19:36:41 RRSAgent has joined #wai-wcag 19:36:41 logging to http://www.w3.org/2005/08/11-wai-wcag-irc 19:36:45 RRSagent, stop 19:38:27 regrets: Doyle Burnett, Luca Mascaro, Andi Snow-Weaver, Roberto Scano, Tim Boland 19:38:31 RRSagent, stop 20:01:33 gregg has joined #wai-wcag 20:01:37 rellero has joined #wai-wcag 20:01:57 +??P6 20:02:00 +??P5 20:02:16 zakim, ??P3 may be Ben_and_Gregg 20:02:16 +Ben_and_Gregg?; got it 20:02:19 +??P7 20:02:42 +Loretta_Guarino_Reid 20:02:44 -??P7 20:02:44 zakim, ??P4 is Makoto 20:02:44 +Makoto; got it 20:03:14 +??P7 20:03:30 zakim, ??P7 is Yvette_Hoitink 20:03:30 +Yvette_Hoitink; got it 20:03:36 zakim, ??P5 may be Christophe 20:03:36 +Christophe?; got it 20:03:43 agenda? 20:03:48 +[IWA-HWG] 20:04:03 zakim, [IWA-HWG] is rellero 20:04:03 +rellero; got it 20:04:38 zakim, who is here? 20:04:38 On the phone I see +61.3.988.9.aaaa, Bengt_Farre, Michael_Cooper, Ben_and_Gregg?, Makoto, ??P6, Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, rellero 20:04:41 On IRC I see rellero, gregg, Michael, Yvette, ben_, Makoto, sebastiano, bengt, Christophe, RRSAgent, Zakim 20:04:41 Becky has joined #wai-wcag 20:04:44 +Becky_Gibson 20:04:46 -rellero 20:05:15 Ciao Roberto :) 20:05:24 +??P9 20:05:37 04 01zakim, ??P9 is rellero 20:05:46 zakim, 61.3.988.9.aaa is Sophia 20:05:46 sorry, ben_, I do not recognize a party named '61.3.988.9.aaa' 20:05:48 zakim, P9 is rellero 20:05:48 sorry, rellero, I do not recognize a party named 'P9' 20:05:57 zakim, +61 is Sophia_Celic 20:05:57 +Sophia_Celic; got it 20:06:00 04 01zakim, ??P9 is rellero 20:06:11 ciao seb 20:06:11 zakim, who is on the phone? 20:06:11 On the phone I see Sophia_Celic, Bengt_Farre, Michael_Cooper, Ben_and_Gregg?, Makoto, ??P6, Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, ??P9 20:06:21 zakim, who is here? 20:06:21 On the phone I see Sophia_Celic, Bengt_Farre, Michael_Cooper, Ben_and_Gregg?, Makoto, ??P6, Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, ??P9 20:06:24 On IRC I see Becky, rellero, gregg, Michael, Yvette, ben_, Makoto, sebastiano, bengt, Christophe, RRSAgent, Zakim 20:06:39 zakim, ??P9 is Roberto_Ellero 20:06:39 +Roberto_Ellero; got it 20:06:47 :-) 20:06:59 zakim, who's making noise? 20:07:10 Yvette, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Bengt_Farre (48%), Ben_and_Gregg? (5%), Makoto (34%), Christophe? (4%), Loretta_Guarino_Reid (19%) 20:07:13 +??P11 20:07:20 zakim, mute me 20:07:20 Makoto should now be muted 20:07:21 zakim, who is here? 20:07:21 On the phone I see Sophia_Celic, Bengt_Farre, Michael_Cooper, Ben_and_Gregg?, Makoto (muted), ??P6 (muted), Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, 20:07:24 ... Roberto_Ellero, ??P11 20:07:25 On IRC I see Becky, rellero, gregg, Michael, Yvette, ben_, Makoto, sebastiano, bengt, Christophe, RRSAgent, Zakim 20:07:28 zakim, ??P11 is Andi 20:07:28 +Andi; got it 20:07:28 zakim mute me 20:07:42 zakim, I am Bengt_Farre 20:07:42 ok, bengt, I now associate you with Bengt_Farre 20:07:44 zakim, mute bengt 20:07:45 Bengt_Farre should now be muted 20:07:52 zakim, who's making noise? 20:07:53 better ? 20:07:59 nope :-( 20:08:06 but it might be my bad connection 20:08:07 Yvette, listening for 14 seconds I heard sound from the following: Ben_and_Gregg? (3%) 20:08:13 then it wasnt me zakim is strange 20:08:16 zakim mute me 20:08:20 zakim, who is on the phone? 20:08:20 On the phone I see Sophia_Celic, Bengt_Farre (muted), Michael_Cooper, Ben_and_Gregg?, Makoto (muted), ??P6, Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, 20:08:23 ... Roberto_Ellero, Andi 20:09:01 zakim, who is making noise ? 20:09:13 bengt, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Ben_and_Gregg? (24%), Yvette_Hoitink (25%), Loretta_Guarino_Reid (30%) 20:09:25 no 20:09:34 +Wendy 20:09:40 zakim, who is muted 20:09:40 ben_, you need to end that query with '?' 20:09:47 zakim, who is muted? 20:09:47 I see Bengt_Farre, Makoto muted 20:09:47 makoto 20:10:09 I called in as nr 2 20:10:15 zakim, who is on the phone? 20:10:15 On the phone I see Sophia_Celic, Bengt_Farre (muted), Michael_Cooper, Ben_and_Gregg?, Makoto, ??P6, Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, Roberto_Ellero, 20:10:18 ... Andi, Wendy 20:10:21 zakim, Makoto is Ben_and_Gregg 20:10:21 +Ben_and_Gregg; got it 20:10:28 zakim, who is on the phone? 20:10:28 On the phone I see Sophia_Celic, Bengt_Farre (muted), Michael_Cooper, Ben_and_Gregg?, Ben_and_Gregg, ??P6, Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, 20:10:31 ... Roberto_Ellero, Andi, Wendy 20:10:43 zakim, Ben_and_Gregg? may be Makoto 20:10:45 +Makoto?; got it 20:10:59 zakim, who is on the phone 20:10:59 I don't understand 'who is on the phone', ben_ 20:11:06 zakim, who is on the phone? 20:11:06 On the phone I see Sophia_Celic, Bengt_Farre (muted), Michael_Cooper, Makoto?, Ben_and_Gregg, ??P6 (muted), Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, 20:11:10 ... Roberto_Ellero, Andi, Wendy 20:11:42 p6 is makoro 20:11:43 wendy has joined #wai-wcag 20:11:47 p6 is makoto 20:12:06 zakim, who's muted? 20:12:06 I see Bengt_Farre muted 20:12:20 zakim, who is on the phone? 20:12:20 On the phone I see Sophia_Celic, Bengt_Farre (muted), Michael_Cooper, Makoto?, Ben_and_Gregg, ??P6, Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, Roberto_Ellero, 20:12:23 ... Andi, Wendy 20:12:29 zakim, ??P6 may be Sebastiano 20:12:29 +Sebastiano?; got it 20:12:34 zakim, ??P6 may be Christophe 20:12:34 I already had ??P6 as Sebastiano?, ben_ 20:12:41 zakim, who is on the phone? 20:12:41 On the phone I see Sophia_Celic, Bengt_Farre (muted), Michael_Cooper, Makoto?, Ben_and_Gregg, Sebastiano?, Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, Becky_Gibson, 20:12:43 Topic: TTF update 20:12:44 ... Roberto_Ellero, Andi, Wendy 20:12:51 zakim, mute me 20:12:51 Yvette_Hoitink should now be muted 20:13:27 Becky? can you scribe the first hour today? 20:13:43 zakim, mute me 20:13:43 Sebastiano? should now be muted 20:14:44 Andi has joined #wai-wcag 20:15:39 scribe: wendy 20:15:50 discussed scripts, prioritizing which topics to cover first/before last call 20:15:53 also, how to test 20:15:58 +Alex_Li 20:15:59 some proposals coming 20:16:04 reviewed some test cases 20:16:37 +Matt_May 20:16:55 Topic: TTF Work Statement 20:17:00 zakim, who is on the phone? 20:17:00 On the phone I see Sophia_Celic, Bengt_Farre (muted), Michael_Cooper, Makoto?, Ben_and_Gregg, Sebastiano? (muted), Christophe?, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink (muted), 20:17:04 ... Becky_Gibson, Roberto_Ellero, Andi, Wendy, Alex_Li, Matt_May 20:17:17 http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2003/12/wttf.html 20:18:01 scribe: Becky 20:18:38 addition: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2005JulSep/0367.html 20:19:24 Resolution: adopt TTF Work statment 20:19:54 with amendment posted by Wendy today (Aug 10) 20:20:32 Topic: Disposition of frame title (http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-gl/2005JulSep/0250.html) 20:20:43 agenda? 20:20:58 agenda+ Priority 3 Mapping Discussion. 20:21:12 agenda+ Priority 2 Mapping Discussion Continued. 20:21:45 zakim, unmute me 20:21:45 Yvette_Hoitink should no longer be muted 20:23:41 q+ 20:24:16 joeclark has joined #wai-wcag 20:24:49 +David_MacDonald 20:24:50 proposal was to map WCAG 1.0 checkpoing 12.1 to WCAG 2.0 2.4 L1 SC1 and 2.4 L2 SC 4 20:24:59 q+ 20:25:23 ack ben 20:25:24 there were issues with this at prev. meeting and small group went off to discuss 20:25:25 +??P16 20:25:25 ack andi 20:25:46 zakim, ??P16 is Joe_Clark 20:25:46 +Joe_Clark; got it 20:25:56 zakim, joeclark is Joe_Clark 20:25:56 +Joe_Clark; got it 20:26:24 q+ 20:26:38 q- 20:26:50 -David_MacDonald 20:26:53 David has joined #wai-wcag 20:27:32 suggest new issue: frame title should either be listed as an example of navigation element or programmatically identified needs to mean and identification 20:28:06 of type 20:28:33 agenda? 20:28:40 zakim, take up agendum 1 20:28:40 agendum 1. "Priority 3 Mapping Discussion." taken up [from ben_] 20:28:49 zakim, mute me 20:28:49 Yvette_Hoitink should now be muted 20:29:05 resolution: map WCAG 1.0 checkpoing 12.1 to GL 2.4 L1 SC1 and 2.4 L2 SC4 20:33:26 ack lor 20:33:38 Topic: Mapping of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 4.2 20:34:37 Resolution: Map WCAG 1.0 CP 4.2 to WCAG 2.0 GL 3.1 L3 SC3 20:35:36 Topic: Mapping WCAG 1.0 CP 4.3 to GL 3.1 L1 SC1 20:35:45 Resolution: accepted above mapping 20:35:45 fyi: mapping results at http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/p3mapping/results 20:36:06 Michael has joined #wai-wcag 20:37:02 Topic: Mapping WCAG 1.0 CP 9.4 20:37:40 Resolution: Map WCAG 1.0 9.4 to WCAG 2.0 GL 2.4 L3 SC1 20:38:10 Topic: Mapping WCAG 1.0 CP 9.5 20:39:32 zakim, unmute me 20:39:32 Yvette_Hoitink should no longer be muted 20:39:40 q+ 20:40:12 q+ to say "reminder: resolution from last week - resolution: use "deprecated" for things we don't want people to do anymore and "not required" for things that WCAG 2.0 does not require for conformance, but may still appear in advisory" 20:40:38 suggest deprecating or marking as not required or provide as advisory 20:40:54 ack joe 20:41:36 jc: this is valid HTML so we should be careful about deprecating 20:42:04 q+ to say "have to address because it's in WCAG 1" 20:42:33 ack wendy 20:42:33 wendy, you wanted to say "reminder: resolution from last week - resolution: use "deprecated" for things we don't want people to do anymore and "not required" for things that WCAG 20:42:36 ... 2.0 does not require for conformance, but may still appear in advisory" 20:42:47 q- 20:44:39 gv: mappings must be to an entity or advisory item in guidedoc 20:45:42 fyi: use of "deprecated" resolution in last week's minutes - http://www.w3.org/2005/08/04-wai-wcag-minutes.html#item02 20:47:38 resolution: map WCAG 1.0 CP 9.5 to advisory item in GuideDoc and note that it is no longer required 20:47:59 topic: mapping of WCAG 1.0 CP 10.5 20:48:28 q+ to say "bridge ala recent bug" 20:48:54 q+ 20:50:05 ack wendy 20:50:05 wendy, you wanted to say "bridge ala recent bug" 20:50:17 fyi: andy budd's technique described in - http://trace.wisc.edu/bugzilla_wcag/show_bug.cgi?id=1542 20:51:42 currently maps to html "fallback" technique - http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-HTML-TECHS/#fallback-techniques 20:52:11 q+ 20:52:18 ack y 20:52:22 ack wendy 20:52:45 zakim, who's making noise? 20:52:56 Yvette, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Sophia_Celic (57%), Makoto? (32%), Loretta_Guarino_Reid (28%), Becky_Gibson (38%), Andi (4%) 20:54:55 zakim, mute me 20:54:55 Makoto? should now be muted 20:57:32 q+ 21:00:05 ack joe 21:02:02 scribe: Michael 21:02:22 Resolution: map WCAG 1.0 CP 10.5 should map to advisory item in Guide doc - with note that no longer needed for user agents but may be useful for cognitive disabilites 21:03:40 topic: Mapping of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 11.3 21:04:05 q+ 21:04:46 ack andi 21:04:57 q? 21:05:00 q+ 21:06:12 q+ 21:06:26 ack j 21:06:53 -Joe_Clark.a 21:07:12 Pleasure as ever, Gregg. I'm going to the supermarket. 21:07:13 joeclark has left #wai-wcag 21:07:55 +David_MacDonald 21:09:33 resolution: WCAG 1.0 CP 11.3 does not map to any WCAG 2.0 SC though certain aspects may map to certain SC or advisory items 21:10:13 topic: Mapping of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 13.5 21:11:52 q- 21:11:57 ack L 21:12:39 q+ 21:13:09 q+ 21:13:12 ack ben 21:13:37 ack y 21:15:02 +??P19 21:15:34 resolution: WCAG 2.0 CP 13.5 is not required in WCAG 2.0 by any SC. It is a possible strategy to address 2.4 L2 SC 1 21:15:55 topic: Mapping of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 13.6 21:15:58 zakim, ??P19 is Kerstin_Goldsmith 21:15:58 +Kerstin_Goldsmith; got it 21:16:28 q+ 21:17:02 ack y 21:17:52 resolution: WCAG 1.0 CP 13.6 maps to WCAG 2.0 SC 2.4 L2 SC 2. Note in WCAG 2.0 it only relates to groups that are repeated on multiple delivery units. 21:18:05 topic: Mapping of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 13.7 21:18:08 -Andi 21:20:02 q+ 21:21:01 Kesh has joined #wai-wcag 21:21:27 q+ to say "disagree" 21:22:42 ack d 21:23:04 ack y 21:23:04 Yvette, you wanted to say "disagree" 21:25:22 resolution: WCAG 1.0 CP 13.7 does not directly map to any WCAG 2.0 Success Criterion and is not required. Some aspects relate to 2.4 L2 SC 1 and 2.5 L3 SC 2 as well as advisory items in the guide doc. 21:25:43 topic: Mapping of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 13.8 21:28:27 q+ 21:28:44 ack c 21:28:55 zakim, who's muted? 21:28:55 I see Bengt_Farre, Makoto? muted 21:28:56 zakim, unmute me 21:28:56 Christophe? was not muted, Christophe 21:29:10 zakim, unmute Makoto? 21:29:10 Makoto? should no longer be muted 21:29:26 zakim, unmute Bengt_Farre 21:29:26 Bengt_Farre should no longer be muted 21:29:35 christophe it's 60# 21:29:45 zakim, mute Bengt_Farre 21:29:45 Bengt_Farre should now be muted 21:30:10 q+ 21:30:17 zakim, unmute me 21:30:17 Yvette_Hoitink was not muted, Yvette 21:30:20 ack y 21:32:17 resolution: WCAG 1.0 CP 13.8 is not required by any Success Criterion in WCAG 2.0. May be useful to map to advisory items in the guide doc. 21:32:33 topic: Mapping of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 13.9 21:34:10 resolution: WCAG 1.0 CP 13.9 is not in WCAG 2.0 but does relate to Success Criterion 2.4 L3 SC 2 and would appear in advisory items in the guide doc. 21:34:21 topic: Mapping of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 13.10 21:38:02 resolution: WCAG 1.0 CP 13.10 is not required by any Success Criterion in WCAG 2.0. ASCII art is considered non-text content and would map to an advisory item in the guide doc. 21:38:14 topic: WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 14.2 21:39:36 q+ 21:39:46 ack y 21:41:46 q+ 21:42:15 can I get the URI for the mapping doc -- cannot find in email just now? 21:42:26 http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/p3mapping/results 21:42:34 thanks much! 21:43:17 current draft of the maping document is http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/2005/06/30-mapping.html 21:44:10 q- 21:44:14 ack al 21:45:16 q+ 21:46:06 ack l 21:46:48 ack y 21:48:07 q+ to say, "Propose CP 14.2 is one of 3 strategies that can be used to address 3.1 L3 SC5" 21:49:32 ack ben 21:49:32 ben_, you wanted to say, "Propose CP 14.2 is one of 3 strategies that can be used to address 3.1 L3 SC5" 21:50:14 resolution: WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 14.2 is not required by any WCAG 2.0 Success Criterion. It is a strategy that can be used to address WCAG 2.0 SC 3.1 L3 SC 5. 21:50:25 topic: Mapping of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 14.3 21:50:56 q+ to say, "Can we have a resolution on the meaning of mapping - to be used for next WD?" 21:53:00 resolution: Aspects of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 14.3 are required by WCAG 2.0 Guideline 3.2 L2 SC1, 3.2 L2 SC 4, and 3.2 L3 SC 1. There is no Success Criterion in WCAG 2.0 that is as broad as WCAG 1.0 CP 14.3, so aspects of it do not relate. 21:53:25 topic: Mapping of WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 1.5 21:53:29 zakim, mute me 21:53:29 Yvette_Hoitink should now be muted 21:54:11 q+ 21:54:17 -Roberto_Ellero 21:54:57 zakim, unmute me 21:54:57 Yvette_Hoitink should no longer be muted 21:55:29 ack Christophe 21:55:29 Christophe, you wanted to say, "Can we have a resolution on the meaning of mapping - to be used for next WD?" 21:58:14 resolution: Our mapping document should indicate when a WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint is required by WCAG 2.0 and also if a WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint is sufficient to satisfy a WCAG 2.0 Success Criterion. We note if an item appears in advisory information if it is not required. 21:58:33 ack y 21:59:16 q+ to say "explain that until user agents has been met" 22:00:02 ack y 22:00:03 Yvette, you wanted to say "explain that until user agents has been met" 22:00:06 -Alex_Li 22:02:19 resolution: WCAG 1.0 Checkpoint 1.5 is not required by any Success Criterion on WCAG 2.0. It might appear as a repair technique in conjunction with an advisory item in the guide doc. Note: this is no longer required because of advances in user agents. 22:04:09 RRSAgent, make log world 22:04:13 -Kerstin_Goldsmith 22:04:15 -Michael_Cooper 22:04:15 -Matt_May 22:04:16 -Loretta_Guarino_Reid 22:04:17 -Becky_Gibson 22:04:18 -Bengt_Farre 22:04:19 -Wendy 22:04:21 -Sophia_Celic 22:04:22 -Yvette_Hoitink 22:04:24 -Ben_and_Gregg 22:04:26 -David_MacDonald 22:04:29 Meeting: WCAG WG telecon 22:04:31 Chair: Gregg 22:04:35 -Sebastiano? 22:04:44 s/Sophia/Sofia 22:04:55 zakim, who's on the phone? 22:04:55 On the phone I see Makoto?, Christophe? 22:05:01 wendy please mark me present, I came late thx 22:05:08 zakim, kick Makoto 22:05:08 I don't understand 'kick Makoto', wendy 22:05:14 zakim, drop makoto 22:05:14 Makoto? is being disconnected 22:05:16 -Makoto? 22:05:20 zakim, drop christophe 22:05:20 Christophe? is being disconnected 22:05:21 WAI_WCAG()4:00PM has ended 22:05:22 Attendees were +61.3.988.9.aaaa, Bengt_Farre, Michael_Cooper, Loretta_Guarino_Reid, Yvette_Hoitink, Christophe?, rellero, Becky_Gibson, Sophia_Celic, Roberto_Ellero, Andi, Wendy, 22:05:24 ... Ben_and_Gregg, Makoto?, Sebastiano?, Alex_Li, Matt_May, David_MacDonald, Joe_Clark, Kerstin_Goldsmith 22:05:34 ben_ has left #wai-wcag 22:05:41 zakim, bye 22:05:41 Zakim has left #wai-wcag 22:05:45 RRSAGent, generate minutes 22:05:45 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2005/08/11-wai-wcag-minutes.html wendy 22:05:57 Yeah, was me (Sebastiano) 22:08:53 RRSAgent, bye 22:08:53 I see no action items