00:54:09 RRSAgent has joined #ua 00:54:12 rrsagent, make log world 00:54:58 JRG has joined #UA 00:55:39 hello 00:57:47 WAI_UAWG()8:00PM has now started 00:57:53 +??P0 00:58:00 Hi Matt 00:59:00 -??P0 00:59:01 WAI_UAWG()8:00PM has ended 00:59:02 Attendees were 01:00:35 Matt I am on the phone if you want tot talk 01:01:50 who is here? 01:02:41 mcmay_ has joined #ua 01:03:07 zakim, this is wai_ua 01:03:07 ok, mcmay_; that matches WAI_UAWG()8:00PM 01:03:10 korn has joined #ua 01:03:12 zakim, who's here? 01:03:12 On the phone I see ??P0, ??P1, Matt, DPoehlman, Susan_Crayne, Peter_Korn 01:03:14 On IRC I see korn, mcmay_, JRG, RRSAgent, Zakim, MattSEA 01:03:23 -DPoehlman 01:04:33 + +1.402.466.aaaa 01:05:22 +DPoehlman 01:07:53 I'll type it into IRC 01:08:18 I may be in Japan for the Tuesday of the Tech Plenary, then to Boston Wednesday. 01:09:19 dpoehlman has joined #ua 01:09:20 Weds is the Plenary day 01:10:23 jg: Weds is when the group gets together to discuss general W3C technology 01:11:24 kyle has joined #ua 01:11:51 pk: Not sure of the value or how many people to send 01:12:40 jg: Reason to meet with PFWG is to talk about DHTML and navigation to new formats. Might be useful for Sun people to get involved. 01:14:26 -DPoehlman 01:14:40 I read and commented. I'll be back on the phone shortly. 01:15:19 +DPoehlman 01:15:55 pk: item navigation is crucial. perhaps the best way to do that is crucial. 01:16:02 zakim, who's making noise? 01:16:15 mcmay, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: ??P1 (31%), Susan_Crayne (66%), Peter_Korn (85%) 01:16:48 pk: Believe that much of what can be done should be done in JavaScript. Trying to make explicit that navigation is important. 01:16:52 zakim, mute Susan 01:16:52 Susan_Crayne should now be muted 01:16:58 zakim, unmute susan 01:16:58 Susan_Crayne should no longer be muted 01:17:03 zakim, mute ??p1 01:17:03 ??P1 should now be muted 01:17:31 pk: Sun is stating that we are doing certain work in this phase, and the rest of the work should be done by someone in JavaScript layer. 01:17:59 pk: We have a bug list in Section 12 which notes what aspects of keyboard nav function in Mozilla head, what in Sun branch, what are not functioning. 01:18:25 pk: We've posted a build of the Sun branch as a source tarball. 01:19:12 pk: also talking with accessibility contacts at Red Hat. 01:19:20 zakim, unmute p1 01:19:20 sorry, mcmay, I do not see a party named 'p1' 01:19:24 zakim, unmute ??p1 01:19:24 ??P1 should no longer be muted 01:19:26 kyle might be muted. 01:20:22 kyle: iframe is different from form control. 01:20:35 jg: What about links in the document rendered in iframe? 01:21:29 kyle is producing an echo. 01:21:35 http://cita.disability.uiuc.edu/mozilla/ts-test-page-iframe.html 01:22:34 pk: We need to figure out what the behavior is for links within an iframe. 01:24:04 jg: IE treats iframes as part of the doc. Don't know about Opera. 01:28:40 pk: Could cause a race condition with a scroll when it moves up into an iframe. 01:29:12 pk: What guidance is appropriate to UAs on this? 01:29:18 jg: I think PF wants to discuss this. 01:29:37 jg: In general, the design criteria would be not to use absolute positioning. But if using float and clear, then doc order would work. 01:32:17 jg: What does WCAG say about floating content? 01:32:28 mm: CSS suggests using float and clear. 01:32:37 jg: What about fixed items along the edge? 01:32:42 mm: Not sure there's a decision on that. 01:35:02 jg: So document order may be the best strategy. 01:38:54 q+ to ask about frames vs entire document nav? 01:39:15 jg: What are you doing with tab? 01:39:32 pk: We're talking about how to navigate into and out of an applet, for example. 01:40:00 jl: There are some HTML widgets other than forms 01:40:32 jl: Example of widget is textarea. 01:42:11 dp: When you tab through a page and nav to a form control, test says that if you're to the right of an element, you're in the label. So the next tab takes me into the edit box, or I have to right-arrow into it? 01:44:58 dp: Multiline edits? 01:45:07 pk: That's a textarea. We don't have that in our example. 01:46:05 pk: If you're in a form control that's eating the tabs, you have a special character to get out of that. 01:46:21 jg: In Moz, hitting enter doesn't submit the form. Might in IE, but not in Moz. 01:48:17 dp: Why does it say space to highlight and enter to activate it? Not sure I want to have to do that. 01:49:10 pk: In GTK+, space equals click. 01:49:58 ky: Space should actuate it. 01:51:22 dp: In the document, Ctrl+Home goes to top of frame, Ctrl+End goes to bottom. I need to go from top-left of document to bottom-right corner of doc. I suggested Shift-Ctrl-Home and End, but Ctrl-PgUp and PgDn could do that. 01:51:32 dp: If there's reasoning for this, I'm interested. 01:51:46 pk: General reasoning is that each frame is its own little world and its own complete document. 01:55:20 dp: I don't want to lose the ability to go all the way to the top/bottom of the document. 01:56:00 jg: A lot of systems like WebCT and Blackboard have 7-11 frames, sometimes nested. 02:00:27 pk: I think start and end of frame is very important. 02:00:45 tr: I'd like to have both frame and master document. 02:01:12 pk: Can David and Travis propose some keystrokes? 02:01:29 dp: Every time I think of something, I realize it's used. 02:02:02 dp: Ctrl-Home to top of frame, and up arrow twice to top of doc? 02:03:44 jg: Meet Jan 5? 02:04:24 q- 02:05:20 dpoehlman has left #ua 02:06:48 -??P0 02:06:50 -Peter_Korn 02:06:51 -DPoehlman 02:06:53 -Susan_Crayne 02:06:57 -Matt 02:06:58 - +1.402.466.aaaa 02:06:59 WAI_UAWG()8:00PM has ended 02:07:00 Attendees were Matt, DPoehlman, Susan_Crayne, Peter_Korn, +1.402.466.aaaa 02:07:09 kyle has left #ua