IRC log of dawg on 2004-12-07

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:30:23 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #dawg
14:30:24 [Zakim]
+??P5
14:30:31 [AndyS]
zakim, ??P5 is AndyS
14:30:31 [Zakim]
+AndyS; got it
14:30:42 [ericP]
scribe: EricP
14:30:51 [DanC]
Zakim, take up agendum 1
14:30:51 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Convene, take roll, review records and agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0412.html" taken up [from DanC]
14:31:04 [AndyS]
There is the matter of untrusted graphs (re Source) of course.
14:31:19 [AndyS]
Alberto/regrets
14:31:32 [SimonR]
HowardK/regrets
14:31:40 [DanC]
regrets Pat Hayes
14:31:48 [SimonR]
Hiroyuki Sato, regrets
14:32:06 [ericP]
zakim, who is here?
14:32:06 [Zakim]
On the phone I see EricP, DanC, SimonR, TomAdams, SteveH, Kendall_Clark, Kevin, AndyS
14:32:31 [DanC]
regrets Dave Beckett
14:33:03 [AndyS]
Farrukh/regrets
14:33:12 [DanC]
30 Nov http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0394.html
14:33:37 [ericP]
resolved to accept http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0394.html as a true record
14:33:59 [ericP]
zakim, please take up agendum 1
14:33:59 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Convene, take roll, review records and agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0412.html" taken up [from DanC]
14:34:09 [DanC]
Zakim, pick a scribe
14:34:09 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose AndyS
14:34:26 [ericP]
next meeting Dec 14
14:34:34 [ericP]
chair: danc
14:34:40 [ericP]
scribe: tomA
14:34:49 [DanC]
ACTION KendallC: expose our walking tour data to SPARQL querying clients
14:34:49 [DanC]
ETA before F2F4
14:35:02 [DanC]
agenda + ftf5 in March 2005
14:35:43 [ericP]
zakim, agenda?
14:35:43 [Zakim]
I see 7 items remaining on the agenda:
14:35:44 [Zakim]
1. Convene, take roll, review records and agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0412.html [from DanC]
14:35:47 [Zakim]
2. ftf4 2005-01-19/2005-01-20 in Helsinki, Finland [from DanC]
14:35:48 [Zakim]
3. Test Cases [from DanC]
14:35:49 [Zakim]
4. Protocol [from DanC]
14:35:50 [Zakim]
5. SPARQL SOURCE Issue [from DanC]
14:35:51 [Zakim]
6. SPARQL update, issues [from DanC]
14:35:52 [Zakim]
7. ftf5 in March 2005 [from DanC]
14:35:55 [DanC]
Zakim next agendum
14:35:58 [DanC]
Zakim, next agendum
14:35:58 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "ftf4 2005-01-19/2005-01-20 in Helsinki, Finland" taken up [from DanC]
14:37:13 [ericP]
[DanC forwards mail to WG re what to wear in Finland]
14:37:27 [AndyS]
Janne/regrets
14:39:10 [JosD]
JosD has joined #dawg
14:39:21 [ericP]
DanC: expect 12 at f2f4
14:39:27 [DanC]
Zakim, take up agendum 7
14:39:27 [Zakim]
agendum 7. "ftf5 in March 2005" taken up [from DanC]
14:39:39 [DanC]
http://esw.w3.org/topic/SwigAtTp2005
14:40:19 [Zakim]
+JosD
14:41:00 [DanC]
ACTION EricP: find logistics re F2F5 at tech plenary in Boston March 28 Feb - 4 Mar (2 days). Some WG preference to Mon/Tue of that week. CONTINUES
14:42:41 [DanC]
kendall: is it possible to meet 4 days? I feel I get a lot done at ftf meetings
14:42:49 [ericP]
KendallK proposes 4 day meeting
14:42:50 [DanC]
DanC: I'd be too exhaused to chair all that.
14:43:02 [DanC]
(kendall said "I'm not sure I'm proposing that" actually, ericp)
14:43:12 [ericP]
(right)
14:43:30 [SimonR]
(favorable to the idea of the 4 day meeting)
14:43:35 [ericP]
EricP: will dillute the meeting some given ohter people's meeting oblications
14:43:58 [ericP]
SimonR: +1 (will be able to attend)
14:44:35 [ericP]
DanC: can chair two days. want to go to interest group meeting and play with toys
14:45:02 [ericP]
AndyS: can share pain with SWPBD for IG attendance
14:45:20 [ericP]
... we should present or at least be available to the IG to get feedback
14:45:32 [ericP]
DanC: want to show clients interoperating
14:45:40 [DanC]
http://esw.w3.org/topic/DawgShows <- http://esw.w3.org/topic/SwigAtTp2005
14:45:41 [ericP]
... cf DawgShow
14:45:46 [SimonR]
http://esw.w3.org/topic/DawgShows
14:45:46 [DanC]
Zakim, next agendum
14:45:46 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "ftf4 2005-01-19/2005-01-20 in Helsinki, Finland" taken up [from DanC]
14:45:52 [DanC]
Zakim, close agendum 2
14:45:52 [Zakim]
agendum 2 closed
14:45:53 [Zakim]
I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:45:54 [Zakim]
3. Test Cases [from DanC]
14:45:55 [DanC]
Zakim, next agendum
14:45:55 [Zakim]
agendum 2 was just opened, DanC
14:46:17 [DanC]
DONE: ACTION Jos: Write email about alternative result format using
14:46:17 [DanC]
collections - avoid use/mention issues
14:46:21 [ericP]
Zakim, next agendum
14:46:21 [Zakim]
agendum 2 was just opened, ericP
14:46:32 [DanC]
jos's msg http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0415.html
14:46:41 [ericP]
zakim, take up agendum 3
14:46:41 [Zakim]
agendum 3. "Test Cases" taken up [from DanC]
14:47:01 [ericP]
Jos: confused about use/mention issue. the answer is just in the graph itself
14:47:30 [ericP]
DanC: use/mention: Mary is a girl vs. Mary is a four letter word starting with "M"
14:47:53 [kendall]
zakim, mute me
14:47:53 [Zakim]
Kendall_Clark should now be muted
14:47:56 [ericP]
... no discriminating use caess found yet.
14:48:01 [DanC]
s/use/test/
14:48:06 [ericP]
tx
14:48:13 [kendall]
DanBri's URI munging test cases seem relevant here
14:48:17 [kendall]
zakim, unmute me
14:48:17 [Zakim]
Kendall_Clark should no longer be muted
14:48:23 [DanC]
ah... good point, kendall
14:48:51 [JosD]
EricP, the <<uri>> in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0420.html
14:49:00 [ericP]
DanC: another use/mention issue is regexps on URIs
14:49:13 [ericP]
... not adding to issues yet...
14:49:25 [AndyS]
The property URI and the resources URI cases are slightly different
14:49:43 [DanC]
ISSUE: use/mention issues in regex operators, test result format
14:50:22 [ericP]
DanC: gets to name the issue
14:50:29 [ericP]
s/://
14:50:57 [DanC]
. ACTION: SteveH is willing to adapt his testing infrastructure to generate input/output RDF/XML and typed nodes into manifest file
14:50:58 [ericP]
DnaC: no sweeping changes on the test materials based on Jos's action
14:51:11 [DanC]
ACTION: SteveH is willing to adapt his testing infrastructure to generate input/output RDF/XML and typed nodes into manifest file. CONTINUES.
14:52:30 [ericP]
DanC: README file suggested a link to the minutes which would be useful to me
14:52:43 [DanC]
"dawgt:approval dawgt:Approved" -- tests/data/simple/manifest.n3
14:52:55 [ericP]
SimonR: some parts of the test area are forbidden
14:53:00 [DanC]
ACTION EricP: make sure all dawg tests are world-readable now and going forward
14:53:16 [AndyS]
Minor request - no tabs in files please (I have them set as 4 for N3 in emacs)
14:53:21 [ericP]
(note to self, default ACL)
14:54:51 [ericP]
DanC: no specification for the "non-XML" syntax
14:55:19 [ericP]
ACTION EricP: come up with a specification for the "non-XML" syntax (may be turtle)
14:55:29 [DaveB]
?
14:55:32 [ericP]
SteveH: I'm using a turtle parser
14:55:50 [ericP]
DanC: should be integrated with the README
14:56:07 [ericP]
SimonR: next four test cases make sense to me
14:56:14 [ericP]
... willing to approve them.
14:56:28 [DanC]
these are http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/#sparql-query-example-2-1a
14:56:29 [ericP]
... need to hack kowari to run them
14:56:36 [ericP]
JosD: i've run them
14:56:39 [DanC]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/#sparql-query-example-2-2a
14:56:49 [DanC]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/#sparql-query-example-2-3a
14:56:56 [DanC]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/#sparql-query-example-2-4a
14:57:42 [ericP]
i see nothing under http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/...,access... that isn't world-readbale
14:58:26 [ericP]
RESOLVED to approve the four tests (above)
14:58:38 [ericP]
Abstentions: KendallC
14:58:45 [ericP]
Objections: -none-
14:58:51 [DaveB]
(I've run them, approve them)
14:59:01 [ericP]
[discussion of fifth]
14:59:07 [kendall]
zakim, mute me
14:59:07 [Zakim]
Kendall_Clark should now be muted
14:59:16 [AndyS]
Is Turtle (N3-data, whatever) going to "standardized" in W3C (c.f. N-Triples). Should we do it?
14:59:16 [ericP]
DanC: has a "<" in it. not sure support it.
14:59:32 [DanC]
considering http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/#sparql-query-example-3
14:59:46 [kendall]
zakim, unmute me
14:59:46 [Zakim]
Kendall_Clark should no longer be muted
15:00:36 [ericP]
PROPOSED to approve http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/#sparql-query-example-3
15:00:57 [ericP]
SimonR: can you put scalar constraints in the graph?
15:01:40 [DanC]
"?price + 3 < ?x + ?y" did I hear that right, AndyS? interesting test case.
15:01:47 [SimonR]
"Can you put scalar constraints into the same syntax as graph constraints?"
15:03:42 [AndyS]
op:numeric-less-than
15:03:54 [AndyS]
op: = http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/operations
15:03:56 [kendall]
zakim, mute me
15:03:58 [Zakim]
Kendall_Clark should now be muted
15:04:01 [ericP]
EricP: specifying that they are supported in the graph constraint...
15:04:35 [DanC]
$Revision: 1.146 $ of $Date: 2004/12/06 10:04:50 $ has broken link http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/rq23/#extendedtests
15:04:37 [ericP]
[discussing standard XML-Schema comparitors in the graph constraint]
15:05:46 [ericP]
do we support this ?:
15:05:47 [ericP]
:book1 dc:title "SPARQL Tutorial" .
15:05:47 [ericP]
:book1 ns:price :price .
15:05:48 [ericP]
:price foo:lessThan 42.
15:06:09 [ericP]
can we query that differently than testing
15:06:18 [ericP]
:book1 dc:title "SPARQL Tutorial" .
15:06:21 [ericP]
:book1 ns:price 41 .
15:06:23 [ericP]
?
15:06:44 [ericP]
s/foo/op/ over the last 8 lines
15:07:00 [DanC]
Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:07:00 [Zakim]
On the phone I see EricP, DanC, SimonR, TomAdams, SteveH, Kendall_Clark (muted), Kevin, AndyS, JosD
15:07:04 [kendall]
pat?
15:07:53 [AndyS]
What about op:lessThan "42"^^xsd:byte (0verloading)
15:09:04 [ericP]
ACTION: SimonR to sketch tests around comparitors in the grpah constraint
15:09:08 [ericP]
ACTION: EricP to sketch tests around comparitors in the grpah constraint
15:09:17 [SimonR]
ACTION SimonR: propose test case for scalar constraint with syntax uniform to graph constraints
15:09:27 [DanC]
action -6
15:09:43 [AndyS]
Steve - does that work for 3Store? Do you store values or lexical forms?
15:10:04 [SteveH]
AndyS, lexical forms, but we store multiple ones, and do live cating to values
15:10:16 [SteveH]
AndyS, future versions will (probably) store values too
15:10:27 [SteveH]
cating == casting
15:10:55 [kendall]
+1 to simon's point
15:10:59 [AndyS]
Our users expect round-tripping : xsd:byte in, xsd:byte out - need lexcial forms
15:11:51 [kendall]
">" should be bound to a property and be treated as syntactic sugar for it.
15:12:46 [ericP]
ericP: that is distinct from whether those operators are available (and mean the same thing) in the graph constraints
15:12:48 [kendall]
zakim, unmute me
15:12:48 [Zakim]
Kendall_Clark should no longer be muted
15:13:11 [DanC]
pointer to draft of that XSCH note, josd?
15:14:19 [ericP]
AndyS: XSCH SWBPD task force is addressing XSD data types in RDF.
15:14:41 [ericP]
... value space of double and value space of integer are not necessarily the same
15:14:58 [JosD]
DanC, pointer is http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/XSCH/xsch-sw/
15:14:59 [ericP]
... can't necessarily compare them
15:15:17 [SimonR]
Do we want to put some urgency behind this and aim at a yea/nay vote on ex3 for the next meeting?
15:15:19 [DanC]
Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:15:19 [Zakim]
On the phone I see EricP, DanC, SimonR, TomAdams, SteveH, Kendall_Clark, Kevin, AndyS, JosD
15:15:34 [DanC]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/#sparql-query-example-3
15:15:45 [ericP]
JosD: +1 to put scalar constraints in the graph constraints
15:16:15 [ericP]
DanC: who's happy wiht test3?
15:16:21 [ericP]
ericP: like the syntax
15:16:27 [ericP]
Danc: would approve
15:16:34 [DanC]
danc would abstain
15:16:36 [ericP]
tx
15:16:48 [ericP]
SimonR does't like syntax
15:16:57 [ericP]
Jose: abstain
15:16:57 [DaveB]
I would approve it
15:17:07 [ericP]
SteveH: approve
15:17:17 [ericP]
i don't know how many i missed
15:17:26 [ericP]
i didn't XOFF
15:17:43 [ericP]
DanC: not putting the question now
15:17:53 [TomAdams]
TomAdams, doesn't like syntax, abstain
15:17:56 [AndyS]
Andy's next example: 2*?x < ?y+3
15:18:01 [ericP]
(after 4-ish in favor and multiple abstantions)
15:18:05 [DanC]
Zakim, move to next agendum
15:18:05 [Zakim]
agendum 4. "Protocol" taken up [from DanC]
15:18:38 [DanC]
26 Nov binding http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0364.html
15:18:46 [DanC]
Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:18:46 [Zakim]
On the phone I see EricP, DanC, SimonR, TomAdams, SteveH, Kendall_Clark, Kevin, AndyS, JosD
15:18:47 [ericP]
DanC: updated veriable binding results format
15:19:35 [ericP]
EricP: i htink we should use an RDF-compitable but regular syntax
15:19:51 [ericP]
DanC: neutral
15:20:13 [kendall]
Jos sketched an RDF format for returning variable bindings pretty recently, as I recall.
15:20:15 [ericP]
SimonR: +1 RDF, approve list of vars at the head.
15:20:24 [ericP]
... similar to our SOAP impl.
15:20:35 [ericP]
... in retrospect, i wouldn't hvae done it that way
15:20:52 [ericP]
... a var X will always have the smae time
15:21:17 [ericP]
... would like the vars recorded in an attribute or some such
15:21:32 [DaveB]
an rdf[/xml] compatible format will be slightly more bulkier, need extra properties between <results> and <result> for example
15:21:40 [ericP]
TomA: +1 Simon.
15:21:52 [ericP]
... like them not in attributes
15:22:21 [ericP]
DanC: we could wrap this up in two weeks or so. good idea? bad idea?
15:22:30 [DanC]
"wrap this up" = publish as a WD
15:22:41 [ericP]
TomA: +1 wrap up
15:22:54 [ericP]
SteveH: like it -- need to play wiht it more
15:23:03 [DaveB]
I'm hunting for advice what to change here, please can people send email.
15:23:22 [ericP]
KendallC: don't know which format people are talking about
15:23:35 [SimonR]
(I don't like representing the variable list as elements <variables><x/><y/></variables> -- as an attribute variable="x y" or a processing instruction <?sparql-variables x y ?> are alternatives.)
15:23:38 [ericP]
... like result 1 (vars in element names)
15:24:07 [SteveH]
To be more specific, I like format 1 more than 2
15:24:13 [DaveB]
SimonR: what don't like? What's a technical difference/problem?
15:24:19 [ericP]
... liked Rob Shearer's point about getting XML out of RDF
15:24:22 [kendall]
steveh: thanks
15:24:29 [SteveH]
+1 to what kendall said, needs to be an XML format
15:24:34 [ericP]
KevinW: like result 1
15:24:51 [kendall]
+1 to andy's point re: con-neg
15:24:59 [ericP]
AndyS: I don't think we need it to be RDF-compatibl.e can use an RDF form.
15:25:09 [ericP]
... there are folks who like to schema everything
15:25:18 [ericP]
... wasn't just HP people.
15:25:30 [ericP]
JosD: +1 ericP for RDF format.
15:25:35 [SimonR]
DaveB: The techincal problem is that the elements used to represent the variables in the variable list behave entirely differently from everywhere else -- all other instances are associated with some RDF node.
15:25:48 [ericP]
... proposals are still compact
15:26:02 [kendall]
Yep, I corrected that for the scribe, DanC.
15:26:07 [ericP]
tx
15:26:17 [DaveB]
SimonR: fair enough
15:26:28 [ericP]
DanC: would like this in the protocol draft
15:26:40 [TomAdams]
+1 for adding to the protocol draft
15:26:48 [ericP]
SimonR: +1, can't imagine a protocol draft without it
15:26:57 [ericP]
KendallC: think it's more work
15:27:00 [AndyS]
-1 for the protocol draft - can use without protocol
15:27:25 [ericP]
scribe is confused about *what's* more work
15:27:37 [ericP]
probably 2 WDs
15:27:46 [kendall]
ericP: I meant more work *for me* as the potential protocol draft editor
15:27:54 [ericP]
roger
15:28:04 [ericP]
DanC: want published soon
15:28:14 [SimonR]
DaveB: That I'd be quite favorable to -- the variables declaration is forced to occur first by the way XML attributes work too, which is rather elegant.
15:28:16 [DanC]
daveb, do you want to edit your design into WD format, or would you prefer somebody else do that?
15:28:18 [ericP]
daveb: do you want to edit a draft of the XML result format?
15:28:28 [DaveB]
ericP, Danc: yes, I'll edit it
15:28:30 [ericP]
s/:/,/
15:28:48 [ericP]
daveb, can we action you?
15:28:51 [DaveB]
yes
15:28:53 [ericP]
tx
15:28:54 [DanC]
I'd like to get an action on Dave to write and on ?SOMEBODY to review
15:29:06 [DanC]
when can you deliver a draft, dave? when can ?SOMEBODY review it?
15:29:20 [ericP]
ACTION: DaveB to write an XML result format
15:29:31 [DanC]
is this a "few days" sorta thing, daveB? or a 2 weeks thing?
15:29:32 [ericP]
ACTIO: AndyS to review
15:29:36 [DaveB]
few days
15:29:55 [ericP]
ACTIO: SteveH to review Dave's XML result set format
15:30:11 [ericP]
ACTION: AndyS to review Dave's XML result set format
15:30:17 [ericP]
ACTION: SteveH to review Dave's XML result set format
15:30:36 [DanC]
so I'm expecting to have a draft and some reviews in my hand when I prepare next week's agenda. let me know if any risks/problems pop up
15:30:45 [DaveB]
I shall try to make some sort of xml schema (RNG, weak xsd) for the result1 format
15:30:49 [DaveB]
ok
15:31:17 [kendall]
I have no beliefs about the matter.
15:31:58 [ericP]
DanC: result set format thread issues...
15:32:17 [DanC]
# Issue with the result set format Seaborne, Andy (Monday, 22 November) http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0336.html
15:32:24 [ericP]
s/thread issues/issues thread/
15:32:31 [SimonR]
SimonR has joined #dawg
15:32:35 [DanC]
that was about listing the vars at the top
15:32:36 [ericP]
... listing vars at top
15:32:39 [ericP]
... will get worked out
15:33:05 [DanC]
http://monkeyfist.com/kendall/sparql-protocol-simplex/ 1.8
15:33:10 [SteveH]
kendall, why "simplex"?
15:33:11 [ericP]
zakim, take up next agendum
15:33:11 [Zakim]
agendum 5. "SPARQL SOURCE Issue" taken up [from DanC]
15:33:21 [ericP]
zakim, take up previous agendum
15:33:21 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'take up previous agendum', ericP
15:33:24 [ericP]
oops
15:33:54 [ericP]
NOTE TO SCRIBE: still on protocol agendum
15:34:08 [ericP]
zakim, take up agendum 4
15:34:08 [Zakim]
agendum 4. "Protocol" taken up [from DanC]
15:34:34 [ericP]
KendallC: comments were against the larger document/design.
15:34:48 [ericP]
... haven't checked them against simplex
15:35:33 [ericP]
AndyS: I put comments against the simplex spec
15:36:12 [ericP]
DanC: if i were KendallC, i wouldn't be in audit mode now.
15:36:37 [ericP]
Kendall: i read everyhting but didn't necessarily resond
15:36:52 [ericP]
AndyS: why is getTriples a separate language
15:37:29 [ericP]
... HTTP section doesn't allow you to specify an other QL
15:37:57 [ericP]
KendallC: agree other langs should be available.
15:37:58 [ericP]
... probably a document bug
15:38:35 [ericP]
[getTriples is getGraph]
15:39:03 [ericP]
... not in audit more while doc isn't a WG draft
15:39:42 [AndyS]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0326.html talks about lang=
15:40:08 [ericP]
[meeting will go full 90 mins]
15:40:26 [ericP]
DanC: would like to see simplex become a WD in three weeks
15:40:38 [DaveB]
+1 simplex to WD
15:40:53 [SteveH]
+1
15:40:59 [ericP]
+1
15:41:05 [TomAdams]
+1
15:41:27 [AndyS]
i've implemented some of it
15:41:41 [AndyS]
inc XML results
15:43:21 [ericP]
PROPOSE that this simplex be published pending approval from KendallC and TomA
15:43:40 [AndyS]
Impl: http://www.sparql.org/query.html :-)
15:43:45 [ericP]
KendallC: want AndyS as he has the most substantive issues
15:43:49 [ericP]
PROPOSE that this simplex be published pending approval from KendallC and TomA and AndyS
15:44:19 [DanC]
So RESOLVED.
15:44:19 [ericP]
Objections: 0
15:44:27 [ericP]
Abstentions: 0
15:44:36 [ericP]
s/ten/tan/
15:45:05 [SimonR]
I'd be particularly pleased to see DaveB's XML result format integrated into the concrete protocol.
15:45:21 [ericP]
KendallC: time frame? three days? three weeks?
15:45:36 [DaveB]
I'll be using the xml result format sans protocol, as will others I guess
15:45:52 [AndyS]
I will agree to anything to publish - agreement is not necessary for a WD as far as I'm concerned
15:46:14 [DanC]
"SPARQL Protocol for RDF"
15:46:25 [kendall]
DaveB: I agree. I don't really *want* it in the protocol draft; but I'd really like to have a document I can point to from the protocol doc.
15:46:31 [ericP]
ACTION: publish "SPARQL Protocol for RDF" pending approval from TomA and AndyS
15:46:53 [DanC]
daveb, I hope to put a similar question re results format next week
15:47:03 [DaveB]
ack DanC
15:47:12 [SimonR]
DaveB: how to convert the query results definitions from rq23 into a sequence of XML characters seems to part of protocol to me, even if it's useful elsewhere.
15:47:23 [ericP]
DanC: we need to figure out how to test the protocol
15:47:27 [SimonR]
...seems to be...
15:48:02 [DanC]
Zakim, next agendum
15:48:02 [Zakim]
agendum 5. "SPARQL SOURCE Issue" taken up [from DanC]
15:48:23 [TomAdams]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0426.html
15:49:00 [ericP]
ACTION DaveB: update the dawg test repository to record or amend tests to correspond to the http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0241.html
15:49:03 [ericP]
CONTINUED
15:49:11 [DanC]
# TKS/Kowari named graph usage Tom Adams (Tuesday, 7 December) http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0426.html
15:49:15 [ericP]
ACTION TomA: write email to list about how their customers are using named graphs
15:49:16 [DanC]
discharges Tom's action
15:49:16 [ericP]
DONE
15:49:31 [ericP]
ACTION JanneS: propose text for hard failure in the protocol draft
15:49:45 [ericP]
CONTINUED
15:49:47 [ericP]
ACTION DanC: suggest formal definitions for SOURCE
15:50:19 [ericP]
CONTINUED
15:50:25 [ericP]
distracted by OPTIONAL
15:51:07 [ericP]
[ Proposal: querying untrusted graphs ]
15:51:14 [Zakim]
-SteveH
15:51:25 [ericP]
DanC: hope this will resove the SOURCE issue
15:51:44 [DanC]
I see it as input to the SOURCE issue; hence I'd like a response from DaveB, SOURCE issue owner
15:51:45 [ericP]
tx
15:51:57 [DanC]
Zakim, next agendum
15:51:57 [Zakim]
agendum 6. "SPARQL update, issues" taken up [from DanC]
15:52:16 [DanC]
http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/rq23/ $Revision: 1.146 $ of $Date: 2004/12/06 10:04:50 $
15:52:43 [ericP]
ACTION: PatH to review editors working draft of rq23
15:52:58 [ericP]
CONTINUED
15:53:13 [ericP]
much progress
15:53:15 [DanC]
progress on pat's action: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0419.html http://www.ihmc.us/users/phayes/SPARQL-PAT.html
15:53:56 [DanC]
ah... http://www.ihmc.us/users/phayes/SPARQLdefs.html
15:54:05 [ericP]
KendallC: PatH has a set of definitions in SPARQLdefs.html
15:54:39 [ericP]
s/CONTINUED/DONE/
15:55:01 [ericP]
ACTION AlbertoR: owns issue 'DESCRIBE'
15:56:04 [Zakim]
-TomAdams
15:56:34 [DanC]
action DONE.
15:57:09 [ericP]
ACTION DanC: owner of issue 'yes or no questions' (pending protocol doc)
15:57:43 [ericP]
[ DanC auctions his issue ]
15:57:59 [ericP]
EricP: may take it next week
15:58:02 [ericP]
CONTINUED
15:58:09 [ericP]
ACTION SteveH: own (i.e. propose resolution to) disjunction issue
15:58:33 [ericP]
AndyS: disjunction has text with no outstanding issues
15:58:55 [ericP]
... issue is whether examples clearly illustrate
15:59:12 [ericP]
DanC: test cases?
15:59:38 [ericP]
EricP: I can migrate some Algae UnionDisjunciton test cases
16:00:09 [ericP]
AndyS: integrating PatH's feedback could push us past XMass
16:00:19 [ericP]
... would like to publish as is.
16:01:02 [ericP]
JosD: would like to incorporate PatH's changes
16:01:54 [ericP]
SimonR, KendallC: +1 to waiting for PatH's changes
16:03:01 [ericP]
PROPOSE to adjourn
16:03:19 [ericP]
SimonR: 2nd
16:03:28 [Zakim]
-Kendall_Clark
16:03:29 [DanC]
ADJOURN.
16:03:29 [Zakim]
-JosD
16:03:30 [Zakim]
-SimonR
16:03:41 [KevinW]
KevinW has left #dawg
16:03:44 [Zakim]
-DanC
16:04:00 [Zakim]
-Kevin
16:04:09 [DanC]
ACTION EricP: migrate some Algae UnionDisjunciton test cases
16:05:56 [ericP]
XSD issues:
16:05:58 [ericP]
comparing dissimilar varlue spaces
16:06:17 [ericP]
which to make required
16:06:51 [ericP]
storage issues for lexical comparisons
16:08:19 [ericP]
separate libs for XSD (comparisons)
16:08:34 [ericP]
- ask HowardK, LiamQ
16:08:49 [ericP]
how do you compare NAN and -0 and that sort of thing
16:09:05 [ericP]
impls are not aiming to do all that work from scratch
16:24:11 [Zakim]
-AndyS
16:24:14 [Zakim]
-EricP
16:24:15 [Zakim]
SW_DAWG()9:30AM has ended
16:24:16 [Zakim]
Attendees were EricP, DanC, SimonR, [Tucana], TomAdams, SteveH, Kendall_Clark, Kevin, AndyS, JosD
16:24:48 [AndyS]
AndyS has left #dawg
16:30:18 [DanC]
RRSAgent, make logs world-access
16:30:22 [DanC]
RRSAgent, bye
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
I see 20 open action items:
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: KendallC to expose our walking tour data to SPARQL querying clients [1]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T14-34-49
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: EricP to find logistics re F2F5 at tech plenary in Boston March 28 Feb - 4 Mar (2 days). Some WG preference to Mon/Tue of that week. CONTINUES [2]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T14-41-00
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: SteveH is willing to adapt his testing infrastructure to generate input/output RDF/XML and typed nodes into manifest file. CONTINUES. [3]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T14-51-11
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: EricP to make sure all dawg tests are world-readable now and going forward [4]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T14-53-00
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: EricP to come up with a specification for the "non-XML" syntax (may be turtle) [5]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T14-55-19
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: EricP to sketch tests around comparitors in the grpah constraint [7]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-09-08
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: SimonR to propose test case for scalar constraint with syntax uniform to graph constraints [8]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-09-17
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: DaveB to write an XML result format [9]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-29-20
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: AndyS to review Dave's XML result set format [10]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-30-11
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: SteveH to review Dave's XML result set format [11]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-30-17
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: publish "SPARQL Protocol for RDF" pending approval from TomA and AndyS [12]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-46-31
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: DaveB to update the dawg test repository to record or amend tests to correspond to the http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004OctDec/0241.html [13]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-49-00
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: TomA to write email to list about how their customers are using named graphs [14]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-49-15
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: JanneS to propose text for hard failure in the protocol draft [15]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-49-31
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: DanC to suggest formal definitions for SOURCE [16]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-49-47
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: PatH to review editors working draft of rq23 [17]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-52-43
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: AlbertoR to owns issue 'DESCRIBE' [18]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-55-01
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: DanC to owner of issue 'yes or no questions' (pending protocol doc) [19]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-57-09
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: SteveH to own (i.e. propose resolution to) disjunction issue [20]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T15-58-09
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: EricP to migrate some Algae UnionDisjunciton test cases [21]
16:30:22 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/12/07-dawg-irc#T16-04-09