changes that I found to me a significant changes
15:19:13 <AndyS> Enrico made other changes that I found to be a significant changes
15:19:44 <DaveB> and a new doc would have a Schedule Impact
15:20:58 <EliasT> can we quote DanC on the logs, please?
15:21:26 <DaveB> "Semanticists should be obstetricians, not coroners of programming languages.    -- John Reynolds" -- quotes DanC
15:21:36 <DaveB> ( found in http://www.w3.org/2000/10/swap/infoset/xmod67.html )
15:23:25 <DaveB> DaveB has not swapped this semantics stuff in.  and am scared
15:24:37 <DaveB> Yoshio: owl disjunction should be one of the service aspects.  no semantic obligation in the language.  don't want to delay things more.
15:25:18 <AndyS> +1 to minimal like DISTINCT
15:25:30 <kendall> I think the OWL heads would be happy with that, if it worked out.
15:25:36 <AndyS> A feature of the thing (service) being asked.
15:25:43 <DaveB> DanC: would like to treat this like distinct
15:26:07 <DanC> (yes, I think that's what yoshio said, AndyS. A feature of the thing (service) being asked. )
15:26:21 <Yoshio> exactly
15:26:23 <AndyS> Ack
15:26:26 <kendall> oh, I was talking about Republicans. :>
15:26:33 <DanC> Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:26:33 <Zakim> On the phone I see LeeF, AndyS, DaveB, Yoshio, Kendall_Clark, DanC, SteveH, EricP, Pat_Hayes, EliasT
15:26:35 <kendall> (sorry)
15:27:11 <DanC> Zakim, next item
15:27:11 <Zakim> agendum 9. "issues#owlDisjunction" taken up [from DanC]
15:27:17 <DaveB> issue http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/issues#owlDisjunction
15:28:29 <DaveB> ref  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0069
15:28:44 <DaveB> ^- the "worker example" / "little house example"
15:29:51 <DaveB> DanC - thinks that IH would be satisfied if sparql was defined in terms of rdf-simple entailment
15:30:00 <DaveB> IH=Ian Horrocks
15:30:29 <kendall> sorry, didn't hear what he said
15:31:30 <DaveB> PatH - if we for e.g. based on owl-entailment we'd have to explain how the semantics such as disjunction translates into owl:oneOf (sp?) ...
15:31:40 <DaveB> (not scribed all of that)
15:33:10 <DanC> hope to make progress on these 2 issues 20 Sep, 4 Oct
15:33:16 <patH> I sugest we shouold not get invoolved with trying to make disjunction in a query fully relate to OWL disjunction. That buys us into a larger set of problkems than our charter allows. We should focus on RDf not OWL.
15:33:51 <DanC> Zakim, next item
15:33:51 <Zakim> agendum 10. "SPARQL QL grammar" taken up [from DanC]
15:35:11 <DaveB> good news: I've mostly updated to grammar in current editor's draft and got no shift/reduce conflicts.  bad news: it's  not passing previously working tests (i.e. I'm still fixing it)
15:35:18 <DanC> 1.489
15:35:31 <DanC> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/rq23/#grammar
15:35:52 <DanC> "The SPARQL grammar is LL(1) when the rules with uppercased names are used as terminals."
15:37:04 <patH> "if you were the only/tool in the world..."
15:37:31 <ericP> AndyS, Q_IRI_REF, roger -- tx
15:37:42 <DaveB> DanC: what about var names?
15:37:51 <DaveB> afs: can start with digits and underscores (rule 84)
15:38:00 <DanC> VARNAME prod 84
15:38:29 <kendall> zakim, mute me
15:38:29 <Zakim> Kendall_Clark should now be muted
15:38:37 <DaveB> AndyS: NCCHAR1 adds '_' from NCCHAR1p (used for namespace prefixes)
15:39:00 <kendall> fire engines and ambulances
15:41:46 <DaveB> dscusion of lang changes to grammar - possible new builtin, or qnamed-function
15:41:48 <DanC> REQUEST FOR TEST CASE: SELECT ?x WHERE {.}
15:42:00 <DaveB> ... and possibly import the xquery fn (with URI) for the language matching
15:42:51 <DanC> ACTION SteveH: review grammar tests
15:43:00 <DanC> ACTION DaveB: review grammar tests
15:43:24 <DaveB> that's the SyntaxDev dir and subdirs
15:44:00 <DaveB> AndyS: I've got TestBadSyntax working too, should that not be in the test namespace/manifest stuff?
15:44:15 <DanC> Zakim, next item
15:44:15 <Zakim> agendum 11. "issues#badIRIRef" taken up [from DanC]
15:44:32 <DanC> test case: SELECT ?x WHERE { <foo###bar> dc:title ?x }
15:44:33 <DaveB> (that was my message to Andy, not what he said)
15:44:46 <AndyS> Needs Steve to agree and update the doc and scripts
15:45:15 <DanC> "Any IRI references in a SPARQL query string must be valid according to RFC 3987 [RFC3987] and RFC 3986 [RFC3986]."
15:45:22 <SteveH> AndyS, can you point me to that tommorow? I have to run after the telecon
15:45:46 <DanC> (that stuff about BASE is redundant w.r.t. text ericp is wrangling)
15:45:48 <DaveB> -- "IRI References" unnumbered section in http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/rq23/#grammar
15:47:42 <AndyS> Will add something like "any qname, and <> must be a valid IRI reference" by naming the rules that are involved
15:48:30 <DaveB> IIRC RDF core decided not to check uri syntax?
15:49:43 <DaveB> DanC: are there any cases where a syntactically valid query is invalid?
15:50:28 <patH> possible (?) use case might be using the query protocol to locae illegal URIs in an RDF document. Question is, why does it fall to SPARQL to be the URI censor?
15:50:38 <patH> locae/locate
15:51:05 <DaveB> DanC asked if a query with an unbound prefix is a valid sparql query.
15:53:06 <kendall> zakim, unmute me
15:53:06 <Zakim> Kendall_Clark should no longer be muted
15:54:23 <kendall> zakim, mute me
15:54:23 <Zakim> Kendall_Clark should now be muted
15:56:08 <Yoshio> q+ to ask if  it implies every SPARQL server MUST check the validity or it will be unconformant?  I think we could separate conformance of a query and of a server
15:56:15 <AndyS> Difficult to find a good IRI library (JJC is looking at this for us at the moment)
15:57:09 <AndyS> ARQ catches ### today - thinking of making it switchable
15:57:17 <DanC> PROPOSED: that SELECT ?x WHERE { <foo###bar> dc:title ?x } is not a SPARQL query string; that Q_IRI_REF's must conform to generic IRI syntax
15:57:24 <kendall> zakim, unmute me
15:57:24 <Zakim> Kendall_Clark should no longer be muted
15:57:30 <DanC> ack Yoshio 
15:57:30 <Zakim> Yoshio, you wanted to ask if  it implies every SPARQL server MUST check the validity or it will be unconformant?  I think we could separate conformance of a query and of a server
15:57:36 <DanC> Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:57:36 <Zakim> On the phone I see LeeF, AndyS, DaveB, Yoshio, Kendall_Clark, DanC, SteveH, EricP, Pat_Hayes, EliasT
15:57:40 <kendall> zakim, mute me
15:57:40 <Zakim> Kendall_Clark should now be muted
15:58:04 <kendall> FWIW, I support the proposal that Q_IRI_REFs must conform to generic IRI syntax.
15:59:41 <DanC> y a y y y a n n n a
16:00:24 <DanC> PROPOSED: that SELECT ?x WHERE { <foo###bar> dc:title ?x } is not a SPARQL query string; that Q_IRI_REF's must conform to generic IRI syntax
16:01:01 <DanC> hayes, harris, andy, ericp abstain
16:01:11 <kendall> FYI: We're out of time. :>
16:01:40 <DanC> so RESOLVED.  hayes, harris, andy, ericp abstain
16:01:52 <Zakim> -DaveB
16:01:53 <DanC> ADJOURN.
16:02:02 <DanC> dave, do you have what you need to produce the record?
16:02:03 <Zakim> -SteveH
16:02:08 <DanC> RRSAgent, make logs world-access
16:02:15 <DaveB> yes I think so
16:02:23 <kendall> zakim, unmute me
16:02:23 <Zakim> Kendall_Clark should no longer be muted
16:02:35 <EliasT> yay!
16:02:51 <EliasT> down with the protocols!
16:03:20 <EliasT> (except for SPARQL Protocol, of course)
16:03:43 <ericP> EliasT, please preface protocol comments with PROTOCOL: for tracking purposes
16:04:09 <Yoshio> I'm wondering if the reasons for abstain(ation?) has things to do with the restriction that every SPARQL server should check the validity, (but seems too late... :(
16:04:16 <EliasT> noted. thanks. :-)
16:04:29 <Zakim> -Kendall_Clark
16:04:45 <SteveH> Yoshio, yes, thats wy i abstained
16:04:55 <AndyS> me too
16:05:02 <patH> yoshio, I think the idea is that who checks is not specified, but legasl;ity is.
16:05:24 <Zakim> -EliasT
16:05:25 <Zakim> -DanC
16:05:27 <Zakim> -Pat_Hayes
16:05:28 <Zakim> -LeeF
16:05:28 <Zakim> -EricP
16:05:30 <Zakim> -AndyS
16:05:35 <Zakim> -Yoshio
16:05:36 <Zakim> SW_DAWG()10:30AM has ended
16:05:37 <Zakim> Attendees were EliasT, AndyS, LeeF, Yoshio, DaveB, Kendall_Clark, DanC, SteveH, Rachel_Yager, EricP, Pat_Hayes
16:06:17 <Yoshio> I (also) don't like the idea that every SPARQL server MUST check the validity. 
16:07:13 <Yoshio> We may separate the validity of query from its detection
16:07:36 <DaveB> validity of a query I can live with
16:07:54 <DaveB> checking the syntax of every URI in the data is more of a burden
16:09:03 <LeeF> Is there a non-cumbersome way to say that queries with bad URIs are invalid but need not be checked while still expecting a query processor to check that "jifwjiew" is not a valid SPARQL query?
16:10:51 <EliasT> EliasT has left #dawg
16:10:56 <DaveB> not really unless it's something like match the sparql grammar without doing the checks given indirectly in references such as URIs
16:11:47 <Yoshio> For me, just expecting is OK in the sense that  a server SHOULD check, but I'm not happy with "MUST"
16:11:54 <SteveH> well, sparql allready defines what a valid query looks like at the syntax level, and there was/is some extra text that tells you you have to look inside IRIs
16:15:52 <Yoshio> Yoshio has left #dawg
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