14:30:40 RRSAgent has joined #dawg 14:31:06 Zakim not seeing the phone bridge? Didn't see a ??P when I phoned in 14:31:32 +??P17 14:31:33 Zakim, who's on the phone? 14:31:33 On the phone I see RobS, Kendall_Clark, ??P4, ??P15, ??P16, EricP, DanC, ??P17 14:31:34 zakim, who is here? 14:31:34 On the phone I see RobS, Kendall_Clark, ??P4, ??P15, ??P16, EricP, DanC, ??P17 14:31:36 On IRC I see RRSAgent, AlbertoR, AndyS, kendall, HiroyukiS, Zakim, DanC, SimonR, DaveB, SteveH, ericP, afs 14:31:45 Zakim, ??P17 is DaveB 14:31:45 +DaveB; got it 14:31:52 Zakim, ??P16 is AndyS 14:31:52 +AndyS; got it 14:32:05 +AlbertoG 14:32:32 Zakim, ??P4 is SimonR 14:32:32 +SimonR; got it 14:32:42 + +004419aaaa 14:32:43 Zakim, mute SimonR temporarily 14:32:43 SimonR should now be muted 14:32:58 SimonR should now be unmuted again 14:33:03 Zakim, +004419aaaa is SteveH 14:33:03 +SteveH; got it 14:33:10 FarrukhNajmi has joined #dawg 14:33:16 Zakim, SimonR is Somebody 14:33:16 +Somebody; got it 14:33:22 Zakim, ??P15 is SimonR 14:33:22 +SimonR; got it 14:33:28 Zakim, mute SimonR temporarily 14:33:28 SimonR should now be muted 14:33:32 I joind just before Kendall 14:33:42 Zakim, Somebody is HiroyukiS 14:33:42 +HiroyukiS; got it 14:33:43 I am running just a few min late in another meeting. Will dialin shortly. thanks. cu 14:33:43 SimonR should now be unmuted again 14:33:50 ok, FarrukhNajmi 14:33:54 +??P20 14:34:03 Zakim, ??P20 is JosD 14:34:03 +JosD; got it 14:35:29 Zakim, agenda? 14:35:29 I see 10 items remaining on the agenda: 14:35:30 1. Convene, take roll, review record (http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0408.html), agenda [from DanC] 14:35:33 2. public comments on date/time (ACTION TomA) [from DanC] 14:35:35 3. rules, construct (action Simon+Kendall) [from DanC] 14:35:37 4. 4.6 Additional Semantic Information, rules, construct (action Simon+Kendall) [from DanC] 14:35:39 5. returning bnodes issue (ACTION SimonR) [from DanC] 14:35:41 6. 4.5 Querying Multiple Sources (ACTION RobS?) [from DanC] 14:35:43 7. PREFIX syntax (ACTION KendallC) [from DanC] 14:35:44 8. XQuery tradeoff (ACTION SimonR) [from DanC] 14:35:45 9. SOURCE issue (ACTION DaveB) [from DanC] 14:35:46 10. ftf agenda, issues list http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/ftf3-brs#agenda [from DanC] 14:36:35 Zakim, who's on the phone? 14:36:35 On the phone I see RobS, Kendall_Clark, HiroyukiS, SimonR, AndyS, EricP, DanC, DaveB, AlbertoR, SteveH, JosD 14:36:50 We have regrets via email from Farrukh, Bryan, Yoshio and Hiroyuki. (Farrukh is present, however!) 14:37:16 ACTION KendallC: PREFIX CONTINUES without discussion 14:37:21 agenda -7 14:37:34 * I'm on the phone. 14:37:40 TomAdams has joined #dawg 14:37:41 agenda -3 14:37:51 +[Tucana] 14:38:01 zakim, tucana is TomAdams 14:38:01 +TomAdams; got it 14:38:48 ACTION SimonR: returning bnodes issue CONTINUES without discussion 14:38:51 agenda -5 14:39:22 agenda + BRQL r1.55 14:39:57 agenda + tests update 14:40:27 fwiw, a link to the brql spec is always nice in email's announcing an update of it... 14:40:49 Got it. Will do next time. 14:40:53 RRSAgent, make logs world-access 14:41:19 can someone paste brql's uri? it's so unmemorable I can't remember it! 14:41:23 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/rq23/ 14:41:36 thx 14:42:01 Resolved to accept the minutes of the 08/31 minutes. 14:42:20 No teleconference will be held on the 14th, due to the Bristol F2F. 14:42:38 Kendall offers to scribe at the F2F. 14:42:44 Zakim, close agendum 1 14:42:44 agendum 1 closed 14:42:45 I see 8 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 14:42:46 2. public comments on date/time (ACTION TomA) [from DanC] 14:42:55 (Andy also offered but I trumped him! :>) 14:42:55 Zakim, next agendum 14:42:55 agendum 2. "public comments on date/time (ACTION TomA)" taken up [from DanC] 14:43:18 Tom's proposal http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0454.html 14:43:37 TomA sent the email message this morning. 14:44:04 TomA says that Bjoern said that there weren't enough use-cases around datatyping. 14:44:09 q+ 14:44:33 new XPath has some http://www.w3.org/TR/xpath-functions/#comp.duration.datetime 14:45:01 q- 14:45:09 http://www.w3.org/TR/xpath-functions/#func-current-dateTime 14:45:20 fn:current-dateTime() as xs:dateTime 14:45:29 ACTION RobS: see if XQuery has a now() function 14:45:35 Discussion about adding a function for accessing the current time. (Does XQuery have such a function?) 14:45:38 yep - those actually - txs DaveB 14:46:13 query has current-dateTime(), current-date() and current-time() as well as comparison functions 14:47:20 TomA asks: is this question of time beyond our scope? 14:49:01 +Farrukh_Najmi 14:49:17 welcome Farrukh 14:49:29 Hi ERic and colleagues 14:49:33 I see section 12 Testing Values http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/rq23/#extendedtests $Revision: 1.36 $ of $Date: 2004/09/07 18:10:26 $ 14:49:50 AndyS is expecting the language to eventually support user-defined functions. 14:49:55 Zakim, next agendum 14:49:55 agendum 3. "4.6 Additional Semantic Information, rules, construct (action Simon+Kendall)" taken up [from DanC] 14:51:06 SimonR, I will send my reply to Bjoern's comment email to him, copied to comments list, as is basically. 14:51:17 getting more concrete about 4.6 Kendall Clark http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0403.html 14:52:09 Kendall summarizes http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0403.html 14:52:32 Tom, your mail to Wolper Cc'd public-rdf-dawg-comments-request (vs. the list itself). I've bounced it to the comments list (with a corrected Cc:) and it hwas been archived [http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg-comments/2004Sep/0001] 14:53:29 -1 on syntactic suger 14:53:43 (-.5, really) 14:54:54 q+ to talk about srql 14:55:00 q+ 14:55:26 FYI: Other systems have special predicates: directSubClassOf 14:55:35 No need for syntax 14:55:48 ack tom 14:56:36 We such users as well - usually writing editors and the like 14:56:48 I would be happy with special predicates. 14:57:17 special predicates can give unexpeted results to queries 14:57:19 Also I agree with RobS - direct/indirect is complicated and subtle 14:57:23 +1 14:58:48 ack ericp 14:58:48 ericP, you wanted to talk about srql 14:59:13 Kendall is worried that we'll be doing with regard to inferencing is an actual mistake rather than a matter of taste. 14:59:28 Danc exhorts people to submit use-cases for inferencing! 15:00:41 Kendall points out UCs 2.3 and 2.11 as claiming that they motivate inferencing. 15:01:05 EricP, it's user error, not mail client. 15:01:16 UC: Ontology editors : Are there any other areas? 15:01:52 ACTION TomAdams: finding a use-case for direct/transitive. 15:03:41 ACTION KendallClark: Pester Aditya about scheme/metascheme query support re: SWOOP 15:04:45 DONE: ACTION Simon on CONSTRUCT 15:04:55 Zakim, next agendum 15:04:55 agendum 4. "returning bnodes issue (ACTION SimonR)" taken up [from DanC] 15:05:20 Zakim, close agendum 4 15:05:20 agendum 4 closed 15:05:21 I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 15:05:22 5. XQuery tradeoff (ACTION SimonR) [from DanC] 15:05:47 --- 4.5 multiple source ACTION RobS? 15:05:59 DONE: Action Robs. 15:06:26 Zakim, next agendum 15:06:26 agendum 5. "XQuery tradeoff (ACTION SimonR)" taken up [from DanC] 15:06:39 Kendall, we're doing work with OWL APIs ATM, I may be able to get some input here also... 15:07:38 SimonR requests RobS to take over this action. 15:07:41 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0441.html 15:07:46 XQuery syntax for BRQL semantics http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0441.html 15:09:39 Tom: Ah, good to know. 15:12:12 AndyS objects to RobS's quoted proposal based on it not being XQuery. 15:12:18 ... http://www.w3.org/TR/xpath-datamodel/ ... 15:14:49 q+ 15:17:38 q- 15:17:53 q+ 15:18:01 q? 15:18:12 -AlbertoR 15:18:37 +[ASemantics] 15:28:54 q- 15:29:21 ack SimonR 15:32:18 q+ To ask about query optimisers with Xquery 15:34:55 ack TomAdams 15:34:55 TomAdams, you wanted to ask about query optimisers with Xquery 15:36:16 ack danc 15:36:16 DanC, you wanted to ask andy about other proposals we don't get to hear about 15:38:43 "Making RDF Data Available for XML processing" 15:39:09 http://jena.hpl.hp.com/~afs/RDF-XML.html 15:39:43 +1 to put the above document on the reading list for F2F 15:40:56 http://www.w3.org/TR/xpath-functions/ 15:42:33 DanC requests that RobS and AndyS's documents will be on the reading list for the F2F. 15:42:40 Zakim, next agendum 15:42:40 agendum 6. "SOURCE issue (ACTION DaveB)" taken up [from DanC] 15:43:19 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0447.html 15:45:49 I mentioned some issues about FROM vs. SOURCE - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0327.html 15:46:39 (for the record) Sources specified in SOURCE clause are unions currently. 15:49:37 +1 15:50:03 would like to discuss the FROM vs. SOURCE more at f2f or by email - 15:50:06 Zakim, next agendum 15:50:06 agendum 7. "ftf agenda, issues list http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/ftf3-brs#agenda" taken up [from DanC] 15:50:10 FROM , is merged union 15:50:51 (For the record!) 15:51:11 SOURCE isn't union. 15:51:20 also possible discussion about SOURCE as bNode and realed UC "Identity management" - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0415.html 15:51:46 AndyS: hmm, that's kinda hard to scan... any chance for something more like FROM AND ? 15:51:47 DanC: Useful to get F2F discussion on several issues. Inviting volunteers to lead discussion on specific issues. 15:52:25 RobS volunteers to lead the XQuery topic. 15:52:32 If you want - no difficulties there 15:52:38 "DI use case?" what's DI? 15:52:52 Device Independence 15:53:03 AndyS, I knew I'd make a fool of myself over not having read it thoroughly... :) 15:53:16 DanC suggests he'll have to compose an issues list. Would like someone else involved in composing it but suspects it might be hard to do so. 15:53:27 Andy: maybe i just shouldn't ever talk about syntax ;> 15:54:51 DaveB volunteers to lead a discussion on SOURCE. 15:55:19 Zakim, next agendum 15:55:19 agendum 8. "BRQL r1.55" taken up [from DanC] 15:55:56 AndyS is proposing 1.55 to be the baseline used at the F2F. 15:56:11 Zakim, who's on the phone? 15:56:11 On the phone I see RobS, Kendall_Clark, HiroyukiS, SimonR, AndyS, EricP, DanC, DaveB, SteveH, JosD, TomAdams, Farrukh_Najmi, [ASemantics] 15:57:52 Unanimous to freeze 1.55. 15:58:03 Zakim, next agendum 15:58:03 agendum 9. "tests update" taken up [from DanC] 15:58:34 simple tests http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0426.html 15:58:38 -RobS 15:59:23 My time is up sorry, have to leave. Bye. 15:59:26 -TomAdams 15:59:41 -Kendall_Clark 16:01:59 http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/ 16:03:15 for ftf reading: test README http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/tests/README.html 16:03:21 Zakim, next agendum 16:03:21 I do not see any non-closed agenda items, DanC 16:03:42 -DaveB 16:03:46 -[ASemantics] 16:03:47 -DanC 16:03:48 -JosD 16:03:49 -SimonR 16:03:49 -Farrukh_Najmi 16:03:58 -AndyS 16:04:01 -SteveH 16:04:02 -EricP 16:04:02 Oh, where can I get the IRC log? 16:04:09 -HiroyukiS 16:04:10 RRSAgent: pointer? 16:04:10 See http://www.w3.org/2004/09/07-dawg-irc#T16-04-10 16:04:10 SW_DAWG()10:30AM has ended 16:04:10 AlbertoR has left #dawg 16:04:11 Attendees were RobS, Kendall_Clark, EricP, DanC, DaveB, AndyS, SteveH, SimonR, HiroyukiS, AlbertoR, JosD, [Tucana], TomAdams, Farrukh_Najmi, [ASemantics] 16:04:24 Ah, thanks RRSAgent! :) 16:04:53 Simon, Tucana is what zakim thinks Dave & my office is... 16:05:06 RRSAgent, list actions 16:05:06 I see 5 open action items: 16:05:06 ACTION: KendallC to PREFIX CONTINUES without discussion [1] 16:05:06 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/09/07-dawg-irc#T14-37-16 16:05:06 ACTION: SimonR to returning bnodes issue CONTINUES without discussion [2] 16:05:06 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/09/07-dawg-irc#T14-38-48 16:05:06 ACTION: RobS to see if XQuery has a now() function [3] 16:05:06 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/09/07-dawg-irc#T14-45-29 16:05:06 ACTION: TomAdams to finding a use-case for direct/transitive. [4] 16:05:06 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/09/07-dawg-irc#T15-01-52 16:05:06 ACTION: KendallClark to Pester Aditya about scheme/metascheme query support re: SWOOP [5] 16:05:06 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/09/07-dawg-irc#T15-03-41 16:05:14 Sharing the phone for the SWBP, I presume. 16:06:24 bye 18:08:26 Zakim has left #dawg